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The Change in Michael's Message and Image After 'Thriller'

Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

83magic said:
people are posting and referencing things that are not within the time frame or context of this discussion. i'll let Michael speak for himself.
here on the set of 'beat it', Michael discusses the concept and message of the video/song, not having street experience, and feeling shy and uncomfortable offstage, his sunday rituals of fasting and dancing, Disney, and redesigning the family home (notice how he perks up at this point)
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Michael dad really messed up michael. he didn't know anybody. all he knew was the stage. he didn't know alot people. michael was very intelligent and creative young man he got some of his ideas from movies,books, and school. michael loved to read and history. he kind of like me when i get my most of my creatively from. it's sad to know michael really have no friends. and this is nothing new he went though this all his life. it's make me wanna cry. quincy jones wasn't really his friend because once he left him for teddy riley in the late 80's he was mad because he wanted to try an genre of music. diana ross rejected him. he loved her so much. he was an loner. :( i didn't know michael was an fan of the pirates of the caribbean. i loved those movies. i know this before the movies but it's cool to know he like it. make sense he loved pirates. michael was born to entertain us. i always knew beat it was an possible message when i first saw the video as an small child. i love the video. i love the song. it's one of my favorite songs from the thriller era. it's also catchy and rocked good. i actually start dancing everytime when i hear the song.

i love michael in the video. the way he dances in the video is excellent. it's like he moves with the music and every beat. i love when he go to the pool hall and comes in and etc. the way he turns around and slap his thigh and sit on edge of the pool table is so spot on. the whole video was excellent.

i see what you mean about thriller era michael because i love this era too. he an sweetheart in this era and very child friendly. he also more happier in this era as well. he was a very handsome young man during this time. he only in his early 20's-mid 20's in this era. he so young and had a whole life headed of him especially the fact his father never let him have friends or never met different people he wasn't jesus christ of course because none of us are but his image here is so calm. in 1984 i'm not mistaking he had tribute in his 20's. how many artists ever had an tribute so early in their lifes like MJ? michael had people looking up to him so young. bless him we miss him so. :heart:
 
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Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

You know looking back it was good MJ fasted. after all he was an dancer. he was always slim though. :)
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

Regarding the crotch-grabbing thingy...I think it's way more simple than some of you make it out to be. Michael was making love with the music :wub:. It went beyond expressing himself, it was about becoming one with the sound. Every one of his songs carried an idea behind it, something Michael believed in and felt in his heart.
So when you lose yourself inside the music and float away to other realities, your primal instincts take over. And sexuality is as primal of an instinct as you can get.
To be short, he was fckng the music on stage. Just look at him move...that stuff comes from the heart. And the heart is controlled by the genitals, if you ask me.

But yeah, it's really funny how some people actually prefer the limited and controlled Michael, as he was up until Bad. I guess to each his own. I think Invincible is the best album and know that I'm in minority.
However, I believe we can all agree that Michael wasn't actually pushing the limits until Bad. He just dominated what was already established. OK, Thriller did already push the envelope, but only because Michael had a bit more control. But Thriller represented an existing era, while Bad defined a whole new world and possibilities.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. There is nothing revolutionary in singing beautifully. Not everyone can, but everyone knows how it should be done. When you've got a killer mellody (like Human Nature), the song writes itself. Take away Michael's signature grunts, moans and screams and you've got a pretty standard song. An incredible song, a masterpiece....but still standard in the sense of structure.
But then, take a song like Speed Demon and tell me if that isn't something that you've never ever heard before. A revolution, a breakthrough concept that basically noone can emulate.

Limiting yourself to only Michael's early work....that's a rough criminal :troll2:
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

Regarding the crotch-grabbing thingy...I think it's way more simple than some of you make it
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it was his way of expressing the anger he felt like his way of saying ''up yours'' to joe and all his naysayers . If felt the beat thats when he expressed himself during dance
 
About his panther dance video:

Having been absent from new music for nearly four years, Michael Jackson wanted with his panther dance video to return emphatically in the limelight.

And he eventually achieved that, because that video created the desired for him controversy and set tongues wagging about him in general, and therefore that video's controversy also helped him to increase the sales of his ‘Dangerous’ album even more.

Michael Jackson used the simulated masturbation scene along with the depicted, nonsensical violence (in the original version) as the video’s two main ways in order to achieve that controversy.

Having achieved that desired initial controversy, his next step was to slightly alter certain parts of that video via the CGI method.

It is worth noting that the subsequent video’s altering via CGI method had been planned from the very beginning, as the next step after the achieved, initial controversy of the video.

Also, in the unseen version of that video, Michael Jackson shot even more violent scenes along with extremely sexually explicit gestures and moves, but the director John Landis eventually rejected that unseen version because it would be too shocking for the world.
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

It doesn't surprise me that Michael had it planned but I don't think the controversy was only for album sales. You can also look at it as being part of the point he was making and felt passionate about. The public reaction was already in the film with Bart watching the Panther dance on TV and Homer shouting at him to turn it off. Having the reaction in real life enabled him to use the graffiti which only further serves to emphasise the meaning in the film. It's a clever idea and he had some really genius moments.

What happened to the unseen version, was it destroyed?
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

Would it be ready for viewing in this day and age? would they ever release " that" version? its twenty years on ... times have changed ..
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

wendijane said:
Would it be ready for viewing in this day and age? would they ever release " that" version? its twenty years on ... times have changed ..
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Lol no way people are pathetically soft these days. Offended by everything.
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

8701girl said:
If felt the beat thats when he expressed himself during dance
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You got a point. i do remember him saying that. i remember him saying when the music is about to chance to a different part he would thrust his hips. i have seen it.
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

Maybe Michael wanted to be "sexy"? is being "sexy" wrong? i think that was he was probably doing. i don't think sexy dancing wrong BUT i do think who your targeting to is.

i mean look at betty boop and jessica rabbit. they all drawled "bad" but they not really are. Michael had an sex appeal he always did since thriller era.
 
I think michael should of just say who we was targeting to that's all. he said everyone. at the end of day people need to watch their kids. i mean i like michael but he should of been honest who he targeting to. he claimed he love the kids but your way of some your dancing isn't kid-friendly. growing up looking at michael dance i always use laugh how the way he touch himself. everyone who knew michael jackson we laugh because we knew how he dances and his heehee's and hoo-hoo's. i don't think michael is bad. like DuranDuran said micheal was pretty mild compare to other artists. good and bad exists. you can't make a story without something good or bad with it. that's the truth. you can't have a plot without an conflict. at the end of the day watch your kids. it's not the TV or the radio work to watch them. it's the parents.

Micheal is already going though fake lies now and like he was then. while i love him he should been careful who the people he was around with. he was always naïve. poor michael. :(
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

Michael grabbing himself or stroking his body while he danced is not going to have any weird or traumatising effect on a child. His sensual dancing was nowhere near as suggestive as other stuff kids are exposed to. He just did what he felt in the moment. Just because you deem some of his dancing as not child-friendly that doesn't mean he didn't love children. It has nothing to do with it.
 
entertainment

NatureCriminal7896 said:
at the end of the day watch your kids. it's not the TV or the radio work to watch them. it's the parents.
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It's been said that the kids of preachers/pastors who are kept isolated from secular things are the sometimes the ones who go wild when they leave home. Also sheltered kids are generally the ones who can get scammed easily when they go out into the world as apposed to more streetwise kids. The unsheltered kids might grow up to take advantage of the sheltered ones. Like in that Tito interview, he mentioned that he, Jackie, & Jermaine were older than Michael & Marlon when they started performing so had a little more outside life experience than them. Jackie was scouted to play professional baseball.

Different parents teach their children different things, a racist parent is going to pass their bigotry to their kids. Nobody is born racist or anything else. They learn it from somebody. Just like kids are raised in different religions and a rich kid doesn't get the same upbringing as a poor one. A particular race/ethnicity is likely to have more entertainment in their own race as well as cultural things belonging to it. A Mexican is more likely to listen to Mexican singers and buy their CDs than a white or Chinese person would.

Not all parents control what their kids listen to or watch. Anyway that's harder to do today than before everything was done on computers and the internet came into wide use. Kids can easily access porn today for free. It's on Twitter, Instagram, Tumblr, and Facebook. They aren't porn sites, but people put the pictures/gifs on them. Supposedly the sites have sensors that block it, but that doesn't really work. Pre-internet, they could only see it is if their parents happen to have the magazines and/or videotapes and the kids find them. You can find nudie videos on Youtube and also KKK & Neo Nazi videos, Satanism and all kinds of things. Kids having phones mean they can film school fights and upload them online.
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

I didn't said that anna..... though. everyone has their own opinions. i don't think michael was bad guy though. it's own people kids. if they want they kids with michael then fine. if they don't then that's their thing. heck some people might don't wanna be around me. do i have i problem with that? not exactly. maybe it their thing. maybe we don't fit with each other. we have differences. we all different. i say do whatever you want. like whatever you feel. just be careful that's all. but like i said Everyone Has Their Own Opinions.
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

NatureCriminal7896 said:
I didn't said that anna..... though.
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Yes, you did. Literally right above my last post. That is what you are saying when you say something is not child-friendly. You are saying that it's not suitable for children. Which means it's potentially harmful to them in some way. You also said that he "claimed to love kids but his dancing wasn't kid-friendly". Well his dancing has nothing to do with how much he loved kids. The two are not mutually exclusive.
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

Respect one another. Everyone is different. Everyone have their own opinions.
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

Growing up michael dancing never bother me but he did touch himself while dancing. in other people eyes they may think that's not right. so yeah everyone has their own opinions and it nothing wrong about it. at the end of the day it about respect. heck some people don't like michael at all but that doesn't mean he an bad person.

Michael said he was fine if some people didn't like his music or his dancing etc. and he's right. some people only like michael for his humanitarian work and not his music. that's a fact. there are somethings michael didn't like he did himself as person and in music.

like said we all different and have our own opinions. RESPECT.
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

NatureCriminal7896 said:
Respect one another. Everyone is different. Everyone have their own opinions.
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This is a discussion forum. People aren't always going to agree with you. Disagreeing isn't disrespect.
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

Okay guys. now i'm getting confuse. :coockoo:
 
NatureCriminal7896;4270595 said:
Okay guys. now i'm getting confuse. :coockoo:
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What she’s trying to say is that you don’t have to agree with someone to respect them. You said this yourself though, with how you don’t agree with what Michael did with his dances but you still love him.
 
Hudson112;4270596 said:
What she’s trying to say is that you don’t have to agree with someone to respect them. You said this yourself though, with how you don’t agree with what Michael did with his dances but you still love him.
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No i never said i didn't like his dancing. his dancing never bother me only the part where's he touch himself. and his dangerous and history eras other than that still love him AS AN PERSON.
 
NatureCriminal7896;4270597 said:
No i never said i didn't like his dancing. his dancing never bother me only the part where's he touch himself. and his dangerous and history eras other than that still love him AS AN PERSON.
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I didn’t say you didn’t like his dancing, I said you didn’t like WHAT HE DID with his dancing (touching himself, as you say, even though that is one of his dance routines, so in a way, you kind of are bothered by his dancing in that aspect) But the point still stands, you don’t have to agree with people’s choices to respect them. There’s nothing to be confused about, you said it yourself.
 
Hudson112;4270598 said:
I didn’t say you didn’t like his dancing, I said you didn’t like WHAT HE DID with his dancing (touching himself, as you say, even though that is one of his dance routines, so in a way, you kind of are bothered by his dancing in that aspect) But the point still stands, you don’t have to agree with people’s choices to respect them. There’s nothing to be confused about, you said it yourself.
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Forget it. because i don't get it. there's nothing wrong with you. just something i have as an person. an blessed day or night whatever you are or what time it is.
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

NatureCriminal7896 said:
Forget it. because i don't get it. there's nothing wrong with you. just something i have as an person. an blessed day or night whatever you are or what time it is.
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Same to you.
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

I never took the BAD era seriously. i just saw it as entertainment. we all tend to forget the fact Michael was an entertainer. all artists,dancers,actors,and entertainers do this. i think we all take it too seriously. it all pretend anyway. as for Michael injustice songs those are serious topics. you don't have to like some of his music styles or his videos. it all about your taste and what you like as an person. as long it doesn't have nothing to with you going to jail for. go for it.

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Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

NatureCriminal7896 said:
I never took the BAD era seriously. i just saw it as entertainment. we all tend to forget the fact Michael was an entertainer. all artists,dancers,actors,and entertainers do this. i think we all take it too seriously. it all pretend anyway. as for Michael injustice songs those are serious topics. you don't have to like some of his music styles or his videos. it all about your taste and what you like as an person.
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Who's "we"? It was the OP who started talking about how he didn't like how Mike sang after Thriller in the other thread, which was moved to this one. Too aggressive & angry for the OP. Then he or she started saying that Mike was Peter Pan because that was what he presented in the early 1980s and that the behavior and images later was Mike trying to fit in with other performers and not really who he was.

As far as pretend, that is not necessarily so. Look at singers like Marvin Gaye & Chris Cornell who often put their personal problems into their songs. Marvin has an entire album about getting divorced from his 1st wife called Here My Dear. Chris committed suicide about a year ago and Marvin was shot by his father in 1984. Tupac Shakur got killed over living that "Thug Life" persona.
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

Not all things people do is pretend. your right. but that's not the case with EVERYONE. you don't have agree what say guys. these are my opinions so is 83magic.
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

I like both Thriller and BAD eras. everything before that and everything in the 2000's. everyone has their own eras they like and don't like. some may like all eras. IT"S YOU. not anyone elses taste.
 
Re: the change in michael's message and image after 'thriller'

At the end of the day we all love MJ. i think that's all what matters on this forum.
 
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