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[Video] Another Part of Me performance from Wembley DVD

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Themidwestcowboy said:
Btw is it just me or are alot of Michaels ''Aow '' in another part of me alot higher than he usually shouts them?
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I also noticed that "Aow" was too high. Maybe he's smiling after that while running to the stage left side. I don't like it but it is the only vocal error he did in that performance. He's singing fantastic during the whole performance.
 
rsggamer123 said:
2mhzst3.jpg
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Why the supposed web version (right one) has a logo? This isnt the real one that was streamed. Its problably some smartass upscale to hd with changed contrast and put his name on it.
 
emale said:
I also noticed that "Aow" was too high. Maybe he's smiling after that while running to the stage left side. I don't like it but it is the only vocal error he did in that performance. He's singing fantastic during the whole performance.
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I wouldn't call it vocal error.
 
lom kit said:
Why the supposed web version (right one) has a logo? This isnt the real one that was streamed. Its problably some smartass upscale to hd with changed contrast and put his name on it.
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Its just somebody who recorded the stream and uploaded it for everyone. No smartass upscale.
 
IMWhizzle said:
With all due respect, your enhancement looks NOT natural.

The DVD was restored to the defaults the show was recorded. Put in mind that the VHS was a copy of a Umatic, and that was 25 years ago. The tape may be slightly damaged, so this would be the best they could do.

The colors of the DVD are awesome. It's not necessary to soften them.
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I haven't edited the colors. I just started from the Trailer which I think is more natural in term of contrast & sharpness... and I'm curious to know what I did wrong with it :)
 
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what i like about the video is, that only mike is seen in there. no screaming fans.
what i dont like is the quality. yes its a stream, but i think we dont get really dvd quality.
 
rsggamer123 said:
Its just somebody who recorded the stream and uploaded it for everyone. No smartass upscale.
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It might be not upscaled, but is definately more done then just recorded and uploaded. So this comparason is not accurate.
this one you posted in the other thread is

4s0kg4.jpg


Anyway, judging the quality of the final result by any of those streams is pointless. no matter what bitrate the stream has, anything under 8000kbps regarding what codec is used, suffers from compression.
 
lom kit said:
It might be not upscaled, but is definately more done then just recorded and uploaded. So this comparason is not accurate.
this one you posted in the other thread is

4s0kg4.jpg


Anyway, judging the quality of the final result by any of those streams is pointless. no matter what bitrate the stream has, anything under 8000kbps regarding what codec is used, suffers from compression.
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It's not long now... just wait till it comes out then judge.
P.s lom kit - Thanks for making me waste 30mins staring at your signature of the hands! :p
 
lom kit said:
Anyway, judging the quality of the final result by any of those streams is pointless. no matter what bitrate the stream has, anything under 8000kbps regarding what codec is used, suffers from compression.
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:blink:

I say it again.. the problem here is not the compression. 3000kbps is very acceptable for x264.

Look at Michael's face on the following picture. They applied too strong filters.. which gives the feeling it was colored like a cartoon.. with a limited number of colors - without nuances. This is NOT the result of compression.


sony0000.png


0000yi.png
 
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I see what you talking about. you right about the cartoonish look. I was refering specific to the last screenshot i posted, that is from the tvc mpg and sony france stream. there you can see that differences between both its due the compression and the de-interlacing. very notible in the backgroung and his face. i totaly ignore the apom video from yesterday.

are the screens you post from Bad Tour London - Another Part Of Me (HQ_Dudex).flv 105mb? i don't know how authentic this one either is.
cause there was another 52mb version.

And sorry, 3000kbps may be acceptable, but not enough. here is screen of average 5500kbps. I think you see what i mean.
e4d2812b2f.jpg


even blu-ray rips with that bitrate don't look good. not so bad as mpg with such low bitrate. x264 looks sharp, the low comperession is still visible.
 
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lom kit said:
I see what you talking about. you right about the cartoonish look. I was refering specific to the last screenshot i posted, that is from the tvc mpg and sony france stream. there you can see that differences between both its due the compression and the de-interlacing. very notible in the backgroung and his face. i totaly ignore the apom video from yesterday.
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The video posted on Sony France Youtube's channel indeed suffers heavy compression.

lom kit said:
are the screens you post from Bad Tour London - Another Part Of Me (HQ_Dudex).flv 105mb? i don't know how authentic this one either is.
cause there was another 52mb version.
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indeed.. the 108Mb version is the direct stream copy of amazon and with a very good compression rate. The weird thing is that it looks more (and poorly) enhanced than the TV Trailer !

The Trailer uploaded in mpeg is not too compressed either but it suffers wrong processing during NTSC->PAL conversion... which produce this blurry effect and details lost.. don't hold this against me, I can't fix this ;).

The purpose of my comparison was not to compare the global quality but to point out that the amazon clip was over processed which produces this 'cartoonish' look.

Because of the field issue & the stronger editing.. I do believe that APOM is closer to the DVD quality. But this is just my assumption..
 
bwmusique;3703751 said:
this concert was released in VHS back in the days but for the blu ray they transfert staright from the master which is the 35mm reels...


[video=youtube;EbsXov6O0Kk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EbsXov6O0Kk[/video]

Also guy look at this video at 1min25 this is not MITM and not APOM look like the Medley. So it prove that the whole concert was recorded in 35mm film!!
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I really hope they find those film reels. It is so sad that they did shoot few concerts on film but they are nowhere to be found. :(

Here is the text that confirms that Bad Tour was shot on film if someone hasn't seen it:

http://icolorist.com/grading-michael-jackson/

"The concert was shot on a mixture of 35mm and 16mm film, it seemed at times they were shooting film for fun! The crew filmed 2 nights out of the 5 Wembley stadium gigs, film was also fed from the earlier tour legs in Australia, Japan, and Europe. As an accompanying piece to the concert, an “on the road” documentary was also filmed at the same time

The single “Another part of me” was cut from some of my early telecine work. The music video was cut from footage shot in London and Paris, that shows you how tight Jackson’s performance was. As far as I know the complete concert and documentary has never been released. A disappointing waste as the film managed to capture Jackson at his peak. Jackson never came into Visions during the project but Frank Dileo, his cigar smoking manager, visited a couple of times."

I'm still very excited that Wembley dvd is getting released. Only 1 week left!
clap.gif
 
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lom kit said:
And sorry, 3000kbps may be acceptable, but not enough. here is screen of average 5500kbps. I think you see what i mean.
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The following is encoded with x264 - 3000kbps as well.. and believe me, it has far better compression rate than the DVD quality.

max0000.png
 
mjmax said:
Sorry but this is not true.. the average bitrate is 3000kbps, which is very good for h264.

captureuzi.png


Again, you're wrong. The text is not blocky, it's just badly interlaced.. probably wrong use of Yadif algorithm.


You're comparing with en reencoded version from youtube. I'm comparing the direct stream capture from Amazon, which is 108 Mb.


Don't be mistaken by the comb artifact.. the source is interlaced. You won't see that on your television as it will apply a bob filter on the fly. ;)
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err... i didnt watch the reencoded version from youtube, i was talking about the amazon clip, so please stop assuming, and being a smartass...

my point about the text, was that the text came after the video... the original VHS did not have the text on it. The fact that the text being unclear, is an example of the edits done for the amazon clip...
 
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DarkZavage said:
err... i didnt watch the reencoded version from youtube, i was talking about the amazon clip, so please stop assuming, and being a smartass...

my point about the text, was that the text came after the video... the original VHS did not have the text on it. The fact that the text being unclear, is an example of the edits done for the amazon clip...
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no need to be unpolite.. I didn't say something against you.
The text is unclear because of deinterlacing filter. Since the video is put on internet it has to be deinterlaced.
 
@mjmax
just by the look of the resolution 720x608 its cleary that the tvc mpg is processed wrong, let the field issues, black barr and etc by side. I had the impression you took the amazon stream as to what the final result of the dvd will be. where i think the tvc is true to it about colors, contrast, filtering and compression. so i think it was misunderstanding.

about the 3000kbps. I think it depends of the way it was encoded. you did more then just processing from mpg to another. the filtering you did and cleaning worked out with the low bitrate and it wasn't need to use higher, because of the source used. for web-streaming 3000 is enough. when you do straight convertion of let say blu-ray to x264mkv, to me personaly everything that uses average bitrate of under 10mbps its not useful. and those on the fly compressions YT does worsen it even more.

Anyway. did you concider to do enhancement of Yokohama ("yiuchi" version)?
 
This is Moonwalker:
This is Wembley:

ONE IS FROM A VHS. Do you people know what a VHS is? This is the best looking VHS I've ever seen. Also, if you have a youtube channel it does not make you a professional enhancer, and by no means do you know what to do with this clip and make it look like they have. People, seriously. We are days away, and we're spending it being idiots comparing it to 35mm film? It's a shame they couldn't find film, but they couldn't so this is what we got.
 
dam2040 said:
This is Moonwalker:
This is Wembley:

ONE IS FROM A VHS. Do you people know what a VHS is? This is the best looking VHS I've ever seen. Also, if you have a youtube channel it does not make you a professional enhancer, and by no means do you know what to do with this clip and make it look like they have. People, seriously. We are days away, and we're spending it being idiots comparing it to 35mm film? It's a shame they couldn't find film, but they couldn't so this is what we got.
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I've seen much better VHS.
 
Equally, people should be permitted to discuss this in any way they see fit. If you don't want ANY negativity, then look away and enjoy Bad 25 yourself lol.

I, for one, have to pinch myself daily. I can't believe a Bad concert is coming in 10 days. I've waited so many years for this. I've dreamt of it. I still feel like I'm dreaming sometimes. For those reasons, the APOM quality while no where near perfect, is entirely acceptable to me.
 
ChrisC said:
Equally, people should be permitted to discuss this in any way they see fit. If you don't want ANY negativity, then look away and enjoy Bad 25 yourself lol.
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I will, believe me. But it's just when people complain for the sake of it and it starts to get pathetic like comparing to the Moonwalker Blu-Ray. That's just a joke.
 
lom kit said:
i think the tvc is true to it about colors, contrast, filtering and compression.
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why do you think so?

lom kit said:
Anyway. did you concider to do enhancement of Yokohama ("yiuchi" version)?
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Some months ago mjjlatvia asked me for a way to remove the halos - you know these black areas around the edges - so I wrote a script to detect and fix them. It was just a try and I'll let him work on this source.. :)

Btw, Wembley also have a lot of halos... they were obvsiously present on the VHS, but they got stronger with the sharpening. They could surely have dealt with them more properly.




Yuichi's version

original0000.png

Shot at 2012-09-07

halos detection

halosred0000.jpg

Shot at 2012-09-07

halos removal

max0000.png

Shot at 2012-09-07
​

@dam2040: I think that professionals are much more competent than us to restore videos... and I would love that they used their skills to do a great job on this concert.. but the facts are here: I can see obvious mistakes in the way the video was processed. And I could say the same about the Vision's boxset. That makes me think the skills are not the top condition to do a good job.. the passion we put in work is probably more important.
 
Even if it was the u-matic, it wouldn't be blu-ray HD crystal clear gorgeousness.
It would look a lot BETTER, but apparently some people here still don't understand the difference between a tape (any tape) and film.
 
I don't really love the way Wembley looks. It's from a VHS,and the not 35 MM,which I'm sure they could of found if they tried and they know where to get it,but they didn't want to lease the footage or pay to get it or whatever that process is. So they took a short cut and took MJ's VHS. And I am more than sure they could of found or used another concert (other than wembley) on VHS or 35 MM that is better quality. Plus the way that was enhanced...

It doesn't look natural. And the VHS sucked, a lot of detail was lost. The colors look weird. I just don't like it. I watch the official video of APOM and then watch that and think,arg. And I bet if they used the 35 MM,they could of cropped it and maybe use different angles or edit it like that.

I bet they could of done some cool stuff and even make a Blu Ray off it and wide screen 16:9.
 
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It doesn't matter with me. As long as I can see the concert, I'm good. I've got HIStory Tours on DVD and I'm not really bothered by the varied qualities.

I'm still excited for this release. Sept. 18th here in the US. I pre-ordered the deluxe, hopefully I'll get it that Monday.
 
The thing that bothers me is that we now accuse Michael of loosing the films, because the Estate is not able to put the hand on them.. as if Michael was responsible for archiving everything !

Let me just come back on their declaration:

It would certainly be less expensive for the Estate to be able to create a DVD from a Umatic tape than to spend the time and money to painstakingly restore/enhance the VHS footage, but then we would not be delivering a truly authentic experience and we truly believe that watching this concert with the high quality audio will create a magical experience for all the fans as it has for us. We ultimately chose a lab that has developed its own proprietary technology for doing this kind of work (including restoration for NASA of VHS footage) in order to make the visual experience the best it can be under the circumstances.
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First, I highly doubt that it would actually be more expensive to transfer a VHS rather than obtaining the rights for the 35 mm films, remaster them very professionally and make a good montage using different camera angles..

Second, I would really like to understand why the video is damaged in several aspects whereas they paid for such a pro lab to restore it. Some would feel difficult to believe it, but I'll tell it anyway: there are fans around here who would have done a better work... and it would have been less expensive to hire them. :)

Why do I always have the feeling that they are making excuses when I read their official statements.. ? :scratch:

I want to add that I really enjoy Michael's performance on APOM.. and the concert promises to be amazing despite the low quality ! :)
 
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