Verdict Reached: AEG NOT Liable - Discussion- Katherine Jackson vs AEG

[marebear]

The world is watching and a lot of people don't buy the close knit image that they would like you to believe. The kids are getting older and will have their independence. I believe Michael's influence on them is strong and they will make their own lives.

 

[crillon]

^^I agree. Walgren wanted a restitution, which Panish advised Katherine not to take because it would reduce the amount they could recover from AEG. She said no to the restitution, and gambled on the AEG case. She lost.

Panish's firm spent all those millions and they only charge if they win. They will have to win a big settlement now to cover that loss. Katherine added a lawyer that deals with appeals. I think you have about 60 days to appeal, so maybe the lawyer is already writing the brief?

Someone should advise Katherine Jackson to cut her losses and live out the rest of her life with some dignity to honor her son, Michael, and his children. She'll lose on appeal, too. She's already done so much damage to Michael's legacy and it's time for her and her cubs to give it a rest and do the right thing.

 

[jaydom7]

This is Katherine's fault... she had the chance to seek restitution against Murray. Pastor and Walgren practically begged her to do it knowing how nutty he was and knowing how unethical he was in his treatment of MJ yet she refused.. She said he deserved to have his money for his kids yet he killed her son and she doesn't give a shit.. I swear this woman deserved not to win a penny.. she wants to blame AEG for not taking care of or protecting her son but she didn't do it either..

 

[marebear]

I wish she would cut her losses too and move on. Her kids leave her to deal with the fallout. Not one of her beloved children could go to court to be there for her? I don't like AEG and the way they treated Michael was disrespectful and if they had known about the propofol it would be a different story for me.

 

[ivy]

this is another juror

Juror Calvin Smith said he didn’t believe AEG could have done anything about Jackson’s problems.

“If AEG had known what was going on behind closed doors, it would probably have made a difference, but they didn’t," Smith said.

"Michael Jackson was pretty used to getting his own way, he was a big star. He had all these doctors who wanted to be his doctors. And he could pretty much get what he wanted. If anybody said no, well they were out of the mix, and he’d find somebody else. … How could AEG have done anything about it when they were kept in the dark?”

I guess we should be thankful that this jury did not reach to assigning percentages for responsibility. It looks like they might have put it on Michael.

 

[Ashtanga]

I'm not surprised with the result. -_- But I'm glad that Katherine and her cubs will not put your hand on the money. Money she would earn at the expense of Michael using his name. This trial was not to obtain justice. Was for obtain more money again using Michael. Katherine should be ashamed of itself for giving ammunition to press to further tarnish the image of Michael and throw his name in the mud. And worse, further expose PPB. Thanks Katherine! :clapping: uke:

But with all this circus what Katherine win of good? :bugeyed NOTHING ... :sigh: I really hope now left Michael and PPB in peace once and for all. And hopefully now this family learn to work and each chase their goals with their own work/effort and follow on with their lives and stop living at the expense of Michael... why are all still living at the expense of Michael. What a shame! :doh: They are adults and old who are able to move on their own and not depend on anyone. It is time for all of them leave the world of fantasy and back to reality. Well, now everything will follow in peace and Jackson family will walk with their own legs? Will they stop using Michael? They are able? :busted: I do not know :fear: .... I'm not so sure about that :fear:, but I will pray for that to happen. ray:




P.S. Randy is not screaming on twitter? He must be very upset and angry.... :smilerolleyes:

 

[Petrarose]

Oh I wish I could see & hear what Randy & company are up to. I wonder if any one tweeted a ha ha to Randy.

I just thought about something: The jury stopped at question 2. This means that all the drug information, doctor information, addiction information, debt information, future earning information, research study, & labeling Michael an addict or doctor shopper were of no consequence. They were not essential to question 1 and 2. The jury looked at the contract and the definition of oral contracts. They probably looked at the e-mails to get the behavior between Muarry & AEG to help with the hiring question and those video statements from Phillips & Gonga. They looked at TII. So all Michael's business was aired all over for no reason at all. What a shame. How unfair this is. Of course this is all hindsight. Both sides did not know the jury would get to # 2 and say not liable. However, in looking back you see all that Michael went through in this case, and all the case really needed was the contract, only the e-mails relating to an oral contract, legal definitions, 2 videos, a movie, some pens, rulers, & note pads. This case caused 5 wasted months. Basically, this case could have been tried in 3 weeks, or maybe less because the red flag theory was useless.

Then, look at the millions paid to experts to give testimony that the jury DID NOT even get to USE!! That is so ironic--that both sides spent millions on experts to show how addicted Michael was, and for AEG, how in debt he was; or that prof study that they paid the guy to finish. The most expensive experts' testimony were for naught. It is a strange type of justice. They paid out all that money really for something that was not used. The only thing is they will put all that as a business expense to reduce their tax liability.

 

[Petrarose]

Ivywhat is the background on Calvin Smith? He is saying some of the things many here said though. AEG did not know what happened in the bedroom. In fact, his whole statement is a compilation of what various doctors said. He just put it in one statement. This shows that this juror really believed what the doctors said, and these were Michael's long-term doctors speaking. You are sure right about him putting it on Michael if he got to the end of the questions. Maybe the other jurors might be more moderate in assigning responsibility, who knows...

 

[StellaJackson]

At least we know that the way in which This Is It was marketed was a lie.

 

[Lena Lucy]

I agree with the jury's verdict.

 

[Petrarose]

^^When I look at TII I am not thinking about marketing and that it was a lie. I see Michael talking, creating, dancing, looking serious, laughing, and basically acting like someone in a rehearsal, which is making mistakes, not going full out. Sometimes he looks tired; sometimes he does not. For me to make any comparisons, I would have to take some rehearsals from the history era, e.g., and compare them. He got sick at the rehearsals at the theater here in New York, because he was dehydrated. He had to be hospitalized. AEG was not involved in that. He was also sick at the TII rehearsals. Sickness during rehearsals is not uncommon to Michael. The only difference is that in TII the sickness involved a doctor and his deadly cocktail of drugs to put Michael to sleep, that that AEG knew nothing about.

 

[Petrarose]

Re: Verdict Watch - Discussion- Katherine Jackson vs AEG

Ivy those of us who voted Not Liable, do we get a prize, like a ticket each to go see the Unity Tour or to see the Jackson men & Janet perform in Russia?

 

[Autumn II]

This was always about the "cubs," and nothing else. I have NO idea what they are going to do next, nor do I care. Michael was SMART, in his will. He left nothing to his siblings, and expected them to work for a living. Janet has done that. Anyone else? Michael did not OWE his siblings anything. If he had felt that he did, he would have named them in his will. He did speak, in this verdict, and I feel it was correct. . . If there was anything else, any AEG "conspiracy," that will never be known, and it's OVER. Now, the cubs will finally have to stop looking to their dead brother to support them, and it is OVER.

 

[Vici]

KATHERINE JACKSON
SPINS JURY VERDICT
WE PROVED OUR POINT

Katherine Jackson has a rather tortured analysis of the jury verdict -- she seems to be saying even if she didn't get any money, she still kinda won.

Katherine says, "We have said from the beginning that this case was a search for the truth. We found the truth. AEG hired Dr. Conrad Murray, the man who is in jail for killing Michael Jackson."

She's right to this extent ... the jury did say AEG Live hired Murray. In fact Katherine scoffs at AEG, saying, "AEG has denied for years, and continues to deny, that they hired Dr. Conrad Murray. The jury found unanimously that AEG hired Dr. Murray." But then the jury delivered a knockout punch to the Jackson lawsuit, by deciding essentially that when AEG Live hired Murray, they had no reason to believe he was an incompetent general practitioner ... which was the whole point of bringing a doctor on board in the first place. Therefore, AEG was not negligent.

Katherine is pissed, saying, "AEG has repeated the mantra that this lawsuit was a shakedown. Such a statement is a slap in the face of the entire judicial system that allowed this case to go to a jury."

Katherine and her lawyer, Perry Sanders, say "All options regarding the balance of the jury verdict (the ruling there was no negligence) are being considered."

http://m.tmz.com/#Article/2013/10/02/katherine-jackson

 

[Petrarose]

Autumn to me it is over too. I don't think an appeal is going to work. I feel this chapter of family vs AEG is over. I hope Randy will leave his mother alone, so she can just enjoy her time doing what she loves, like going to the Kingdom Hall & playing her games.

Did anyone see Panish's or Katherine's faces after the verdict? Did they look sad or indifferent?

^^That TMZ article--I don't think Katherine said that. It sounds more like her attorney. To pretend that the truth they were searching for was about who hired Muarry is just too pitiful. What are these options they are talking about? The only thing is an appeal and there is nothing to use for an appeal. Maybe they should get Wass to do it.

What is the situation with Sanders? He is Katherine's personal lawyer, so he is being paid. Even if the Panish firm looses money with the AEG case, Sanders still gets his money form Katherine.

 

[Ashtanga]

KATHERINE JACKSON
SPINS JURY VERDICT
WE PROVED OUR POINT

Katherine Jackson has a rather tortured analysis of the jury verdict -- she seems to be saying even if she didn't get any money, she still kinda won.

Katherine says, "We have said from the beginning that this case was a search for the truth. We found the truth. AEG hired Dr. Conrad Murray, the man who is in jail for killing Michael Jackson."

She's right to this extent ... the jury did say AEG Live hired Murray. In fact Katherine scoffs at AEG, saying, "AEG has denied for years, and continues to deny, that they hired Dr. Conrad Murray. The jury found unanimously that AEG hired Dr. Murray." But then the jury delivered a knockout punch to the Jackson lawsuit, by deciding essentially that when AEG Live hired Murray, they had no reason to believe he was an incompetent general practitioner ... which was the whole point of bringing a doctor on board in the first place. Therefore, AEG was not negligent.

Katherine is pissed, saying, "AEG has repeated the mantra that this lawsuit was a shakedown. Such a statement is a slap in the face of the entire judicial system that allowed this case to go to a jury."

Katherine and her lawyer, Perry Sanders, say "All options regarding the balance of the jury verdict (the ruling there was no negligence) are being considered."

http://m.tmz.com/#Article/2013/10/02/katherine-jackson

Oh Katherine, please stop, it's time to be silent and move on. We've had enough with this shit trial. Why keep it moving? :wtf2 :mat:

 

[qbee]

At least we know that the way in which This Is It was marketed was a lie.

How should the "This Is It" film to show Michael's performances been marketed to the world, In You opinion?

I understand what you are saying and agree that saying he was at the top of his game was not exactly truthful. (but that's show biz marketing) I know Kenny O wanted to present Michael in the best light possible. After all TII was not a documentary of his personal problems. It was a concert show, more or less, to show him at his best for the world to see how great he still was. Not to show him on the day he was sick and unable to perform. When the court and Jackson's attorneys were allowed to reviewed ALL the TII footage they didn't find anything that would show MJ wasn't capable. Thats why it wasn't brought into evidence.

 

[StellaJackson]

How should the "This Is It" film to show Michael's performances been marketed to the world, In You opinion?

I understand what you are saying and agree that saying he was at the top of his game was not exactly truthful. (but that's show biz marketing) I know Kenny O wanted to present Michael in the best light possible. After all TII was not a documentary of his personal problems. It was a concert show, more or less, to show him at his best for the world to see how great he still was. Not to show him on the day he was sick and unable to perform. When the court and Jackson's attorneys were allowed to reviewed ALL the TII footage they didn't find anything that would show MJ wasn't capable. Thats why it wasn't brought into evidence.

Because we were told he was extremely healthy during the promotion of the movie and they made out like it came as a complete shock to them. The testimony and AEG emails, particularly the trouble at the front ones, tell a very different story.

 

[qbee]

Katherine says, "We have said from the beginning that this case was a search for the truth. We found the truth. AEG hired Dr. Conrad Murray, the man who is in jail for killing Michael Jackson."

OK she got what she wanted. Her attorneys stated this was not about money and she said in court she just wanted to know the truth. So there is no reason to appeal because she got what she was looking for. AEG hired Conrad Murray for Michael. Time to move on

 

[Petrarose]

Because we were told he was extremely healthy during the promotion of the movie and they made out like it came as a complete shock to them. The testimony and AEG emails, particularly the trouble at the front ones, tell a very different story.

But Stella be realistic. How do you want them to promote the show? What company would promote a show by saying, "This is a show with a sick star. Come and see his great sickness." His death was a shock. No one knew Michael would die when they left him that night. Only Karen knew he would die and that is because she has great powers. Even if he was shakey, rambling about God, was cold, lost weight, looking at TII does not give any clue that he would die. That is the point Putnam wanted to make when he asked the jury to look at the whole thing. TII does not make you see red flags. However, stripping all Michael's cloths off and looking at his body is a different thing. However, the audience did not see Michael naked, although I would have enjoyed that.

If we are to believe the testimony, the witness claimed that Michael made some members of the family sign a letter saying he was not having problems with drugs. Now should we chastise them and say "at lest we learn that the way in which this letter was written/formulated was a lie?" To me these are all the same thing. You present the best side to others. You market the positive aspects of your product. Who writes come and buy our shoes because it is made in Mexico with cheap labor?

Qbee you are right. Based on that statement, she did get what she wanted. Since this case is not about money, then everyone is happy. AEG is happy because they are not liable and Katherine is happy because she found out the truth. We needed 5 months to learn only 1 thing--that AEG hired Muarry.

 

[StellaJackson]

But Stella be realistic. How do you want them to promote the show? What company would promote a show by saying, "This is a show with a sick star. Come and see his great sickness." His death was a shock. No one knew Michael would die when they left him that night. Only Karen knew he would die and that is because she has great powers. Even if he was shakey, rambling about God, was cold, lost weight, looking at TII does not give any clue that he would die. That is the point Putnam wanted to make when he asked the jury to look at the whole thing. TII does not make you see red flags. However, stripping all Michael's cloths off and looking at his body is a different thing. However, the audience did not see Michael naked, although I would have enjoyed that.

If we are to believe the testimony, the witness claimed that Michael made some members of the family sign a letter saying he was not having problems with drugs. Now should we chastise them and say "at lest we learn that the way in which this letter was written/formulated was a lie?" To me these are all the same thing. You present the best side to others. You market the positive aspects of your product. Who writes come and buy our shoes because it is made in Mexico with cheap labor?

I'm talking about the movie.

 

[Petrarose]

I'm talking about the movie.

Yeah I know. You feel the way it was marketed was a lie.

 

[Betelgeuse]

Namaste, fellow MJJCians,

If I may say something:

While some may feel sad, frustrated or even angry becaus of the verdict, and feel compassion with Katherine, PPB and the Jacksons, there is nothing we can do to change things.

I do believe Michael went Home as a part of a bigger picture - to help mankind awaken spiritually, to understand and spread Michael's messages and this way help Michael Heal the World.

No earthly court can change this - and no earthly court or verdict can change what happened to Michael. One has already been convicted for the death of Michael, and the current case has shown much to the world that the world needs to learn - also as a part of a bigger picture. We, Michael's spiritual family, has not learned anything new from the trial, but those who did not know Michael so well, has learned about his difficulties - and this help people to understand him better and this may be a way into getting to understand Michael for real.

There is always a meaning with things - please know that - and also know that we cannot always see the bigger picture in an actual situation - but we may learn it later on.

When people say justice for Michael... no earthly court or verdict can bring justice for Michael. Really, it is not in the hands of a jury or a judge. Justice for Michael is in the hands of US:

Justice for Michael would be if Humanity learned from its mistakes and errors ... if we became sufficiently brave to unite people all around the globe and across all borders... if we invested enough time, money and energy in eliminating economic and social inequalities throughout the world...if we did enough to bring ALL world religions together in ONE large peaceful coexistence... and if we learned to confront, transform and transcend all false images of our enemies and those we fear and find "strange", so that we can see the pure beauty and love in the hearts of all our fellow human beings.

That would be justice for Michael.

In my eyes, therefore, and based upon what I think would be justice for Michael - let us keep spreading Michael's messages. Because spreading Michael's messages WILL lead to the above-mentioned scenarios... eventually. It is not easy and it will take a long time, but we do have the universal energies with us. It is time now to create a sacred Planet Earth. This is what Michael died for. And it is our duty and joyful endeavour to fulfill.

Everyday we can all do justice for Michael. And I believe that this is much more important to him that any rulings that will be worked out in court. Michael is now far beyond all earthly suffering and he is by the side of his mother, his children and his family all the time. Have faith in that.

So let us all keep on standing by Michael in every deed we do every day in our life. And let us keep on trying to inspire others to do the same. This is continued justice for Michael.... and it is justice for any others who have suffered under separation, alienation and hatred - and what follows from these poor qualities of the immature human race.

Let us keep the faith. Let us stand shoulder by shoulder. Let us be strong hearted warriors of Light. And let us help each other help peace, love and harmony to prevail.

This is justice for Michael.

Feel free to share,
L.O.V.E.
Betelgeuse

“In a world filled with hate, we must still dare to hope. In a world filled with anger, we must still dare to comfort. In a world filled with despair, we must still dare to dream. And in a world filled with distrust, we must still dare to believe.”
- Michael Jackson

 

[passy001]

The damage to his reputation and legacy is huge and unnecessary. suddenly MJ entire medical history is right there in the open. There is absolutely zero consolation price here.

Hope KJ stops the madness and tells her curbs to find a job for a change.

 

[Autumn II]

How should the "This Is It" film to show Michael's performances been marketed to the world, In You opinion?

I understand what you are saying and agree that saying he was at the top of his game was not exactly truthful. (but that's show biz marketing) I know Kenny O wanted to show Michael in the best light possible. After all TII was not a documentary of his personal problems. It was a concert show, more or less, to show him at his best for the world to see how great he still was. Not to show him on the day he was sick and unable to perform. When the court and Jackson's attorneys were allowed to reviewed ALL the TII footage they didn't find anything that would show MJ wasn't capable. Thats why it wasn't brought into evidence.

I have friends who were totally NOT fans, and who saw TII. They came away transformed, did not realize how great he was. Whatever else is the case, that film brought him to the wider-world.

Those of us who have "watched" him for decades might have seen other things in TII, but for those new to him, it only widened his fan-base, and that was a very good thing. .

 

[Severus Snape]

Maybe they should get Wass to do it.

She's pretty adamant about the fact she only does appeals, as she tells drunk people who seek her legal advice.

Who knows, maybe she can find a Flanny 2.0... ;3

 

[Tygger]

“Conrad Murray was hired to be a general practitioner. Conrad Murray had a license. He graduated from an accredited college… "We felt he was competent," Darden said. “That doesn’t mean we felt he was ethical, and maybe if the word ‘ethical’ was in the question, it might have been a different outcome,” he said. “In the end, he was very unethical. He did something he shouldn’t have done. "

The same doctor who was competent and fit simply did not understand why his patient deteriorated under his negligent administration of propofol. That deterioration fell under general care. The jurors were to look at the doctor’s actions during his two month employment by AEG not on his employment date of May 1st. It saddens me this case was lost due 10 jurors confusion. It is still rewarding to know that all twelve jurors understood at the very least the doctor was hired by AEG and he was conflicted.

ABC7 Court News
Juror 9, Kevin Smith, told us they could not answer yes to question 2, because Dr. Murray was fit and competent for the job he was hired. He said Dr. Murray was to be a general practitioner doctor, to treat Michael and his children. He didn't have any malpractice lawsuit.

Where was this in the AEG employment contract?

Juror Calvin Smith said he didn’t believe AEG could have done anything about Jackson’s problems.

“If AEG had known what was going on behind closed doors, it would probably have made a difference, but they didn’t," Smith said.

"Michael Jackson was pretty used to getting his own way, he was a big star. He had all these doctors who wanted to be his doctors. And he could pretty much get what he wanted. If anybody said no, well they were out of the mix, and he’d find somebody else. … How could AEG have done anything about it when they were kept in the dark?”

The judge and the plaintiffs’ lawyers said that AEG knowing about propofol was not an issue in this case. That was proven by both verdict forms. The defendants continually said they did not know about propofol.

It is not what is said, it is how it is said.

This verdict assigns 100% responsibility to Michael for his own passing. His doctor was rendered fit and competent. Wass will most likely be successful in getting his licenses removed from suspension as he is still a fit and competent doctor for general care as per this verdict. As a practicing doctor, he may not need to write that book some are looking forward to.

Katherine does not owe lawyer fees so she would not need to use the monies her son willed her to pay Panish’s team. That is a very good thing as there may not be much left depending on how the estate tax issues are resolved.

 

[Mechi]

The good outcome is the Jacksons will not get money!

Just hope it will not make them exploiting the children even more!

 

[Hess]

I just hope the family backs off now and stop destroying MJ's image!

Now - let's focus on a new album.

 

[MIST]

Um but he didn't even know how to properly give CPR!!

I´m sure he knew it but I also think Murray knew Michael had died and CPR wouldn´t help.He just pretended he was doing something to help Michael survive.