Debunking Murray's Police Interview

elusive moonwalker · Oct 11, 2011

So how can murray claim mj didnt re awake once the diprivan wore off seeing as he only gave enough for upto 10mins. suddenly the loraz worked and kept him asleep even after the dip wore off. doesnt sound believable cinsidering what murray had claimed went on the last ten hours

Autumn II · Oct 11, 2011

Thanks, Ivy, for posting. Beth Karas' observations are spot-on, and of course there are others -- probably too numerous to mention? I highly doubt Murray will take the stand, because it wouldn't be possible for him to explain away the many inconsistencies. Given that lengthy interview, and its content, it's likely Murray lied to his attorneys, too! They helped him fabricate the "story" he gave to police, but they didn't really have all the information.

Murray must be an IDIOT? How could he possibly not remember that he told ER docs that he had "no watch," and then make frequent references to "a watch" in the police interview? Same with, "no phones were working," in juxtaposition with his multiple phone calls that are a matter of police records?

I'm mostly watching live-stream, but did catch a few of the "talking heads" last night. Mostly, they are baffled by the defense "strategy," because there isn't much of one? There were some interesting observations about the jury, that they seemed moved by the recording of Michael (SO sad . . . .) and also seemed to nod off during the defense's LONG hammering away of toxicology data. In the end, their decision probably won't be made by data about drugs and their amounts, but by the long chain of blunders and the overall pattern of that, and the LYING.

Bonnie Blue · Oct 11, 2011

elusive moonwalker said:
So how can murray claim mj didnt re awake once the diprivan wore off seeing as he only gave enough for upto 10mins. suddenly the loraz worked and kept him asleep even after the dip wore off. doesnt sound believable cinsidering what murray had claimed went on the last ten hours

This is what is confusing. What would be the point of murray giving 25mg of prop after hours and hours of restlessness from mj, if it would only work for 10-15 mins and then you're back at square 1. I think murray would say that the small dose of prop would react with all the other meds he gave mj and hopefully knock him out for longer. But you need someone with medical knowledge of propofol to answer that, whether once it leaves your system you can just continue being 'out of it' if you're either tired/drugged with other sedatives. I have zero medical knowledge so don't know.

What i did pick up,is that murray says he gave that dose of prop at 10.40ish and he said in the interview that he wanted mj to get 2 hours sleep. Not sure what that length of time translates into amount of propofol ingestion - again we don't know what calculations murray is meant to have made as to how it would react with sedatives already taken - if any calcs were actually made!

jilliebean · Oct 12, 2011

I guess this isn't really a contradiction, but you know what else bothers me? I can tell while listening that there is presumed guilt and he is laying the ground work, I mean yeah there are a lot of contradictions, that always happens when you're lying, but he also purposely adds things in there. For example when he is telling detectives about that evening and he says something like "Michael asked for his milk" he doesn't even bother to explain to detectives until I believe Murray says "milk" twice and the detectives think he is talking about dairy milk, then he clarifies.... That is not the way a professional doctor would explain things, I don't think Michael referred to propofol as his "milk" I just think Murray made a point to say that so he could later play this card that Michael was familiar with or addicted to this drug. He does it with other things too, but I can't think of them right now. I hope the jury picks up on this stuff, because it does show a guilty conscious imo.

Ramona122003 · Oct 12, 2011

jilliebean said:
I guess this isn't really a contradiction, but you know what else bothers me? I can tell while listening that there is presumed guilt and he is laying the ground work, I mean yeah there are a lot of contradictions, that always happens when you're lying, but he also purposely adds things in there. For example when he is telling detectives about that evening and he says something like "Michael asked for his milk" he doesn't even bother to explain to detectives until I believe Murray says "milk" twice and the detectives think he is talking about dairy milk, then he clarifies.... That is not the way a professional doctor would explain things, I don't think Michael referred to propofol as his "milk" I just think Murray made a point to say that so he could later play this card that Michael was familiar with or addicted to this drug. He does it with other things too, but I can't think of them right now. I hope the jury picks up on this stuff, because it does show a guilty conscious imo.

In all honesty, Michael could had very well called propofol 'milk'. Doctors call it that so I don't see why it would be odd or weird if he did referred to it as such. The only ones making a big deal out of it is the media because they all think back to Jesus Juice. Which also isn't a word that Michael made up since it has been proven that some people to call wine Jesus Juice for one reason or another.

I will agree, however, that Murray put emphasis on that word to show both how 'knowledgeable' Michael was on propofol and show connection of behavior, Jesus Juice above.

elusive moonwalker · Oct 12, 2011

That interview was about attacking mj. the security toliet comment the comment about lee and her kids. two days after hes gone and hes been attacked. i would find that very off putting as a jurror and wonder what has murray got to hide

jilliebean · Oct 12, 2011

elusive moonwalker said:
That interview was about attacking mj. the security toliet comment the comment about lee and her kids. two days after hes gone and hes been attacked. i would find that very off putting as a jurror and wonder what has murray got to hide

Good points, that is what I mean it is like he is inserting little bits of info, not just answering the questions. He was smart to do that, he knew the chances of it being played in court were good, and I'm guessing that is why he refused other interviews. I just hope the jury can see it, because to me it was really obvious he is pushing the blame away (far away) from himself, which to me makes him look more guilty.

soulmum · Oct 12, 2011

Dr Steinberg has done a fabulous job on debunking Murray's testimony - aided and abetted by Flanagan himself. lol

Experience the magic · Oct 12, 2011

Autumn II said:
Thanks, Ivy, for posting. Beth Karas' observations are spot-on, and of course there are others -- probably too numerous to mention? I highly doubt Murray will take the stand, because it wouldn't be possible for him to explain away the many inconsistencies. Given that lengthy interview, and its content, it's likely Murray lied to his attorneys, too! They helped him fabricate the "story" he gave to police, but they didn't really have all the information.

The man dug is own grave before even opening his mouth...

Mirabella76 · Oct 13, 2011

Well, he told he gave flumazenil to Michael - so he knew that benz is agonist to propofol. He told it twice - himself on the tape saying about antidot when Michael was breathless and in Amir's testimony when told him about 'bad reaction'
But on the same tape he told that he DIDN'T KNOW what is the cause of death and was lying about pulmonary embolism or smth like that

MJnVA · Oct 13, 2011

experience the magic said:
the man dug is own grave before even opening his mouth...

bingo!!!

Anyone think that AEG will be going after Murray for the loss of revenue??

Vici · Oct 13, 2011

I dont get this.. take a lookk here guys...at the beginning of the interview, Murray says Michael never disclosed names of other doctors etc.. but at the middle/end of the interview, Murray starts to name-drop different doctors and eventually says those are the names MJ mentioned to him. HUH?

------------------------
Detective Martinez: Do you know if he was under the care of any other doctors?

Murray: He never disclosed that to me, but because he moved around so much, I would assume he was.

Detective Martinez: Okay, so you’re not sure if you were the only doctor?

Murray: No

-------

Detective Martinez: Okay, can you tell us about the general health of Mr Jackson?

Murray: … I knew he was probably seeing other physicians for other issues that he does not disclose to me, clearly.

------

Murray: … And he explained to me that he had taken it [propofol] multiple times. He used it frequently on his tours. It was given to him by multiple doctors…. And he also said he has used it in Germany and several other places but never truly disclosed the doctor’s name.

-----

Murray: … And he told me he was seeing a Dr Lee, who was giving him a special cocktail for flushing his body and supposed to give energy.

------

Murray:… I wanted to give you another name of Dr Adams, because you asked about the milk…. Then I got another call from his assistant Michael Amir. And he says Mr Jackson wants to speak me with again. He said “Dr Conrad, nothing works, You know, I’ve had pills from the other doctors in Beverly Hills, and I’ve had medicine from Arnold Klein, who says he gave me the strongest medication. And I I have medicine from Dr Metzer. They all don’t work”.

Martinez: Dr Klein, Dr Metzer. Was there another one?

Dr Murray: Those are the names that he had mentioned.

----------

Dr Murray:.. And then he said “Do you know this Dr Adams?”

Detective Smith: Dr Adams gave him the milk before?

Murray: Yeah. David Adams.

-------

Murray: I was not aware of any other medications that he was taking, but I heard he was seeing a Dr Klein three times a week in Beverly Hills. And he never disclosed that to me.

Autumn II · Oct 14, 2011

In the police interview, Murray had fabricated a story about "comforting the children." Guess not? Add this to the list.

Conrad Murray didn't comfort Jackson's kids in ER, family says
By Alan Duke, CNN
updated 5:27 PM EST, Thu October 13, 2011

Los Angeles (CNN) -- Michael Jackson's oldest son disputed Dr. Conrad Murray's claim, given in his police interview, that the doctor comforted him and his siblings in the emergency room after they learned their father was dead, according to a Jackson family member who was with the children that day.

Prince Jackson told his family that Murray's account played in his involuntary manslaughter trial this week was not true, Trent Jackson, the nephew of Katherine and Joe Jackson, said Thursday.

"Perfect storm" of drugs killed Jackson, sleep expert says

Jackson family members were upset that jurors may sympathize with Murray because of perceived compassion for the children that day, Jackson told CNN.

"I hugged them all, gave comfort to Paris, comfort to Prince, comfort to Blanket, which is the last little guy, because whenever they were sick, they would always ask for Dr. Conrad," Murray told detectives two days after Jackson's death in 2009.
Anesthesiologist on propofol dosing

Trent Jackson, who drove Katherine Jackson to Ronald Reagan UCLA Medical Center, where doctors were trying to revive her son, said Murray did not have a conversation with Paris Jackson, the 12-year-old daughter, as he told police.

"She asked me, 'Dr. Murray, you said you save a lot of patients. You know, you save people with heart attacks, and you couldn't save my dad," Murray told detectives. "I said, 'I tried my best.' And she said, 'I know that, Dr. Murray. At least I know. I know you tried your best. I know you tried your best, but I'm really sad. You know, I will wake up in the morning, and I won't be able to see my daddy.'"

Prince, Paris and Blanket Jackson were initially kept in an SUV outside of the emergency room after they followed the ambulance carrying their father to the hospital, Trent Jackson said. Frank Dileo, who was Michael Jackson's manager, later escorted them inside after their grandmother arrived, according to Trent Jackson.

Murray never spoke to Michael Jackson's mother at the emergency room, contrary to his statement to police, Trent Jackson said.

While the truthfulness of Murray's interview is a major issue in the trial, it is not expected that Michael Jackson's 14-year-old son Prince will be called to testify, the relative said. Katherine Jackson, who has custody of the children, is opposed to any of them being called as witnesses, he said.

Prosecutors are near a conclusion to their direct presentation in Murray's trial, but rebuttal witnesses could be called next week after the defense rests its case.

http://www.cnn.com/2...html?hpt=hp_bn2

Miche · Oct 14, 2011

Thats intesting, I'm pretty certain that Alberto Alvaraz testified he or Michael Amir escourted the kids into hospital when they arrived and they waited in a small room with hospital care staff and with a guard outside the door, till Katherine or the others arrived?

elusive moonwalker · Oct 14, 2011

Rebuttal could take days if u put up witnesses like trent.thats one issue the pros could use as nothing has been said during the testimony to refute that claim by murray. that would be good thing to do imo. shows his physco tendencies he claimibg he talked to the kids and kathetine when he didnt

Soundmind · Oct 15, 2011

I have just finished re reading Murray's interview with the police. When he talked about MJ suffering from withdrawal , he was talking about propofol , withdrawal caused by lack of propofol .

I believe the demerol idea came later when the Jacksons sent their boys to smear MJ's reputation !!!

He told the detectives he believed MJ was dependent on propofol because MJ was receiving it each day for two months. He did not give him propofol on June 24 and was not going to give him any on June 25 that's why MJ's "psychologically, mentally" refused to seelp according to him . not word to word but that's what he said: " You will not find one publication or study that says propofol is addictive because no one was given propofol on daily basis, but later there will be because he was showing indication of dependency and on that night I saw withdrawal symptoms because he did not get it"

I believe that was why he claimed MJ was receiving it on daily basis, I don't think at that time he knew how much incriminating to him that information would become , he just wanted the detective to believe MJ was addicted to the drug , was getting it everyday and could not handle two days of no propofol so he injected himself and died.

Sometheing else : <!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <w:TrackMoves/> <w:TrackFormatting/> <w

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Add that to his comment on MJ asking him to push the syringe because other doctors allowed him to do so, what you get?!!!!

I can't believe how much thought was put into this script!! Everyword was said for a reason .

BTW after they abandoned the drinking theory , the defense will probably claim Murray left for minutes , probably 5 minutes maybe even less , it depends on Schafer's testimony ,what's his estimation of the survival time based on the high blood concentration !! there is no need to claim a longer interval because propofol via IV bolus or drip works very rapidly. That's what I believe!!

elusive moonwalker · Oct 16, 2011

Yeah everything was so scripted in that interview.they couldnt have made it more obvious if they tried.flanagans defence from his cross says they will claim murray left the room for alot longer because mj was sleeping normally. left the room to make all those calls. thats something the defence has implied alot

Ramona122003 · Oct 16, 2011

elusive moonwalker said:
Yeah everything was so scripted in that interview.they couldnt have made it more obvious if they tried.flanagans defence from his cross says they will claim murray left the room for alot longer because mj was sleeping normally. left the room to make all those calls. thats something the defence has implied alot

Too bad for them that claim came back to bite them in the butt. Namely, the doctors said that if Michael was still asleep after the drug wore off, then something was wrong and Murray should had woken Michael. When Flan tried to cover his butt by saying that Michael may had been tired and sleeping normally, the doctor jumped on him by saying that Murray wouldn't had know that since he didn't have the proper equipment to monitor Michael to make sure he was indeed sleeping or in distress. Even still, you don't leave the room until the person wakes up.

elusive moonwalker · Oct 16, 2011

Yeah agree. the drs made it very clear about waking him up if he slept on they were very steadfast about it. it also impeaches murray yet again. you may lost track of time but everyone knows if you left somewhere for 2 mins or 30.theres a big difference

elusive moonwalker · Oct 16, 2011

Ontop of murray lieing about not making phonecalls. so he says he left the room for two mins. when he may or may not have left to make all those calls but didnt want the pokice knowing in the begining. thats incriminating in itself

cinzia · Oct 17, 2011

This entire thing all sounds so false. Is this really how police interviews are conducted, with the lawyer present basically prompting and coaching the client? Sweet.
And here murray is telling adams that he doesn't know if Michael can afford 2 doctors? Not his business is it.
Then chernoff page 58 telling the cops: murray's completely skipped the important part...And Michael saying he wanted murray to be around 'forever'...Why? He hadn't been his full time doctor to begin with so why would he want him around 'forever'?

And then chernoff pipes up with the 'he's been sleeping on it for years...' Oh really? So he would go to the dentist or plastic surgeon and they'd propofol him for a few hours so he could sleep? (Yet murray says Michael told him he would not need prop. for sleep once the tour was over.) IF true and he had a relationship with say Dr. Adams, why would he need murray, wouldn't it make more sense to approach Adams first since he would know all about procuring and giving the medicine. Why murray, Michael, why did you pick murray who had never used the drug??

Page 20 murray can't remember which leg he placed the IV in just 2 days before, yet he has crystal clear recollections of conversations from months ago.

And chernoff is just mother's little helper on page 42:Chernoff: And let's...let's be clear. Let's make sure you guys ask this question, if you don't mind... Before you were hired on as his doctor, where you aware that michael jackson was taking this on a daily basis.

So on page 67 he admits he knows the address (except for the zip...is that really so vital? I have no idea) yet initially he said he didn't know the address.. And although he says the house is locked up at night, by now it was late morning so what was the point of that tidbit of trivia?
First he says he put his left hand under Michael meaning he did compressions with his right, now he says he continued CPR with his left hand and I am getting confused.
And his reason for not calling 911 page68 ...what a lot of nonsense. He didn't want to tell Amir to call 911 because he would have to explain what was going on? Oh really? Security is going to cross examine the doctor who tells them to call 911?

Well, obviously murray is a hero, after all he tried so hard to do the right things for michael, it wasn't his fault he didn't know what was going on with all those other doctors, after all his patient never told him. Poor man so misled by his patient. Yup, no doubt about it, that conrad murray is a poor innocent man, your Honor....He is innocent of morals, ethics, common sense, intelligence, integrity, honesty, decency, compassion.

Miche · Oct 17, 2011

You got it all in a nutshell, Cinzea! :bow:

Goodbye Michael · Nov 1, 2011

he said he didn't know about klein until after jackson died, he read about it or saw it on the news or something, but someone from AEG said they told Murray they thought he was seeing Klein and to check it out

Autumn II · Nov 1, 2011

And now? Looks like the defense has no option but to debunk their own client's police statement? At the end of the cross of White yesterday, there were statements made that "it wouldn't have made any difference if Murray had called 911 right away, because Michael was already dead." The knowledge that it was already hopeless would explain the ineffective CPR, and delay in summoning help, and all the rest of it. So, we know that Murray left the room --probably for a prolonged period of time. Where WAS he, and what was he doing, and how long was he really gone? There was never a TOD determined, so we may never know the answer to that.

I think that once he returned and found Michael gone. . and beyond saving. . . the rest of his actions were damage control. There was no need for Amir to call 911 (or for Kai Chase to call 911) because there was already no hope for Michael. Murray was thinking of HIMSELF, and the mess he was in.

Now, the defense seems to be saying, "it didn't matter that Murray never mentioned propofol to EMTs or to hospital personnel, because Michael was already gone." (but yet Murray wouldn't let EMTs "call it" at the house.) What kind of defense is THAT? I expect that Murray lied to his attorneys as well, which is why they allowed him to make that statement to police? That at the time, the attorneys didn't know it was largely, almost ENTIRELY, untrue.

White's testimony almost defies comprehension! He was promoting the idea that "Michael was already gone," which of course makes Murray's lies to police VERY obvious. But, White apparently did NO research on his own. He wrote no report, either. Just a "letter of initial thoughts." He had a STUDENT do the model/chart. He was unaware of research on propofol, but yet he apparently was the originator of the "Michael drank the propofol" theory. Walgren utterly shredded him on cross. Not sure what defense Murray has LEFT? He is being hung out to dry by his OWN words in that police statement -- and almost ALL of it is untrue.

Debunking Murray's Police Interview

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