mjfanboy27
Proud Member
history is a great album fans love all the songs on it the normal masses only know they don't care about earth song you are not alone and scream childhood stranger in moscow is unfortunately underestimated
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nopehistory is a great album fans love all the songs on it
I would say most of the songs on HIStory are related to the allegations and his portrayal in the media :BTW, I always wished History would be a 100% protest concept album; only songs about his side of the (allegation) story and explaining who he was instead of a few songs that touch on that subject. But now that I think of those songs: did History actually bring something new besides D.S.? I mean that one was definitely about the allegations but all the other songs..? Thematically they could have easily been on Bad or Dangerous too right..?
Yes so I was under the same impression but then I thought 'Michael basically wasn't someone to change a winning concept and so probably wanted to continue making albums like the ones before: a little something for everyone/family entertainment/same personal themes. That's why I now doubt History is that unique:I would say most of the songs on HIStory are related to the allegations and his portrayal in the media :
Scream (The Media bashing him)
Stranger In Moscow (feeling lonely and depressed after just being accused)
This Time Around (It's him being pissed about the allegations and people wanting to put him down)
D.S (Tom Sneddon Diss Track)
Money ("You'll do anything for money", this feels like it could be aimed at the people that want to gain money from him, such as the Chandlers)
Childhood (Him Justifying himself on why he is the way he is)
Tabloid Junkie (Similar theme as Scream)
2Bad (Similar Theme as This Time Around)
Also Smile, even though it's a cover could be interpreted as him saying despite all the bad that came his way, In the end there is still hope and he tries to find it by smiling.
I feel like songs such as Stranger In Moscow, This Time Around, 2BAD etc... wouldn't have ever existed if he didn't go through the 93 allegations so I really don't think they could have been on BAD or Dangerous.
I guess you've just missed my point. Of course I don't mean literally 100% of all songs.I think the song on Youtube with the most amount of views is Baby Shark, like over 11 billion or something. There's many people who listen to music in languages they don't speak or understand. What about instrumental songs or artists?
It's certainly inspirational in a lot of cases. I don't know who would aspire to drug dealing and prostitution, but evidently some people do.Do you think most of the people who listen to death metal, horrorcore, goth, showtunes, & gangsta rap do the things the songs are about?
I'm not.Are you aware of the Kidz Bop series of albums?
Yeah, that's one of the few songs that goes against the album's prevailing trend. It's pretty generic, anybody could have sung it and it would have sounded fine, you wouldn't raise an eyebrow.You are Not Alone , a nice song but a cringe video and now we know R Kelly wrote it makes it even worse.
That's pretty much how I see it as well.Similar to Dangerous but it was not quite as good.
Agreed. But when I'm listening to Childhood, I ask myself, what would I think if I heard somebody else singing it? It would just be wrong.I personally like that he included some ballads like, Childhood, Smile, Little Susie, etc.
Yeah, those three are more relatable. Notice two of them are straightforward love songs. You don't need to explain anything about them. For somebody to understand and appreciate half of HIStory, assuming somebody young who wasn't alive in the 90s, you'd need to spend a lot of time explaining the whole backstory.Michael about relatable songs: Heal the World, Speechless, ummm and that’s a difficult one, I think ummm. hmmmm .. You are my Life. AD: So you went for the ones that are kind of the biggest statements in a way, it seems to me. MJ: Yeah because it is important they are very melodic and they have a great important message that’s kind of immortal. That can relate to any time and space you know.
Wow, didn't know that. Thanks.the song was originally called Tabloid Jungle in the 80s
True. And for me, part of the interest is to see how similar those experiences are to my own. I guess that's often why people like artists who look like themselves, come from the same town, etc.If artists only made songs about other people and not about their personal experiences it would all be so uninteresting and bland imo
It definitely is interesting. But it can easily go too far. There's a difference between 1 or 2 songs on an album that say "I'm MJ and I do MJ stuff", and having 10 of them on an album.isn't it more interesting the hear the stories and experiences a very unique individual such as Michael Jackson has to share
That's what I'm getting at. When it's MJ it makes it one step harder to relate.To me a piece of art is a way for an artist to share a bit of his story, of course no one other than him can relate to being the most famous person on Earth,
I like what you did there.in a way it helps getting to know him and his life by hearing his side of the story
I'd not really thought about the believability before. I guess you're right.I agree and ironically enough his unique circumstances also made it hard to 'believe' him (for me) when he actually did songs more relatable to the public later on; like when he sings about casually walking into a park with a girl I immediately think: yeah right, MJ in park without a crowd of people![]()
Good point. Without that stuff, the album after Dangerous would have been very different. Not nearly as angry, etc.I would say most of the songs on HIStory are related to the allegations and his portrayal in the media. I feel like songs such as Stranger In Moscow, This Time Around, 2BAD etc... wouldn't have ever existed if he didn't go through the 93 allegations so I really don't think they could have been on BAD or Dangerous.
I think this way anytime someone covers some MJ songs though. There's very few people can get away with.Agreed. But when I'm listening to Childhood, I ask myself, what would I think if I heard somebody else singing it? It would just be wrong.
I think you're mistaken about that. Hip hop has been mainstream music since the 1990s. There's rappers all over the world in many languages. There's rap in Bollywood movies and in K-pop music. Nu-metal was rapping & rock music. There's even hip hop sounds in contemporary country music and there's also "hick hop". Hip hop is often used in movie trailers no matter what the movie is about. Just because you might not listen to hip hop does not mean anything. Drake, Nicki Minaj, & Lil Wayne have more songs on the Hot 100 than anyone else, along with non-rapper Taylor Swift. A lot of popular actors today are rappers like Queen Latifah, Will Smith (aka Fresh Prince), LL Cool J, Ice Cube, Ice-T, etc. Paul McCartney, B.B. King, Bob Dylan, Mick Jagger, Aretha Franklin, Michael Jackson, & many other veteran artists have done collabos with rappers or hip hop producers. Duran Duran had an album produced by Timbaland and has done remakes of rap songs like 911 Is A Joke & White Lines. In recent years, even symphony orchestras are doing hip hop music or collaborating with rappers. Classical music is mainly a white audience. Snoop Dogg has a cooking show with Martha Stewart & The Roots are the house band on The Tonight Show. The drummer from The Roots (Questlove) has written popular books and has won an Oscar for his documentary Summer Of Soul. The Oscars are as white as you can get.Like, it must be a coincidence, but there was a lot of discussion in another thread a few days ago about why rap isn't more popular with non-blacks. Here's your answer. Maybe if all the songs weren't about guns and jewellery, other people would be able to relate, then you'd sell more copies, then you wouldn't need to invent a "rap chart" or whatever, just to make the sales look good.
I literally only see white people listening to and enjoying rap.Like, it must be a coincidence, but there was a lot of discussion in another thread a few days ago about why rap isn't more popular with non-blacks. Here's your answer. Maybe if all the songs weren't about guns and jewellery, other people would be able to relate, then you'd sell more copies, then you wouldn't need to invent a "rap chart" or whatever, just to make the sales look good.
The first 2 singles Wham! ever released was Wham! Rap & Young Guns and that was in the early 1980s. Run-DMC, Fat Boys, LL Cool J, & Beastie Boys were the first hip hop acts to really get shown on MTV a lot and get regular Top 40 airplay in the mid-1980s. The was another British group from the early 1980s called Modern Romance who had rapping in their music. One of the ex-members of The Clash, formed another group called Big Audio Dynamite, which had hip hop sounds. MTV had the show Yo! MTV Raps. That was MTV, not BET. Blondie had a #1 on Top 40 radio with Rapture. Falco (Der Kommissar, Rock Me Amadeus) was rapping in German. If you look at the audience at concerts for more Afrocentric acts like Public Enemy & Digable Planets, even the audience for them is often largely white. X-Clan music videos used to get shown on MTV. There was a song in the late 1990s spoofing this called Pretty Fly For A White Guy by the alternative rock band The Offspring. The Weird Al version is Pretty Fly For A Rabbi.I literally only see white people listening to and enjoying rap.
This couldn't be further from the truth, rap has been one of the most popular genres in the mainstream for years now and if you go to a hip hop concert nowadays most of the audience is white.Like, it must be a coincidence, but there was a lot of discussion in another thread a few days ago about why rap isn't more popular with non-blacks. Here's your answer. Maybe if all the songs weren't about guns and jewellery, other people would be able to relate, then you'd sell more copies, then you wouldn't need to invent a "rap chart" or whatever, just to make the sales look good.
We've been overrun lately with bitter middle aged "anti-wokers" lately. Who blame MJ for feeding children Soda at gun point and condoning war crimes, and believe rap music is thug music made by thugs like, Quincy Jones and Teddy Riley.Yeah, very out of touch with the whole rap thing. Also "make it more than guns and jewellery" is a very bruh statement to make.
Maybe you just have trouble relating to some things generally given your previous statements.
The first 2 singles Wham! ever released was Wham! Rap & Young Guns and that was in the early 1980s. Run-DMC, Fat Boys, LL Cool J, & Beastie Boys were the first hip hop acts to really get shown on MTV a lot and get regular Top 40 airplay in the mid-1980s. The was another British group from the early 1980s called Modern Romance who had rapping in their music. One of the ex-members of The Clash, formed another group called Big Audio Dynamite, which had hip hop sounds. MTV had the show Yo! MTV Raps. That was MTV, not BET. Blondie had a #1 on Top 40 radio with Rapture. Falco (Der Kommissar, Rock Me Amadeus) was rapping in German. If you look at the audience at concerts for more Afrocentric acts like Public Enemy & Digable Planets, even the audience for them is often largely white. X-Clan music videos used to get shown on MTV. There was a song in the late 1990s spoofing this called Pretty Fly For A White Guy by the alternative rock band The Offspring. The Weird Al version is Pretty Fly For A Rabbi.
The reason the Fresh Prince got a TV sitcom on a major network is because his group DJ Jazzy Jeff & The Fresh Prince had pop hits and he had a more family friendly image than say NWA or Beastie Boys. MC Hammer & Kid n Play had Saturday morning cartoon shows. So did New Kids On The Block. They were a singing group, but they did have rapping in some of their songs, just like the group they were copied from New Edition. Just about Mariah Carey's entire career is doing collaborations with whatever rapper was popular at the moment. New Jack Swing is R&B singing over hip hop & go-go influenced sounds, which kind of killed off the traditional R&B band (that played instruments) on the radio. The NJS acts also had a more hip hop street look and image, instead of the old Temptations matching suit & tie look. That's probably a reason NJS became so popular with the younger audience at the time, it sounded more like the hip hop music they were listening to. A rap feature replaced the instrumental break in a lot of popular music. And that's what you got today with mainstream music. Jay-Z & Kanye West have won more Grammys to date than The Beatles, Elvis Presley, Michael Jackson, Bruce Springsteen, U2, & Phil Collins. The Grammy Awards recently had a Hip Hop 50 Years program on TV and a lot of the recent inductees into the Rock n Roll Hall Of Fame have been hip hop artists.
Even Donald Trump invited Kanye West & Kid Rock to the White House. Years before he became president, he was seen with several rappers and appeared on an episode of Fresh Prince Of Bel-Air. The actor Warren Beatty released a movie called Bulworth in 1998 where his character was a senator who went on TV and rapped while trying to get re-elected. Beatty is a boomer era guy, not a part of the younger generation who were the main hip hop fans.
Like, the part you bolded wasn't my assertion. I was making the point that things like a "rap chart" are just participation awards, so will always be garbage and pointless. The response was "no, we need it, otherwise how will rap songs get to #1!" So what are we saying, they get to #1 anyway, therefore proving my point that it's redundant?I think you're mistaken about that. Hip hop has been mainstream music since the 1990s. There's rappers all over the world in many languages.
I do have some rap. I've got whole albums by MC Jammer, Jazzy Jeff, I've got a whole CD where they rap in French, and, unless my memory is playing tricks on me, the first single I bought was Monie Love.Just because you might not listen to hip hop does not mean anything
I don't make a point of memorizing what's popular with different people. I don't care. My whole point was that music doesn't need to be, and should not be categorised in such a racist way.Yeah I am not sure where they get the idea that rap isn't popular with non-blacks.
It's ok. I don't need to be in touch with it - I'm not trying to make money selling rap music.Yeah, very out of touch with the whole rap thing.
Well maybe don't make comments like "make it more than guns and jewellery and it would sell better" if you don't know what you're talking about and don't have an interest in being informed.It's ok. I don't need to be in touch with it - I'm not trying to make money selling rap music.
We've been overrun lately with bitter middle aged "anti-wokers" lately. Who blame MJ for feeding children Soda at gun point and condoning war crimes, and believe rap music is thug music made by thugs like, Quincy Jones and Teddy Riley.
I wasn't talking about you in this instance though.Hold on, I guess I am 'middle aged' too and generally 'anti-woke' lol, but I was part of organizing Hip hop parties in the early 90s and have seen, and met, the biggest of the biggest. To speak with KRS-One: 'I WAS THERE! (And where were you?)'
I know, I felt the 'middle aged' though haha!I wasn't talking about you in this instance though.
One of the ex-members of The Clash, formed another group called Big Audio Dynamite, which had hip hop sounds. MTV had the show Yo! MTV Raps. That was MTV, not BET.
I don't think Michael was trying to follow any trends when making HIStory. HIStory was a much needed and necessary album for Michael to make. After 1993 he had a lot to get off his chest and he was always better expressing himself through his music than he was in interviews.
Hip hop can refer to the music, which does not necessarily have to contain rapping. There's instrumental hip hop songs, such as some of the records J Dilla released. A well known example of this is the 1983 song Rockit by jazz artist Herbie Hancock. The DJ is also part of hip hop, many of the earlier acts had a DJ who would scratch or mix breakbeats. Originally the DJ was the main star, not the rapper/MC (Grandmaster Flash & The Furious Five, Eric B & Rakim, DJ Jazzy Jeff & The Fresh Prince, Rodney-O & Joe Cooley, etc). Even if the DJ was not a part of the group name, they were there and the acts often had songs about their DJ:Note: I may be mistaking but to my understand rap was fast rhythmic talking/singing, which may not necessarily be "hip hop"... but quickly reading though some article from the origins of hip-hop, I guess that's something I should second check when I find time. Regarding the last example, I would personally classify it as a rap song, but I'm not sure where rap stops and where funk starts in this sound... Both are styles I don't know too well. Corrections welcome.
He'd have had to have been invited or have wanted to, and I can't imagine he saw it as necessary. According to Jermaine he would've tried again in 2011.Should Michael have done the Super Bowl halftime show again?
I'm just thinking if hypothetically he did it at the start of 2002, he could have promoted some Invincible songs, closed the show with Man in the Mirror due to 9/11 and his sales would have significantly went up. But he never did it.