This Is It - Your Analysis

[earth child]

I understand where you are coming from and I understand we see different things, but you can put you're point forwards and I will put mine. But rather than just saying it looks like travis is stopping michael from falling and ending with that, I came up with an indepth answer, which makes perfect sense? I also understand I am vastly outnumbered in the section, and this is the reason people don't travel this far, but I feel I have a right to stick up for Michaels vision.

You really need to watch the behind the scenes and see how into this Michael was, he had a hand in everything, and the way he spoke about enviromental issues and the way he affected people on that show is remarkable, this is the reason I choose to be in that corner. Michael changed lives in those months nutured, taught and helped people, like they said, they were a family. what happened after that changed the world forever, this is it, is the las positive thing Michael did, and hearing him speak about how he wanted people to heed his message just closes the case for me.

I did watch the behind the scenes and saw even more how Michael wasn't the only one not ready to go with this show. Michael has been changing live and spreading a positive message for years. It didn't just start with TII. I, as a life long fan would be doing MJ a disservice to put on blinders and pretend that everything was wonderful, when in fact, it is obvious to me, it wasn't. I know he was a human being with limitation and he deserves more respect than the rose colored glasses will allow.
Sometimes, reality really does bite.

 

[Samtkaninchen]

I mean for a start Travis pain has his hand out clicking his finger to the beat, second of all like mentioned above HE KNOWS THAT PART OF THE PERFORMANCE MICHAEL DOESN'T!!!

8 I believe, was it 11 or 13 until showtime?

Do you think it's possible that MJ still doesn't know that part of the performance at that time?

See, I not criticizing anyone for their opinion, I'm just trying to find answers to questions I have - and as it seems I have more each day. - Peace.

 

[daisy]

I came up with an indepth answer, which makes perfect sense?

...to you.
Please, things you're saying are mainstream obvious opinions but you think you "enlighten us"
We've heard it many times before, sorry :bored:
There are 628 threads in TII section...

 

[Birchey]

I did watch the behind the scenes and saw even more how Michael wasn't the only one not ready to go with this show. Michael has been changing live and spreading a positive message for years. It didn't just start with TII. I, as a life long fan would be doing MJ a disservice to put on blinders and pretend that everything was wonderful, when in fact, it is obvious to me, it wasn't. I know he was a human being with limitation and he deserves more respect than the rose colored glasses will allow.
Sometimes, reality really does bite.

Yes Michael has been spreading the message for a longtime, but I think he felt (Especially with the 4 year thing he said, and with what Kenny said about him not wanting his Kids to grow in an unrecognizable planet) He felt now was the time, like he said This Is It. Can you explain more about why Michael wasn't the only person not ready?

 

[Birchey]

...to you.
Please, things you're saying are mainstream obvious opinions but you think you "enlighten us"
We've heard it many times before, sorry :bored:
There are 628 threads in TII section...

They are mainstream because they are fact, I am laying down facts. And Where else has someone mentioned about Travis knowing the run through for Thriller and not MJ? Travis is clearly cueing MJ near the end to, plus Michael is not so close to the edge.

Just seems funny to me how some people automatically believe every thread that bashed This Is It? Not pointing at you but I have seen some outrageous stuff being put across!

 

[earth child]

Yes Michael has been spreading the message for a longtime, but I think he felt (Especially with the 4 year thing he said, and with what Kenny said about him not wanting his Kids to grow in an unrecognizable planet) He felt now was the time, like he said This Is It. Can you explain more about why Michael wasn't the only person not ready?

Yes, it was 2 weeks until show time and they had never run through DD or SC all the way. They say so in the extras.
Some of the stage props weren't even built yet., (Lightman and bulldozer) Let alone tested and moved to London and tested again. There had never been a dress rehearsal.
I really do not believe they would have been able to pull all of that together and then move the entire thing to a new country and arena in two weeks.

 

[MJJ7777]

I did watch the behind the scenes and saw even more how Michael wasn't the only one not ready to go with this show. Michael has been changing live and spreading a positive message for years. It didn't just start with TII. I, as a life long fan would be doing MJ a disservice to put on blinders and pretend that everything was wonderful, when in fact, it is obvious to me, it wasn't. I know he was a human being with limitation and he deserves more respect than the rose colored glasses will allow.
Sometimes, reality really does bite.

:clapping:I agree earthchild.

Birchey- If it weren't for Michael's positive message, do you think we would have been fans??? That's what attracted me to Michael in the first place. And I continued to see Michael's message spread allthroughout This is It as I was used to seeing it...
ONE difference is that THIS time we have Michael's positive message clouded in a much different and grim surrounding during TII. No matter how much the promoters want us to believe that everything was candyland fine behind the scenes...WE can see the DIFFERENCE because we know Michael that much and enough to see when something isn't right, no matter how much you try to sugarcoat it.

 

[daisy]

They are mainstream because they are fact

:sigh:

Sorry, I'm not going to believe everything I'm told. I do not want to be so limited by the "mainstream true facts"
And thanks to this section I know tehre are other people that would like to dig and see what's beyond the obvious.

this is what the IU stands for:

The Investigative Unit In this forum we question Michael's death, the latest news and stories surrounding his death and the conspiracy theories - contains heavy spectulation so please if you aren't able to respect the atmosphere of this section do not enter.

 

[Birchey]

Yes, it was 2 weeks until show time and they had never run through DD or SC all the way. They say so in the extras.
Some of the stage props weren't even built yet., (Lightman and bulldozer) Let alone tested and moved to London and tested again. There had never been a dress rehearsal.
I really do not believe they would have been able to pull all of that together and then move the entire thing to a new country and arena in two weeks.

Lightman was soon ready, Michael would not have played a big part in it, the technical side of the entrance was most certainly done.

We don't even know where the Bulldozer was being made or sourced from do we? I heard it was a 5 ton Bulldozer/Tractor. could have been made in the UK for all we know, would be interesting if someone would source the company making this? Or is anything on the special features?

About DD and SC not having a full run through, this was nothing new to Michael he was changing stuff and still working on songs just 8 or so days before the opening Bad Tour 88 show. Can I also mention he was still using a stand in too.

Dress rehearsals seem to be brought up alot. Michael didn't do Dress rehearsals until the last minute, another reason is for security, pictures leaking of the full show would be a no go. Zaldy wasn't the only person Making clothes, and the outfit you see Michael wearing at the end of I'll Be There was a finished outfit designed for this show by Michael Bush. Also Michael was to use alternate BJ Jackets, using the light up one on the opening night, then the Jacket was to be put in a museum and a spare used when Michael wanted too.

I think yes it was tight, but Michael left everything until last minute on his shows. Especially re-learning his dance routines

 

[Birchey]

:sigh:

Sorry, I'm not going to believe everything I'm told. I do not want to be so limited by the "mainstream true facts"
And thanks to this section I know tehre are other people that would like to dig and see what's beyond the obvious.

this is what the IU stands for:

Yes I fully understand and have explained this before, but the main word about is "Question" why question something and only accept the worst answer everytime? why not look at both sides of the coin.

Just randomly blurting things out about how bad MJ looked and so on dont make sense, you need stuff to back it up.

 

[daisy]

Lightman was soon ready

When? We don't know that. they were "packing" yet, the opening and the closing of the show was not really rehersed with the equipment (and without? We don't know since nothing like that is shown on the film)

Michael would not have played a big part in it, the technical side of the entrance was most certainly done.

Speculation. We don't know that. The footage we've been shown are not convincing.

We don't even know where the Bulldozer was being made or sourced from do we? I heard it was a 5 ton Bulldozer/Tractor. could have been made in the UK for all we know, would be interesting if someone would source the company making this? Or is anything on the special features?

Could have. We were actually told so little because, I think, so little was prepared.

About DD and SC not having a full run through, this was nothing new to Michael he was changing stuff and still working on songs just 8 or so days before the opening Bad Tour 88 show. Can I also mention he was still using a stand in too.

Dress rehearsals seem to be brought up alot. Michael didn't do Dress rehearsals until the last minute, another reason is for security, pictures leaking of the full show would be a no go. Zaldy wasn't the only person Making clothes, and the outfit you see Michael wearing at the end of I'll Be There was a finished outfit designed for this show by Michael Bush. Also Michael was to use alternate BJ Jackets, using the light up one on the opening night, then the Jacket was to be put in a museum and a spare used when Michael wanted too.

I think yes it was tight, but Michael left everything until last minute on his shows. Especially re-learning his dance routines

Nothing new, we were told this.

Birchey, you need to read more threads here, because we are repeating ourselves.

 

[daisy]

Yes I fully understand and have explained this before, but the main word about is "Question" why question something and only accept the worst answer everytime? why not look at both sides of the coin.

Just randomly blurting things out about how bad MJ looked and so on dont make sense, you need stuff to back it up.

Sorry, but you are positioning yourself as "reasonable" and only saying things that are making "perfect sense" against people here as "blurting things out about how bad MJ looked and so on"
This way you are demonstrating you don't really know what's going on here in this unit.
Could you please, try to read more threads and posts and more carefully, cause we've started being circular here.

 

[Birchey]

Birchey, you need to read more threads here, because we are repeating ourselves.

Point me to one thread with the info about the Bad Tour rehearsals, and the BJ Jacket please, if you already know it go ahead You don't know anything other than that you make up

I will leave this place and you can waste away speculating on stuff that will have no real outcome

 

[Birchey]

Some people are scared of the facts, especially when they reveal that persons lack of knowledge of the subject at hand, its better to just make overcasting comments than actually bring up facts themselves

 

[DJ Spins the sounds]

One thing for sure about TII, Michael was going to do a lot more live singing, than the poor Dangerous and History tours. I think some of the vocal's were some of his best since BAD, especially Smooth Criminal, you show me another 50 year old male who can dance and sing and at that pace, I think he's got every right to be out of breath, lol.

And to comment about the dancing, do you all understand that this was only rehearsal's, I'm sure some of you think you were watching a concert, how can you criticise a rehearsal. Michael was a perfectionist in every way, he just going through the motions, he's done all these routines hundred's of times, plus he was pulling off new moves and experimenting at the same time. TII was not a performance, you must understand this.

Like Kenny said, TII this was just for the fans, to say goodbye, some kind of closure.

 

[Mack]

It is ridiculous, disrespectful and really distasteful to promote the idea that Michael was frail based on a poorly educated opinion of the "This Is It" movie.

There was nothing frail, second-rate or substandard about what Michael was doing - I say this not as a fan, but as a realist; there is no bias here.

Michael was 'marking' his dancing; getting a feel for the stage again - feeling his feet on the floor and the heat of the spotlight on his face. Many dancers do this when preparing themselves for performances. It is worth mentioning that if you watch the second leg bad tour rehearsal news report (if any of you have ever watched it), you will see michael putting in little to no effort while rehearsing... barely any dancing...singing the odd note here or there and walking around casually - was he frail then also? Was he frial when he had a stand in for himself during the bad rehearsals? Was he frail during the earlier stages of the dangerous rehearsals where he literally walked around the stage doing very little dancing? - no.

Also, you notice the only time during this is it... when michael was truely being watched by an "audience" of dancers, he lit the room on fire... he threw moves into the end of billie jean that we've never seen before... was that frail? No, it proves that Michael comes alive when he is being watched, admired and studied.

 

[DJ Spins the sounds]

Some people are scared of the facts, especially when they reveal that persons lack of knowledge of the subject at hand, its better to just make overcasting comments than actually bring up facts themselves

Birchey, I couldn't agree any more.

 

[daisy]

Point me to one thread with the info about the Bad Tour rehearsals, and the BJ Jacket please, if you already know it go ahead You don't know anything other than that you make up

You haven't answered to important arguments here - using your language, you haven't prooved that light man was ready, nor the other equipment.

The thing about Bad tour makes sense, though nothing was like during TII rehersals, there Michael was healthy and able.
the argument about BJ Jacket - well, ok BJ jacket.
Still, if Michael rehearsed dressed for SC, why for SC and not for other songs. Unexplained.

I will leave this place

:bye:

 

[Birchey]

You haven't answered to important arguments here - using your language, you haven't prooved that light man was ready, nor the other equipment.

The thing about Bad tour makes sense, though nothing was like during TII rehersals, there Michael was healthy and able.
the argument about BJ Jacket - well, ok BJ jacket.
Still, if Michael rehearsed dressed for SC, why for SC and not for other songs. Unexplained.


:bye:

I said throw up a source who posted that info before me and I will leave you didn't again you stepped around facts. Michaels working mind was the same, plus he wasn't Frail, dont call him frail unless you can see another 50 year old guy outdance a bunch of up and coming 20 something kids!!!

Michael had the Jacket to hand from the Dome Project more than Likely, also you may have noticed Michael wearing his Dangerous Tour "Heal The World" jacket on this is it also, how many of those SC Jackets you think he got? He wore that shiny gold/bronze/green Jacket, that was for the show, that was completed quite a while before, I am guessing alot more was until Zaldy got on board and decided to create some very time cunsuming designs. Case again is that the clothes or most were done by the deadline were they not? I mean not Michaels death

Also another point the clothes were not ready for the bad tour either, the shows started without full wardrobe, another fact.

You may want to read some comments above that make sense

 

[Birchey]

It is ridiculous, disrespectful and really distasteful to promote the idea that Michael was frail based on a poorly educated opinion of the "This Is It" movie.

There was nothing frail, second-rate or substandard about what Michael was doing - I say this not as a fan, but as a realist; there is no bias here.

Michael was 'marking' his dancing; getting a feel for the stage again - feeling his feet on the floor and the heat of the spotlight on his face. Many dancers do this when preparing themselves for performances. It is worth mentioning that if you watch the second leg bad tour rehearsal news report (if any of you have ever watched it), you will see michael putting in little to no effort while rehearsing... barely any dancing...singing the odd note here or there and walking around casually - was he frail then also? Was he frial when he had a stand in for himself during the bad rehearsals? Was he frail during the earlier stages of the dangerous rehearsals where he literally walked around the stage doing very little dancing? - no.

Also, you notice the only time during this is it... when michael was truely being watched by an "audience" of dancers, he lit the room on fire... he threw moves into the end of billie jean that we've never seen before... was that frail? No, it proves that Michael comes alive when he is being watched, admired and studied.

Fantastic post!

 

[MJJ7777]

I have one thing to say and I'll leave this thread to the Happy-lala promoters,

When Follower Fans came in looking for support in finding the truth in regards to what they saw themselves firsthand, many people set them off to the side and ignored what they were saying because all they were armed with was simply their intuitions, suspicions, concerns and common sense. Their information couldn't be backed up because the world was given an "Official" candyland image of what was going on during the time of TII, so feeling inadequate they (FF) left as their concerns and warnings went unheard, scrutinized and ignored...and then 6/25 happened.

I wasn't here during the confrontation of the follower fans and the other fans but I have read an entire thread that realized its worst fears.

Some people never learn from the past.

Peace.

 

[daisy]

Michaels working mind was the same, plus he wasn't Frail, dont call him frail unless you can see another 50 year old guy outdance a bunch of up and coming 20 something kids!!!

oh no no, I didnt say that. Not true. Definitely. It's a convenient strategy to put some words into another person's mouth and then criticise him/her for that.

Other things you said you repeated yourself and there is no strong evidence that would support your argument. You say yourself "I'm guessing" "supposedly"
That means to most of these things we have difference in opinions.

I can accept we have different opinions here. Can you?
Let's just agree to disagree.

 

[Birchey]

oh no no, I didnt say that. Not true. Definitely. It's a convenient strategy to put some words into another person's mouth and then criticise him/her for that.

Other things you said you repeated yourself and there is no strong evidence that would support your argument. You say yourself "I'm guessing" "supposedly"
That means to most of these things we have difference in opinions.

I can accept we have different opinions here. Can you?
Let's just agree to disagree.

Agreed, cuz we wont get anywhere like this. I am just a man of fact, even if that fact turns out to be wrong, I go with it until proven otherwise. At the moment everything all boils down to the investigation, I just hope it settles a few heads after it done. TMZ are reporting stuff again lets just hope they are telling the truth.

 

[DJ Spins the sounds]

oh no no, I didnt say that. Not true. Definitely. It's a convenient strategy to put some words into another person's mouth and then criticise him/her for that.

Other things you said you repeated yourself and there is no strong evidence that would support your argument. You say yourself "I'm guessing" "supposedly"
That means to most of these things we have difference in opinions.

I can accept we have different opinions here. Can you?
Let's just agree to disagree.

Hi Daisy, can I ask a question, are you a real lifetime fan of Michael Jackson, this is a serious question, or are just angry and bitter about the whole situation that surrounded Michael and the way he was treated during TII. Thanks.

 

[daisy]

Agreed, cuz we wont get anywhere like this. I am just a man of fact, even if that fact turns out to be wrong, I go with it until proven otherwise. At the moment everything all boils down to the investigation, I just hope it settles a few heads after it done. TMZ are reporting stuff again lets just hope they are telling the truth.

This forum IS also about speculation. See the info on this section - "carries heavy speculation..."
ok, cheers

 

[Matt_MJ]

Hi Daisy, can I ask a question, are you a real lifetime fan of Michael Jackson, this is a serious question, or are just angry and bitter about the whole situation that surrounded Michael and the way he was treated during TII. Thanks.

Why does it matter how long you've been a fan?

And you say "angry and bitter" as if we should just accept the image painted by AEG and not question the COUNTLESS accounts which suggest everything wasn't alright.

 

[Birchey]

This forum IS about speculation. See the info on this section - "carries heavy speculation..."

Yes but it should also carry facts to be an investigation should it not? Or are you saying this whole forum is full of speculators? plus this thread is entitled This Is It -YOUR Analysis and I am giving mine. Now think its time you re thinked things, I have already agreed to disagree, I have also stumped you in you're tracks numberous times where you make claims like me repeating info about the bad tour and BJ Jacket yet you dont back up you're claims.

You also mislead people on what Michael said on the Cherry picker on this is it, there are new people joining the forum all the time and reading something like that, posting plain lies is not speculation.

 

[Asedora]

Well, finally I watched TII movie on DVD and it was the first time I watched it. Tell you the truth I watched it with tears. The first impression about it was like I was watching Michael’s final good bye to everybody, to his family and to his fans. Also it feels like Michael knew that AEG was videotaping him for a reason. This why probably he thanked his brothers and his parents Katherine and Joe and said God bless you. The message to his fans and ppl in general about love 4 years left to save the planet was very impressive too. Looks like he knew that it was very important to say at that moment and probably it is going to be the last chance to say. And it was…. .
Kenny Ortega was acting like a black angel appearing from nowhere with the same sort of evil smile on his face. Definitely he acted like a boss there. From my point of view Michael didn’t control the situation. One moment with ear microphones set clearly indicates it. When Michael took out microphones from his ears he said: I am just adjusting to the situation. And he said it with some sort of sad notes in his voice. Personally I took it like a message, like he was adjusting himself to the WHOLE situation not just to that small issue with ear microphones. The part with Cherry picker was odd too.
Also he was wearing his sun glasses almost all the time like he was hiding his tears. Even when he was singing he was trying to put those damn glasses on like it was very important for him to do. It was very heartbreaking to watch. I do not know if anybody paid attention to that part.
In general I can say that Michael was not ready to perform. He was very thin and very weak. His movements were very different and slow and far away from his famous “signature” movements what all fans used to know before very well. Looks like he had a problem with his hands, he didn't know where to put them and it never happened before if you compare the rehearsals from HIStory tour or other tours.

I think he didn’t sing live while Man in the Mirror and Billie Jean rehearsals. I noticed that because at some moments the music and him singing (opening his mouth) were not synchronal. I do not know if anybody could see it?
Also, I believe that in Smooth Criminal part of the movie they used double bodies. I think Joe was right about it but I do not know about which part of the movie he was talking about.
I was expecting to see Stranger in Moscow rehearsals but I guess it was just a rumor that they will add it to DVD.
Now the question is why ppl around Michael didn’t see that something is wrong? I believe AEG ppl knew exactly what they were doing. I can clearly picture a secret business meeting with Kenny, Randy and Frank sitting together and discussing what they have to do now because Michael is not ready to perform. I see it that if he was ready to perform and was healthy he would survive but because he was not in a good shape he had to die because no way that AEG would lose money. I have a strong feeling that there was no chance for Michael to perform in London. The truth is that Michael was framed and he was forced to do those concerts. This part of conspiracy we are already aware of at least at this forum. This all situation is very heartbreaking and sad and after watching this movie I definitely can say that there is crime there behind this death and we have to get an answer. Why?

EDIT:OK, this is my opinion. And the last thing I have to say, ppl who says that Michael was happy and healthy are blind or they watched a different movie with just Kenny Ortega in it.

 

[DJ Spins the sounds]

Why does it matter how long you've been a fan?

And you say "angry and bitter" as if we should just accept the image painted by AEG and not question the COUNTLESS accounts which suggest everything wasn't alright.

Sorry, can you read, I asked Daisy a question, not anyone else on here. And just calm down, I'm asking a simple question. Some people on here just seem very angry and sharp, can we just discuss TII, in an orderly fashion please without being rude to each other?

 

[Birchey]

Well, finally I watched TII movie on DVD and it was the first time I watched it. Tell you the truth I watched it with tears. The first impression about it was like I was watching Michael’s final good bye to everybody, to his family and to his fans. Also it feels like Michael knew that AEG was videotaping him for a reason. This why probably he thanked his brothers and his parents Katherine and Joe and said God bless you. The message to his fans and ppl in general about love 4 years left to save the planet was very impressive too. Looks like he knew that it was very important to say at that moment and probably it is going to be the last chance to say. And it was…. .
Kenny Ortega was acting like a black angel appearing from nowhere with the same sort of evil smile on his face. Definitely he acted like a boss there. From my point of view Michael didn’t control the situation. One moment with ear microphones set clearly indicates it. When Michael took out microphones from his ears he said: I am just adjusting to the situation. And he said it with some sort of sad notes in his voice. Personally I took it like a message, like he was adjusting himself to the WHOLE situation not just to that small issue with ear microphones. The part with Cherry picker was odd too.
Also he was wearing his sun glasses almost all the time like he was hiding his tears. Even when he was singing he was trying to put those damn glasses on like it was very important for him to do. It was very heartbreaking to watch. I do not know if anybody paid attention to that part.
In general I can say that Michael was not ready to perform. He was very thin and very weak. His movements were very different and slow and far away from his famous “signature” movements what all fans used to know before very well. Looks like he had a problem with is hands, he didn't know where to puth them and it never happened before if you compare the rehearsals from HIStory let tour or other tours.

I think he didn’t sing live while Man in the Mirror and Billie Jean rehearsals. I noticed that because at some moments the music and him singing (opening his mouth) were not synchronal. I do not know if anybody could see it?
Also, I believe that in Smooth Criminal part of the movie they used double bodies. I think Joe was right about it but I do not know about which part of the movie he was talking about.
I was expecting to see Stranger in Moscow rehearsals but I guess it was just a rumor that they will add it to DVD.
Now the question is why ppl around Michael didn’t see that something is wrong? I believe AEG ppl knew exactly what they were doing. I can clearly picture a secret business meeting with Kenny, Randy and Frank sitting together and discussing what they have to do now because Michael is not ready to perform. I see it that if he was ready to perform and was healthy he would survive but because he was not in a good shape he had to die because no way that AEG would lose money. I have a strong feeling that there was no chance for Michael to perform in London. The truth is that Michael was framed and he was forced to do those concerts. This part of conspiracy we are already aware of at least at this forum. This all situation is very heartbreaking and sad and after watching this movie I definitely can say that there is crime there behind this death and we have to get an answer. Why?

Okay just a few points so you know.

1. Michael paid for the footage and owned it not AEG
2. Kenny was the directors sometimes directors can be a bit pressing.
3. With The Inner Ears, Michael did not put them back in, he took control there
4. Michaels movements were new, he was trying new steps, he was working on a new style mixed with his old trademark moves, if you watch the DVD Extras you will see Michael moving like crazy in the dance studio
5. The Glasses, very strange to say myself but someone said some people wear them onstage to black things out so they can concentrate on their performance, I also sont think Michael was completely comfident until the Staples centre where he only wore the glasses for shorter times and not much on stage.

I repsect you're opinion, but wanted to put in some key facts and things I have heard just for you to know.

If you watch the special features you will see Michael alot more demanding behind the scenes of what he wants, I they only had a certain amount of time to fit the movie in