Was MJ's Body Moved? Was There a Cover Up? Plastic Surgeon Says YES

[mello1]

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-st...ecret-claims-singer-s-friend-115875-21636485/

Note that this is a tabloid source....

Michael Jackson's heart attack was 'kept secret', claims singer's friend

By Andrew Gregory 31/08/2009

Michael Jackson’s fatal heart attack was kept secret for three hours in a bid to cover-up the real cause of his death, it was claimed yesterday.

It is also believed the King of Pop’s dead body was then moved to his bedroom so police would think he killed himself with a fatal dose of the drug Propofol.

The coroner has ruled Jackson was a victim of homicide after the strong sedative caused his cardiac arrest.

And police are investigating whether his private doctor Conrad Murray is to blame for the death.

Dr Steven Hoefflin, a friend of the singer, revealed the latest twist after speaking to medics involved in Jackson’s case.

He confirmed: “They say he had lividity, which means his blood had already sunk to the back of his body.

“This indicates Michael’s heart had stopped hours earlier.”

Experts at the coroner’s office also reportedly believe Jackson was moved after his heart attack as they discovered disruptions in the pattern of “livor mortis” on his body.

Purple marks show where blood has settled in a lifeless body, which usually takes at least five hours to become apparent. Forensic pathologist Dr Cyril Wecht, not involved in the Jackson case, said: “If someone carried the body from one room to another, the livor would be ‘broken’ where contact with the body was made.

“If one person held his ankles and the other held him under his arms, there would be corresponding white interruptions of livor mortis in those spots.”
Retired FBI special agent Ted Gunderson, who has independently monitored the case, said the new evidence pointed to a “massive cover-up” by Murray.

He asked: “Did Murray try to fool people into thinking Jackson died on the way to hospital in the hope an autopsy could be avoided? If so, it didn’t work, which is why he had to confess to administering Propofol.” Murray, 56, denies mistreating Jackson.

He admitted dosing him with the anaesthetic to help him sleep but has said he did nothing wrong.

Sources said his legal team fear he is being made the scapegoat and insist Jackson himself was responsible for the drugs in his body.

It is thought Murray will claim that Jackson killed himself with an accidental overdose by tampering with the machine controlling his drip, which was set to 25 milligrams.

 

[CherubimII]

Murray probably has probably already collected all his cash money
for assassinating Michael Jackson.
The other part of his deal includes a well financied defense,
against a minor charge of manslaughter.
So yes, his defense will consist of:
1. Demonizing Michael Jackson
2. Trying to get people to feel sorry for Murray
3. Blaming Michael Jackson for his own murder.

But, God is not mocked.
Hell awaits Conrad Murray.

 

[Juli]

I read the same story (it's weird getting Google alerts on MJ these days - one will be about record-breaking Thriller dances in Mexico City or some other light-hearted story, and the next will be something like this) ... I didn't see any speculation as to why his body would have been moved, which makes sense if all they have is physical evidence that his body was carried. The question of time of death is of course huge ...

 

[slimblonde2]

I also think there should be questions about the 'missing time' in the case, which I feel supports a cover-up of some kind :

1. Kai Chase said that Michael normally had breakfast around 10-10:30 and then came down for lunch (not sure what time he had lunch, but lets say 1-2pm) before going to rehearsals (let's say 3-4pm I'm sure some fans can confirm times he left for rehearsal).

2. The original story I read said that MJ was found not breathing at 11:40. So why didn't the doctor collect his breakfast at 10-10:30 and find MJ then?

3. Now the leaked affadavit says MJ 'begged' for propofol at 10:40 after being awake all night. So why would he ask for it at 10:40 if he was due to go to rehearsals that day? That would only give him a few hours of sleep.

So. My question is - what really happened between 10am and noon, when the alarm went up? Where was Murray, where was MJ and what was going on?

 

[Em_Mj]

we need answers man! seriously this whole thing is not right..

 

[KayHey]

I saw this story published in one of our tabloids too. I don't know what to think of it. If true, it's yet another thing that doesn't bode well for Murray. However, I find it odd that Murray's legal team would try to insist Michael overdosed himself (if the claim by 'sources' is true). Doesn't really appear a sound defense if that's all they can use. I don't think Michael could have overdosed himself, so I suspect if the defense team goes down that road, they'll fail. I don't really see how Murray could possibly get away without punishment.

 

[daft gran]

i read this story this morning...could be an element of truth to it. i hope any cover up is exposed.

 

[movingcoolcat]

I just wanted to post this here too, as thisis the investigative unit
It an answear to one of the threads in the main forum:

Well analysed Soso. I think however that there is something more to it. And the reason for that is this:

1. The timeline.

2. The reports of Michaels weight loss, and conversations with fans (as hard as it is for me to accept this, as i would have preffered to believe that Michael realy did want to do the concerts, and that he was not yet again tricked into something, and used).

3. The missing CCTV.

4. The taped phone conversation with the bodyguard, where its clear that Michael still is on the bed, and that CRP is not done correcly despite the fact that there is a medical professional in the house whose job is to know what to do in case of an emergency.

5. The fact that Michael did pass the medical tests done by an independent doctor paid by the insurance company (it would be easy to find out if he was on another payroll- just check if he had gotten some unexpected money in his account, or had some phone converations with someone suspicious).

6. Murrays behaviour after Michaels death, in total from the point he claims to have found him and till now.

7.The fact that this is so convinient. Just look at how this is treated by the media; just another drug overdose.

8. Murrays shady past. How could a company like AEG accept to pay someone a salary like that, and not sheck his past? And if they knew- how could the still hire him? If I wanted to rotect someone, I would have made shore his records were clean.

9. Michaels addmittance to having had addiction issues, and his known medical problems, and insomnia.

There are a lot more things I could list but what scares me is this thought:

What if Murray is treated as a scape goat? It would be possible maybe to switch some of the medication. Or to replace some of it with something of a stronger dosage. How were anyone to know? If Murray indeed treated Michael with propofol over a period of time, and this was known, what if someone replaced one of the bottles with the same type of medicine, just with a stronger % of the active ingridient? It wold have been fairly easy.
And then one could just sit back and wait for disaster to happen.

I may have been reading to many crime stories. But in my mind- this could easily have happened. I am not saying it is what happened. And I am sertainly not defending Murray. But it propably could have been done like that.
Ad what scares me is that this is not just some random pop star, this is a multi million brand who will continue to generate money, after his death. Only difference now, is that they do not have to bother with a real person anymore.

It would be the perfect way to do it. Because how could this be proven, if they did their job right?


I have been thinking about this for a while, because the one thing I could not understand is Murrays reaction. A trained medical experts usually switch on to "autopilot" in a crisis. And he was a cardiac spesialist. To act this stupid, he either had to do so intentionally, or something very unexpected happened. One can sertainly argue that he had already proven to be reckless as he he has admitted to giving Michael Propofol in a home situation, witch is highly risky behaviour and shows that he can take decisions based upon greed and dosconcern for human life.

He could very well be a scapegoat, as he would have nothing to defend himself with other then to smear Michaels reputation. But someone else could easily have set this up. And I doubt that anyone could prove it.

 

[emmah24]

Something is definately amiss, and I hope the LAPD know and are keeping what they have close to their chest. Timeline is crucial, they must know more cause what we have been hearing just doesnt add up to a doctor attempting to save a life. Not in any way.

 

[AmberR]

If MJ's body was carried, was there another person with the doctor?

 

[marjieN]

There is no question that a cover up was carried out. If not, all this speculation, tabloid or otherwise would not be coming to light now. All we need is a statement from the authorities for confirmation....then hopefully an arrest

 

[meena76]

I just wanted to post this here too, as thisis the investigative unit
It an answear to one of the threads in the main forum:

Well analysed Soso. I think however that there is something more to it. And the reason for that is this:

1. The timeline.

2. The reports of Michaels weight loss, and conversations with fans (as hard as it is for me to accept this, as i would have preffered to believe that Michael realy did want to do the concerts, and that he was not yet again tricked into something, and used).

3. The missing CCTV.

4. The taped phone conversation with the bodyguard, where its clear that Michael still is on the bed, and that CRP is not done correcly despite the fact that there is a medical professional in the house whose job is to know what to do in case of an emergency.

5. The fact that Michael did pass the medical tests done by an independent doctor paid by the insurance company (it would be easy to find out if he was on another payroll- just check if he had gotten some unexpected money in his account, or had some phone converations with someone suspicious).

6. Murrays behaviour after Michaels death, in total from the point he claims to have found him and till now.

7.The fact that this is so convinient. Just look at how this is treated by the media; just another drug overdose.

8. Murrays shady past. How could a company like AEG accept to pay someone a salary like that, and not sheck his past? And if they knew- how could the still hire him? If I wanted to rotect someone, I would have made shore his records were clean.

9. Michaels addmittance to having had addiction issues, and his known medical problems, and insomnia.

There are a lot more things I could list but what scares me is this thought:

What if Murray is treated as a scape goat? It would be possible maybe to switch some of the medication. Or to replace some of it with something of a stronger dosage. How were anyone to know? If Murray indeed treated Michael with propofol over a period of time, and this was known, what if someone replaced one of the bottles with the same type of medicine, just with a stronger % of the active ingridient? It wold have been fairly easy.
And then one could just sit back and wait for disaster to happen.

I may have been reading to many crime stories. But in my mind- this could easily have happened. I am not saying it is what happened. And I am sertainly not defending Murray. But it propably could have been done like that.
Ad what scares me is that this is not just some random pop star, this is a multi million brand who will continue to generate money, after his death. Only difference now, is that they do not have to bother with a real person anymore.

It would be the perfect way to do it. Because how could this be proven, if they did their job right?


I have been thinking about this for a while, because the one thing I could not understand is Murrays reaction. A trained medical experts usually switch on to "autopilot" in a crisis. And he was a cardiac spesialist. To act this stupid, he either had to do so intentionally, or something very unexpected happened. One can sertainly argue that he had already proven to be reckless as he he has admitted to giving Michael Propofol in a home situation, witch is highly risky behaviour and shows that he can take decisions based upon greed and dosconcern for human life.

He could very well be a scapegoat, as he would have nothing to defend himself with other then to smear Michaels reputation. But someone else could easily have set this up. And I doubt that anyone could prove it.

These are excellent points.

I have put a lot of thought into why did Murray Panic. At least it certainly appears he did.
I tend to think something went extremly wrong that was unexpected by him. If it is true that Murray was leaving the house and leaving Mike unattended on a regular basis, it wouldn't take much for someone to figure the pattern out and come in an up Mike's dosage leading to 'acute' Propofol intoxication.

This is a possible scenaria and could be the reason why CCTV tapes are missing. I wish we knew what the missing time frame is.

I am sure the cops know and this is one of the things they are keeping to themselves.

If it did go down like this Murray is no way off the hook. If he was leaving Michael unattended he left a window open for someone to come in and kill Michael.

If MJ's body was carried, was there another person with the doctor?

Another reason why the full autopsy report has not been released. This is key information in the case. If body was moved this speaks volumes.

This is getting Sicker and Sicker.

 

[emmah24]

Authorities wont confirm anything, if they're clever enough and serious about this they'll keep what they know so far, out of the public domain and keep it underwraps until they know exactly what they are charging Murray with. I'm hoping that as they havent released the full tox report, its cause they've already caught Murray out in his account of the timeline.

As for any possibility that Michael was moved, yes, someone else would have to be involved in that.

I wonder if there is a security log of the house detailing who came and went that evening, even before then.

Are these reports of missing CCTV accurate, do we know for sure that they existed in the first place and have indeed gone missing?

Every day that passes just presents more and more questions, frustratingly.

 

[marjieN]

.

As for any possibility that Michael was moved, yes, someone else would have to be involved in that.

Yes this is what I though as soon as I read it. It would have to be another adult, and when we start going there it looks like we are we are getting into very murky waters indeed

 

[Kane]

The worrying things is, the other people who were involved will get away with it unless he confesses.

 

[meena76]

Joe has concerns for a reason. The family did a second autospy report. They know a lot more than we do.

I am sure the autopsy report shows the body was moved.

Murray needs to come clean about everything and stop trying to save his own azz. It's to late for him now he is going down and he needs to take everyone else down with him.

 

[slimblonde2]

AEG have said that MJ INSISTED on having Dr Murray as his doctor :


http://www.theinsider.com/news/2572726_AEG_Michael_Jackson_Insisted_We_Hire_Dr._Conrad_Murray

I know they could be lying, but what if it is true? Why would he INSIST on someone who was known to be a bit shady and was not licenced to administer controlled drugs (e.g. Xanax, Vicodin, Oxycontin or Demerol) in California or London, if he wanted him as an enabler?

http://www.examiner.com/x-264-Celeb...e-or-adminster-controlled-drugs-in-California

Sounds like Murray was paid off and the person who received the propofol wasn't Michael. It's the only thing that makes sense with the information we currently have!! And I know it sounds far fetched!

 

[Rockin.]

If these marks exist showing Michael's body was moved after death that puts a whole other light on the situation.

 

[blue_eyed_belle]

I hope this is all clarified soon!

 

[elusive moonwalker]

seeing who the source is im not inclined to believe this although it could be true.

 

[meena76]

AEG have said that MJ INSISTED on having Dr Murray as his doctor :


http://www.theinsider.com/news/2572726_AEG_Michael_Jackson_Insisted_We_Hire_Dr._Conrad_Murray

I know they could be lying, but what if it is true? Why would he INSIST on someone who was known to be a bit shady and was not licenced to administer controlled drugs (e.g. Xanax, Vicodin, Oxycontin or Demerol) in California or London, if he wanted him as an enabler?

http://www.examiner.com/x-264-Celeb...e-or-adminster-controlled-drugs-in-California

Sounds like Murray was paid off and the person who received the propofol wasn't Michael. It's the only thing that makes sense with the information we currently have!! And I know it sounds far fetched!

Were are you getting the Xanax, Vicodin, Oxycontin or Demerol from? This was not in the tox report.

 

[elusive moonwalker]

tabloid reports started off with that b4 moving onto diprivan

 

[mischief]

AEG have said that MJ INSISTED on having Dr Murray as his doctor :


http://www.theinsider.com/news/2572726_AEG_Michael_Jackson_Insisted_We_Hire_Dr._Conrad_Murray

I know they could be lying, but what if it is true? Why would he INSIST on someone who was known to be a bit shady and was not licenced to administer controlled drugs (e.g. Xanax, Vicodin, Oxycontin or Demerol) in California or London, if he wanted him as an enabler?

http://www.examiner.com/x-264-Celeb...e-or-adminster-controlled-drugs-in-California

Sounds like Murray was paid off and the person who received the propofol wasn't Michael. It's the only thing that makes sense with the information we currently have!! And I know it sounds far fetched!

Anschutz owns the Examiner...bearing that in mind anything mentioned in the Examiner should be taken at best with a pinch of salt.

 

[meena76]

AEG have said that MJ INSISTED on having Dr Murray as his doctor :


http://www.theinsider.com/news/2572726_AEG_Michael_Jackson_Insisted_We_Hire_Dr._Conrad_Murray

I know they could be lying, but what if it is true? Why would he INSIST on someone who was known to be a bit shady and was not licenced to administer controlled drugs (e.g. Xanax, Vicodin, Oxycontin or Demerol) in California or London, if he wanted him as an enabler?

http://www.examiner.com/x-264-Celeb...e-or-adminster-controlled-drugs-in-California

Sounds like Murray was paid off and the person who received the propofol wasn't Michael. It's the only thing that makes sense with the information we currently have!! And I know it sounds far fetched!

tabloid reports started off with that b4 moving onto diprivan

Uhm, Well you need to stop puttin that out there cause that is totally false.

 

[slimblonde2]

I was just listing those drugs as examples of controlled drugs, not because they were administered by Dr Murray. Propofol isn't a controlled drug, but is Lorazepam?

 

[xthunderx2]

Yes this is what I though as soon as I read it. It would have to be another adult, and when we start going there it looks like we are we are getting into very murky waters indeed

agree..my opinion??? 1 the person could of been someone that was already in the house..... or 2. Murray sneaked someone else in.. If it was someone who was already in the house it could of been anyone...maybe someone who Michael also trusted.

 

[mischief]

agree..my opinion??? 1 the person could of been someone that was already in the house..... or 2. Murray sneaked someone else in.. If it was someone who was already in the house it could of been anyone...maybe someone who Michael also trusted.

I asked this before but don't think it was answered - has anyone here been to the house to know how many entrances and exits it has? I've seen mention of there being a guest entrance ...that implies to me there was another entrance other than the main one. There is also an underground garage - from ariel photos of the house I've seen it looks like there's an entrance ...maybe one leading into the underground garage?...directly off the dual carriageway road at the opposite side to the main entrance.

Does anyone know?

 

[Ashtanga]

Honestly? I do not believe Michael was taking all these drugs. My God, if it were true he could stand or leave the house with so much drugs in his body. Michael would not do anything to harm himself, he would think of their children. Michael went through it so in the past and I'm sure now with 3 children he would not venture to go through that again. Michael would never endanger his life. I'm sure Michael did not take these drugs. Michael was fully aware of what the consequences. Michael is not much less naive and stupid as people think. People might want to handle it, but could not. I doubt that Michael would not question the doctor about these drugs. And if Michael, chose Dr. Murray, is why I had some great reason. There is a lot behind it all... So I do not believe Michael was taking such drugs.

 

[xthunderx2]

I asked this before but don't think it was answered - has anyone here been to the house to know how many entrances and exits it has? I've seen mention of there being a guest entrance ...that implies to me there was another entrance other than the main one. There is also an underground garage - from ariel photos of the house I've seen it looks like there's an entrance ...maybe one leading into the underground garage?...directly off the dual carriageway road at the opposite side to the main entrance.

Does anyone know?

I am sorry I have never been to this house ...however I believe i have read in other threads of fans going to this house...I dont know if they know about entrances though...you might want to look through the threads...sorry I couldn't be of more help..

 

[Oceangirl]

why would murray need anyone else to move mj , murray is very tall , imean really tall man and mj was very samll compared to him he probably carried him himself . do i believe this story ? yes because mj was indeed dead for many many hours before the 911 call . I DON'T NEED A TABLOID TO TELL ME THAT .