Latest on MJJC

why are ppl saying that david cook's version is better than mj's on youtube?

No it doesn't. They're have been plenty of acts who aren't exceptionally talented in any way who have had success commercially. A good tune, with the propoer PR can garner you commercial success. Millie Vanillie, for example. Your thinking of PR savvy, not talent. Intelligence is different then talent. Just as you think Michael actually sees some amount of talent in these people, I think he sees how they can be useful to him on a commercial level. We do KNOW that Michael is working with Will.I.Am and Akon because they're featured already on one of his albums and Michael himself has been seen with Will.I.Am.

Many singers don't have huge egos either and to say that the majority of them do is quite the assumption. Again, technology can not replace talent.
 
Last edited:
wannabestartinsomthin21 said:
No it doesn't. They're have been plenty of acts who aren't exceptionally talented in any way who have had success commercially. A good tune, with the propoer PR can garner you commercial success. Millie Vanillie, for example. Your thinking of PR savvy, not talent. Intelligence is different then talent. Just as you think Michael actually sees some amount of talent in these people, I think he sees how they can be useful to him on a commercial level. We do KNOW that Michael is working with Will.I.Am and Akon because they're featured already on one of his albums and Michael himself has been seen with Will.I.Am.

Many singers don't have huge egos either and to say that the majority of them do is quite the assumption. Again, technology can not replace talent.
Click to expand...
and now...you are agreeing with me, because i always said a well written tune can be successful..hence tpain's song.

i wouldn't call a short lived span of success, followed by suicide, a truly successful career. and i don't agree with you that intelligence is not a talent. i don't agree with you that savvy is not a talent. and i never mentioned what already happened with thriller twenty five..i'm talking about the future. you don't know what will happen there, till the album actually comes out. and i'm not making an assumption. people have a lingo about bands that break up all the time, because of 'creative differnces' that's called ego. and i'm not saying that tech replaces talent..i'm saying that tech is used in conjunction with the talent that tpain has, to come out with a different style of music that doesn't need a lead singer. and by the way...it really is egotistical for a person to think they are not replaceable. beyonce is not just referring to a lover. that applies to any aspect of life.
 
Last edited:
Certain people aren't replaceable. Certain talent isn't replaceable. I'm not agreeing with you because I haven't heard a well written tune come out of T-Pain ever. There are people like 50 Cent who really doesn't have any talent, yet he is very commercially successful. Madonna, another example. The standards for today have dropped drastically and you see virtually talentless people commanding the airwaves and billboard charts. While truly talented people, like Jill Scott get almost ignored. You don't even need a good song today, almost anything passes. Intelligence isn't a talent, it's similar to talent in that it is something you are born with. Talent in the ability to produce something in a better then average quality.

I don't know whether any of Will.I.Am or Akon's stuff will make it on to Michael's album, but I do know he's working with them. I don't know that he's working with Usher or T-Pain because there hasn't been any confirmation of such, just rumors and Usher saying he was trying to get it worked out. Will.I.Am and Akon have actually spoken about being in the studio with Michael.

Singers aren't always the one's to break bands up. Ego's get in the way, but it isn't always the singer and ego doesn't always rear it's ugly head. You can find good singers to sing your material, if you're a good song writer. It's not impossible. And if you are seeking talent to compliment your own, then you have to respect that talent.
 
Last edited:
wannabestartinsomthin21 said:
Certain people aren't replaceable. Certain talent isn't replaceable. I'm not agreeing with you because I haven't heard a well written tune come out of T-Pain ever. There are people like 50 Cent who really doesn't have any talent, yet he is very commercially successful. Madonna, another example. The standards for today have dropped drastically and you see virtually talentless people commanding the airwaves and billboard charts. While truly talented people, like Jill Scott get almost ignored. Intelligence isn't a talent, it's similar to talent in that it is something you are born with. Talent in the ability to produce something in a better then average quality.

I don't know whether any of Will.I.Am or Akon's stuff will make it on to Michael's album, but I do know he's working with them. I don't know that he's working with Usher or T-Pain because there hasn't been any confirmation of such, just rumors and Usher saying he was trying to get it worked out. Will.I.Am and Akon have actually spoken about being in the studio with Michael.

Singers aren't always the one's to break bands up. Ego's get in the way, but it isn't always the singer and ego doesn't always rear it's ugly head. You can find good singers to sing your material, if you're a good song writer. It's not impossible. And if you are seeking talent to compliment your own, then you have to respect that talent.
Click to expand...

nobody said any blanket statements about singers. but i did say too large a number are egotistical and i stand by that. and i already didn't limit it to singers. i did say drummers, keyboardists, etc. and yes....everybody is replaceable, unless they go without the big ego. yes, there are exceptions. but they are fewer than the norm. bands breaking up has become cliche. and you're talking about what's impossible. tpain has already done the 'impossible'. i disagree with you. he has talent. and we do agree, that whatever is going on with MJ, we won't know..until it's totally finalized. and i don't like Jill Scott's songwriting.

the bottom line is, that a songwriter does not have to go the traditional route just because you or i say so.
 
I meant Jill Scott as a singer. She can sing. You made it seem as though singers are the main cause of band break ups. Certain talent IS irreplaceable. You and I differ greatly on that. You can't find someone to replace Stevie Wonder, for example. There is only one. Just like there is only one Michael Jackson. Certain talent is dime a dozen. Like Justin Timberlake, for example. There are many people just like him, with that level of talent. We do know that Michael is working with certain people. I made a statement saying we don't know whether Michael is actually working with Usher or T-Pain because we don't. I never said anything about knowing what's happening on the final product.

A songwriter doesn't have to go the traditional rout, but a songwriter also cannot replace a great vocal talent with a machine. It will never have the same affect in terms of artistic achievement.
 
wannabestartinsomthin21 said:
I meant Jill Scott as a singer. She can sing. You made it seem as though singers are the main cause of band break ups. Certain talent IS irreplaceable. You and I differ greatly on that. You can't find someone to replace Stevie Wonder, for example. There is only one. Just like there is only one Michael Jackson. Certain talent is dime a dozen. Like Justin Timberlake, for example. There are many people just like him, with that level of talent. We do know that Michael is working with certain people. I made a statement saying we don't know whether Michael is actually working with Usher or T-Pain because we don't. I never said anything about knowing what's happening on the final product.

A songwriter doesn't have to go the traditional rout, but a songwriter also cannot replace a great vocal talent with a machine. It will never have the same affect in terms of artistic achievement.
Click to expand...

well you and i differ on the definition of artistic achievment. and i did not make it seem like it was only singers. you didn't read all my posts. i mentioned band members in general. i happened to pick only one singer by name and that was steve perry. and you help make my point. you mentioned two names. Stevie and Michael you will find that both of those artists are devoid of a big ego. i met Stevie. if Stevie was too big for his britches, i'm sure he would not have lasted this long. if you have too big an ego, i don't care who you are, you are replaceable.

and as far as Jill Scott is concerned...songwriting is essential. you need both for great exposure for the most part. and sorry to break it to you, the songwriting does win in the end. both Quincy Jones and David Foster said so, as well. if tpain is getting more exposure than Jill Scott, it's because he has the talent to hook more people with one song hook than Jill Scott does.
 
Last edited:
Songwriting wins over singing? I don't think so, lol. They are both essential to one another. Jill Scott has some good songs but she can sing very well. T-Pain can't sing a lick and has no good songs. Yet he's bigger then Jill Scott commercially. So where's the argument that talent equates to having commercial success?

Stevie Wonder and Michael Jackson COULD have big egos and they would be justified, but it's simply a testiment to their character that they do not.
 
wannabestartinsomthin21 said:
Songwriting wins over singing? I don't think so, lol. They are both essential to one another. Jill Scott has some good songs but she can sing very well. T-Pain can't sing a lick and has no good songs. Yet he's bigger then Jill Scott commercially. So where's the argument that talent equates to having commercial success?

Stevie Wonder and Michael Jackson COULD have big egos and they would be justified, but it's simply a testiment to their character that they do not.
Click to expand...

well you are arguing what if..and i'm arguing what is.

i have yet to hear a good song from Jill Scott. yes, songwriting wins.
Tpain got more mileage out of one good song, than anything Jill Scott has come up with. no..songwriting does not need a good singer. the argument is in the stats. there is no couldve wouldve shouldve....the fact is stevie does NOT and michael does NOT have a big ego. and they are here. i'm not into dealing with hyperbole. and no...Stevie and MJ would NOT be justified to have a big ego. that would fly in the face of your argument that talent is a God given thing. i hear that God has a problem with big egos. the reality is that steve perry had a big ego..and lost. even elton john had a big ego..and lost half his voice. you can be given talent..and..suddenly, in the blink of an eye, you can lose it.
 
Last edited:
You're confusing me. Stevie Wonder and Michael would be here whether they had big egos or not. They're talent would justify having a big ego.

Songwriting doesn't win. A song, written with a vocal part, doesn't need a good singer, but it enhances it's artistic merit if it has one, usually. "Do You know The Way To San Jose" wouldn't have been the success it was without Dionne Warwick. A good singer doesn't need a great song, but it enhances their artistic merit if they have one, usually. One is helpful to the other in most instances, though not needed. I'm simply saying that a machine cannot replace a good singer. It cannot have the same emotional affect. That was my original argument.

Listen to "Golden" by Jill Scott. That's a good song. Better then anything T-Pain's ever come out with.
 
Last edited:
vncwilliam said:
well you are arguing what if..and i'm arguing what is.

i have yet to hear a good song from Jill Scott. yes, songwriting wins.
Tpain got more mileage out of one good song, than anything Jill Scott has come up with. no..songwriting does not need a good singer. the argument is in the stats. there is no couldve wouldve shouldve....the fact is stevie does NOT and michael does NOT have a big ego. and they are here. i'm not into dealing with hyperbole. and no...Stevie and MJ would NOT be justified to have a big ego. that would fly in the face of your argument that talent is a God given thing. i hear that God has a problem with big egos. the reality is that steve perry had a big ego..and lost. even elton john had a big ego..and lost half his voice. you can be given talent..and..suddenly, in the blink of an eye, you can lose it.
Click to expand...

You lose it if you abuse it. Elton John can still sing, but he had throat problems, he had surgery to have potentially cancerous tumros removed. He's the opposite of someone with a big ego. Elton John had big self-esteem issues and was trying to drown it all out. Talent doesn't go because you have a big ego. Talent doesn't go period unless you abuse it to the point of damaging it, such as singing improperly or breaking bones or damaging your joints from dancing too much, etc...
 
Last edited:
wannabestartinsomthin21 said:
You're confusing me. Stevie Wonder and Michael would be here whether they had big egos or not. They're talent would justify having a big ego.

Songwriting doesn't win. A song, written with a vocal part, doesn't need a good singer, but it enhances it's artistic merit if it has one, usually. A good singer doesn't need a great song, but it enhances their artistic merit if they have one, usually. One is helpful to the other in most instances, though not needed.

Listen to "Golden" by Jill Scott. That's a good song. Better then anything T-Pain's ever come out with.
Click to expand...

how am i confusing you? you are presenting to me a hypothetical stevie and michael, and i'm just telling you about the stevie and michael that are here. nobody can predict the outcome of a hypothetical situation. i've heard golden...and i hate that song.

you keep agreeing with me and you don't know it. first you say that the songwriting doesn't win, then you say that a song doesn't need a singer.

all that matters is the inspiration. and sometimes that inspiration can call for a machine. that's why the songwriting wins. the stats draw it out. egos can never win.

nothing justifies an ego. there's enough proof that egotistical people have lost what they first had, talent wise.
 
Last edited:
Plenty of egotistical people retain their talent. Your talking about moral phlilosophy versus actual physical fact. You don't lose your talent because you think very highly of yourself. You lose talent if you abuse yourself. And abusing yourself usually comes from a lack of ego.

Your confusing me because you keep talking about how Michael and Stevie don't have big egos. But that has nothing to do with how talented they are. They were born with that talent and there that talent stays. It's not there because they are humble, it's there because they take care of it. If you feel blessed to have talent and thus take care of it, I can see where your argument of humility can play a factor. But the actual act of having a big ego and thinking highly of yourself does not in itself ruin talent.

Songwriting doesn't win over singing. That's what I mean. One is helped by the other always, and both compliment eachother. One isn't more important then the other though. They both can be done at the level one would call art.

If your talent is big enough, it can justify having an ego. If you are egotistical without the talent to back it up, then there is no excuse for it.
 
Last edited:
you might as well not have talent if you have a giant ego, cus ur success will not last.

elton john had a big ego, then he had addictions, then he lost half his voice. i told you about the other examples. ego less people do take care, and have long success and talent. steve perry is not happy with the ending he got..it doesn't matter how many other people were involved.

there is no justification for ego. history is on my side.

and you have come around to what i already said about songwriting. i already said that they now have an even playing field. that's how they got their victory. and that's why egotistical performers have to watch their back. if you're willing to argue with success, you are willing to argue with anything. and you arguing with tpain's success doesn't make sense. but then, he doesn't need your approval. he's got plenty of fans..and i am a fan of one of his songs. and you only need one good song to establish yourself. Jill Scott can sing till the cows come home..but she can't attain tpain's level unless she can hook them with a killer song. the quetion is, would she be willing to work with a better songwriter? tpain, on the other hand, is working with a plethora of people. and yes..he has no ego.

if you have a big ego, you're likely to think you're invincible, then you practice the type of behaviours that elton john practiced. if you are humble..you'd be too scared to act as if you are invincible...and that's how you end up keeping everything.

and why in the h*** would you risk everything and make life more difficult for yourself by developing a big ego, no matter how big or small your talent is?

i'm not gunna stay up and keep arguing with you. MJ"s fanbase size is full of people who admire no egos and people who admire egos. but an egotistical artist doesn't have any fans that hate a big ego. MJ's fanbase size and longevity wins my argument for me..so.. peace.
 
Last edited:
I watched American idol last night and i LOVED the version that was sung. I thought it was a million times better than the chris cornell version and would have LOVED to have that version on Thriller 25. Man David Cook can sing his ass off. Rock aint ususally my cup of tea but that REALLY worked.... I think Mike would be proud
 
The guy has a great voice but Billie Jean isn't created to be sang like that. I mean this version has nothing to do with Billie Jean. It's a totally different song...I don't like it at all!
 
nt get it..half of them think that david cooks version i.e chris cornell's version is the original one..lmao...its times like this,i wish mj would release the new album,and just kick everyones ass...sigh...its so dissapointing,that ppl r stupid,to think that david cook is better than mj,and he kicks mj;s ass,,and such comments like,
Click to expand...
Who is he? And which song are we talking about here?
 
Its the same with Smooth Criminal everyone thinks Alien Ant Farm did the original and you can see this on the comments after the SC video on youtube. Its a bit crazy to me
 
David Cook's version was great, but Michael's version is the original and WILL ALWAYS be the definitive version. No one can ever sing that song better than MJ. End of story.
 
They do the same thing with Smooth Criminal and the dancing in America's Best Dance Crew when they did the Thriller theme. It is the most irritating thing to read.
Most of the people who write stuff like that are tween fangirls who dont have any sense of what talent is. David Cook was good but it wasn't even his version. It was Chris Cornell's version. But hey i guess if it causes people to watch the original than it's ok. They might even become Michael's fans after a while.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top