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Frank DiLeo Speaks about AEG shows and the Day MJ Died

I don't know... something about the fans' stories and what Frank & Karen are saying are rubbing me the wrong way. If MJ was in such distress as they said, then why were they "holding off from telling him?" :huh:
 
Superstition said:
Exactly. He was either a sharp businessman or he wasn't. If he allowed himself to be roped into doing 40 shows he didn't want to do, then everyone who went around saying how sharp of a businessman he was are contradicting themselves.

I'm sorry, I just can't for the life of me fathoming him being caught off guard. 40+ years in show business and he doesn't know how many concerts he's agreeing to?

Also, people are manipulating what I said. When I said he's doing 50 shows and older artists do that all the time, I didn't mean any artist can sell out 50 shows at one arena. I'm simply saying other artists physically do 50 or more shows, and many of them are very high-energy shows.
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Michael Jackson always bring out contradictions. He was either sick or doing well, he was either READY to do the shows or was pissed that he was even doing them, he was willing to do this for his kids vs. he had to do it to clear debts, etc., etc., etc. Plus did a fan actually tell him that his stuff was going to be auctioned? Am I reading this right?
 
Superstition said:
I'm sorry, no sane person is going to get on stage and do 40 shows they never agreed to. It just doesn't happen.
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Thank you. Obviously if Michael didn't wanna do it, he could've said NO but he chose to do it. He was just overworked. The only things I can believe is that he couldn't sleep, he was working so hard on those rehearsals and that that "doctor" gave him too much of that sh*t eventually taking him out of here. I just don't know if I buy this fan rally to help him with Karen tagging along. That's just weird.
 
kasume said:
My uncle spoke with Jermaine on the 26th, and said Jermaine told him that Michael asked to be taken to the hospital the night before he died but the doctor wouldn't take him and told Michael he was fine instead.

Jermain's story and Liza's add up well. Unlike Murray's, the nurse's and Kleine's. Isn't that a shocker....

I'm sure Jermaine told the investigators about that though.

But, that brings up another question. If Michael was feeling bad the night before and felt he needed to go to the hospital (and we know if Michael asks to go to the hospital then he really needs to go!), then something was clearly wrong with him BEFORE the propofol was injected.
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Then how come they said MJ was doing fine on the 24th? Murray's story ain't good either but neither are these stories...
 
Victoria83 said:
I already explained. See my earlier post.
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I see you speculating that MJ was duped into doing more shows than he wanted, but I didn't see you mention any other artist who has been duped into doing dozens shows they didn't agree to. If I missed it, please point it out to me.
 
any other example would be irrelevant no other artist would be able to sell out dozens of shows the way MJ did it and have people from all over the world come see them this is Michael Jackson we're talking about
all Barrack and Phillips and the others saw in Michael was money, he was an "asset" to them. Michael knew this was more than he could carry but he tried, he tried so hard he was the kind of person who'd try to motivate himself when it all seemed impossible
thome and all these people who came out of nowhere in the last year of his life they knew he was in financial trouble they offered to help him but instead he had to do everything in their own terms, by the way the put it to him if he was not going to play by their own rules his career was over finished terminated
I remember what Evvy Tavasci said in 2006 when she testified for MJ, that he trusts people way too soon after meeting them, and she was close to michael she knew him
I really don't care if anyone believes me I understand people have their own opinion but since we're allowed to speak freely here this is what I think
I wish he would've kept raymone to represent him at least for these concerts, Frank has disappointed me so much as a manager and I used to like him
 
troubleman84 said:
I just don't know if I buy this fan rally to help him with Karen tagging along. That's just weird.
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Bro its true, there are e-mails to prove it. One of our members "Thijizz" also recieved an e-mail. He posted it but the mods shut the thread down. The very same members went on Karen's page and were somewhat blaming her for telling them to "hold off" the intervention as she was seeking help from those in charge. As "weird" as it sounds its true.
 
Superstition said:
I see you speculating that MJ was duped into doing more shows than he wanted, but I didn't see you mention any other artist who has been duped into doing dozens shows they didn't agree to. If I missed it, please point it out to me.
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Not wanting to digress here and talk about other artists on a Michael-board, but yeah, there are/were other artists who were, in a sense, "trapped" by managers. (Michael's life was complicated and he had problems knowing who to trust.) In terms of artists being taken advantage of by corporations, Prince is the obvious example, in his dispute with his record label. He was trapped in that situation for a time, and wrote "slave" on his forehead, and refused to use his name. He had to wait until the contract ran out, I think.

Another example would be Elvis. Elvis, for whatever reason, felt bound to his manager, Tom Parker. Elvis wanted to do movies. . . legitimate movies, but the scripts he was given were ridiculous (most of them). He said at various times that he hated doing those stupid "musical movies," but felt unable to get out of the situation and the movies kept coming. I'm not sure why he felt so trapped? Maybe more psychological than contractual? He also wanted to tour overseas, especially in England where he had a strong fan-base. His manager wasn't an American citizen, didn't have an American passport, and if he'd gone on tour with Elvis, wouldn't have been able to get back into the country. So he nixed any opportunities for Elvis to tour outside of the U.S. And Elvis NEVER DID! He never performed in a foreign country. I don't know if it was some sort of "mental" hold the manager had over him, or was by contract, or what. I just know the results.

Hope that answers. Now, back to the topic, of Dileo, and AEG. . . . .
 
Then why didn't they bring in some "tough love"? I'm still not sure if I totally BUY it now.

True no other artist did what MJ did in ticket sales but does that mean he was the one who DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT IT? Really? Was Michael Jackson THAT clueless and naive? Really?
 
troubleman84 said:
Then why didn't they bring in some "tough love"? I'm still not sure if I totally BUY it now.

True no other artist did what MJ did in ticket sales but does that mean he was the one who DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT IT? Really? Was Michael Jackson THAT clueless and naive? Really?
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I wouldn't call him "clueless," but in recent years Michael had a history of giving away POA to others, i.e. the ability to sign contracts and make business decisions FOR him. (I explained earlier how this may have happened. . . stems back to the devastation of the trial.) We already have the precedent of the auction, where someone (Tohme) must have signed FOR Michael and Michael didn't realize what this meant until it was nearly too late. So for the concerts, it looks as though he authorized someone to sign FOR him in negotiating the deal, and then discovered that he "had to" do not ten concerts, but fifty. This is what I believe.
 
BONGANI said:
Bro its true, there are e-mails to prove it. One of our members "Thijizz" also recieved an e-mail. He posted it but the mods shut the thread down. The very same members went on Karen's page and were somewhat blaming her for telling them to "hold off" the intervention as she was seeking help from those in charge. As "weird" as it sounds its true.
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Yes, this IS true, and I've seen the emails. Many of us have seen them, although they are no longer posted. In the emails, some fans expressed extreme concern for Michael's health, after seeing him in a rehearsal. They wrote Karen Faye about this. She said she knew about it, was trying to DO something, but told the fans to "keep it to themselves" so as (something like) not to "harm" Michael. I never did understand why expressing concern over his health would have been "harming" Michael, because look at what happened!

But yeah, as weird as it seems, it IS true.
 
Victoria83 said:
Not wanting to digress here and talk about other artists on a Michael-board, but yeah, there are/were other artists who were, in a sense, "trapped" by managers. (Michael's life was complicated and he had problems knowing who to trust.) In terms of artists being taken advantage of by corporations, Prince is the obvious example, in his dispute with his record label. He was trapped in that situation for a time, and wrote "slave" on his forehead, and refused to use his name. He had to wait until the contract ran out, I think.

Another example would be Elvis. Elvis, for whatever reason, felt bound to his manager, Tom Parker. Elvis wanted to do movies. . . legitimate movies, but the scripts he was given were ridiculous (most of them). He said at various times that he hated doing those stupid "musical movies," but felt unable to get out of the situation and the movies kept coming. I'm not sure why he felt so trapped? Maybe more psychological than contractual? He also wanted to tour overseas, especially in England where he had a strong fan-base. His manager wasn't an American citizen, didn't have an American passport, and if he'd gone on tour with Elvis, wouldn't have been able to get back into the country. So he nixed any opportunities for Elvis to tour outside of the U.S. And Elvis NEVER DID! He never performed in a foreign country. I don't know if it was some sort of "mental" hold the manager had over him, or was by contract, or what. I just know the results.

Hope that answers. Now, back to the topic, of Dileo, and AEG. . . . .
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Great post Victoria, I don't think fans realize how evil and brutal the music industry is and how they have a way of entrapping people and destroying lives. All the industry needs is to find your achilles tendon and use it make you do things you hate but knowing if it ever becomes public you are destroyed.
 
hopespringseternal said:
Great post Victoria, I don't think fans realize how evil and brutal the music industry is and how they have a way of entrapping people and destroying lives. All the industry needs is to find your achilles tendon and use it make you do things you hate but knowing if it ever becomes public you are destroyed.
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Thanks. You're right, the music business can be brutal, and artists "enslaved," in a sense, by big-business. The artists are just that. . creative people . . . . . who may or may not have a sense for the complexities of business. The more money there is involved, the more the efforts can be to take advantage of the artists.

No one has to believe ME here. Just look at what happened with Invincible? Little or no promotion, or vids, and Michael was outraged at Sony. He hated his own record-label, and literally took his outrage to the streets! Remember that?

Add to all that Michael's lack of skills in discerning who was trustworthy? He wasn't perfect, and it was what it was. I think he felt "forced" to do all fifty concerts. His contract blocked him from performing anywhere else until the concerts were completed (Remember the problem with AGE and the proposed Texas concert?) So it was probably all-or-nothing with the concerts. We don't, if course, know the fine print of the contract, or with what else they may have threatened him? Had our beloved Michael lost control of his own life/choices? To some extent, I think he had. AEG did NOT care about his health or well-being. They may even have conspired to murder him, in my opinion, with Murray used as a fall-guy. . . . . . Michael was a cash-cow, alive or dead, but not, probably, seen as a PERSON to them.

Returning (just for a sec) to the example of Elvis. His manager, Tom Parker, was NOT good for him. Elvis never was "allowed" to tour abroad, for one thing. For another, he was nearly broke when he died. Michael must have been desperate for someone to trust who had his best interests in mind. I think he never found someone who TRULY put his interests first, and that's a tragedy.
 
If he was so entrapped, then why have other artists not been engulfed in the same sh*t that affected MJ? Maybe because they didn't have a$$holes in their corner as MJ did in his. MJ was just too trusting, that's all. Same with Elvis, he didn't trust and yet trusted Tom Parker because he figured Tom would ruin him if he ever fired him. Did Elvis and Vernon even knew what they were dealing with when they got with Tom? I doubt it. Michael DID turn AEG down twice so can anyone explain why he agreed the third time then? Even if it was adding "too many" shows as is claimed here.
 
Why not ask George Michael...........

They are still after him even now!
 
One thing why Michael was targeted is the ATV catalogue with no doubt... it's value will not decrease in the future.
 
The thing is with greatness it doesnt matter if they dont promote or dont do this that and the other and try to put everything in the way. By the time this happens the fans are still there. George Michael and his final two which were not promoted which were not given much notice at all but which were sell outs and every one of his fans tried to get tickets.....

They cant keep talent down. But unfortunately an insecurity heads inwards and the peoples words around them make them believe they need everybody else apart from relying on the fans.
 
Perhaps the so and so's just dont like anyone with Michael in the name.............
 
Don't think they planned to kill him from the very beginning... in the beginning they just wanted money pressure on him probably... but then he got this frail and maybe they smelled the even bigger (intentionally not saying better as this is all about money and business) chance...
 
troubleman84 said:
If he was so entrapped, then why have other artists not been engulfed in the same sh*t that affected MJ? Maybe because they didn't have a$$holes in their corner as MJ did in his. MJ was just too trusting, that's all. Same with Elvis, he didn't trust and yet trusted Tom Parker because he figured Tom would ruin him if he ever fired him. Did Elvis and Vernon even knew what they were dealing with when they got with Tom? I doubt it. Michael DID turn AEG down twice so can anyone explain why he agreed the third time then? Even if it was adding "too many" shows as is claimed here.
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I think Michael was more "engulfed" because of his extreme money-making ability, and he attracted more greedy vultures because of that. Yeah, he was too trusting, but it's really hard to know if someone lies right in your face about how much they "care." He wanted so badly to believe that someone cared?

I don't think either Elvis or Vernon knew what they were getting into with Parker. Elvis was basically not well educated (although later in his life, he did read a lot and self-educate to some extent), and his celebrity came so FAST. He had no real understanding of the business side of music, or what he was getting into, IMHO.

I can't explain why Michael "agreed the third time" with AEG. He may have had conversations with Tohme, or with whoever signed for him, and believed the concerts would be a certain way, but he was lied to?

With the auction, and the subsequent lawsuit by Michael, it seemed his understanding was that the items would be transported to the auction house and THEN he could make selections of what he could keep. He even thanked the auction house for "saving" his belongings, when they did no such thing. So I suspect he was told one thing by Tohme, and it turned out to be a different reality/contract. I just don't know why in his earlier life, Michael was on top of things business-wise, but not later. I still think the trial broke his spirit and some things were just too much to deal with, plus, his priority was his children.

Another thing that's weird. That auction is almost something one would expect AFTER a celebrity has died. It was just. . . . strange. I KNEW something was "off." Michael would have wanted his children to have so much of that personal stuff, but yet. . . . the auction almost happened!

I guess the bottom-line is that big money (like Michael's earning capability) attracts big corruption -- lies, deceit, and worse.
 
Mechi said:
Don't think they planned to kill him from the very beginning... in the beginning they just wanted money pressure on him probably... but then he got this frail and maybe they smelled the even bigger (intentionally not saying better as this is all about money and business) chance...
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Sadly, I think this is accurate. A case of "How can we make the most money off of Michael?" They did not CARE about his life, his health, or about him as a person. Horrible, just horrible, but that's what I believe.
 
i think they set a trap for him. the minute he got that catalogue, it was set. let's hope he fails. oh wow, random, a sex allegation....hmmmmm there's the end of THAT tour.

but he still had fans, he still had earning potential....history was the biggest selling double cd set.

what else can we do? oh i know, charge him a shitload for recording 'vince' and then not promote it at all. so now he OWES us. so instead of him making money off of soemthing he put his heart into, he'll come out in the red. meaning he has to borrow money.

use atv as collateral, use the ranch, etc....then oh wow, random, another sex allegation. hmmmmmmm this time it was bananas. he didn't work or do anything for several yrs. he wasn't earning money. he was amassing a lot of debt.

i think theypushed him in debt so he would lose it. found ways for him to fail on the projects he was trying to do (what more can i give, and from the bottom of my heart) and just overall saturating th emarket w/ anti-jackson news and images.

it was his debt that did him over. it was his debt that drove him to do these shows, it was his debt that made hi ma target.

like bain said, there was a conspiracy to push him into bancruptcy. i truly believe that. but was he killed over this? no way b/c now his debt will be erradicated by the en dof the yr and his own catalogue will be more valuable. so the opposite has happened. his kids get it now.
 
BONGANI said:
Very! But I hear Michael's signature WAS on the contract. Which is what makes this whole thing confusing.
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See? It's like I'm playing f***ing "Clue" with this, lol. :lol: It's like "did he hire an impersonator?" That don't make no sense. He HAD to know what he was signing. I just refuse to believe Michael was that dumb, lol.
 
troubleman84 said:
See? It's like I'm playing f***ing "Clue" with this, lol. :lol: It's like "did he hire an impersonator?" That don't make no sense. He HAD to know what he was signing. I just refuse to believe Michael was that dumb, lol.
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Wonder why he told the fans that he DIDN'T know? hmm..
 
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