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Taylor Swift wants to become the new Thriller

The gesture is appreciated but Michael is not innocent because of his artistic and musical genius, he is innocent because he never committed any crime and to this day there's no single factual evidence stating otherwise. It'd be interesting to hear smart songwriters stating the real corruption behind those allegations and the corruption of the authorities.

Going back to Taylor. If talented songwriters are going to write subjects in common like Michael did with untrusting or femme fatale individuals, it's real talent portraying them in different circumstances, giving them different personalities and feelings. With Taylor it just changes the individual who used to date.
 
Snow White luvs Peter Pan said:
The gesture is appreciated but Michael is not innocent because of his artistic and musical genius, he is innocent because he never committed any crime and to this day there's no single factual evidence stating otherwise. It'd be interesting to hear smart songwriters stating the real corruption behind those allegations and the corruption of the authorities.

Going back to Taylor. If talented songwriters are going to write subjects in common like Michael did with untrusting or femme fatale individuals, it's real talent portraying them in different circumstances, giving them different personalities and feelings. With Taylor it just changes the individual who used to date.
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It all depends how you look at it. It's pretty hard to fathom, at least for me, that a man that wrote such songs as Billie jean, Heal The World, Will You Be There, Earth Song, In The Closet, Do You Know Where Your Children Are could ever be guilty of such a heinous crime.

They got a bit to go until they discover the real truth about his innocence but at least they're on the right direction. I applaude Kendrick Lamar for saying that.

Oh yeah I think Nicki Minaj mention MJ in a song in such a manner that you talk about? Something along the lines of,
They gonna murderer me like they did MJ, Propofol.
 
Themidwestcowboy said:
It all depends how you look at it. It's pretty hard to fathom, at least for me, that a man that wrote such songs as Billie jean, Heal The World, Will You Be There, Earth Song, In The Closet, Do You Know Where Your Children Are could ever be guilty of such a heinous crime.
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Well, Billie Jean I don't think has anything to do with the allegations, but you have a point about Do You Know Where Your Children Are (or Hollywood Tonight), which directly mentions and condemns child sexual abuse. And it was written before the 1993 Chandler case. While such a song cannot be used as direct evidence for his innocence, but I agree with you that it's very difficult to imagine that someone who had those thoughts about child sexual abuse would then turn around and abuse himself in private. And one cannot even claim that the song was some sort of front that he put on, since it was never released in his life.
 
respect77 said:
Well, Billie Jean I don't think has anything to do with the allegations, but you have a point about Do You Know Where Your Children Are (or Hollywood Tonight), which directly mentions and condemns child sexual abuse. And it was written before the 1993 Chandler case. While such a song cannot be used as direct evidence for his innocence, but I agree with you that it's very difficult to imagine that someone who had those thoughts about child sexual abuse would then turn around and abuse himself in private. And one cannot even claim that the song was some sort of front that he put on, since it was never released in his life.
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I agree. It would be really silly if people actually think that was some kind of front. MJ also started visiting children hospitals and started donating money a long time before the 93 case. So what they are implying is that MJ put up a front for almost his entire life?

Yeah songs like ITC and Billie Jean don't have anything with the allegations per say but I think if one looks at the bigger picture those songs portray him as a very sensual and sexual hetero man. How could anyone believe that a man that professes the desire for a woman in such a way secretly lives a double life as a child molester.
 
Interesting discussion about socially conscious music. Imo the state of today's pop music industry makes it very difficult for genuine socially conscious music (or anything raw, heartfelt and serious for that matter) to rise to the top. It's not impossible, but it's certainly not easy given that the entire industry is way too polished, image-driven and controlled by labels who market all their artists to appeal to teenagers because that's where they can make the most money.
 
SoCav said:
Interesting discussion about socially conscious music. Imo the state of today's pop music industry makes it very difficult for genuine socially conscious music (or anything raw, heartfelt and serious for that matter) to rise to the top. It's not impossible, but it's certainly not easy given that the entire industry is way too polished, image-driven and controlled by labels who market all their artists to appeal to teenagers because that's where they can make the most money.
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I think that (Especially now a days) record companies are run by people who studied business studies in school/college and have no real passion for music.
 
Themidwestcowboy said:
When shit hit the fan, is you still a fan?
That ni**a gave us Billie Jean, you say he touched those kids?
When shit hit the fan, is you still a fan?"

He gained many points in my book for saying this.
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I always have a hard time with people mentioning his genius/success in music (or just any of his accomplishments) when defending Michael. His talent and why he's innocent have nothing to do with each other. My problem with 'arguments' like "but he made Thriller!" is that it only helps strengthen this image that anyone who believe in his innocence is simply too blinded by his fame to see any wrongdoing on his part, which is so far from the truth.

respect77 said:
While such a song cannot be used as direct evidence for his innocence, but I agree with you that it's very difficult to imagine that someone who had those thoughts about child sexual abuse would then turn around and abuse himself in private.
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Exactly, plus a child molester would never even mention the subject out of the blue and draw attention to it like that.


Back to Taylor wanting to reach Michael's level.. I'm not sure if she really believes that:unsure: but I don't think any of today's artists can come up with 'the new Thriller'. That video revolutionized the entire music video concept back then, and I don't see anyone talented or original enough to create something with the same impact today.
 
Lil said:
I always have a hard time with people mentioning his genius/success in music (or just any of his accomplishments) when defending Michael. His talent and why he's innocent have nothing to do with each other. My problem with 'arguments' like "but he made Thriller!" is that it only helps strengthen this image that anyone who believe in his innocence is simply too blinded by his fame to see any wrongdoing on his part, which is so far from the truth.
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Very true, it's a ridiculous and rather disturbing line of reasoning.
 
I see it as an honour to MJ that everyone always wants to compare themselves to Michael Jackson.

They will never be as good or popular - but the fact that they compare themselves to MJ when they try to reach perfection is a compliment IMO.


Thriller is and will always be a timeless masterpiece - it can never be reached or topped. - It's a genius piece of art.
 
Rap music is very socially conscious right now and has been for some years (thanks to artists like Kanye West who broke down the whole 'gangsta' rap norm that was hugely popular until roughly 2007 when he went up against 50 Cent's album and won). It's too early to judge what will be the Earth Song's etc. because these songs are all very recent. Heck, until about 3 years ago They Don't Care About Us didn't get much mention but now it is America's go to song with many of their troubles.
 
Good luck with that,Ms. Swift.
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But I do admire how well she treats her fans though.
 
You may see it as an honor Hess but it rather looks like a shameless PR strategy. All those new comers will achieve to be in the same level Michael is when the pigs fly. Therefore it's a waste of time to even wish it.
 
dam2040 said:
Heck, until about 3 years ago They Don't Care About Us didn't get much mention but now it is America's go to song with many of their troubles.
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Like I said the circumstances of why TDCAU was not successful upon release were totally different than the circumstances of any of these rap songs. TDCAU has always been a good song and in fact, it WAS successful in other countries, but the US media created an artificial scandal around it because of ridiculous anti-semitism allegations and US radios refused to play it. It's becoming big now in the Internet age when access to music does not depend that much on what the radio plays. Rap/hip-hop is a limited genre, it does not appeal to everyone, which is why I don't think any of these songs have the potential to become some big social anthems in the future.
 
dam2040 said:
Rap music is very socially conscious right now and has been for some years (thanks to artists like Kanye West who broke down the whole 'gangsta' rap norm that was hugely popular until roughly 2007 when he went up against 50 Cent's album and won). It's too early to judge what will be the Earth Song's etc. because these songs are all very recent. Heck, until about 3 years ago They Don't Care About Us didn't get much mention but now it is America's go to song with many of their troubles.
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Gangsta rap might have been most prevalent at the top of the charts in the early 2000s but guys like Talib Kweli, Immortal Technique and Mos Def were all releasing succesful socially conscious material and continuing the legacy of 80s pioneers like Public Enemy and KRS One before Kanye even came out with College Dropout in 2003 (and afterwards).

respect77 said:
Rap/hip-hop is a limited genre, it does not appeal to everyone, which is why I don't think any of these songs have the potential to become some big social anthems in the future.
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Yeah, I also don't think rap/hip-hop has the universal appeal needed to spark a social anthem that speaks to everybody.
 
On another note, This song from Alicia Keys was incredible. This is the types of songs I want to hear big artist sing.

[youtube]HrKmDgk8Edg[/youtube]
 
SoCav said:
Gangsta rap might have been most prevalent at the top of the charts in the early 2000s but guys like Talib Kweli, Immortal Technique and Mos Def were all releasing succesful socially conscious material and continuing the legacy of 80s pioneers like Public Enemy and KRS One before Kanye even came out with College Dropout in 2003 (and afterwards).


Yeah, I also don't think rap/hip-hop has the universal appeal needed to spark a social anthem that speaks to everybody.
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College Dropout was 2004 ;) But yeah, it wasn't done on a HUGE scale until people like 'Ye came along. Rap/Hip Hop needs Pop hooks/samples to cross over, even the most skilled rappers would tell you if they want a hit they get a Pop singer doing the hook. That tells you the reach rap has on its own.
 
dam2040 said:
College Dropout was 2004 ;) But yeah, it wasn't done on a HUGE scale until people like 'Ye came along. Rap/Hip Hop needs Pop hooks/samples to cross over, even the most skilled rappers would tell you if they want a hit they get a Pop singer doing the hook. That tells you the reach rap has on its own.
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Ah, you're right, 2004 (man, time flies), sorry. Yeah, not saying Kanye's success didn't have an influence, it certainly did. I just don't think he was at the forefront of that movement.

Do agree with you about the second part. And the most overt/explicit political rap tends to be more raw and have less of a pop slant already.
 
dam2040 said:
even the most skilled rappers would tell you if they want a hit they get a Pop singer doing the hook. That tells you the reach rap has on its own.
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That's actually pretty true. Think about Eminem's collaborations with Rihanna, they were pretty unstoppable on the charts - easily Eminem's biggest hits since he returned after his break.

...and speaking of Riri I now have FourFiveSeconds stuck in my head :p
 
^^^And let's not forget Jay Z and Alicia's Empire State of Mind. Folks who hate rap, got into that one. Grandmother's were singing that song.
 
Nothing is ever gonna top that Thriller video on any level

As Lionel Richie said about Thriller, it's the Gone of the Wind of music videos
 
HIStoric said:
That's actually pretty true. Think about Eminem's collaborations with Rihanna, they were pretty unstoppable on the charts - easily Eminem's biggest hits since he returned after his break.

...and speaking of Riri I now have FourFiveSeconds stuck in my head :p
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Good song! :) Prefer All of the Lights if we're being honest, Rihanna/Kanye have some great collabs. But yeah, samples/hooks all have that Pop influence to cross over into the #1 hits. See You Again, the Fast and Furious song is huge and is that rap/pop crossover.
 
respect77 said:
OK, I added to my post, so let me repeat:

I still don't think this generation has What's Going Ons, We Are The Worlds, Imagines, Earth Songs, TDCAUs etc. (Heck they had to re-make WATW and Do They Know It's Christmas...)

Most of the songs you posted were minor hits, if they were hits at all. The only bigger hits are Born This Way (#1) and Same Love ?(#11). (Ironically the most successful of these songs (BTW) is melodically a rip-off of an old Madonna song and thematically a rip-off of an old Valentino song that was covered by many, many artist since.)

You mentioned TDCAU's late success. Of course that could happen, but I don't think it's likely with any of these songs. They are just not that good. While I admit this is my subjective judgement of them, but you also have to remember that the reason why TDCAU was not successful upon release were very special circumstances which had to do with MJ's treatment by the US media. So I don't really think any of these songs situation can be compared to TDCAU's situation. TDCAU was good already in 1995, the US media simply sabotaged it.
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The whole reason why TDCAU wasnt successfull upon release was mainly cuz of the "anti jewish" judgement the media made bout that song. If the media hadnt made that judgement with those few little words in that song TDCAU wouldve been successfull
 
Bubs said:
I haven't seen this posted anywhere so just for the laughs, I post it here as I don't think it deserves a new thread.

Entertainment Site Asks if Taylor Swift Is the Next Michael Jackson; Twitter Laughs (clearly click bite article:))
http://www.theroot.com/blogs/the_gr...to_a_news_site_asking_if_taylor_swift_is.html

Twitter reactions can be read here:
https://twitter.com/search?f=tweets&vertical=default&q=popmatters&src=typd&lang=en

The twitter reactions are so funny
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LOL WHAAAAT Pretty sure even Taylor herself would think that's a ridiculous notion :lol:
 
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