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The Problem With A.I.

SmoothGangsta said:
I don't really see what this statement has to do with the topic being discussed if I'm honest. If you're going for "MJ never said it was bad so it's fine to do it", then I don't subscribe to that line of thought at all, and I think it takes intentionally leaving things out of the thought process in order to do so.
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I'm saying all of it is unethical from a certain point of view when you get down to it. And the same people who officially want unreleased tracks MJ couldn't finish and approve himself to be put out should think about that as well as they should this. Is it a double standard? No. But kneejerk reactions and emotional appeals just don't make sense when you think about it too long. And this isn't directed at you specifically.

As it is, The Estate is not interested in any AI, so it will not impact things in any way. Unless it crosses moral or legal boundaries, no one will really care about it. At the end of the day, fake songs already exist, and so do synthetic vocals, vocal manipulation, vocaloids, and impersonators. Very rarely are they confused for the real thing. Misinformation on the internet is a tale as old as time, and MJ is no stranger to being victimized by it. At least making up songs or finishing them artificially keeps the focus on his artistry. Officiating the flow of information is all the Estate needs to care about. If they're not selling it then tbh, don't put stock into some of this. The leaks/bootleg market is just gonna have to wallow there.

(You can also argue that MJ wouldn't want biopics or musicals or circuses either, or certainly not his rehearsal footage edited to look like a concert. And what would he say about Drake auto-tuning his voice or cover artist tributes or artificial duets? But that's what the Estate has spent it's time on. That's not entirely relevant but it is a good point).
 
SmoothGangsta said:
Yeah and I feel the same way about that as I do about MJ.
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Fair enough. However, MJ never agreed to the hologram either yet the estate had no problem making it lol. (Ironically, someone deepfaked the hologram but you still cant fix the dancing.šŸ˜‚)

This tech is still very new and easily noticeable. I'm not really worried. When it gets to the point where you cant tell the difference...then it's a different story. I dont think anyone passing this off as real can get away with it (yet).
Enhancing low quality audio? Why not.
Telling people this is unreleased music? Very wrong and misleading.
Making a fun cover? No problem imo.
Beno & Kai are doing the best with this.
 
Mister_Jay_Tee said:
I'm saying all of it is unethical from a certain point of view when you get down to it. And the same people who officially want unreleased tracks MJ couldn't finish and approve himself to be put out should think about that as well as they should this. Is it a double standard? No. But kneejerk reactions and emotional appeals just don't make sense when you think about it too long. And this isn't directed at you specifically.

As it is, The Estate is not interested in any AI, so it will not impact things in any way. Unless it crosses moral or legal boundaries, no one will really care about it. At the end of the day, fake songs already exist, and so do synthetic vocals, vocal manipulation, vocaloids, and impersonators. Very rarely are they confused for the real thing. Misinformation on the internet is a tale as old as time, and MJ is no stranger to being victimized by it. At least making up songs or finishing them artificially keeps the focus on his artistry. Officiating the flow of information is all the Estate needs to care about. If they're not selling it then tbh, don't put stock into some of this. The leaks/bootleg market is just gonna have to wallow there.

(You can also argue that MJ wouldn't want biopics or musicals or circuses either, or certainly not his rehearsal footage edited to look like a concert. And what would he say about Drake auto-tuning his voice or cover artist tributes or artificial duets? But that's what the Estate has spent it's time on. That's not entirely relevant but it is a good point).
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I wasn't talking about the MJ estate doing anything with AI until others brought it up and said it would be a good idea. AI is not MJ and can't be compared to his actual unreleased work as it isn't even anything to do with him, so I don't really understand the comparison you're trying to make in that regard.
 
SmoothGangsta said:
I wasn't talking about the MJ estate doing anything with AI until others brought it up and said it would be a good idea. AI is not MJ and can't be compared to his actual unreleased work as it isn't even anything to do with him, so I don't really understand the comparison you're trying to make in that regard.
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Well we all know it's not MJ. But we don't think that makes it a crime. It's just a random fan thing so far. The upper limit of what can be done with AI is the estate adopting it, which just probably won't happen.
 
Mister_Jay_Tee said:
Well we all know it's not MJ. But we don't think that makes it a crime. It's just a random fan thing so far. The upper limit of what can be done with AI is the estate adopting it, which just probably won't happen.
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Dude, you're the one that compared it to releasing MJ's unreleased music to try and make a point.
 
Mister_Jay_Tee said:
If it wasn't done/finished by MJ we're all operating on gray area, that is my point. That isn't a leap to me.
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It's a pretty big leap to compare releasing MJ's unfinished demos that he actually worked on to using AI to finish them, yeah.
 
SmoothGangsta said:
It's a pretty big leap to compare releasing MJ's unfinished demos that he actually worked on to using AI to finish them, yeah.
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If it bothers you that much then I rescind the comparisions. They're not alike. But I personally find neither one objectionable. And I don't think MJ would object at all to AI. In fact my point was it probably would bother him less than demoes being out out would.

From my point of view, if MJ was pondering a world in which he was deceased, he wouldn't care about AI or sampling him or any of that. While he was alive he didn't care about impersonators, and he liked technology. He did stuff like splicing Rod Serling and Biggie Smalls into his songs, and those were some of the great moments on Invincible. MJ enjoyed studio trickery, even if the fans don't.

Only if he was still alive would he probably have something to say, and that's more so to see what he himself can do with it. (AI is being used on people who are alive as well for the record. Mariah Carey AI is way farther along.)

Conversely, I don't think MJ ever appreciated his songs being put out "unfinished". I don't think he'd change his mind even in the event he was gone. He cared about polish, and quality, even though he may not be there to oversee it. He trusted his co-producers. He didn't put out "demoes", he made "magic", and that's what he enjoyed, a finished product. Even if you simply say it was finished, just left in the vaults that's the show must go on angle he worked on his whole life. MJ didn't like revealing his process, even if the fans enjoyed it.

But he allowed demoes to be put out, so it was condoned in his mind as well. And he allowed remixes, so he objectively condoned reworking his music to make it "hip".

Basically, MJ just was not bothered by much. That's like one of my favorite aspects of his personality So why are so many of his fans?
 
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