Latest on MJJC

Preliminary Hearing 11/1/11. Day Six. Discussion Thread

elusive moonwalker said:
the guy said he got it wrong. so bring him back for what. its not like hes standing by those calculations.
Click to expand...

I don't know but the defense will use whatever angle they can. In the news they are not saying that. They are acting like this expert did the calculations in the autopsy and realized he made a mistake. They are not saying he was just giving an opinion etc and made a mistake. That's how it is coming across to me.
 
of course the media will say that. they want mj to be a druggie who caused his own death and will take anything they can even when its wrong he wasnt involved in the autopsy. thats how it works with mj
 
elusive moonwalker said:
of course the media will say that. they want mj to be a druggie who caused his own death and will take anything they can even when its wrong he wasnt involved in the autopsy. thats how it works with mj
Click to expand...

I just wish for once they wouldn't do that to Michael.
 
the prosecution timeline is somewhere between 10.40 and 11.00. thedefence have to defend against that.they are using the pros argument.
Click to expand...

no, the prosecution so far has not told them what was the time of death or at least what is the prosecution's estimation of when MJ's life really ended.

Based on the testimony, MJ died between 11:51 and 12:03. You don't cough after propofol injection you would be out within 5 seconds, you don't cough under propofol IV, you cough when you are waking up from propofol.

Flagan's theory as laid by the defence "yes Murray induced sleep using a syringe but it was infused for 3 to 5 minutes starting 10:40 am, its effect would have worn off within minutes and at 11 am MJ was sleeping but without propofol effect, which the expert agreed to.

They are saying after that, if MJ died of acute propofol intoxication, then it had nothing to do with what Murray gave at 10:40 am , understandably "after 40 minutes would an infusion of 25 mg given for 3 to 5 minutes have any effect on him? " the expert replied NO.

He brought the 2 minutes argument.

The coroner said Murray told investigators "I went to the bathroom" he had to walk through long corridor to reach the bathroom, Jackson was heavy sedate by propofol and then he woke up and administered propofol to himself and stopped breathing ( he's talking about I left after ten minutes of that dose for two minutes only ) , all that happened within two minutes maximum and that's why he ruled it a homicide because it did not make sense to him ( later he said the expert told them mj could not do it due to the IV configuration)

Falagan asked him with 150mg of propofol what would be the onset of sedation especially at 4.5 mg blood concentration, the coroner said he believed it was within one minute , he said MJ received propofol on 10:40 am , the effect of propofol at 12 would have worn off , MJ would be sober enough to do it himself at 12 and at 4.5 blood concentration, one minute would have been enough .


He brought the 2 minutes and death within one minute later with the expert also
. The expert said Murray deviated from standard care when he left his patient without monitoring for 2 minutes and did not perform CPR appropriately

Flagan said but at 4.5 ( apparently antemortem they were higher by 30%) how could Murray possibly brought him back, he was already gone , how could have he known he drunk propofol or injected propofol?

The expert explained a very complicated technic to bring breathing back , and to sound more convincing he said Murray should have predicted MJ would wae up and inject himself or drink propofol cus he was a known addict, he repeated this words four times " he knew he had a known addict in the room, he should have never allowed propofol to be into his reach"


Yes, the media said this is a point for the prosecution, but if a jury hears expert on propofol say that, Murray will walk.

That expert throw MJ under the bus to make an argument. He mentioned the word known addict at least 4 times .
 
marebear said:
I just wish for once they wouldn't do that to Michael.
Click to expand...
unfortunate the media has always dissed Michael...and now that he is gone...they continue to make stuff up...I dont think it will ever change. I blame the media for alot of things when it comes to Michael. They have said alot of bad things about him over the years..and the poor guy had to learn to put on brave face and act like it didn't bother him...but we all know that it did..why wouldn't it...Michael was human..with real human feelings and emotions.
 
no, the prosecution so far has not told them what was the time of death or at least what is the prosecution's estimation of when MJ's life really ended.
Click to expand...
yeah thats correct. the time im talking about 10.40-11 is the time of the dip being given according to the pros
 
They are saying after that, if MJ died of acute propofol intoxication, then it had nothing to do with what Murray gave at 10:40 am , understandbly "after 40 minutes would an infusion of 25 mg given for 3 to 5 minutes have any effect on him? " the expert replied NO. (soundmind)

but that is if he gave 25 mg.. the blood was higher then 4,5 approx 5.85 if you count 30% so that means that if he gave michael 200 mg of propofol and he went away michael died and when he came back it was to late or he didnt know what to do..
 
xthunderx2 said:
unfortunate the media has always dissed Michael...and now that he is gone...they continue to make stuff up...I dont think it will ever change. I blame the media for alot of things when it comes to Michael. They have said alot of bad things about him over the years..and the poor guy had to learn to put on brave face and act like it didn't bother him...but we all know that it did..why wouldn't it...Michael was human..with real human feelings and emotions.
Click to expand...

I agree. I blame the media a lot for what they did to Michael and how the public saw him. Celebrities have to deal with crap like that but with Michael is was character assasination. They never treated him like a human being. I will never forget that.
 
Soundmind said:
no, the prosecution so far has not told them what was the time of death or at least what is the prosecution's estimation of when MJ's life really ended.

Based on the testimony, MJ died between 11:51 and 12:03. You don't cough after propofol injection you would be out within 5 seconds, you don't cough under propofol IV, you cough when you are waking up from propofol.

Flagan's theory as laid by the defence "yes Murray induced sleep using a syringe but it was infused for 3 to 5 minutes starting 10:40 am, its effect would have worn off within minutes and at 11 am MJ was sleeping but without propofol effect, which the expert agreed to.

They are saying after that, if MJ died of acute propofol intoxication, then it had nothing to do with what Murray gave at 10:40 am , understandably "after 40 minutes would an infusion of 25 mg given for 3 to 5 minutes have any effect on him? " the expert replied NO.

He brought the 2 minutes argument.

The coroner said Murray told investigators "I went to the bathroom" he had to walk through long corridor to reach the bathroom, Jackson was heavy sedate by propofol and then he woke up and administered propofol to himself and stopped breathing ( he's talking about I left after ten minutes of that dose for two minutes only ) , all that happened within two minutes maximum and that's why he ruled it a homicide because it did not make sense to him ( later he said the expert told them mj could not do it due to the IV configuration)

Falagan asked him with 150mg of propofol what would be the onset of sedation especially at 4.5 mg blood concentration, the coroner said he believed it was within one minute , he said MJ received propofol on 10:40 am , the effect of propofol at 12 would have worn off , MJ would be sober enough to do it himself at 12 and at 4.5 blood concentration, one minute would have been enough .


He brought the 2 minutes and death within one minute later with the expert also
. The expert said Murray deviated from standard care when he left his patient without monitoring for 2 minutes and did not perform CPR appropriately

Flagan said but at 4.5 ( apparently antemortem they were higher by 30%) how could Murray possibly brought him back, he was already gone , how could have he known he drunk propofol or injected propofol?

The expert explained a very complicated technic to bring breathing back , and to sound more convincing he said Murray should have predicted MJ would wae up and inject himself or drink propofol cus he was a known addict, he repeated this words four times " he knew he had a known addict in the room, he should have never allowed propofol to be into his reach"


Yes, the media said this is a point for the prosecution, but if a jury hears expert on propofol say that, Murray will walk.

That expert throw MJ under the bus to make an argument. He mentioned the word known addict at least 4 times .
Click to expand...
I thought the testimony that was given was that if Murray did come back in that two minute time window and saw Michael not breathing..all he had to do was tilt Michael head back and use the ambu bag and help get oxygen into MJ's lungs..because his heart would of been that last thing to stop....and it take s a little time for his heart to stop..he would of had to of stopped breathing first..so that tells them that Murray was gone for a hell of alot longer that 2 minutes. And as far as the testimony him saying that Murray never should of left the propofol with the reach of Michael because he was an addict..the guy is full of shit..Michael was not an addict. They need a knew expert......and you have pointed out he called Michael an addict multiple times..
 
Last edited:
So Soundmind are you saying if they bring back that expert Murray will walk?
 
I thougt the testimony that was gien was that if Murray did come back in that two minute time window and aw Michael not breathing..alll he had to do was tilt Michael head back and use the ambu bag and help get oxygen into MJ's lungs..because his heart would of been that last thing to stop....and it take s a little time for his heart to stop..he would of had to od stopped breathing first..so that tells them that Murray was one for a hell of alot longer that 2 minutes.
Click to expand...
yeah he did say that
 
The syringe injected into the IV port was 10cc, so the last dose was 100mg=10ml propofol maximum,

In all the amount in his body was 150mg + -, That's an injection to induce sleep (60 + - according to UCLA doctor ) which was given before all the other sedatives and probably much earlier than 10:40 am but there's no way to determine when exactly. and the last bolus injection which killed him immediately and based on the syringe did not exceed 100mg but given rapidly.
 
Did Murray even have a ambu bag ready? and he didn't even have oxygen did he?
 
If Murray felt MJ was becoming addicted to it and he gave it anyway, where is the charge of prescribing to an addict? especially if the prosecutor allowed that 'expert' to say a known addict.
 
Sophielo said:
Michael is never coming back but the right decision was made today to take Murray to trial. We just have to pray the right result is attained at the end. Justice for Michael.
Click to expand...

Yes bringing him to trial is the right decision, I agree. But I don't feel the right result will be attained.

I have never been comfortable with evaluating a sentence. Should someone get 10 years, 15 years , what is the fair sentence ? I hope I'll never be called for jury duty, because here juries are only for major crimes, and the jury has to decide on the verdict and the sentence, with the help of professional judges.

6 or 7 years ago, a famous french singer was convicted for killing his girlfriend (she was a famous actress). It happened in Lithuania, so he was convicted and sentenced there, according to Lithuanian laws.
He was convicted based on his version of the story, which was they got into an argument, she lost control, he slapped her 4 times in the face, she fell down, unconscious.
She fell into a coma, he did not realise how serious it was - he said he thought she was sleeping. They had been drinking that night. He was upset, so he called a lot of people to tell them about the incident, someone eventually came to check on her, realised it was serious, and called for medical assistance, 6 or 7 hours after the slaps. She had some sort of brain swelling (during the slaps her brain had hit the skull too hard apparently), and she died a few days later. She might have been saved if she had been treated immediately.

He was convicted based on his version not really because they really know what happened , they were alone in that room, but because his version was plausible : he was NOT caught lying. He did show remorse, and expressed it to her family during the trial. He had no history of violence, they never found a single witness who testified for that.

He killed someone, not intentionally, it happened very quickly, he never thought that 4 slaps in the face would have such consequences, and as he is not a medical professional, he did not recognise a coma. That's what he was convicted for.

He got 8 years, and served 4.

Now, I'm not saying 8 years is a fair sentence, I don't know that.

Compare that to what Murray did. He killed someone, probably not intentionally.
He bought over 250 vials of propofol over a 2 months period of time, and never took the time to worry about the possible side effects, or what drug propofol should not be mixed with ???

4 years maximum ??? This is so upsetting.

I hope he will get 4 years, without parole.
 
StacyJ said:
Did Murray even have a ambu bag ready? and he didn't even have oxygen did he?
Click to expand...
I believe they said the ambu bag was in the closet..and when the paramedics checked the oxygen tanks..they were empty...
 
Ingelief said:
but that is if he gave 25 mg.. the blood was higher then 4,5 approx 5.85 if you count 30% so that means that if he gave michael 200 mg of propofol and he went away michael died and when he came back it was to late or he didnt know what to do..
Click to expand...

The 4.5 or even 5.85 would probably mean it was a lot more than 200 mg. I don't know that of course, but it sounds like a lot more than 25 mg and even 200 mg to me.
 
I thougt the testimony that was gien was that if Murray did come back in that two minute time window and aw Michael not breathing..alll he had to do was tilt Michael head back and use the ambu bag and help get oxygen into MJ's lungs..because his heart would of been that last thing to stop....and it take s a little time for his heart to stop..he would of had to od stopped breathing first..so that tells them that Murray was one for a hell of alot longer that 2 minutes. And as far as the testimony him saying that Murray never should of left the propofol with the reach of Michael because he was an addict..the guy is full of hit..Michael was not an addict.
Click to expand...

Yes, they did say that, trials and tribulations said it was very complicated and had to do with tongue ...etc but you don't tell a jury of average people send this doctor to jail eventhough MJ might have done it himself , you don't leave them believing you are not sure what really went down that day and you are an expert who reviewed the case for months .

Murray did not LEAVE , not even for one minute , not even for one SECOND, you don't cough after being injected with propofol YOU DON'T . Murray was there beside MJ when everything happened HE SAW EVERYTHING .

Flagan was throwing theories and the coroner and experts were explaining why even if those theories turned out to be true he was the one to blame, but that's won't help them with the jury. He did it means there is no "if" and "so what I will still blame him"
It would take one juror to say "blame him as much as you want he did not give the last dose , he won't go to jail"
 
Flagan was throwing theories and the coroner and experts were explaining why even if those theories turned out to be true he was the one to blame, but that's won't help them with the jury. He did it means there is no "if" and "so what I will still blame him"
It would take one juror to say "blame him as much as you want he did not give the last dose , he won't go to jail"
Click to expand...
guess it depends on the judges instructions to the jury. ie u dont have to believe he gave the last injection but u can still find him guilty if u bleive his actions of not monitoring,using it outside of a hos etc where so negligent that it led to a death.

becasue at the end of the day its a he said she said case.unless theres something in the toxics that can show flannigan theory doesnt fit. the problem for the pros is that in putting thier case out there the defence can just build a defence or an excuse for every action/timing.like we ahve seen with he then fell asleep for 40 mins etc. it can never be provern one way or the other. its down to credibility. ie attacking a man who cant defend himself or murrays credibility with all the covering up
 
Last edited:
Soundmind said:
Yes, they did say that, trials and tribulations said it was very complicated and had to do with tongue ...etc but you don't tell a jury of average people send this doctor to jail eventhough MJ might have done it himself , you don't leave them believing you are not sure what really went down that day and you are an expert who reviewed the case for months .

Murray did not LEAVE , not even for one minute , not even for one SECOND, you don't cough after being injected with propofol YOU DON'T . Murray was there beside MJ when everything happened HE SAW EVERYTHING .

Flagan was throwing theories and the coroner and experts were explaining why even if those theories turned out to be true he was the one to blame, but that's won't help them with the jury. He did it means there is no "if" and "so what I will still blame him"
It would take one juror to say "blame him as much as you want he did not give the last dose , he won't go to jail"
Click to expand...
I understand what it is you are trying to say about the jury coming to a conclusion of guilt..but the prosecutor has not shown their entire hand yet..for that we can be sure. And may I ask how you know that Murray never left Michael's side?? were you in that room..?? because if you were then..that clears up the whole case right there....you can go give testimony. Because you seem to be the only one THAT DOES know what Murray did..other than Murray himself.
 
About the medical license being suspended in California....I am CERTAIN Nevada and Texas will do the same. I doubt they will let a doctor practise in their state when in another state it has been shown in COURT that he is a "danger to the public" if he he is allowed to continue. Also....just looking at Murray's defense's arguements, it becomes clear they know that too...They were like "You want it to have a punishment effect...but Dr. Murray doesn't even have a practise in California...he isn't treating any other patient's in California..." As in....if you suspend his license...it won't have any effect on Dr. Murray. WELL....if it doesn't...why do you try to ask the judge to NOT suspend his license with ANY kind of agruements at all then? UNLESS, you know that it will cause the other states to follow. OR...unless you know he does indeed have patients in California and his main income comes from those patients. And if he will lose that income, he won't be able to pay child support...andlet's not forget that if he will be behind with his child support payments, Nevada will immediately suspend his license too based on THAT.

Another thing....Murray will be on trial for involuntary manslaughter. That means...if he was reckless or not as a doctor. The judge just ordered his license to be suspended because Murray is a "danger to the public". The judge heard the evidence....what do you think his verdict would be? Not guilty? So in my opinion it already is very telling from how the judge ruled, what the outcome will be. Sure, you gotta convince the jurors...but the jurors also need to judge based on EVIDENCE. They won't be allowed to judge based on "gut feeling" or what their personal opinion is. And if one juror for example would say Murray is "not guilty", I would bet the other jurors would point to him/her what facts make it clear he most definately is guilty.

EVEN if Michael would have drunk the Propofol...it won't change the fact that MURRAY is guilty. Where did the Propofol come from ? Murray ordered busloads of it. Who started giving the Propofol? Dr. Murray. Under which doctor's treatment did MJ even DEVELOP this alleged addicion of his? DR. MURRAY!!! And this is important because it becomes from Dr. Murray's OWN statement....he said he was concerned MJ was DEVELOPING an addiction. He didn't say MJ already was addicted...no, he said "developing" as in "becoming" an addict. So....IF Michael was addicted to it...which doctor can be made responsible for the addiction? Dr. Murray. Which doctor did NOT make sure the emergency equipment and drugs you HAVE to have when giving Propofol is there? Dr. Murray. Which doctor administered Propofol without having a person there who knows how to assist with respiratory problems and knows how to intubate? Dr. Murray. Which doctor left a patient, who has gotten Propofol and other sedatives, alone in the room? Dr. Murray. Which doctor gave all the sedatives, etc. and not only left the room, but also didn't MONITOR the patient? Dr. Murray. Which doctor knew his patient (and I am putting this because Murray is trying to use it as a defense) is addicted to Propofol but a) still gave that to his patient and b ) left the patient alone with Propofol next to the patiet with syringes and needles and with a working i.v....Dr. Murray. Which doctor found a patient not breathing but waited over 20 minutes to call 911? Dr. Murray. Which doctor gave CPR on a bed. Dr. Murray. Which doctor tried to hide evidence? Dr. Murray. Which doctor did not tell the EMTs or the doctors at UCLA what drugs exactly he had given to the patient? Dr. Murray. Which doctor did not keep patient records while treating MJ? Dr. Murray.

So, even if MJ drank it....it won't change anything. Also, WHEN was MJ supposed to have drunk it anyways??? Don't forget that Propofol leaves the body fairly quickly, so if it was found MJ must have been drinking it fairly shortly before he died. And Dr. Murray has insisted that he left the room ONLY for two minutes MAXIMUM. So again, the same proplem as with the "self-injection"....would MJ really be alert enough that he'd be able to have the needed coordination to be SO FAST that he could open several Propofol bottles and then either pour or use a syringe to get the Propofol into his juice, then drink it, and then stop breathing....all that it less than two minutes?? Don't think so. And there is no way any juror will buy that either...because that is ridicilous. And EVEN if MJ would have managed that somehow, that would mean that he would have JUST stopped breathing, like right when Murray came back, so he was not beyond being saved at that point. Which again brings back Murray's responsibility as the only doctor there, especially as the only DOCTOR there who has admitted he administered Propofol. He was SUPPOSED to know exactly what to do an how to help the patient if he has trouble breathing. Don't forget that when giving Propofol you need to be PREPARED for those EXACT problems. So if Murray came out and saw MJ not breathing he SHOULD have been able to help MJ like it was nothing. Like he would not have bene doing anything else in his whole life. It should have been a ROUTINE to him. Because WHAT would have he done if MJ would have stopped breathing when HE gave the Propofol? What? What was his plan? So, again...whether MJ self-administered or if MUrray gave it to him really is beside the point. Dr. Murray was the doctor there who was supposed to be monitoring and helping the patient, and not only did he leave that patient alone, but he also did NOT KNOW how to help. So what was he doing administering Propofol in the first place? Itis COMPLETELY insane and totally reckless!

If Murray will now change his timeline because the 2 minutes won't give MJ enough time to wake up, open the bottles, get it in the juice, drink it and go back to bed and stop breathing...and say he was away and on the phone for over 40 minutes, then things will become even MORE troubling (sp?) for him. Because he would admit to have left a sedated patient ALONE with no monitoring that would have even alerted him with a SOUND, for 40 minutes. So in that case too whether MJ drank it or not would pretty much become secondary because it is INSANE to leave a sedated patient alone. ESPECIALLY one who has gotten Propofol!!! Also, if Muray says he was away for 40 minutes and not 2 minutes...then he also will admit has lied to the police officers from the beginning. Because he said he ONLY left for less than 2 minutes to go to the bathroom. So his credibility would completely be gone by then because nothing he has said so far makes any sense and there has already been a pattern of lying. So if he will admit to have been lying to the POLICE OFFICERS....do you understand what that will do to him?

So again, no matter WHAT way you twist it....there is no way out for Dr. Murray.
 
Last edited:
yeah because I'm on the defense team , right?


the perimortem abrasions , as stated by the coroner himself the onset of sedation was one minute with 4.5 concentration MJ must have died within one minute. I know MJ did not do it because he could not SIMPLY he could not. So who caused the perimortem abrasions ? Murray , unless you believe someone other than Murray was there to move MJ while he was dying.

Add to that the girlfriend testimony. She heard someone coughing and she said it was not Murray. If he was given propofol via an IV drip, he would not be coughing he would have died and no one even knew when. If he injected himself while Murray was in the bathroom, he would have been out within 3 to 5 SECONDS and the mistress would not have heard him coughing. If Murray injected him and then left the room and returned two minutes later MJ would have been already dead and again the mistress would not have heard HIM coughing .

Logical thinking is a bless. Coughing means MJ was WELL , ALIVE AND BREATHING.

The only possibility remains : he was injected after she heard him coughing . So where that put Murray? exactly at the crime scene and it would explain the perimortem abrasions that occured within the survial time which did not exceed 1 minute based on the VERY high concentration in his blood . Clear?
 
Soundmind said:
Murray did not LEAVE , not even for one minute , not even for one SECOND, you don't cough after being injected with propofol YOU DON'T . Murray was there beside MJ when everything happened HE SAW EVERYTHING .
Click to expand...

We cannot assume it was Michael who was coughing. Nicole Alvarez said she heard "commotion, and coughing." She didn't say/know WHO was coughing. She assumed Murray dropped the phone, so she couldn't know if it was Murray coughing, or Michael, or someone else. No way to know.

Assuming that that is true, that Murray was "right there" (which I do not assume, given the number of times Murray has lied/contradicted himself, or neglected to give key information in a timely way), if he was THERE, then Michael could have been saved.

If Murray was there and "saw everything," THAT was the moment to call 911, and as we know . . . he didn't. At that point, Michael's heart would not have stopped yet. If Murray lacked oxygen, and the ambu bag was in the closet, and if he lacked the proper medications, he should have PUT MICHAEL IN A CAR, and driven him to the hospital. It was only minutes away!

But then, all this is assuming that Michael administered the fatal dose to himself. Which I think he did not.
 
she said it was not Murray , the voice she heard was not Murray SHE DID SAY THAT how many times we have to say speak for yourself and don't say we don't know.


I for myself, don't believe in this laughable conspiracy theories , and it could have been someone else , go discuss that in the conspiracy section not here.

A witness testified UNDER OATH , that between 11:51 and 12:03 SHE HEARD SOMEONE ELSE coughing in that room and the voice she did not recognize as Murray.

Do you believe the defense is pleased with this testimony?

If MJ was coughing then THERE IS NO WAY HE INJECTED HIMSELF WHILE MURRAY WAS OUT.

She delivered the most damaging testimony so far placing Murray beside MJ immediately before his death and you still argue WE DON'T KNOW , come on now
 
i dont know if coughing is a fact she heared that maybe she said and it could easily be something else

"milka i agree with you... the amount what is in his blood never is spoken off

soundmind said less than 200mg but i dont know why he-she said that?

5,85 is propably more the level in blood so that means higher..


and that mean if he not used a drip he killed michael with a bolus injection with at least 200mg..

then he left to make calles and came back to late

no way he is calling in the room than michael would certanly not sleep..
 
ok soo I found something VERY intere4ting about propofol and cough...you cough AFTER propfol is administered..why because the fumes get in the lungs and aggravates people with asthma...here read this//


quaker1996
03-19-2008, 05:44 PM

Have also noticed many people cough after the white stuff goes in.

Anybody else experiencing this?
This may help (even though generic propofol contains 0.25 mg/mL sodium metabisulfite it may help to explain the cough):

http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/picrender.fcgi?artid=1368138&blobtype=pdf
"Inhaled metabisulphite produced dose dependent bronchoconstriction in all atopic nonasthmatic and all atopic asthmatic subjects who were non-selected volunteers. Inhaled metabisulphite had a metallic taste and caused cough at concentrations above 25 mg ml-1."

IceDoc
03-19-2008, 06:21 PM

This may help (even though generic propofol contains 0.25 mg/mL sodium metabisulfite it may help to explain the cough):

http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/picrender.fcgi?artid=1368138&blobtype=pdf
"Inhaled metabisulphite produced dose dependent bronchoconstriction in all atopic nonasthmatic and all atopic asthmatic subjects who were non-selected volunteers. Inhaled metabisulphite had a metallic taste and caused cough at concentrations above 25 mg ml-1."

And...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/...=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsP anel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

Demonstrated that the sulfite preservative prevented the bronchodilation that propofol normally provides. In sheep.









http://forums.studentdoctor.net/archive/index.php/t-506105.html
 
maybe if is testified as a fact that he gave the lethal amound then left (1100) and came back when michael was not breathing at 1200.. then its murder right?

leaving for an hour and giving the lethal dose..

wel whatever happens some things need to be proven yet... hope they consult alot of smart forensics maybe like CSI can figure something out ;) lol
 
but he was death at least 30 min the paremedics think, so the coughing could not been micheal

i dont believe that at all... he was already that, so maybe the stress was during 11.00 alone stressing not breathing.. pfff
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top