Michael May not find justice in our legal system but....

Emoonwalker,

We seem to be talking about 2 different things here. I don't know where you live but what I am saying is the DA office IN LA has not been successful in trying high profile case's. They lost OJ ( Gil Garcetti, DA at the time) they lost Robert Blake and they had to do the Spector case twice to just barely get a conviction. Do you understand what I am trying to explain? It's DA's office track Record. Steve Cooley is the current DA. If he had waited for LAPD to finish their case and went to a GJ they could have come up with a higher charge. This DA is running for a higher office and wanted a win, more than he wanted Justice for Michael. The Autopsy showed such high levels of propofol ( amount unknown, pending toxicology) That it was seeping from his eyes!! That is not 25milg. as Murray stated! Murray lied, he did not try to save Michael and we want Justice. Our only recourse is at the polls. November 2, 2010. If you do not wish to help, that is fine. No one is forcing you to.
 
yeah i agree. ive mentioned murder 2 enough and im frankly more pissed that theres no cover upcharges. but i guess if he wants a conviction for whatever reason they are going with one they can easily get.do u cut you nose off to spite your face type thing

ok so can't he drum up more charges or is he not willing to?..this IM CANNOT be all he is charging him with...???.for instance...I mean we all know that he didn't tell them about the propofol originally...there are sooo many more charges Murray could have brought against him.
 
I am sorry all this has confused me, I am not really with it when it comes to all the charges and details of what they all mean so i am sorry for asking this question lol! Are u saying its not going to a grand jury then???
 
That is the point exactly, you hit the nail on the head...Murray injected Michael with deadly amounts of propofol...in addition to other sedatives. He performed improper CPR He did not call for help for hours after Michael was gone. He made phone calls to other patience while MJ laid dead. He lied to EMT's Police and ER Doctors..not that it mattered because MJ was long gone by then. He tried to cover up the crimes scene and hide the fact Michael was gone. I spoke to someone doing a Documentary with the family and they said the heat was as high is it could get and all the fire places were on. This was not an accident. Murray has shown malice in so many of his actions. Where are the security tapes proving what Murray said...oh yes gone! Why to cover the truth. This DA is afraid of a loss, plain and simple. With out risk..no reward!
 
The DA's strategy is to get IM and he will be elected. He doesn't want to go higher even if there's plenty of evidence and the case can be won imo. Why risk? Why rock the boat with powerful people who might be supporting Murray? Like this everyone is happy (public, DA, Murray supporters) but NOT genuine fans, family, and MJ's kids!!
 
I am sorry all this has confused me, I am not really with it when it comes to all the charges and details of what they all mean so i am sorry for asking this question lol! Are u saying its not going to a grand jury then???

There will be no Grand Jury! The DA's office decided the charges. We go to prelim on April 5th where a court date will be set and they attorney general will ask to have Murray medical license removed in CA..big deal his only client in CA is dead anyway.

where the heck is the Medical board for Texas and Nevada, where he is practicing now??

Injustice, he deserved better!

Justice4MJ
 
There will be no Grand Jury! The DA's office decided the charges. We go to prelim on April 5th where a court date will be set and they attorney general will ask to have Murray medical license removed in CA..big deal his only client in CA is dead anyway.

where the heck is the Medical board for Texas and Nevada, where he is practicing now??

Injustice, he deserved better!

Justice4MJ

Thank you! I knew abou the prelim on April 5th i was just getting so confused!
 
if he was scared of a loss he would be taking this case to a GJ and not a prelim. what they say makes no sense at all


they won the spector case and was cooley involved in oj?

Yeah, that's true, and doesn't make a lot of sense? There surely is more than enough evidence for Involuntary Manslaughter, and a GJ would be a chance to present evidence and test the water for a higher charge. In a GJ, the "rules" are a lot looser than in a prelim, I think? It's a chance to bring forward witnesses and see what they know/will testify to. The proceedings of a GJ are usually sealed, so that info should not affect a trial. There is that saying, "A Grand Jury can indict a ham-sandwich." It's a good time to lay out a case and see what the prevailing ideas may be. I'm not sure what the significance of his not doing a GJ might be?

I really don't remember if Cooley was involved in the OJ case. Anyone?
 
In my humble opinion, there is more than enough evidence to go for a murder 2 with reckless disregard against Murray and the autopsy supports that evidence.

The problem is that the D.A. office in Los Angeles has shown incompetency throughout the years. Always have, always will. The D.A. settled for the lesser charge in order to WIN the case. I was listening to an assistant D.A. for another city on Blog Talk Radio and he was shocked at the charge and said it could be easily proven Murder 2/Reckless Disregard For Human Life.

Ultimately it was up to the D.A. to asses the charge and he did. Do I feel that the charge should be more than it is? Of course. Is justice always served? Nope.

Co-sign this. Justice is truly not always served. . . .It does affect the trial that Cooley is running for A.G. The I.M charge is very shocking!

In many jurisdictions (and I'd have to look up LA for this. Or someone else can?) the jury has a variety of options. If the charge is I.M., juries can still convict, but lower it to a lesser charge. Happens all the time. A Grand Jury would have HELPED the DA, not hindered.
 
I hope everyone is watching VH1 Famous crime scene Michael Jackson. Too bad this show isn't trying this case. Murray would fry.
 
In my humble opinion, there is more than enough evidence to go for a murder 2 with reckless disregard against Murray and the autopsy supports that evidence.

The problem is that the D.A. office in Los Angeles has shown incompetency throughout the years. Always have, always will. The D.A. settled for the lesser charge in order to WIN the case. I was listening to an assistant D.A. for another city on Blog Talk Radio and he was shocked at the charge and said it could be easily proven Murder 2/Reckless Disregard For Human Life.

Ultimately it was up to the D.A. to asses the charge and he did. Do I feel that the charge should be more than it is? Of course. Is justice always served? Nope.

I too personally prefer a higher charge and of course a higher sentence but I think they took into consideration what the defense strategies could be when determining the charges. Here as we all love Michael we are affected by our emotions heavily and fail to consider what the defense could do and it could affect the outcome of the trial.

we all need to evaluate this situation from the perspective of 12 impartial jurors.

I know that I definitely want to see Murray behind bars and therefore rather than DA taking a risk of Murray going free, I rather see them aim for a certain conviction. and I also trust T-Mez's opinion.
 
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Let me just say this about the last post apove me. It does not matter if he wanted it. Remember help but do no harm
 
Up until what point can more charges be added on? If and/or when this goes to trial, is it possible that more charges could be added on? Say a lot of damning information is revealed at the trial; could that prompt more charges? Does such a thing ever happen? Or is this wishful thinking on my part.
 
At this point, I am not 100% certain just 99% that once the charges were filed that is the end of the story. How great would it be if a special task force stepped in and fired this DA on the grounds of miscarriage of justice and raised the charges to where they should be.

My thoughts are strings are being pulled somewhere.
 
Emoonwalker,

We seem to be talking about 2 different things here. I don't know where you live but what I am saying is the DA office IN LA has not been successful in trying high profile case's. They lost OJ ( Gil Garcetti, DA at the time) they lost Robert Blake and they had to do the Spector case twice to just barely get a conviction. Do you understand what I am trying to explain? It's DA's office track Record. Steve Cooley is the current DA. If he had waited for LAPD to finish their case and went to a GJ they could have come up with a higher charge. This DA is running for a higher office and wanted a win, more than he wanted Justice for Michael. The Autopsy showed such high levels of propofol ( amount unknown, pending toxicology) That it was seeping from his eyes!! That is not 25milg. as Murray stated! Murray lied, he did not try to save Michael and we want Justice. Our only recourse is at the polls. November 2, 2010. If you do not wish to help, that is fine. No one is forcing you to.

That is what really stood out from the autopsy report, I was reading it and that part highlights itself to the point of me crying over it.

I say VOTE when you can, do what you can! I wished I could help you.
 
That is the point exactly, you hit the nail on the head...Murray injected Michael with deadly amounts of propofol...in addition to other sedatives. He performed improper CPR He did not call for help for hours after Michael was gone. He made phone calls to other patience while MJ laid dead. He lied to EMT's Police and ER Doctors..not that it mattered because MJ was long gone by then. He tried to cover up the crimes scene and hide the fact Michael was gone. I spoke to someone doing a Documentary with the family and they said the heat was as high is it could get and all the fire places were on. This was not an accident. Murray has shown malice in so many of his actions. Where are the security tapes proving what Murray said...oh yes gone! Why to cover the truth. This DA is afraid of a loss, plain and simple. With out risk..no reward!

Didn't the EMTs say that the heat was turned up? Certainly at MJs "optical" weight I would think he'd be cold nonstop- but it seemed odd to me regardless. Especially in JUNE in LA.
Definitely not an accident. I remember trying to find the temperature at which Propofol disintegrates.

This "justice system" is not there to provide "justice", plain and simple. Very sad.
 
Heart breaking! What did Michael ever do to deserve this? He never hurt a soul and it just never ends for him..God I hope he can not look down and see what is taking place. I just see his beautiful face with a tear running down his check.

Please Join us at www.justice4mj.com for updates and plans of action.
 
Emoonwalker,

We seem to be talking about 2 different things here. I don't know where you live but what I am saying is the DA office IN LA has not been successful in trying high profile case's. They lost OJ ( Gil Garcetti, DA at the time) they lost Robert Blake and they had to do the Spector case twice to just barely get a conviction. Do you understand what I am trying to explain? It's DA's office track Record. Steve Cooley is the current DA. If he had waited for LAPD to finish their case and went to a GJ they could have come up with a higher charge. This DA is running for a higher office and wanted a win, more than he wanted Justice for Michael. The Autopsy showed such high levels of propofol ( amount unknown, pending toxicology) That it was seeping from his eyes!! That is not 25milg. as Murray stated! Murray lied, he did not try to save Michael and we want Justice. Our only recourse is at the polls. November 2, 2010. If you do not wish to help, that is fine. No one is forcing you to.

yeah we seem to be talking about different things.or different interpretations.yeah i understand andagree for the most part with what you are saying in your post above but the article u originally posted to me said different things.

f he had waited for LAPD to finish their case
that i dont understand.. the police finish their case then pass it onto the D.A.

the questions are the motives as u have said. is it about a conviction or justice and what is the motivation behind it. motivation for his career or genuinly worried he may not get a murder 2 so is doing like what mez talked about. i guess we wont know until the end
 
Jackson Prosecutors' Internal War
DateWednesday, February 17, 2010 at 05:18PM
Jackson Prosecutors' Internal War

by Gerald Posner

BS Top - Posner Chernoff
Getty Images; AP Photo Will the L.A. District Attorney’s office blow yet another big case? Gerald Posner on the internal battles that helped delay the charges expected against Dr. Conrad Murray today. Plus, read Gerald Posner's report on Gerald Posner's report on Conrad Murray's defense attorney.


Will they blow it again?


The Los Angeles District Attorney's office, which has seen a two-decade streak of losing its highest-profile Hollywood cases, from Robert Blake to O.J. Simpson, is supposed to start its latest trial of the century today. So far, with Dr. Conrad Murray expected to turn himself in to face involuntary manslaughter charges, they're off to a rough start.
A retired senior Los Angeles police official and a Los Angeles-based defense attorney, both familiar with the specifics of the Michael Jackson death probe, describe a series of angry battles, encompassing which DA would handle the case, what charges should be brought and whether to go to a grand jury or have a preliminary hearing. This partly explains the long delay in moving forward with the case, which has puzzled so many observers. These fights, the sources said, even pitted prosecutors against their own Bureau of Investigation. Such accounts dovetail with a TMZ report yesterday that the DA's office has been feuding with the L.A. Police Department, and that today's anticipated arraignment of Dr. Murray might even be indefinitely postponed due to disagreements between the two about how he should be arrested and processed.
"They have no choice but to deliver an indictment or there would be hell to pay."
The defense attorney said that war among the prosecutors started last September, three months after the pop superstar died of a drug overdose. The first skirmish, a winner-take-all affair, featured two of the DA office's most powerful figures, Major Crimes's territorial chief, Patrick Dixon, and William Hodgman, the chief of Target Crimes. After Jackson's death, the Los Angeles police had dealt only with the Target Crimes Division, which describes itself as doing work on arson, crimes against peace officers, stalking and threat assessment, and child abductions. It is not clear why Target Crimes got the case in the first place. But Dixon was adamant that his Major Crimes unit, which handles all celebrity cases, should have jurisdiction. When Hodgman dug in his heels, the dispute escalated straight to the desk of the District Attorney, Steve Cooley.
• Gerald Posner: Conrad Murray’s Defense Attorney Is the Next Johnnie CochranCooley, the son of an FBI agent and a career prosecutor, is the first Los Angeles County District Attorney in 70 years to be re-elected to a third term. He has a no-nonsense reputation, and sided with Dixon, much to the chagrin of Target Crimes, which had by then put in more than two months of work.
Ed Chernoff, Murray’s Houston lawyer, knew around this time that there was something wrong when in late August, a Los Angeles police detective told him, “Hodgman is going to be taken off the case.”
“Why,” Chernoff asked.
“There’s something going on at the DA’s office.”
“I had a warm relationship with Hodgman,” Chernoff told me. The two exchanged information, and worked together in vain to try and stop the late August release of a sealed search warrant in Houston. Hodgman had even promised to call Chernoff and discuss the case before the DA settled on any charges.
The move to Major Crimes may have ended the fight over turf, but once it was there, more problems followed. David Walgren, a respected veteran who is also handling the Roman Polanski case, took on the assignment. He had no rapport with Chernoff as a starter.
“When I would call him and say, ‘Hi, this is Ed Chernoff. What’s going on?’ He would say, ‘No comment.’ I’m not kidding. He wouldn’t talk to me at all.”
Chernoff wasn’t the only one having trouble adjusting to Walgren. Throughout the fall, Walgren was at odds with Dominick Rivetti, Chief of the DA’s Bureau of Investigation. According to the former police official, who counts many current members of the DA's office as friends, some of Rivetti's investigators had dubbed the Jackson probe "a shit case," and thought that if it were not for public and family pressure, there might not even have been a probe.
"Eight months of a costly investigation, in a bankrupt state," one prominent defense attorney told me, "they have no choice but to deliver an indictment or there would be hell to pay."
The O.J. Simpson trial cost the state $9 million and Michael Jackson's $2.7 million child abuse trial ended in an acquittal. The Robert Blake murder trial, which ended in a "not guilty" jury verdict, cost the state an estimated $5 million between the investigation and the trial.
Walgren, according to the police official, had contentious meetings with Rivetti's investigators, sometimes irate that they were unable to draw a firm consensus on the medical evidence needed for a higher charge. He was also disappointed when he initially reviewed the police evidence, which reportedly included conflicting conversations with medical experts to determine whether Murray's behavior in his treatment of Jackson, especially on the fatal night, fell outside the bounds of reasonable medical practice. And he was disappointed, says the police official, to discover that investigators had determined that Murray's medical past did not include a large dispensing history of opiates or pain pills—the types that were prescribed in significant amounts to Jackson by other physicians.
The early debate in Major Crimes was whether to seek a murder indictment or merely involuntary manslaughter. Evidently, says the source, voluntary manslaughter was not seriously considered. "It either was going to be strong enough to go after a murder charge, or they were going to settle for the safest charge," he says.
At one impassioned meeting last November, a member of the Bureau of Investigation is said to have told Walgren, "How are we going to convince 12 people to understand all the medical terminology and believe Propofol killed him when our experts don't even know for sure." It was a turning point in the internal debate over what charge to pursue. By December, the consensus was that involuntary manslaughter was the charge on which the office had the greatest chance of obtaining a conviction. Walgren, according to an attorney who knows him well, says he's always been an advocate that over-charging is problematic. "He'd rather get a conviction on a smaller count than have someone walk free on a headline grabbing indictment," says his friend.
As a consensus swirled around involuntary manslaughter, the next fight was over whether to proceed to a grand jury to obtain an indictment—preventing the defense from getting an advance look at the prosecution's case—or to bring the matter for a hearing before a judge, as was done in the O.J. Simpson case. According to the retired police official, Walgren urged that the case be presented to a grand jury but was overruled by Dixon.
Prosecutors often joke that they can get a grand jury—which only receives handpicked evidence—to indict a ham sandwich for a crime, but there was fear in the office that a grand jury might not find the evidence developed by the investigators to be compelling enough to issue an indictment.
"This may be one of those rare cases where a grand jury of ordinary citizens is not ready to attach criminal liability to the doctor," prominent Los Angeles defense attorney, Mark Geragos, tells me. "The DA might feel better off in front of a judge."
Also, if there are internal doubts about the strength of the case, and how best to present complicated medical testimony to a jury, the District Attorney might want to do a test run through a preliminary hearing and afterward make adjustments for the trial.
"They did that on the USC case (a 2007 infanticide case against a USC student)," Geragos adds. "I destroyed the coroner in the preliminary hearing, and they hired a new expert to repair the damage for the trial." In that case, the DA's plan didn't pay off. A trial judge dismissed the charges.
In overruling Walgren, says the former police official, Dixon and others also decided they gained a strategic advantage in a preliminary hearing. In Los Angeles court jurisdiction, a case brought by indictment goes to the downtown courts. One brought by a preliminary hearing will go before the LAX Court, which has a higher demographic of black jurors. Says the attorney who is a friend of Walgren's: "Since Michael Jackson has been totally embraced now by the black community, it's better for the prosecution to have a large black jury pool."
That preliminary hearing could be held as soon as 10 days after Murray's arraignment, but it's not expected for several weeks since the defense is likely to use that time to digest all the documents they will receive from the prosecutors after Murray is officially charged. From there, the Jackson drama will move from the private to the public domain. When asked for comment on the internal acrimony so far, Sandi Gibbons, the Los Angeles District Attorney Public Information Officer responded: "We would not comment on such unfounded drivel."
Plus: Check out more of the latest entertainment, fashion, and culture coverage on Sexy Beast—photos, videos, features, and Tweets.
Gerald Posner is The Daily Beast's chief investigative reporter. He's the award-winning author of 10 investigative nonfiction bestsellers, on topics ranging from political assassinations, to Nazi war criminals, to 9/11, to terrorism. His latest book, Miami Babylon: Crime, Wealth and Power—A Dispatch from the Beach, was published in October. He lives in Miami Beach with his wife, the author Trisha Posner.

For inquiries, please contact The Daily Beast at editorial@thedailybeeast.com
Link to article: http://www.thedailybeast.com/tag/conrad+murray+trial/
 
tbh i dont take posner seriously as hes defended murray from the outset blaming mj for what happened. and with the daily beasts connections to dimond. thankfully hes been sacked from there now
 
I think it was cowardly not to go with a grand jury, that indicates what the jury might see as well, however I agree that it would be worse if a higher charge ended with an aquittal.

When he is found guilty which I believe he will that will give the estate an almost certain win in a civil case, and I would be shocked if they didn't do it. The medical board have already shown they want to revoke his licence, so his justice may only be a few years in jail, but he comes out to no career and handing over any money he makes to the estate. He knows he is always at risk of a deranged person killing him. I would never wish that to happen, tho I wouldn't care if it did.

His life, hopefully is as destroyed as Michael's and if he lives into old age, broke and regretting the moment he injected that stuff into Michael (regretting for his own selfish reasons) then justice to a large part will be served.
 
.......Awwwww,keep the faith hun:yes::better::yes:
We all are figthing for it,toghether with the family,but fully understand your'e fear!:yes::better::yes:
And how you will manage it, what is your or our strategy? Do you really believe we have the power to have an influence on the case? I don't believe it. And my fear is the same, also from the beginning. If I am wrong you can imagine how HAPPY I would be.
 
Up until what point can more charges be added on? If and/or when this goes to trial, is it possible that more charges could be added on? Say a lot of damning information is revealed at the trial; could that prompt more charges? Does such a thing ever happen? Or is this wishful thinking on my part.
From now till preliminary hearing and throughout the entire trial, new and higher charges can be piled on.
 
^ Thanks a lot for answering, Christy.

I really hope this happens. The charge that stands is simply not enough.
 
Thank you Christy and everyone for your follow up on this post,that was extremely informative.
 
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