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Is there such a thing as a bad MJ song, album or performance?

up914043

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michael was a perfectionist in his own right, but were there some projects even for his own standard subpar or there's no such thing?
 
Yes. A lot of people think that MJ was at his worst during the Invincible era. The album, the songs and the performances weren't as good as compared to his previous works.

For example: MJ was drugged on the first night of his 30th anniversary concerts, he also wasn't as involved in the production of the Invincible album and people have a dislike for some songs from Invincible (such as Cry and The Lost Children).
 
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AChanceToDance said:
Yes. A lot of people think that MJ was at his worst during the Invincible era, the album, the songs and the performances weren't as good as compared to his previous works.

For example: MJ was drugged on the first night of his 30th anniversary concerts, he also wasn't as involved in the production of the Invincible album and people have a dislike for some songs from Invincible (such as Cry and The Lost Children).
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Oh I never knew, do you have or know any links to these said performances so I could watch?
 
There were subpar projects for his own standards, among others:

The 'Girlfriend' song (1979) which is a melodically weak and thus easily forgettable song.

The 'On The Line' song (1997) in which Michael Jackson with his mellifluous vocals and style tries unsuccessfully to sound like the American singer Babyface.

The 'Heaven Can Wait' song (2001) in which his voice cracks on certain parts.

The two MSG Anniversary Shows (2001), where Michael Jackson finds it hard not only to execute his dance routines but also to lip-sync properly.

The 'Dangerous' performance (2002) at the American Bandstand where towards the end he basically ruins his performance with his out of breath voice.
 
mj_frenzy said:
There were subpar projects for his own standards, among others:

The 'Girlfriend' song (1979) which is a melodically weak and thus easily forgettable song.

The 'On The Line' song (1997) in which Michael Jackson with his mellifluous vocals and style tries unsuccessfully to sound like the American singer Babyface.

The 'Heaven Can Wait' song (2001) in which his voice cracks on certain parts.

The two MSG Anniversary Shows (2001), where Michael Jackson finds it hard not only to execute his dance routines but also to lip-sync properly.

The 'Dangerous' performance (2002) at the American Bandstand where towards the end he basically ruins his performance with his out of breath voice.
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Thanks, do you mind getting me links to those performances if that's okay?
 
I used to consider his performances of "Happy" from 1975~1977 were disappointing.
But, listening to them right now I think they're OK, not sure what changed in my perception... It's not just that he doesn't have the same voice as when the album version was recorded. Maybe I listened less to the 70s Jacksons stuff recently and I lost comparison points.
 
Maxym said:
I used to consider his performances of "Happy" from 1975~1977 were disappointing.
But, listening to them right now I think they're OK, not sure what changed in my perception... It's not just that he doesn't have the same voice as when the album version was recorded. Maybe I listened less to the 70s Jacksons stuff recently and I lost comparison points.
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That seems fair, I'll check that one out and see what you mean.
 
AChanceToDance said:
For example: MJ was drugged on the first night of his 30th anniversary concerts
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Really! something was off with that performance, but I thought he was just disinterested. I cannot imagine Michael coming to perform drugged!!
 
mj_frenzy said:
There were subpar projects for his own standards, among others:

The 'Girlfriend' song (1979) which is a melodically weak and thus easily forgettable song.
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'Girlfriend' was written by one of the greatest melodists in the history of pop music and, yes, it's not his greatest effort, however, I wouldn't call the melody weak.
mj_frenzy said:
The 'On The Line' song (1997) in which Michael Jackson with his mellifluous vocals and style tries unsuccessfully to sound like the American singer Babyface.
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He wasn't trying to sound like anybody but himself. It's not the only song that he sang in this style either.

mj_frenzy said:
The 'Heaven Can Wait' song (2001) in which his voice cracks on certain parts.
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It's not his most remarkable vocal performance, that I can agree with. However, it isn't nearly as bad as you're trying to make it out to be. His voice sounds a bit strained from the second verse onwards but does not crack. He was hitting C5's over and over again in that song, at the age of 43. That is insane that he could still do that, and there are some really clean, albeit short, C5's in other songs on that album (e.g Speechless or You Are My Life).

mj_frenzy said:
The two MSG Anniversary Shows (2001), where Michael Jackson finds it hard not only to execute his dance routines but also to lip-sync properly.
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He was literally drugged on the first night, what do you expect? And the second night was, actually, a lot better, but it was clear that he was going through a pretty tough time. Most people who watched the special, enjoyed it though. That's what's most important, in my opinion.

mj_frenzy said:
The 'Dangerous' performance (2002) at the American Bandstand where towards the end he basically ruins his performance with his out of breath voice.
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Really? These few seconds ruin the whole performance? He was 43 years old and was dancing like a 20 year old, doing a very hard and demanding choreography. It's completely natural to be out of breath. That is, most likely, the reason why he lip-synched every Dangerous performance he ever did. And the microphone was turned on, I'm pretty sure, by mistake.
 
OMG! That is aweful! I don't know if it's the bad recording or he is actually out of tune. Please erase! Erase this from my memory!!?! I don't want to know this even exists.
 
Hiker said:
OMG! That is aweful! I don't know if it's the bad recording or he is actually out of tune. Please erase! Erase this from my memory!!?! I don't want to know this even exists.
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All the verses are playback. He does some live adlibs during the song and sings live after 3:24.

mj_frenzy said:
Here is the 'Dangerous' performance (2002) at the American Bandstand:

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I think this is a great performance. That out of breath live part doesn't bother me.
 
mj_frenzy said:
The 'Girlfriend' song (1979) which is a melodically weak and thus easily forgettable song.
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Surprisingly the original is alright.
The 'On The Line' song (1997) in which Michael Jackson with his mellifluous vocals and style tries unsuccessfully to sound like the American singer Babyface.
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Oh come on, On The Line is a great song.

And even if it wasn't, It's from a "rare" single, not from a main album, making it easier to forgive.
The 'Heaven Can Wait' song (2001) in which his voice cracks on certain parts.
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Could be wrong but I think that's an artistic choice.
 
I'm basically going to echo what AChanceToDance said. The September 7th 30th anniversary show was an absolute mess. He clearly looked high as a kite on opiates, during Billie Jean he forgot several dance moves and tried to moonwalk on a rough rubber surface and gave up halfway through. He wouldn't stop cupping the mic even though it was pretty obvious to everyone there he was lip syncing. Black or White and Beat It weren't too bad, but You Rock My World was just...disastrous, he looked compleltey disoriented and just completley out of it.

Thankfully, he was totally sober for the September 10th show and it was literally a night and day difference.
 
The HWT Johannesburg 97 show is one of, if not the weakest of Michael's concerts I have watched. There are some good moments within of course, but as a whole, it is a concert one should skip for Basel 97 or Brunei 96, as both are like, day and night better in all areas. In fact, most of the other shows and performances that came before Johannesburg are probably better. It makes me realize DWT 93 leg is better than I have thought, and even then those are not amongst the best of Michael's shows. Not to criticize the guy tho, I understand

Also I just wanna add, the Billie Jean performance in MSG 2001 should have been edited to include some of the noteworthy parts, like the ankle breaker and some of the spotlight dancing from the first night that were cut out, as well as the second moonwalk and beatbox from the second night that were cut out. The performance is at least more enjoyable because of the atmosphere; it's where the suitcase hype thing works best.


(P.S. Would love to see the show that succeeded in Durban. It was his last performance of many songs, the last of many things. It should be a better concert overall, my personal prediction)
 
AChanceToDance said:
For example: MJ was drugged on the first night of his 30th anniversary concerts, he also wasn't as involved in the production of the Invincible album and people have a dislike for some songs from Invincible (such as Cry and The Lost Children).
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Yeah he didn't seem like himself. I don't know how to explain but it's like he's there but also not there. I watched the edited for TV version w/ re-recorded vocals and I thought the whole MSG performance was great until I saw the amateur unedited and untouched version. That performance was not great. I felt bad for the ticket-goers and people coming to see his show cause they didn't get the full experience of Michael, the show wasn't really there all together. I wonder if their minds and thoughts changed about Michael's perfectionist side, performance skills or going to Michael's concerts after that performance. I hope not cause Michael was just having a rough night and the show wasn't really fully rehearsed like that.
 
AChanceToDance said:
he also wasn't as involved in the production of the Invincible album and people have a dislike for some songs from Invincible (such as Cry and The Lost Children).
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Yeah, personally for me, I thought Invincible was great but it had a lot of fillers on the album. No disrespect to Michael, it's just some of the songs weren't meant for the album. For example, his personal songs: The Lost Children, Speechless, Cry, YAML and etc. I know these songs meant a lot to him but it wasn't album material. And these songs were ok but he had stronger songs in the vault that he could've used for the album, in my opinion.
 
The Lost Children and Speechless are probably in my top 5 invincible songs at the moment.

Whatever Happens
Threatened
YRMW
Speechless
The Lost Children
 
Rocketeer said:
The HWT Johannesburg 97 show is one of, if not the weakest of Michael's concerts I have watched. There are some good moments within of course, but as a whole, it is a concert one should skip for Basel 97 or Brunei 96, as both are like, day and night better in all areas. In fact, most of the other shows and performances that came before Johannesburg are probably better. It makes me realize DWT 93 leg is better than I have thought, and even then those are not amongst the best of Michael's shows. Not to criticize the guy tho, I understand

Also I just wanna add, the Billie Jean performance in MSG 2001 should have been edited to include some of the noteworthy parts, like the ankle breaker and some of the spotlight dancing from the first night that were cut out, as well as the second moonwalk and beatbox from the second night that were cut out. The performance is at least more enjoyable because of the atmosphere; it's where the suitcase hype thing works best.


(P.S. Would love to see the show that succeeded in Durban. It was his last performance of many songs, the last of many things. It should be a better concert overall, my personal prediction)
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Johannesburg 97 did have one MAJOR redeeming factor though. Stranger In Moscow probably displayed MJ's best robot dance moves. Basically combining the modern robot moves with the old school Dancing Machine moves from the J5 days.
 
Many would probably say HIStory Tour because most is lip-synced. Also the 1996 Brunei concert that looks like Dangerous Tour. There is more live singing in that but I'm not a big fan of that show.
 
Galactus123 said:
Also the 1996 Brunei concert that looks like Dangerous Tour. There is more live singing in that but I'm not a big fan of that show.
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Special shows like that are pretty cool to watch tho, we're lucky to be able to watch it. Jam and Human Nature in HIStory era. The adlibs at the end of Earth Song. Coolness galore. Just imagine if they would have proceeded with performing some songs from Bad, like Bad and Dirty Diana.
 
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