[Discussion] Sexual Abuse Claims Against MJ Estate - Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

There are 4 stuff

- civil claim against MJ
- civil claim against companies
- probate claim against Estate by Robson
- probate claim against Estate by Safechuck.

if judge grants Estate's demurrers on /around October yes the only thing remaining would be probate claims. If judge rejects late probate claims it would be over for good. If late probate claims are allowed then they would go through civil process as well.




Probate claims take place Nov 6 correct?

This is the same judge right? i saw it in a post early today.

Ivy do you see the judge maybe reject the probate claims also?

The reason why i say that is i do see the judge let the probate claims go forward all of the deadlines have expire and i don't see Wade said that it was MJ who stop him from filing he knew in 2012 and he still did not file. I don't see what their will find in the NL docs.
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

Yes, it's a discovery to support their equitable estoppel and that's why I don't understand what they hope from it that would support that. What could possibly be there to give Robson a pass on why he did not file within 60 days of allegedly discovering his alleged abuse? I mean even if he brings in Jordan's jail claim to support his (BTW, the Gardner interview was not a part of any court proceedings IMO - it was a private document by the Chandlers that they leaked to the press in 2003, so they will not find it among the NL search material) and even if the Judge believed this sets a "pattern" (rather than Wade simply modelling his allegations after past allegations) that still would not help him in getting around the fact that he should have filed within 60 days of discovering his alleged abuse, which would be July 2012, not May 2013.

Thinking loudly about this equitable estoppel. I realize that they hope that equitable estoppel would overwrite this 60 days limit. How much can equitable estoppel extend a statute? Or is it always individually decided in a case? But I still cannot see what circumstance would make it reasonable to apply equitable estoppel in this case. If they accept Robson's claim that MJ allegedly telling him in 1993 that they would both go to jail or that he was so brainwashed that he did not realize the illicit nature of anal raping a child until 2012 is a reason for equitable estoppel then they might as well as abolish statutes of limitations altogether. I mean from then on then anyone could claim outside of any statute that "well, I just realized I was abused and I wasn't able to realize it before because my abuser told me 20 years ago that we go to jail and I still believed it until I was 30, 40 or 100 years old and I did not know that anally raping a child was wrong anyway, I just learned it from my therapist now" and then anyone can go ahead with such allegations at any time, regardless of statutes of limitations. This would be a very bad precedent.
 
Ivy @Ivy_4MJ · 22 h.

I love Weitzman's not so subtle jabs - "largely discredited Chandler allegations"...
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Estate about Robson's claims (in court documents) -->
ByaBPV_IIAI4AuV.jpg:large
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

So if i I understand this correctly they think there is evidence that Branca or any one who worked for Michael knew he had been molesting Wade and did nothing to protect him? If true, it makes me really wonder what did Wade tell these attorneys
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

I believe the lawyers know it is bullshit, they are not even specialised in molestation, they are all after mj's money.Filing and leaking motions on the eve of every big project is illustration of their blackmailing tactics nothing else.
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

So if i I understand this correctly they think there is evidence that Branca or any one who worked for Michael knew he had been molesting Wade and did nothing to protect him? If true, it makes me really wonder what did Wade tell these attorneys

The complaint has Doe defendants - real individuals as well. Technically those could be assistants, lawyers, business associates that have worked with Michael & his companies on anything related to Wade. Nobody is named or added and such lawsuit against such people is irrelevant to the Estate. Plus even if they file such lawsuit and/or add MJ's lawyers / assistants etc it wouldn't go anywhere because

- Wade and Safechuck accusations predates Chandler allegations. So it would be hard to show those people "knew or should have known" abuse claim.
- none of those people were in a position to stop Michael or have power over him. They were working for him.
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

^ Plus I think if someone claimed he or she saw or suspected something but did not report it then that would be that person's individual responsibility, not MJ's companies. For example if they used Blanca Francia. I don't know who Francia was employed by but for argument's sake let's say she was employed by MJJP or MJJV. But her claim that she saw MJ do this or that with Wade would not make the companies responsible, since she did not report it to anyone until she saw money in making such claims in 1993. The companies would only be responsible if employees had reported it to their bosses and there had been some collective effort to cover it up.

So Wade should actually sue people like Blanca Francia or his own mother, if it was real and if it was not about the money but healing. But of course he does not, he rather tries to drag the entities and people with money into it.
 
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Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

^^

As far as I can see the October 1 hearing about MJ and Companies demurrers are going to happen as planned. The issue is the probate court and apparently the Nov 6th date set for summary judgment request of Estate. There's an email - and I'll post it tonight when I go home - that Wade's lawyers is talking about rescheduling it because they would need several weeks to prepare after they get the discovery. Estate was rejecting it stating their argument is about legal basis for late claims and discovery is irrelevant. I would expect an expart motion from Wade's side to reschedule it and if granted probate issue would be delayed several months.

This is tricky. Can the summary judgement happen before WR lawyers argue for the equitable estopel doctrine?

As far as i understand these are two separate issues.

Summary judgement is usually when there is no legal basis for a trial usually after a case has survived the demurrer phase.

Now WR wants to use the equitale estopel doctrine ( that is if he can even prove it) to bypass the demurrer phase.

but will the judge still go forward with the summary judgement even before WR lawyers argue for the the equitale estopel doctrine?
 
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Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

Thinking loudly about this equitable estoppel. I realize that they hope that equitable estoppel would overwrite this 60 days limit. How much can equitable estoppel extend a statute? Or is it always individually decided in a case? But I still cannot see what circumstance would make it reasonable to apply equitable estoppel in this case. If they accept Robson's claim that MJ allegedly telling him in 1993 that they would both go to jail or that he was so brainwashed that he did not realize the illicit nature of anal raping a child until 2012 is a reason for equitable estoppel then they might as well as abolish statutes of limitations altogether. I mean from then on then anyone could claim outside of any statute that "well, I just realized I was abused and I wasn't able to realize it before because my abuser told me 20 years ago that we go to jail and I still believed it until I was 30, 40 or 100 years old and I did not know that anally raping a child was wrong anyway, I just learned it from my therapist now" and then anyone can go ahead with such allegations at any time, regardless of statutes of limitations. This would be a very bad precedent.

That is exactly what I was saying a few days ago:
Ivy, if judge allows this case to go forward, what stops other people with suppressed, compressed or repressed memory to put in claims years to come?. All of them can claim the same as Wade that somehow MJ made them to forget their memories that they were molested for years, but now those memories are coming out and they need money. There are definitely lots of loonies out there that when their money runs out, they need to dip in bank of Michael Jackson.

They all can say "I remembered it when I remembered" for years to come if judge gives green light to this case.
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

Hey guys, I need help.
I was reading this
No, equitable estoppel is not the same as delayed discovery. Estoppel by inducement may preclude a defendant from raising the statute of limitations defense only if the defendant's promises, threats or representations actually induced the plaintiff to forbear filing a lawsuit.

In order to assert equitable estoppel, the following four elements must be present: (1) the party to be estopped must be apprised of the facts; (2) he must intend that his conduct be acted on, or must so act that the party asserting estoppel had a right to believe it was so intended; (3) the party asserting estoppel must be ignorant of the true state of facts; and (4) he must rely upon the conduct to his injury.
http://www.avvo.com/legal-answers/in-california--what-is-equitable-estoppel-and-is-i-672815.html

First paragraph is ok and clear, but the second isn't.
Can somebody put that is normal language, as I understand the words separately, but put them together it becomes mumbo jumbo to me:-(


This document refer those 4 elements of equitable estoppel
http://amradaronline.files.wordpress.com/2014/05/jackson-estate047_redacted.pdf
 
No, it's not delayed discovery.

In simple terms equitable estoppel means that statutes of limitations can be lifted if the accuser can show that the reason why he missed to file within statutes is because of some deliberate conduct by the defendant or his representatives. Typically a threat or misleading the victim about his legal possibilities. For example, in cases of child abuse the alleged victim can say that he was threatened by the abuser. I'm going to illustrate it through one of the precedent cases Robson uses in his lawsuit (which in my view is rather counter-productive for Robson because comparing his case to this one just highlights how ridiculous his request for equitable estoppel is):

Doe vs. Bakersfield City School District (2006)

Here the accuser said he was sexually molested by a teacher in high school and the abuse continued even beyond that until he was about 20 years old. When he left school the teacher went after him, always did things to be near him, to have access to him. Meanwhile he threatened him saying he had people in high places and if the victim ever told he would ruin him.

The abuse stopped around 2000 and he filed his lawsuit in July 2002, so it's not like it took him 20 years to realize what was abuse or something. In fact he first disclosed his abuse to his girlfriend in November or December 2001. Then the girlfriend ("A") immediatly called the abuser to confront him:

After A.'s call, Diaz contacted plaintiff and said he wanted to see him.   A. called Diaz again and told him to stay away from plaintiff.   Diaz replied, “You better watch out because he doesn't know what he's doing.   I'll get him.   This is going to ruin him if it's going to ruin me.”


Law enforcement was also contacted right around that time. Although the abuse stopped in 2000, the abuser kept calling and threatening the victim and in fact there were threats made by the abuser even after law enforcement was contacted:

In February 2002, A. and plaintiff were driving by Diaz's sister's house when they spotted Diaz outside unloading groceries.   A. rolled down the window and yelled, “You can't face the truth;  you want to hide from it!”   Diaz yelled back at plaintiff, who was in the passenger seat of the car, “I can't believe you're doing this to me!   You're going to be very sorry!   You should have kept your mouth shut!”


Now, this is totally different from the kind of narrative Wade is telling, ie. that MJ told him in 1993 they would both go to jail and that both of their carreers would be over and that just had such a profound effect on Wade that he was unable to acknowledge his abuse until he was 30. Despite of seeing that no other accuser of MJ ever went to jail.

Here we have stalking and direct threats from this teacher that he would take down and ruin the accuser which continued until basically the accuser reported the abuse and even after.

So these are the type of things where equitable estoppel is usually granted. But what does Wade claim?

He claims that MJ threatened him in 1993 that they would both go to jail and brainwashed him into thinking that anal rape was love which he still believed as an adult man and with the 1993 and 2005 cases behind us, and therefore he was unable to disclose his alleged abuse until 2012. I can't see how that BS would be a reason for equitable estoppel. How can anyone belive that MJ's alleged threat that they would both go to jail reasonably had such a grip on him until he was 30, when he could see that no other accuser of MJ ever went to jail? How can anyone believe that he did not know until 2012 that anally raping and sexually molesting children was illegal? Yes, he claims that:

2d9s0sw.jpg


So why did he think MJ was on trial in 2005 if he did not know until 2012 that such acts would be illicit? BTW, this is yet another contradiction in his claims: on one hand he claims he believed both he and MJ would go to jail if it came out - ie. it was illicit by both of them. Then in another statement he makes he claims he was not aware of the illicit nature of it at all. So which one is it?

Moreover, even if we believe everything he says about MJ molesting, threatening and brainwashing him and Wade not knowing until 2012 that anally raping children was wrong and we believe that MJ telling him at 11 that they would both go to jail had such a profound effect on him that he was unable and unwilling to realize his abuse until he went to therapy in May 2012, even then he is outside of statutes. Probate Code 9103 acknowledges the possibility of a late discovery of someone's injury and in that case it gives the claimant the possibility to file within 60 days after discovering the facts giving arise to the claim. Ie. in this case Wade says he discovered and was able to acknowledge for the first time that he was abused on May 8, 2012. That means by Probate law he should have filed until July 8, 2012. He missed that. So I have no idea what kind of equitable estoppel could be ivoked for that for him. MJ was dead at the time so he could not do anything to prevent Wade from filing a claim within 60 days. And there is nothing that Wade claims about the Estate blocking him, threatening him or anything like that.

As I see it he is trying the angle that he was so brainwashed and so severly manipulated by MJ that even after realizing his abuse for the first time in May 2012 that still prevented him from making a timely claim within the possibilities of Probate Code 9103. But if this is accepted by the court then I think they might as well as abolish statutes of limitations altogether. Because like we talked about it above, then anyone can make any claim about being brainwashed and that could be used as an excuse for any untimely claim.
 
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Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

Theoretically speaking, if Wades bullshit allegations were true and he didn't realise 'anal rape' was wrong until his phoney epiphany moment in 2012, then couldn't the question be asked to him 'if you didn't know these acts were wrong, how often did you partake in these kinds of sexual activities with others?' - Think about it, if he genuinely thought all of these things that were carried out were not criminal, surely wouldn't he have then acted out the same sexual acts on others? Who knows maybe Britney broke up with him becaus he insisted she wear a strap-on..... Gross yes, but this is to get you thinking outside of the box here and to consider how the psychosexual nature of such acts at a young age can transpire or impact upon sexual relations and attitudes when one transcends into adulthood. I think what Wade hasn't realised is that this will open up an entire Pandora's box and questions about how his own sexuality or sexual attitude/character/perversions have all come about from the again, bullshit abuse that didn't actually happen. Will his wife have to take the stand and reveal intimate details? Guess not as it's a civil trial and not criminal right?

Also, does anyone know that if this were to lead to a civil trial whereby WR were to win, could the Estate counter attack and then take WR to court in a criminal trial?
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

@Respect, is your reply to my post?
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

Yes, I thought you do not understand what equitable estoppel is.
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

So if i I understand this correctly they think there is evidence that Branca or any one who worked for Michael knew he had been molesting Wade and did nothing to protect him? If true, it makes me really wonder what did Wade tell these attorneys

Exactly.
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

Thinking loudly about this equitable estoppel. I realize that they hope that equitable estoppel would overwrite this 60 days limit. How much can equitable estoppel extend a statute? Or is it always individually decided in a case? But I still cannot see what circumstance would make it reasonable to apply equitable estoppel in this case. If they accept Robson's claim that MJ allegedly telling him in 1993 that they would both go to jail or that he was so brainwashed that he did not realize the illicit nature of anal raping a child until 2012 is a reason for equitable estoppel then they might as well as abolish statutes of limitations altogether. I mean from then on then anyone could claim outside of any statute that "well, I just realized I was abused and I wasn't able to realize it before because my abuser told me 20 years ago that we go to jail and I still believed it until I was 30, 40 or 100 years old and I did not know that anally raping a child was wrong anyway, I just learned it from my therapist now" and then anyone can go ahead with such allegations at any time, regardless of statutes of limitations. This would be a very bad precedent.



That why i don't see a judge letting Wade use this come on 1993-2012 you mean to tell me Michael had control over Wade from the grave by telling him 1993 we will both go to jail. I hope judge is smart because if he let this messy go through you are right it will open a flood gate and yes statutes of limitations right out of the window.
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

I really don't see this going any farther once the judge dismiss Mj companies and MJ because their have nothing to do with this abuse that is it for the lawsuit then we have the probate claims from Wade and James which has expire and was file late to the Estate.

Now Wade is claiming that MJ was the reason why he didn't report the abuse and Wade is also saying he had no memory of the abuse until 2012 and why because Michael told him in 1993 that if he tell their both will go to jail this is what Wade is try to do to explain why he did not file in time and saying he just remember that he was abuse by Michael for 7 yr. he knew about this in 2012 and still never file.


Now these are the facts so we have a clear pictures it does not matter how Wade and his lawyer are trying to get around the statutes of limitations you can't and using this will not help i do not see this as ground for equitable estoppel i don't see how a judge can overwrite the 60 days it is the law you can't break the law you are not suppose too.


I hope the judge does not take this lie from Wade and let this claim go forward because it will be a mistake and unfair.
 
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Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

@Bubs

If you are just asking what this part specifically means:

In order to assert equitable estoppel, the following four elements must be present: (1) the party to be estopped must be apprised of the facts; (2) he must intend that his conduct be acted on, or must so act that the party asserting estoppel had a right to believe it was so intended; (3) the party asserting estoppel must be ignorant of the true state of facts; and (4) he must rely upon the conduct to his injury.

I don't understand it clearly (is there someone among us with a US law degree? LOL) but in Robson's motion this is how they translate these four principles to this case:

(1) the party to be estopped must be apprised of the facts


"As alleged by Claimaint, Decendent clearly knew that he was committing wrongful sexual acts with Claimant"

So this means that to be estopped MJ must know that what he was allegedly doing was wrong.

(2) he must intend that his conduct be acted on, or must so act that the party asserting estoppel had a right to believe it was so intended;

"then; by convincing Claimant to lie about the nature of their relationship and leading Claimant to believe he was a consenting participant in their sexual acts, Decendent engaged in conduct which he intended Claimant to act upon"

(3) the party asserting estoppel must be ignorant of the true state of facts


"Claimant was unaware of the illicit, non-consensual nature of these acts until he sought therapy as an adult"

(4) he must rely upon the conduct to his injury.

"and lastly, Claimant relied to his detriment upon Decendent's conduct by continuing to deny that he had been the victim of abuse until after the statute of limitations had run."
 
Thanks Respect.

"In order to assert equitable estoppel, the following four elements must be present: (1) the party to be estopped must be apprised of the facts; (2) he must intend that his conduct be acted on, or must so act that the party asserting estoppel had a right to believe it was so intended; (3) the party asserting estoppel must be ignorant of the true state of facts; and (4) he must rely upon the conduct to his injury."

I read it tons of times, but could make out what exactly were those 4 elements that must be present.
It read like something politicians would put together so it seems they say something but actually say nothing:)

I found this, which makes more sense as what comes to explanation those 4 elements:

California Civil Jury Instructions (CACI)
456. Defendant Estopped From Asserting Statute of Limitations Defense

[Name of plaintiff] claims that even if [his/her/its] lawsuit was not filed on time, [he/she/it] may still proceed because [name of defendant] did or said something that caused [name of plaintiff] to delay filing the lawsuit. In order to establish the right to proceed, [name of plaintiff] must prove all of the following:

1. That [name of defendant] said or did something that caused [name of plaintiff] to believe that it would not be necessary to file a lawsuit;

2. That [name of plaintiff] relied on [name of defendant]’s conduct and therefore did not file the lawsuit within the time otherwise required;

3. That a reasonable person in [name of plaintiff]’s position would have relied on [name of defendant]’s conduct;

4. That after the limitation period had expired, [name of defendant]’s representations by words or conduct proved to not be true; and

5. That [name of plaintiff] proceeded diligently to file suit once [he/ she/it] discovered the actual facts.
It is not necessary that [name of defendant] have acted in bad faith or intended to mislead [name of plaintiff].

https://www.justia.com/trials-litigation/docs/caci/400/456.html


When I read that, it makes sense, and I can see what WR and his team are after.
 
3. That a reasonable person in [name of plaintiff]’s position would have relied on [name of defendant]’s conduct;

So he must prove that a reasonable person would have not known that anally raping children was wrong, illicit and non-consensual until a therapist enlightened him about that at the age of 30. A reasonable person would not have known that even if he testified in a child abuse trial as an adult where it was clearly stated that such acts are illicit and wrong. (Or why else did he think MJ was on trial?) A reasonable person would have relied upon a ridiculous lie (that victims of child molestation go to jail or that the anal rape of children is consensual love) that Defendant allegedly told him when he was 11, even when he could see that no other accusers of MJ ever went to jail and there was a criminal trial when Robson was already an adult, which clearly highlighted that such acts were wrong, illicit and non-consensual (wrong and illicit on the abuser's part, not the victim's).

In that motion he also says that the access to NL search material and former witness statements are needed to prove these 4 points for equitable estoppel. I have no idea how anything found there could prove things like Robson was unaware of the illicit, non-consensual nature of such acts or that MJ lied to him about the nature of their relationship leading Robson to believe until 2012 that it was a consensual relationship.

ETA: I'm guessing he will try to take claims by the former accusers to support his. Like Jordan saying the jail thing, although it will be interesting how he will be able to use that to support that a reasonable person would have believed that until the age of 30, when Jordan said in that exchange with Dr. Gardner that he did not believe it. Even then as a 13-year-old. And since then we had a criminal trial (while Robson was an adult) which clearly showed that accusers do not go jail and that these alleged acts are illicit and non-consensual.

Moreover, these documents are public for many years so they do not prove anything other than that Robson and his lawyer looked into the other allegations before building up his and that they took elements from them. I know that at this stage it's not the task of a Judge to determine whether Robson is telling the truth or not about how his allegations emerged. He just has to see the claim and whether that reasonably makes him entitled to equitable estoppel. Still this seems very messy to me. Also, how can one use an allegation against someone when in that case the accused was aquitted? I mean in case they want to use some claim by Gavin. MJ was found not guilty in that case, so how can they use allegations by Gavin to "prove" Wade's?

This is not the first time that MJ is put in such an unfair legal situation. It's almost the same as when the "prior bad acts" part was allowed in in 2005. When allegations uncorroborated by the alleged victims themselves were used against MJ. Actaully it's even worse now, because it would take it even further because here allegations in which MJ was even aquitted would be used against him. And without MJ being here to be able to defend himself. It's crazy.
 
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http://www.dailymichael.com/

Civil case updates

Estate had filed two demurrers (dismissal request stating there’s no legal basis for a lawsuit) and parties are getting ready for the demurrer hearing. Most current documents (added September 24th) are Estate’s replies to Robson’s opposition to Estate’s demurrer requests. As I prepare this post court system isn’t showing Robson’s opposition documents (I’ll update this post if they become available) therefore this post is done based on what the Estate reply documents state about Robson’s opposition and their reply.

Hearing for these two demurrers is set for October 1st.

Doe1 (MJ) Demurrer

Document link: http://www.scribd.com/doc/241210020/Robson-Estate-Reply-Doe-1-Demurrer

Estate had filed a demurrer to dismiss MJ as Doe 1 defendant on the civil case simply arguing Doe1 / MJ is deceased and no court has jurisdiction to have a case or have power to enter judgment against him.
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

24bl1lh.jpg


So this means we have a Doe 4 and 5 now named - ie. the Estate executors? Because so far it was Doe 1 - MJ (probably will be dismissed), Doe 2-3 - MJJ Productions and MJJ Ventures. It seems the companies may get dismissed as well, so I guess for the lawsuit not to get dismissed totally Robson added the Executors now as Doe 4 or Doe 5?

He will be able to sue the Estate of course, but only if the Probate Court decides in his favour and the Estate disputes the claim, but I wonder if he has a legal basis to name them as Doe 4 and 5 defendants here in this lawsuit, or it's the same as with the other Does: he knows he has no legal basis for that, he just does it to keep the lawsuit going for strategical reasons?

It's confusing, because then next they cite Robson's argument that the Estate executors cannot ask for the dismissal of MJ as defendant becasue they are not a party to the proceedings. But if they are Doe 4 and 5 now then they clearly are a party, aren't they? Besides what the Estate themselves argue of course which is this:

263hz.jpg
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

^^

Executors aren't added yet but Doe 4 and Doe 5 is reserved for them. He hopes to win the probate claim and then add executors / estate to his lawsuit. I felt his arguments were quite absurd. Such as he didn't serve MJ - how do you serve MJ? and Executors aren't parties. Yes Executors themselves aren't parties yet to the civil case but they can make appearances if they want to represent MJ. If you go with Robson's lawyers logic anyone can sue a deceased and no deceased can get that case dismissed as they cannot be served and make appearance. Crazy right?
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

^^

Executors aren't added yet but Doe 4 and Doe 5 is reserved for them. He hopes to win the probate claim and then add executors / estate to his lawsuit. I felt his arguments were quite absurd. Such as he didn't serve MJ - how do you serve MJ? and Executors aren't parties. Yes Executors themselves aren't parties yet to the civil case but they can make appearances if they want to represent MJ. If you go with Robson's lawyers logic anyone can sue a deceased and no deceased can get that case dismissed as they cannot be served and make appearance. Crazy right?



let said that the Executors or Estate do not represent MJ what would be next?

Right a deceased can't get it dismiss because their can't be served and i agree with you this is crazy.
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

^^

Executors aren't added yet but Doe 4 and Doe 5 is reserved for them. He hopes to win the probate claim and then add executors / estate to his lawsuit. I felt his arguments were quite absurd. Such as he didn't serve MJ - how do you serve MJ? and Executors aren't parties. Yes Executors themselves aren't parties yet to the civil case but they can make appearances if they want to represent MJ. If you go with Robson's lawyers logic anyone can sue a deceased and no deceased can get that case dismissed as they cannot be served and make appearance. Crazy right?

That's pretty much his strategy here. it's to keep the civil suit alive until the probate court decides whether to allow his frivolous claim. so in reality everything depends on the probate court. it has the power to end this madness.

The question here is: what happens if the civil courts dismisses both MJ and his companies next month? does that mean that the lawsuit is tossed for good since there is none else attached to the civil suit? if robson says that he's reserving doe4 and doe5 for the executors, then why not naming them directly? probably because they have no legal basis until the probate court says so. in which case can the estate asks the civil court to dismiss the entire suit if there is no other party to the suit?
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

I guess that's why they are trying to get the Executors "admit" they knew something, anything.
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

I would love to know how this judge will ruler on this will he ruler in favor of the Estate on the law suite then ruler in favor of Wade on the probate claim. Ivy is this something that can happen?

IMO if the judge dismiss the law suite then why let the probate claim go through i would love to hear how the judge would explain this if he let Wade use the reasons why he didn't file.
 
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Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

That's pretty much his strategy here. it's to keep the civil suit alive until the probate court decides whether to allow his frivolous claim. so in reality everything depends on the probate court. it has the power to end this madness.

The question here is: what happens if the civil courts dismisses both MJ and his companies next month? does that mean that the lawsuit is tossed for good since there is none else attached to the civil suit? if robson says that he's reserving doe4 and doe5 for the executors, then why not naming them directly? probably because they have no legal basis until the probate court says so. in which case can the estate asks the civil court to dismiss the entire suit if there is no other party to the suit?



That right if the court does dismiss MJ two companies and MJ that is the end of the law suite all that is left is the probate claim.
 
Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

Califormia laws are so crazy.
 
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