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Elvis Presley is the king of music?

Hot_Street said:
maybe this guy
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oh, good thinking. Let's give him a Queen. Theda Bara.

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kai said:
true.. even though he got his ideas from black-artists and even one of the persons (he was black) who wrote a lot of his songs died poorly and didn't get paid. Not mentioning the other creepy stuff about elvis.
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I don't understand why he is to blame for the racism going on at the time. He was a very talented and charismatic guy and if we're being honest, everyone in popular music has gotten their ideas in one way or another from black music. Elvis was very respectful to the black community, despite what some may think, and he has always given credit to black artists, when asked where his style came from.
 
Apparently, on google trends (set to 2004-present) the top artist listed for "King of Music" is MJ.
 
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Also let's not forget about Maestro Damon Albarn ☝️ The King of Indie music
 
moni said:
Why do most people call Elvis Presley the king of music when he didn't write a single song?
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I have never heard him be called the "king of music" until now.
He has a voice that could make any song his own. He never did a world tour yet made the whole world know him during his short time on earth. He was funny and charismatic. He slept with lots of babes.

He had his faults, like everyone else. He was used and abused, like just about everyone else. He died too early, like so many others we know.
 
@Victorious, which would you prefer, an artist like Elvis doing what Little Richard and Chuck Berry did, with permission or otherwise, but being the only one to be recognized, or an artist like MJ being maybe considered an equal to Caucasian artists, but also being pigeonholed as a "black artist"?
 
Mister_Jay_Tee said:
@Victorious, which would you prefer, an artist like Elvis doing what Little Richard and Chuck Berry did, with permission or otherwise, but being the only one to be recognized, or an artist like MJ being maybe considered an equal to Caucasian artists, but also being pigeonholed as a "black artist"?
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Gonna put you on the spot, how many artists would you rank over Elvis? Excluding Michael of course
 
IhateTheMedia said:
Gonna put you on the spot, how many artists would you rank over Elvis? Excluding Michael of course
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Well, James Brown was prime.

Jackie Wilson also got a lot of accolades.

Little Richard and Chuck Berry again, also were very good and deserved accolades.

Frank Sinatra was also Music Royalty in his day. And I say Ray Charles deserved all his flowers.

As a performer, I concede, Elvis was a lot of trendsetting. He had just about everything. He made being pretty, the most important part of Pop.
 
Mister_Jay_Tee said:
Well, James Brown was prime.

Jackie Wilson also got a lot of accolades.

Little Richard and Chuck Berry again, also were very good and deserved accolades.

Frank Sinatra was also Music Royalty in his day. And I say Ray Charles deserved all his flowers.

As a performer, I concede, Elvis was a lot of trendsetting. He had just about everything. He made being pretty, the most important part of Pop.
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My question was just in terms of making good music you enjoy listening too, not performing. :unsure:
 
IhateTheMedia said:
My question was just in terms of making good music you enjoy listening too, not performing. :unsure:
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Well, remove Little Richard and Chuck Berry then. The rest I enjoy personally.

If you're including newer artists than Elvis? It increases exponentially in the 70s and 80s.
 
Mister_Jay_Tee said:
Well, remove Little Richard and Chuck Berry then. The rest I enjoy personally.

If you're including newer artists than Elvis? It increases exponentially in the 70s and 80s.
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Anyone regardless of time period is allowed. Groups count too
 
IhateTheMedia said:
Anyone regardless of time period is allowed. Groups count too
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Chaka Khan shoots right near the top then, she was actually insanely talented.

Slave, Kool & The Gang, Heatwave

Prince of course.

I actually don't wanna say ACTQ lol, but yeah, they're some of my faves. J Dilla too.

Really I like all sorts, I couldn't even remember them all even
 
Mister_Jay_Tee said:
@Victorious, which would you prefer, an artist like Elvis doing what Little Richard and Chuck Berry did, with permission or otherwise, but being the only one to be recognized, or an artist like MJ being maybe considered an equal to Caucasian artists, but also being pigeonholed as a "black artist"?
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Well my whole point is that they are both not okay, but the latter seems to be very much in style these days; and even propagated (which makes it worse I guess)
 
Victorious said:
Well my whole point is that they are both not okay, but the latter seems to be very much in style these days; and even propagated (which makes it worse I guess)
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Well I think it's fine. Black artists getting their shine. So far I haven't learned about a single African American composer in my music appreciation class, and we all know they exist. It's just not a priority.

What MJ meant back in the day was totally different, for a different meaning. And they already have been saying he made "white" music, he "hated being black". It's necessary. To tip the scales to normalcy and just appreciation.
 
Mister_Jay_Tee said:
Well I think it's fine. Black artists getting their shine. So far I haven't learned about a single African American composer in my music appreciation class, and we all know they exist. It's just not a priority.
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Really? No William Grant Still, Samuel Coleridge -Taylor, Florence Price? Scott Joplin?

That's depressing. :(
 
Mister_Jay_Tee said:
Nope. All Baroque, classical, romantic era blahness. A bunch of dudes making tunes I could barely describe as "listenable".
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Someone needs to talk to your curriculum programming team, lol. I mean, if the emphasis is on classical, well, those names I posted all qualify. Even Scott Joplin but definitely the others. I don't know how good it is over here in the UK, tbf. Maybe it's not brilliant. But it's already several years since BBC Radio 3 (the classical music station) did a whole week of William Grant Still as Composer of the Week. Samuel C-T has been recognised for longer. Florence Price is getting some attention and that might be quite new bc she's up against the sexism thing, as well, but she has been performed at the Proms (major festival of mostly classical music, runs every year in the UK) since at least 2018. She was back again this year.

I don't even listen to loads of classical music bc I don't listen to radio much - there might be a lot more going on than just the little bits I've mentioned here. But, like I said, I have no idea if any of this has filtered down into schools or university classes.

George Walker? The first African American to get the Pulitzer Prize for Music?

OK, I'll stop now. Just a bit shocked, that's all. I thought we'd made a bit more progress.
 
Mister_Jay_Tee said:
So far I haven't learned about a single African American composer in my music appreciation class, and we all know they exist. It's just not a priority.
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I don't know how the rest of your music class is set up but if they want to teach you about composers that were significantly relevant for classical music than maybe those composers were deemed rightfully not significantly relevant enough by the teachers/experts.? Regardless of colour

If that is the case would you still want the school to teach you about them?
 
Victorious said:
I don't know how the rest of your music class is set up but if they want to teach you about composers that were significantly relevant for classical music than maybe those composers were deemed rightfully not significantly relevant enough by the teachers/experts.? Regardless of colour

If that is the case would you still want the school to teach you about them?
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If it was me, skin colour is irrelevant - it's all about who made the biggest contribution and the impact that they had on classical music.

It seems that everything gets turned into a race issue these days.
 
Victorious said:
I don't know how the rest of your music class is set up but if they want to teach you about composers that were significantly relevant for classical music than maybe those composers were deemed rightfully not significantly relevant enough by the teachers/experts.? Regardless of colour
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But this is the interesting question, imo. Are those African American composers actually not up to the standard of the usual suspects who would be taught on a (classical?) music course? Why not include some of them and examine that very question? Why not teach and demonstrate how the (white European) composers are better? Assuming that they actually are better. Or perhaps that would open up a complicated can of worms but, still, why is there not a way to include some of them? Not all of them and not as if they are on the same level as Beethoven, necessarily, but I still think the curriculum should be broadened out, even just a little bit.

How do we decide who is significant? If these composers are deemed good enough to be programmed on Radio 3 - a very prestigious classical music radio station - and if they are good enough to be included in The Proms - another extremely prestigious
institution - then why are they not good enough to be included in Mr JT's college class? What do Mr JT's teachers know that the bods in charge of R3 or The Proms don't know?

Victorious said:
If that is the case would you still want the school to teach you about them?
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I can't speak for Mr JT, obviously, but for myself my answer is Yes! I want some of those composers to be included in my course.

The curriculum doesn't have to be so white and Eurocentric and male. It can open up a bit and include some women, some composers from a different ethnic background. Beethoven isn't going anywhere, he'll still be there for anyone to appreciate.

The Proms always used to be white and male and Eurocentric and they only did classical music in the strictest sense. But for many years now they have included jazz, film scores, orchestrated versions of, for example, Queen (or was it The Beatles? I didn't pay attention, tbh, bc I don't like either of them but it was one of those groups, lol). My point is, if the BBC can push the boundaries a little bit, an American college course surely can?
 
Blues_Away2023 said:
If it was me, skin colour is irrelevant - it's all about who made the biggest contribution and the impact that they had on classical music.

It seems that everything gets turned into a race issue these days.
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I don't see this as a race issue. I simply see that female composers and Black composers have been left out of the picture and I can't see a good reason for that. Black and / or female classical music composers couldn't have made an impact bc they weren't allowed in. If we exclude people bc their contribution is not sufficiently impressive (according to who, exactly?) then we continue to have a classical music landscape dominated by white men. It's the C21. I'm not interested in seeing that particular status quo maintained. I want it to be challenged.

Some people whine and complain about jazz being played on Radio 3 (it's been there for years and years) but most people seem to accept that it has it's place alongside traditional classical music which still gets far more hours than any other type of music played on R3. The same thing happened when film scores started to be given air time on R3.
 
@Hiker can you merge the thread in the Elvis Presly-thread or in the forum anything goes

Elvis Presley

Who here besides me LOVES Elvis? I pretty much worship the man even tho i was only 2 when he died. He was AMAZING. :wub:
www.mjjcommunity.com www.mjjcommunity.com
 
Mister_Jay_Tee said:
Well I think it's fine. Black artists getting their shine. So far I haven't learned about a single African American composer in my music appreciation class, and we all know they exist. It's just not a priority.
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Mr JT, you should go into class and challenge your teachers! Tell them that Marin Alsop has programmed William Grant Still as part of the 2023/24 season with the Philharmonia Orchestra. It's called Let Freedom Ring, it's dedicated to the sounds of America.

See what they say, lol.
 
zinniabooklover said:
I don't see this as a race issue. I simply see that female composers and Black composers have been left out of the picture and I can't see a good reason for that. Black and / or female classical music composers couldn't have made an impact bc they weren't allowed in. If we exclude people bc their contribution is not sufficiently impressive (according to who, exactly?) then we continue to have a classical music landscape dominated by white men. It's the C21. I'm not interested in seeing that particular status quo maintained. I want it to be challenged.

Some people whine and complain about jazz being played on Radio 3 (it's been there for years and years) but most people seem to accept that it has it's place alongside traditional classical music which still gets far more hours than any other type of music played on R3. The same thing happened when film scores started to be given air time on R3.
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Very interesting, you seem very knowledgeable about classical music @zinniabooklover so no complaints from me.
 
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