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Murray Trial- Day 17 - October 25

bouee said:
Hi everyone ! well , I'm not worried about the verdict, I don't see how Murray could walk ...The charge is based on negligence, it's been proved many times alreadyI'll post updates tonight until the break lunch, I'm not sure I can do it after, since I work early in the morning. On Thursday, I won't be home until the lunch break , at the earliest, so if I can take notes, it will be after rhe lunch break, but maybe not at all . So I will rely on you for updates !
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id really appreciate it if u coukd do updates after the lunch break as i can only update till lunch then i have work on wednesday. then thats it for me interms of being at work during the case. so i can do all of thursday for you.if u cant do wed afteroon session others need to help out. x
 
twinklEE said:
Oh btw. This is what Latoya had to say about yesterday's testimony
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poor girl sees all that aeg cash dissapearing with each testimony.who cares about getting murray found guilty.tweeted her but i think shes blocked me lol. although i aint got a clue so cant really tell
 
Autumn II said:
Yes, it IS. The defense has entirely unraveled. And now Karen Faye is MISSING? :clapping:(did she find an urgent opportunity in Thailand?)
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did they search on twitter...she seems pretty available there.
 
elusive moonwalker said:
So they are gonna use an addiction witness. hope the pros have theirs ready for rebuttal. then again this could backfire big time. like steinberg said. so the defence have two witnesses left to save their case.
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I can only imagine what is going on in those jurors minds....they have got to be thinking,,,,what kind of a defense is this. Like we keep saying there IS NO defense for what it is Murray has done, They can bring in all the witness they want..and none of them will be able to justify Murry's actions on June 25th
 
Urgh work have rung me and asked if i will go in early. so ill still be here and can update till lunch. but then i have to go to work straight away. where as before i was gonna listen to the first hour of the afternoon session on my phone while going to work. i guess this is the least important day for witnesses though. gonna relay on u guys for updates for the afternoon session
 
So I was thinking... murray began buying the propofol in april yet made no effort to obtain emergency equipment or an assistant, etc. Why not? CM had plenty of time to arrange things, had he wanted to. Did he not do it because if he had started to turn Michael's room into a mini ICU, Michael might have started asking questions that cm would not have wanted to answer? From what I have read, Michael seemed insistent on having an anesthesiologist present when receiving prop. during med/dental procedures. I know it's crazy in light of all we've heard and seen but could it be remotely possible he didn't realize he was getting prop and thought he was only getting benzos...No, of course not...sigh. *me going around in circles again*
Why didn't murray have any emergency equipment? I wish someone could ask him even that much.
 
twinklEE said:
It's Latoya what do you expect? Tweets like this one always remind me why I dislike her so much, at least I'm not one of those excusing their pathetic actions and giving them the benefit of the doubt again and again, only to be disappointed yet again. I've recognized them for what they are.

It's really interesting to see how many Jackson Family members showed up for yesterday's court day when Randy Phillips was taking the stand, yet didn't bother showing up while Shafer and others were fighting the defense and explaining possible scenarios of how Michael could have died. They certainly have their priorities in the right place.
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Latoya was sick with the flu last week and Janet was on tour is the reason why they weren't there before. Jermaine has been ill as well. Katherine, Joe, Randy and Rebbie were all there for the testimony you mentioned except for Monday when it was just Randy and Rebbie.
 
So I was thinking... murray began buying the propofol in april yet made no effort to obtain emergency equipment or an assistant, etc. Why not? CM had plenty of time to arrange things, had he wanted to. Did he not do it because if he had started to turn Michael's room into a mini ICU, Michael might have started asking questions that cm would not have wanted to answer? From what I have read, Michael seemed insistent on having an anesthesiologist present when receiving prop. during med/dental procedures. I know it's crazy in light of all we've heard and seen but could it be remotely possible he didn't realize he was getting prop and thought he was only getting benzos...No, of course not...sigh. *me going around in circles again*
Why didn't murray have any emergency equipment? I wish someone could ask him even that much.
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I've been wondering that as well. If Michael was as familiar with propofol as they claim he was and KNEW he needed an anesthesiologist then why would he be okay with Murray having NO equipment to monitor him? None of this makes any sense at all.
 
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Lynn88 said:
Latoya was sick with the flu last week and Janet was on tour is the reason why they weren't there before. Jermaine has been ill as well. Katherine, Joe, Randy and Rebbie were all there for the testimony you mentioned except for Monday when it was just Randy and Rebbie.
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Who cares. randy rebbie janet are the perpretrators of the druggie defence that we will see tom and latoya is to busy being upset that the testimony doesnt support the claims in the aeg lawsuit.doesnt care that the testimony actually supports convicting murray. well at least they found out that mike was an insomniac at last!
 
Lynn88 said:
Latoya was sick with the flu last week and Janet was on tour is the reason why they weren't there before. Jermaine has been ill as well. Katherine, Joe, Randy and Rebbie were all there for the testimony you mentioned except for Monday when it was just Randy and Rebbie.
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Stop making excuses for them this is not just about showing up but about being engaged in a trial, Latoya was busy vacationing across Europe two weeks ago, surely she wasn't sick for that, or when she posted pictures of her caviar while being on the plane. Was Latoya too sick to pay attention to Shafer's testimony as well? As she couldn't get his name right? Yet she was constantly kissing up to HLN. Latoya opened her damn mouth only when it came to Randy Phillips testimony, this is about what Murray did to Michael to cause his death, who the f_ cares about Randy Phillip's testimony and him saying that they never considered to pull the plug or that drugs weren't issue?! A normal person, a sane person would be satisfied with Randy's testimony as it's not helping the defense at all, but not Latoya her greedy attention whoring ass is concerned about the $$$$ they won't get. She doesn't give a damn about Murray or this trial, but seems to be pretty concerned with the AEG lawsuit. What kind of fuckery is this ?!
 
I am disappointed Karen won't testify. I wanted to hear what she would have to say under oath.
 
I didn't catch up with all the testimony til late last night and was too tired to comment but it appears to have been another good day for the prosecution. I was saving my comments about Lee til after she testified but I think her testimony spoke LOUDLY for itself...so Imma bypass the other foolishness and not address it as I had planned. :)

LOL @ the defense's tox expert having to concede that the stomach contents of lorazepam were as little as Dr. Shafer said they were. WOW!

The thing with Latoya is exactly why some here have a problem with that family. They only tend to tweet when it involves something effecting their bottom line$. WHY THE HELL isn't she tweeting like crazy about the FACTS in this case that show this doctor let her brother DIE. Why isn't she tweeting about how horribly he suffered with insomnia for so many years. :censored: Latoya and the rest of them who think now is a bangup time to go on vacay. Utter disgrace...as usual.

And LMAO @ Karen allegedly being in hiding or unable to be found. If it's untrue perhaps she should tweet to McCartney at the AP and let him know his report is false and that she is, in fact, AVAILABLE but just hasn't been approached by the defense with a subpoena. If the defense is lying in court to the judge and making excuses to keep her from telling the TRUTH, then she should be willing and able to stand up and clear up the matter BEFORE the defense rests its case. I swear fo' God if she doesn't address this before the defense rests, it will become amazingly clear that she is indeed either HIDING or she is ALLOWING the defense to lie to the court to keep from having to get on the stand and tell her story.

She has ALL DAY today to fix this if it's a lie, rumor or error. Let's see if she tweets to clear the air or will she conveniently disappear until after the case finishes to proclaim it was a silly rumor.


ETA: Thanks to all for the updates. Always appreciated.
 
re murray's medical records, not connected to yesterday's testimony:

do you remember the medical records shown in court which murray kept about mj prior to 2009. the first went back to early 2006 (01/11/06). i think there was some speculation here that murray's office got the date wrong, confusing 2007 with 2006. but there was another record dating from 07/24/06.
i thought it interesting that murray appeared to develop a sense of charity in 2006 when he opened his clinic in houston.

murray bio mentioning houston clinic:
http://www.biography.com/people/dr-conrad-murray-481814

articles mentioning houston clinic:
http://www.aframnews.com/html/inter...onnected-in-Michael-Jacksons-Death/Page1.html
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/23/us/23jackson.html
 
I believe Karen is hiding becuase she can not truthfully testify to the things she stated to fans or publically. She calls them her truths which she says may differ from others truths .. thats a ridiculas statement IMO She lied about her discussion with KO and about him not trying to help MJ and cant not testify to that now that evidence shows he did try and help as best he could. He drew attention to MJs not feeling well and went to a meeting to adress that with his DR. He was told everything would be taken care of and that MJ is fine. .. There was not anything else he had power to do. No one knew what was going on behind closed doors and even KF herself told fans to back off and wait so as not to draw attention so she cant fault others for doing the same. Karen faye has always been a huge gossip and tears down everyone who was in Mjs life in order to build her self up as some kind of saint who never betrayed MJ - That is false. when caught in her lies her excuse is - well that was my truth and undrstanding at the time. after the fact she ripped these people to pieces .. such as she did with Lisa maria. in 2007 then in 2010 she said she was wrong but the words are already out there and that damage from them.

She even infered that KO he was responsible fot the bridge accident at MJ and friends in order to disredit him further stating MJ told her at TII kenney never apologised . *side eyes* and Although Im not fond of Gest she also just bashed him for stating something she herself spread through the fan base about MJ and drugs at 30th Anniversary concert. She went in great detail. I called her on that but she blocked my twitter account. I wish she would have been found so fans could see for themselves though her testimony. "Her truths"

She has a reason to hide ..
 
sophie said:
re murray's medical records, not connected to yesterday's testimony:

do you remember the medical records shown in court which murray kept about mj prior to 2009. the first went back to early 2006 (01/11/06). i think there was some speculation here that murray's office got the date wrong, confusing 2007 with 2006. but there was another record dating from 07/24/06.
i thought it interesting that murray appeared to develop a sense of charity in 2006 when he opened his clinic in houston.

murray bio mentioning houston clinic:
http://www.biography.com/people/dr-conrad-murray-481814

articles mentioning houston clinic:
http://www.aframnews.com/html/inter...onnected-in-Michael-Jacksons-Death/Page1.html
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/23/us/23jackson.html
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The dates were wrong becuase after the trial Michael was in barhain and Ireland and never returned
to the USA untill Dec 23 2006 So Murray couldnt have met or treated him duing that time.
 
I also wanted to add something about questions in the thread about Michael allowing Murray to administer without a lot of equipment....

TO ME...it appears Murray convinced Michael that he was skilled at giving the drug. He never admits in his interview that he didn't know HOW to administer propofol or ever told Michael he was not experienced with it and might not be up to the task. In fact, when he "claims" Michael said he was concerned about Murray being able to handle the job (the long hours), it is MURRAY, in his police interview, who confidently states he told Michael that he COULD HANDLE IT. He never seemed to indicate he was not up to the task or wary of doing this. So there is not a doubt in my mind that he convinced Michael that all the equipment he was normally familiar with was not required anymore or that he was competent enuf to monitor Michael with only that pulse oxymeter and his eyes.

Think about it, what is he and his lawyer doing in this very case? They are trying to convince everyone that the pulse thingy was all that was needed. Don't you think he more than likely said the same to Michael...and was prolly very convincing about it. Michael TRUSTED him.
 
qbee said:
The dates were wrong becuase after the trial Michael was in barhain and Ireland and never returned to the USA untill Dec 23 2006 So Murray couldnt have met or treated him duing that time.
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there were several reports at the time and amongst fans that mj returned to the usa for a short visit in early 06
 
wendy2004 said:
I also wanted to add something about questions in the thread about Michael allowing Murray to administer without a lot of equipment....TO ME...it appears Murray convinced Michael that he was skilled at giving the drug. He never admits in his interview that he didn't know HOW to administer propofol or ever told Michael he was not experienced with it and might not be up to the task. In fact, when he "claims" Michael said he was concerned about Murray being able to handle the job (the long hours), it is MURRAY, in his police interview, who confidently states he told Michael that he COULD HANDLE IT. He never seemed to indicate he was not up to the task or wary of doing this. So there is not a doubt in my mind that he convinced Michael that all the equipment he was normally familiar with was not required anymore or that he was competent enuf to monitor Michael with only that pulse oxymeter and his eyes. Think about it, what is he and his lawyer doing in this very case? They are trying to convince everyone that the pulse thingy was all that was needed. Don't you think he more than likely said the same to Michael...and was prolly very convincing about it. Michael TRUSTED him.
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and yesterday walgren got randy to point out that mj seemed very trusting of murray
 
Another thing....in the Seacost invoices...it seems Murray DID purchase some items that would be useful for respiratory arrest or at the very least, something to clear MJ's airway. He bought the thing to bring the tongue from in the back of the throat if apnea occurs, yet NONE of these items were found in the house. Where was he storing all those items if he wasn't using them? And why weren't they in the house for emergencies if he bought them for that purpose? Did he have one and DID use it and that went into his pocket with the tubing? We saw the ambu bag on the floor but he never mentions using it in his police interview. There's a lot about what Murray did that morning that he hasn't told or left out for whatever reason. The only way he can clarify it all is to take the stand and finally purge. Problem is this: He has lied so much already who will believe a word he says.

As they say...sometimes the cover-up is just as bad as the actual crime.
 
The Jacksons have eight reserved seats in the courtroom, don't they? It's a LARGE family. All those seats should be filled, all the time. I see no excuse for it, if they are not.
 
Off topic (but not too much) amy whinehouse's autopsy findings were published today and they did find that she had had alcohol the night she died and this killed her. She was the poster girl for drugs 2/3 yrs before she died, was shown drunk and staggering about on stage a month or two before she died, and yet her family steadfastly stood by her after her death, defending her reputation, saying she was in rehab from alcohol. Compare and contrast with mj's family, wasn't brian oxman out front and centre on 25th/26th saying mj's death was inevitable and there was all the talk about family interventions in the days following his death? And the defence in this trial is using the addict angle for all that they can as there is nothing else for them to use. I wouldn't have been surprised if some of the jacksons hadn't been called as defence witnesses.
 
I just saw a short interview Nurse Lee gave. She said she suddenly just got sick and it was like a virus in the courtroom. The interviewer said it was that time of the year, but Lee came back and said, 'it wasn't that kind of virus'. She then quickly added that she won't got any further into it.

It would seem that she wasn't sick or nervous about testifying, but she got sick because she was in the same room as Murray.
 
Ramona122003 said:
I just saw a short interview Nurse Lee gave. She said she suddenly just got sick and it was like a virus in the courtroom. The interviewer said it was that time of the year, but Lee came back and said, 'it wasn't that kind of virus'. She then quickly added that she won't got any further into it.

It would seem that she wasn't sick or nervous about testifying, but she got sick because she was in the same room as Murray.
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I think that is entirely POSSIBLE. That man just radiates evil. Yeah, a "virus" is a good way of putting it.

Turns out, I now think Lee was GREAT -- for the prosecution. She did a medical work-up on Michael, kept careful notes, and seems to have been thoroughly professional --and not "viral," at all.
 
Bonnie Blue said:
Off topic (but not too much) amy whinehouse's autopsy findings were published today and they did find that she had had alcohol the night she died and this killed her. She was the poster girl for drugs 2/3 yrs before she died, was shown drunk and staggering about on stage a month or two before she died, and yet her family steadfastly stood by her after her death, defending her reputation, saying she was in rehab from alcohol. Compare and contrast with mj's family, wasn't brian oxman out front and centre on 25th/26th saying mj's death was inevitable and there was all the talk about family interventions in the days following his death? And the defence in this trial is using the addict angle for all that they can as there is nothing else for them to use. I wouldn't have been surprised if some of the jacksons hadn't been called as defence witnesses.
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Even if they aren't called as witnesses they've done enuf to poison the public and what a potential jury pool. I wouldn't be surprised if Murray and Chernoff did not see the coverage of that 1st 24-hrs after MJ's death and decided to use the addict angle to their advantage. In Murray's police interview it's clear he's ready to join the fray and playing dumb like he didn't know about other doctors and whatnot...even though MJ's meds were at the bedside and he admits to noticing the meds not prescribed by him (some meds out of date and being underused). I totally agree with you that the Oxmans and Chopras and Jacksons have a lot to be proud of.

What I found interesting when glancing bits and pieces of Murray's records on MJ for certain years was that either Murray, someone in his office, someone at the labs, or someone in Michael's house (oh what the hell...I'll say it as surely it wouldn't have been MJ doing it...GRACE) was talking MJ's health biz to either the media or his family and misinterpreting it. Some things mentioned in Murray's records had turned up in tabloid reports in the past years and NOW it seems to be clear where that info originated. However, the source of the story either lied or purposely mischaracterized MJ's condition.

Hint? Remember all that talk about MJ's liver being bad and gavet his elaborate tale of why it was bad? WHERE did we first hear that? WHO was first to throw that drama out there? Think back.
Hmmm...
 
Ramona122003 said:
I just saw a short interview Nurse Lee gave. She said she suddenly just got sick and it was like a virus in the courtroom. The interviewer said it was that time of the year, but Lee came back and said, 'it wasn't that kind of virus'. She then quickly added that she won't got any further into it.

It would seem that she wasn't sick or nervous about testifying, but she got sick because she was in the same room as Murray.
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Omg...this is kinda funny cuz I noticed the minute Chernoff asked Judge Pastor to approach her to help with her notes she seemed to get REALLY flustered and "ill". It was like she didn't want him anywhere near her. This is going to sound weird but some ppl are sensitive to evil or to ppl who give off severely bad vibes. That may be what she meant by "virus", like Autumn II mentioned.
 
twinklEE said:
Stop making excuses for them this is not just about showing up but about being engaged in a trial, Latoya was busy vacationing across Europe two weeks ago, surely she wasn't sick for that, or when she posted pictures of her caviar while being on the plane. Was Latoya too sick to pay attention to Shafer's testimony as well? As she couldn't get his name right? Yet she was constantly kissing up to HLN. Latoya opened her damn mouth only when it came to Randy Phillips testimony, this is about what Murray did to Michael to cause his death, who the f_ cares about Randy Phillip's testimony and him saying that they never considered to pull the plug or that drugs weren't issue?! A normal person, a sane person would be satisfied with Randy's testimony as it's not helping the defense at all, but not Latoya her greedy attention whoring ass is concerned about the $$$$ they won't get. She doesn't give a damn about Murray or this trial, but seems to be pretty concerned with the AEG lawsuit. What kind of fuckery is this ?!
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YOU were the one complaining that family wasn't in the court to hear testimony and I gave you valid reasons as to why they weren't. And you yourself just pointed out that Latoya was following online yet that obviously isn't good enough for you. Another poster had it right in 2300 Jackson St. when she said nothing the Jacksons do will ever be right in many people's eyes.
 
twinklEE said:
It's really interesting to see how many Jackson Family members showed up for yesterday's court day when Randy Phillips was taking the stand, yet didn't bother showing up while Shafer and others were fighting the defense and explaining possible scenarios of how Michael could have died. They certainly have their priorities in the right place.
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^^ Waw I did not think of that one. I was thinking they came because they thought the defense will begin that day, but you have something there. How come this is the first time Latoya made that statement. She could have said a similar statement when other witnesses were on the stand. What made yesterday so different. I guess it is Randy's testimony she is talking about.

Those who are worried that Muarry will be found not guilty. Keep strong. The case is about neglect, and it has been proven. The judge will inform the jury that if they see negligence on Muarry's part they can say he is guilty. People who are looking at the case from the media are listening to the commentators angles about how Michael was the one who asked Muarry to give him prof. However, the charges are not about whether Michael caused his death by seeking someone to give him the drug, but that his doctor acted in a reckless and neglectful manner. I have never been worried about this case and as the days go by I am becoming even more confident, if that is possible.

If if the jury think Michael was wrong to ask for prof, they still have to go by the judges instructions which points at determining that the charges have been proven. Be strong and don't let others make you think about negative outcomes.
 
Lynn88 said:
YOU were the one complaining that family wasn't in the court to hear testimony and I gave you valid reasons as to why they weren't. And you yourself just pointed out that Latoya was following online yet that obviously isn't good enough for you. Another poster had it right in 2300 Jackson St. when she said nothing the Jacksons do will ever be right in many people's eyes.
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LMAO, a million people are right when they say NO MATTER what the Jackson's pull you will NEVER people will NEVER see anything wrong in it, and GOD KNOWS they have exhausted everything so far. There is barely anything left for them to do now. The reasons you gave were definitely NOT VAILID. For someone like Jermaine maybe, who actually makes sense on Twitter while talking about the trial, the witnesses and the reason whey HE couldn't be present. But folks like LATOYA had NO REASON. There is NO REASON for her to continue ignoring these facts, the woman is SIXTY not SIX. Some actions are INEXCUSABLE whether or not you consider them Gods or nor not.
 
wendy2004 said:
Omg...this is kinda funny cuz I noticed the minute Chernoff asked Judge Pastor to approach her to help with her notes she seemed to get REALLY flustered and "ill". It was like she didn't want him anywhere near her. This is going to sound weird but some ppl are sensitive to evil or to ppl who give off severely bad vibes. That may be what she meant by "virus", like Autumn II mentioned.
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Absolutely, if you watch her testimony again you can see her glance sideways at Murray and immediately looked sick and flustered. She really didn't want to be in that room with him.
 
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