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Preliminary Hearing 11/1/11. Day Six. Discussion Thread
- Thread starter ivy
- Start date
Is this a fact? Are you 100% sure? I really hope so, because this would give me some hope that they still might add to the charges later on.
Strange Blues
Proud Member
I dunno about the situation in the US, but I've read that it's one of the general principles of criminal procedure that the prosecutor can add new charges or alter the original criminal charge as long as the new charge relates to the same events as the original one. The accused then has the right to state their opinion on the new charge.
Thanks for responding, Strange Blues. I feel a whole lot better now! Murray's license was suspended, the case goes to trial AND there's still hope of added charges as the trial goes further.
Feeling optimistic atm.
Feeling optimistic atm.
mijaons
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I don't think they're gonna add any more charges after this 
My fear is that the prosecution may goof up. Also, I'm terribly scared that they may show some pictures. Dear God, spare him that at least! He's been through enough! My stomach churns. THAT is not worth Murray being in jail for a couple of yrs.
My fear is that the prosecution may goof up. Also, I'm terribly scared that they may show some pictures. Dear God, spare him that at least! He's been through enough! My stomach churns. THAT is not worth Murray being in jail for a couple of yrs.classic
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I was thinking about a type of charge such as obstruction of justice. But, I am wondering if this hasn't been done because the statements that doctors and EMTs contributed to Murray that they didn't believe were not statements made to law enforcement after the investigation was officially launched. I wonder if there is another law that would cover such that could possibly be tacked on later if the prosecution feels that the testimony is strong enough.
Autumn II
Proud Member
I don't believe it's possible now to increase the charges to Murder 2, unless there is new evidence. As of now, there are no additional charges to Involuntary Manslaughter.
Obstruction of justice would seem to be warranted as an additional charge, and there are others. These were mentioned in the petition. For "stacked charges," I think these can still be added to Involuntary Manslaughter.
"Hiding evidence," fleeing from the hospital and not talking to police for two days, and not mentioning the propofol, all would seem to fall under the category of obstruction, as well as under other categories of charges.
elusive moonwalker
Guests
morning afternoon all. just catching up from last night. so we have the drama about the expert who got the numbers wrong. if the guy on the stand turned round and said sorry i got it wrong i miscalcuated then thats it it doesnt matter. the defence arent goona use him when hes already said i made a mistake.its good paper talk but nothing else. hes not even trying to to contridict what the coroner said hes just crap at maths.mountain out of a mole hill. we all laughed the othe day when the defence brought up this defence, now some are getting twitchy. its no less laughable today as it was then. especially when u have the documented evidence of what the cpr did to mj
its 12 either way. all 12 have to say guilty or all 12 have to say not gulity. u get a 11-1 saying gulity or not guilty its a mistrial and depending on which way the 11-1 goes ie if its 11-1 guilty u will have a re trial like with robert blake. 11-1 not guilty then that will prob be it and they wont re try but its not a case of getting 11-1 saying guilty and that mean its a not guilty verdict. it has to be unanimous either way.
I don't think they're gonna add any more charges after this
I`m so with you with this. I can`t even think about it. It would kill Mrs. Jackson for sure. OMG.
PrincessMichaela
Proud Member
Completely agree...
AMEN. :agree:
Along with:
"A summer's disregard,
a broken bottle top,
and one man's soul."
...
elusive moonwalker
Guests
post of the week! spot on. only mj could be faced with such B.S u had all the crap in 03-05 about hot air ballons and there been no clocks and kidnapping .if that were happening to anyone else it would be laughed out of court but cause its mj and 20 plus years of media brainwashing anything is possible. exactly the same here. mj is treated like a subhuman and has been for decades. where anything is possible. is this why so many were shocked when he left us casue bloody hell he was a human being after all. it disgusts me
I'm still saying if it would have been someone else and not Michael Jackson, this whole case would have gone an entire different way, the way he is treated although he's gone for 18 months is utterly disgusting.
agree with you this is just heart breaking. there is only this much a person can take, and God knows this man took so much for so many years from so many different sides, idk, if it would have been me I wouldn't have been able to withstand the on going bs for decades and decades from money hungry/media hungry/jealous/immoral assholes.
............
MyLifeMJ
Proud Member
Please my dear GOD, help Michael, his kid, family and us-fans.
i want to see the real justice and pray for that everyday.ray:
it hurts my brain, my stomach, my whole body and my soul. i don't know where i walk, what i say, what i do. What i do only know is waiting for justice. i hope these times will pass without anything which can hurt Michael or his kids.
i hope they are going to add other charges if it's possible as you said.
just keep praying my dear friends and remember GOD is on our side!!!ray:
i want to see the real justice and pray for that everyday.
ray:it hurts my brain, my stomach, my whole body and my soul. i don't know where i walk, what i say, what i do. What i do only know is waiting for justice. i hope these times will pass without anything which can hurt Michael or his kids.
i hope they are going to add other charges if it's possible as you said.
just keep praying my dear friends and remember GOD is on our side!!!
ray: Ingelief
Proud Member
Wel i dont think this works what u do. the 70 mg is when he was at autopsy, whatever he drank already for a part is procesed by the body, so you cant calculate it like that ivy.
If 4,5 in his blood is higher abou 30 % you have 5,85 in his blood
5,85 in his blood what amount of giving comes with that?????? 300 mg?
Also the tonque is always checked because its a important place with alot of information how a patient dies. so thats a good thing they checked it.
i only can asume that drinking it coused vomiting so doubt that but they still have to proof it in trial what happens when a person drinks it...
than about the mistake, i dont get exactly what now the true is, but i really believe what milka said where not out of the woods yet they will use that at the trial..
it also can explain why the charges where not changed because of the facts that are not there yet.. fingerprints amounts that were given and a exact timeline is not proven yet..
so that are importand stuff.. i was suprised to read the closing statement of the defense, they were going by 10.40 propofol, did i read that right? so thats murrays timeline going to be?
Ingelief
Proud Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by marebear
I am sorry for the dumb question but didn't he already have an arraignment before?
what is an arraignment? when does this goes to trial? and is the petition we wrote send to the pros?
is er a way we can ask them why there were no more charges? so we know more about it... would be helpfull...
i dont know if there contact info so we can contact them..
ps there is still a pissed patient of murray, read on tmz... pff what an idiot..
Originally Posted by marebear
I am sorry for the dumb question but didn't he already have an arraignment before?
what is an arraignment? when does this goes to trial? and is the petition we wrote send to the pros?
is er a way we can ask them why there were no more charges? so we know more about it... would be helpfull...
i dont know if there contact info so we can contact them..
ps there is still a pissed patient of murray, read on tmz... pff what an idiot..
Sophielo
Proud Member
The news came quite late last night so haven't had the chance to get here to put down my thoughts. I know some people are angry that the charges are not Murder 2 but that is what the court has decided, that there is enough evidence to stand for IM. Its going to be a long hard ride for us all and like 2005 we're going to see people try and slay Michael's character and reveal unecessary details about his private life. Murray needs to pay for what he did. His recklesness and neglect caused a man to unecessarily die, a mother to lose a son, and for three children to loose their father. Sure we'll never get true justice as Michael is never coming back but the right decision was made today to take Murray to trial. We just have to pray the right result is attained at the end. Justice for Michael.
Ingelief
Proud Member
elusive moonwalker
Guests
the prosecution timeline is somewhere between 10.40 and 11.00. thedefence have to defend against that.they are using the pros argument.
StacyJ
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they are going by that timeline because that's what Murray told them. I do believe Murray's interview with the police was recorded correct?
StacyJ
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another thing that bothers me with Murray is the fact that he doesn't know his own timeline. That proves he has no idea what time he was medicating his patient. There is no record of the meds he gave, the amounts or the times. That is pure stupidity and negligence.
Ingelief
Proud Member
good point stacy
I was watching different news shows this morning and they bring up the mistake the expert made. But they don't say he was an independent expert and did not have anything to do with the autopsy. That bothers me. People have the idea that maybe Michael gave himself the propofol. I know that the idea was already out there but this didn't help. I worry about the jury and how they will think.
StacyJ
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I would hope that the real coroner who did the autopsy will be the one testifying during the trial.
StacyJ
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thank you.. I also believe that Murray thought he was going to get away with it. He waited as long as he did to call 911 because he knew that propofol leaves the body quickly. He was hoping that the propofol would've been gone from MJ and then he could've come back to the house and got his medical bag in which he put all the meds in.
Murray ain't slick. He was more interested in covering his butt than saving MJ. He knew MJ was gone as soon as he injected that propofol.
elusive moonwalker
Guests
he created a timeline of that b4 he met with the police
I hope so but someone here yesterday mentioned that the defense could bring that expert back. I just hate how things gets twisted and not everything is reported. Just bits and pieces and people don't see the rest.
elusive moonwalker
Guests
murray said he gave it around 11am. or mj fell asleep around that time. which is the same thing. the amount given put u asleep for between 3.5 mins yet murray claims mj then slept for 40 mins (not medically possible id preusme?) once the diprivan wears off thats it u wake up. it not like he stayed asleep naturally. that then takes u to the timline of finding him at around 12
elusive moonwalker
Guests
the guy said he got it wrong. so bring him back for what. its not like hes standing by those calculations.
elusive moonwalker
Guests
Conrad Murray's license suspended in CA -- are NV and TX next?
January 12th, 2011
After more than a year and a half since the death of Michael Jackson, Dr. Conrad Murray has been ordered to stand trial for involuntary manslaughter and has had his medical license suspended in the state of California.
The Los Angeles Times reports that the cardiologist for the "King of Pop" must now notify officials in Nevada and Texas of his medical suspension in California -- an action that Murray's lawyers fear could trigger a domino effect and cause those 2 states to revoke his license.
Judge Pastor told the courtroom on Tuesday that if the Dr. Murray were to retain his license it "would constitute an imminent danger to public safety."
Attorney's for the cardiologist have battled arduously to allow the physician to remain in practice.
On April 2, 2010, lawyers for 57-year old physician filed papers with the California court stating that without his medical license, Murray would be unable to support his children or adequately provide for his defense.
Negotiators for the cardiologist also struck deals with medical boards in Texas and Nevada -- getting officials to agree to overlook infringements if the doctor would refrain from sedating patients or administering any heavy sedative medications used by anesthesiologists.
However, now that California Judge Michael Pastor has heard sufficient testimony to bring Murray to trial, the doctor faces a whole new quagmire of legal issues and reviews in Texas and Nevada.
Comcast.net reports that Judge Pastor told the court, "Circumstances have changed -- they have changed dramatically. There are extraordinary circumstances that mandate my approving the request of the [California] Medical Board. Overall consideration is the protection of the public. The continued practice by Dr. Murray does pose an imminent danger to the state of California."
Dr. Murray is currently scheduled to be arraigned in court on Jan. 25, where he is expected to enter a plea of "not guilty."
Did you know? Despite Judge Pastor ordering Dr. Murray to stand trial for involuntary manslaughter, the judge refused the prosecutor's request that Conrad Murray's bail be increased from $75,000 to $300,000.
http://www.examiner.com/canada-celebrity-h...-nv-and-tx-next
January 12th, 2011
After more than a year and a half since the death of Michael Jackson, Dr. Conrad Murray has been ordered to stand trial for involuntary manslaughter and has had his medical license suspended in the state of California.
The Los Angeles Times reports that the cardiologist for the "King of Pop" must now notify officials in Nevada and Texas of his medical suspension in California -- an action that Murray's lawyers fear could trigger a domino effect and cause those 2 states to revoke his license.
Judge Pastor told the courtroom on Tuesday that if the Dr. Murray were to retain his license it "would constitute an imminent danger to public safety."
Attorney's for the cardiologist have battled arduously to allow the physician to remain in practice.
On April 2, 2010, lawyers for 57-year old physician filed papers with the California court stating that without his medical license, Murray would be unable to support his children or adequately provide for his defense.
Negotiators for the cardiologist also struck deals with medical boards in Texas and Nevada -- getting officials to agree to overlook infringements if the doctor would refrain from sedating patients or administering any heavy sedative medications used by anesthesiologists.
However, now that California Judge Michael Pastor has heard sufficient testimony to bring Murray to trial, the doctor faces a whole new quagmire of legal issues and reviews in Texas and Nevada.
Comcast.net reports that Judge Pastor told the court, "Circumstances have changed -- they have changed dramatically. There are extraordinary circumstances that mandate my approving the request of the [California] Medical Board. Overall consideration is the protection of the public. The continued practice by Dr. Murray does pose an imminent danger to the state of California."
Dr. Murray is currently scheduled to be arraigned in court on Jan. 25, where he is expected to enter a plea of "not guilty."
Did you know? Despite Judge Pastor ordering Dr. Murray to stand trial for involuntary manslaughter, the judge refused the prosecutor's request that Conrad Murray's bail be increased from $75,000 to $300,000.
http://www.examiner.com/canada-celebrity-h...-nv-and-tx-next