Michael Jackson To Unleash World Premiere Experience At Billboard Music Awards

[WhoIsIt89]

they never said such thing. They only expected and did pay MIJAC. They never stated when they would pay off Sony/ATV



You said there's no more debt that they'll be responsible. Which is untrue. They - Executors and MJ's kids if/when they become Executors - will be responsible for paying Sony/ATV, Neverland, any possible lawsuit judgments and any possible IRS taxes. For example in the worst case scenario Estate might be hit with a $700 Million tax bill and could spend 15 years paying that.

In short while I agree they aren't broke, it's not true to say that there's no debt and /or they need no more money. They still need money to pay for the remaining and possible debts.



He doesn't own the patent, he has licensed the exclusive rights for USA and CAN.



Let's try this : I prepare a presentation for my meeting tomorrow. You set up the projector for the presentation. What do you know about how I prepared my presentation?

As I clearly explained Alki doesn't have and/or never involved in motion capture / CGI / animation of a hologram. Just because he's know how to play a hologram doesn't mean he knows how its done. He certainly cannot know who was involved or not.




Okay so he creates a fake DNA test, he lies about that on national media and it's irrelevant? Similarly all his lies surrounding this issue is irrelevant too? For example he stated that Hologram USA did Tupac hologram while Hologram USA and his license agreement didn't even existed. So are you taking the word of a proven liar just because he says something to support your opinion? Well I would personally wouldn't do that but each to its own.




I didn't say he doesn't have basic understanding of how everything works. However as I repeated to the millionth time, what he "purchased" (nope licensed) is the technology to play a hologram not to do it. Regardless of what he knows about holograms, doesn't change the fact that he knows absolutely nothing about if the MJ one was a body double or CGI. At most he can offer his opinion on that. The cannot provide proof or confirmation.




And every opinion is fine. It's totally fine if you think it's a body double. I did mention this before that this is not something I liked either. But I personally wouldn't use a proven liar to back up my opinion - because guess what it only makes your argument weaker. You have nicely listed several stuff. I would recommend to stick to them rather than claming Alki "confirmed" anything or trying to portray his involvement as something it isn't.

But they did...

According to the docs, all of MJ's debts have been paid, with the exception of a BIG debt involving Michael's publishing catalog ... and executors expect that will be fully paid off by the end of the year.

Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2012/07/13/michael-jackson-estate-debt-almost-cleared-catalog/#ixzz32OcDF0O3


The only issue here is that you're interpreting what I'm saying as meaning the Sony/ATV catalog. When I never specified that in either post, because I wasn't sure if it was alluding to the MiJac catalog or the Sony/ATV. Which I apologize for not being specific.



As far as the last bolded part. I've been doing that this entire time. Have you not read any of those posts or just the one where I mentioned Alki? You're making it seem as if I've been using his words as the ultimate proof of it all, when I never have. Every issue on that list, I've made detailed single posts about prior to Today, when this Alki interview became news. So that "stick to that" stuff, doesn't apply to me.

As it has been said way too many times already, the person who claimed that the estate used that method is not trustworthy. Did you read Ivy's post?

Did you read the many posts in this thread before that Alki video surfaced in which many of us point to reasons of the image being an impersonator, none of which has to do with Alki David? Like the comparison video of the "hologram" and Earnest Valentino?

 

[ivy]

But they did...

Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2012/07/13/michael-jackson-estate-debt-almost-cleared-catalog/#ixzz32OcDF0O3

No they didn't. TMZ doesn't realize the difference between Mijac and Sony/ATV, also the difference between the assets MJ held under his name (aka personal debts) versus the debts that are owned by companies / trusts. Estate is still responsible for the debts on assets owned by trusts/corporations for which MJ is sole owner and/or partner. (Ex: Neverland is owned by Sycamore Ranch LLC. So it's not seen as "personal" asset of MJ. However MJ is partner on that LLC and is responsible for the debts on it. Estate is required to pay for it)

Estate said they would pay off Mijac, TMZ mistakenly generalized it. I have extensive posts about Estate's accounting. I did correct TMZ's mistake then. Also the documents are available. I guess I'm "hardcore" to actually read the document rather than take TMZ's word for it.

-----

Edited to add

@WhoIsIt89

That "you" was generalized and wasn't specific to you. Several times through this day Alki David CNN interview has been posted here as "proof" or "confirmation". I have no issues with people believing that the hologram was an impersonator but I have an issue with a person with no direct involvement / knowledge and a person with serious credibility issues being used as "proof" or "confirmation" of anything. That's the reason why I'm spending this much time and effort trying to explain the known facts. I'm also kinda disappointed that fans choose to believe a proven liar just because he support their point of view.

 

[WhoIsIt89]

You keep using hardcore in quotations for what now?

 

[qbee]

Nightline goes inside the MJ Illusion. They stated Alki David a rival company is not associated with it and the Estate insists different technology was used to create the Virtual MJ.



ABC US News | International News

Rough transcript

Michael Jackson showed up at last night's billboard music awards to perform his new salt. And he's not the first dead celebrity to make a surprise appearance. ABC's David Wright explains how.


The King of -- Walks again. That the billboard music awards last night this brand new Michael Jackson number stole the show. Some of the fans working.


Magical -- -- the best way to explain -- -- Michael match. 3-D avatar performing on stage -- Not a hologram the virtual Michael Jackson -- producers. I like to call it an illusion because it is really the -- -- and the magic and -- and for me that's the essence and the energy of Michael what is really brought to life.


Not just Michael some of the dancers are avatars to. Others are real -- probably were still in diapers when thriller was at the top of the charts the majority he's got it right we'll probably born around. Thriller.


The -- -- -- superstars but becoming a thing from Elvis performing a duet with Celine Dion. -- -- -- -- with Snoop -- at Coachella. Politicians are trying to already a virtual Al Gore -- -- the earth summit in Tokyo.


Romeo and speak -- and telegraph. And the new Indian prime minister made several campaign stops this way. -- -- Garnett -- have been met that guy won any election -- basic technology an illusion that predates television.


-- -- -- I didn't -- -- this is -- the other -- an old nineteenth century magic trick but with state of the art digital technology in theory you could bring anyone back from the dead or just have a conversation with yourself. The illusion created by an invisible -- positioned at a 45 degree angle the image called Pepper's ghost. Floats on the screen.


Up his ghost is an Angel technique however this is the 21 century application all of it. We found this his at a rival company not involved in the MJ performance. --Alki David says the technology used last night was similar to this.


Jackson estate insist -- process was different but in theory the sky's the limit you can have a -- Greet everybody coming -- yankees did or run a hundred meters against -- single in theory could be possible to bring back all sorts of iconic moments. Judy Garland from the other side of that -- -- -- Frank Sinatra from the far side of the -- Song. Or as we saw last night Michael Jackson a bit of musical magic making someone who's already immortal seemed to come back to life.

Source http://abcnews.go.com/Nightline/video/michael-jacksons-billboard-performance-pulled-off-23789186

 

[ivy]

You keep using hardcore in quotations for what now?

why would you have issues with me using a term that you used as well?


anyway just to make sure that you saw this

Edited to add

@WhoIsIt89

That "you" was generalized and wasn't specific to you. Several times through this day Alki David CNN interview has been posted here as "proof" or "confirmation". I have no issues with people believing that the hologram was an impersonator but I have an issue with a person with no direct involvement / knowledge and a person with serious credibility issues being used as "proof" or "confirmation" of anything. That's the reason why I'm spending this much time and effort trying to explain the known facts. I'm also kinda disappointed that fans choose to believe a proven liar just because he support their point of view.

 

[Tygger]

Both parties in that lawsuit have lied to fans at one time or another.

It is a good thing a judge will decide the facts. If the Estate is victorious and the process is different, it does not mean an impersonator was not used. It will only cement that Michael was not part of the so-called magic; only his vocals were.

 

[WhoIsIt89]

why would you have issues with me using a term that you used as well?


anyway just to make sure that you saw this

Edited to add

@WhoIsIt89

That "you" was generalized and wasn't specific to you. Several times through this day Alki David CNN interview has been posted here as "proof" or "confirmation". I have no issues with people believing that the hologram was an impersonator but I have an issue with a person with no direct involvement / knowledge and a person with serious credibility issues being used as "proof" or "confirmation" of anything. That's the reason why I'm spending this much time and effort trying to explain the known facts. I'm also kinda disappointed that fans choose to believe a proven liar just because he support their point of view.

Because I used it as a general term to describe what I was seeing between those who found no issue with the "hologram" and those who did. I also said I meant no disrespect by it. You on the other hand are simply using it in a condescending manner, because you someway felt a problem with those using the term "hardcore" & "casual" when discussing the two parties. I even said I'm sure there's some hardcore fans who enjoyed it, but for the most part, from what I've seen, again, are self-admitted casual fans who, self-admittedly pay little attention to detail and just enjoy the moment.

I see what you're saying about the Alki David thing, but I personally have never once stated or used his video as "proof" or a "confirmation". What I did say, was that that video confirmed to me, atop of everything else that I've become aware of through watching the performance over and over again, and other videos, that an impersonator was used.

ABC can say all they like, they can use whatever Estate produced explanation they want. Their's freaking cellphone footage from the BBMA's, front row, of the projection screen hanging from the top of the stage they used. It's the same tech, and I don't think this because Alki David said it is. I think this because I know what I saw in that cell phone video. It's not a 3D Avatar, it's a projection of an impersonator sporting a 3d-esque, CGI of Michael's face (and even that, according to some may not be true.).


Funny how that ABC video also uses Alki David as a source. And just a sentence saying "The Estate insists they're technology was different". Live fan footage said otherwise.

 

[ivy]

re: hardcore

nope if your use wasn't condescending so mine wasn't either. Plus didn't you stated that I probably know more than you do in regards to legal stuff? I didn't claim that, you did. So at most I agreed with you. Finally I'll reply to you with your own words "However, you can inaccurately interpret that however you like. Doesn't hurt me none.:

I personally have never once stated or used his video as "proof" or a "confirmation".

then there's no reason for you to take it personal

ABC can say all they like, they can use whatever Estate produced explanation they want. Their's freaking cellphone footage from the BBMA's, front row, of the projection screen hanging from the top of the stage they used. It's the same tech, and I don't think this because Alki David said it is. I think this because I know what I saw in that cell phone video.

want to know something interesting? (tygger avoid this post as it will include legal issues)

Sunday at 4:52 PM PST Alki's lawyers got an emergency order to examine the device , the show started at 5 PM PST. They examined the projector device for 90 minutes after the show yet it seems like they couldn't determine it's their same patent/technology so they are asking for pictures/ videos of the hologram system when it was playing. Wouldn't you think looking to the projector/screen for 90 minutes would be enough to know if it's their patent / technology especially people here are able to identify what technology used from cell phone videos? I found this quite interesting.

 

[Petrarose]

re: hardcore

nope if your use wasn't condescending so mine wasn't either. Plus didn't you stated that I probably know more than you do in regards to legal stuff? I didn't claim that, you did. So at most I agreed with you. Finally I'll reply to you with your own words "However, you can inaccurately interpret that however you like. Doesn't hurt me none.:



then there's no reason for you to take it personal



want to know something interesting? (tygger avoid this post as it will include legal issues)

Sunday at 4:52 PM PST Alki's lawyers got an emergency order to examine the device , the show started at 5 PM PST. They examined the projector device for 90 minutes after the show yet it seems like they couldn't determine it's their same patent/technology so they are asking for pictures/ videos of the hologram system when it was playing. Wouldn't you think looking to the projector/screen for 90 minutes would be enough to know if it's their patent / technology especially people here are able to identify what technology used from cell phone videos? I found this quite interesting.

Ivy thanks for this^^. That is what I love about your work--you always provide facts. We have a 90 min direct inspection vs using a cell phone to capture the image from a distance from the stage.

 

[Birchey]

re: hardcore

nope if your use wasn't condescending so mine wasn't either. Plus didn't you stated that I probably know more than you do in regards to legal stuff? I didn't claim that, you did. So at most I agreed with you. Finally I'll reply to you with your own words "However, you can inaccurately interpret that however you like. Doesn't hurt me none.:



then there's no reason for you to take it personal



want to know something interesting? (tygger avoid this post as it will include legal issues)

Sunday at 4:52 PM PST Alki's lawyers got an emergency order to examine the device , the show started at 5 PM PST. They examined the projector device for 90 minutes after the show yet it seems like they couldn't determine it's their same patent/technology so they are asking for pictures/ videos of the hologram system when it was playing. Wouldn't you think looking to the projector/screen for 90 minutes would be enough to know if it's their patent / technology especially people here are able to identify what technology used from cell phone videos? I found this quite interesting.

Do you have a source for the last paragraph? ty

 

[WhoIsIt89]

Except they weren't "from a distance", this person was front row for that specific stage which it was displayed on...Sooo yeah...


Whatever the case, it's all based on the same thing. A projector like device hanging at an angle, mirroring an image which is then shown on a thin projection sheet. It's all based around the same thing. Lol, regardless of what ABC or CNN says or anyone else, I know that wasn't a full CGI image. It's simple as that.

 

[ivy]

Do you have a source for the last paragraph? ty

You doubt me? Of course I have a source, court documents. I don't do unnamed sources. not my style.

Here's proof Alki (aka Plaintiffs) have done a 90 minute inspection after the show - though it looks like they wanted to do more.

Here's proof that Alki's lawyers are asking Estate/Billboard/Textor to give them any video they have

You tell me what you make of this. To me as I said it seems like their 90 minute inspection didn't provide them what they are looking for hence they are asking for more information. Feel free to disagree. As the case goes on more information will become available. Currently we are given little bits and pieces and we need to connect them.

and something more. Here's Howard Weitzman's email stating that he had arranged for photographing and videotaping the technology to reserve it as evidence. It doesn't look like they are hiding anything (Estate voluntarily arranged for videotaping the technology without/before a court order) but again come to your own conclusions.

 

[Tygger]

laughs

Ivy, do not let my being in this thread and responding to posts as I wish distract you from defending the Estate against “proven liar” Alki in your posts. I already stated if the Estate wins this lawsuit it does not prove an impersonator was not used. Separate issues that remain separate. The only Michael magic was the vocals.

Luckily, I trust what I saw with my own eyes. Nothing wrong with some fans being entertained by an impersonator and suspending belief for an Estate spectacle.

 

[ivy]

laughs

Ivy, do not let my being in this thread and responding to posts as I wish distract you from defending the Estate against “proven liar” Alki in your posts. I already stated if the Estate wins this lawsuit it does not prove an impersonator was not used. Separate issues that remain separate. The only Michael magic was the vocals.

Luckily, I trust what I saw with my own eyes. Nothing wrong with some fans being entertained by an impersonator and suspending belief for an Estate spectacle.

Don't worry you cannot distract me even if you tried.

As for the hologram I told that I was at most neutral about it. There are a lot of things I didn't like about it. I stated how dance should be better and so on. I also stated my understanding of the technology required a body double and if that's the reality I won't go crazy about it. I see myself as a rational and realistic person and I can be reasonable and accept any limitations of the technology, time and/or money. As I also again mentioned before I never expected this hologram to be "Michael" and I guess it makes a difference how I react to this.

Regardless of how I feel and what I dislike about the hologram, I refuse to entertain Alki as a credible source especially not after his media and court statements differ as a fact and I haven't forgotten his secret son publicity stunt. As I explained that motivated my posts. If it's not clear for anyone I too think that hologram probably had a body double, though we have also given the information that CGI is also possibility. as I don't have necessarily expertise in the technology, I wouldn't make any definite statement. So I hope it's clear that I'm not debating about the possibility of a body double, I just can't understand willingness to give Alki any credibility.

 

[Birchey]

You doubt me? Of course I have a source, court documents. I don't do unnamed sources. not my style.

Here's proof Alki (aka Plaintiffs) have done a 90 minute inspection after the show - though it looks like they wanted to do more.

Here's proof that Alki's lawyers are asking Estate/Billboard/Textor to give them any video they have

You tell me what you make of this. To me as I said it seems like their 90 minute inspection didn't provide them what they are looking for hence they are asking for more information. Feel free to disagree. As the case goes on more information will become available. Currently we are given little bits and pieces and we need to connect them.

Wasn't doubting you, just wanted a source which I still don't have. just pieces cut out of a document, which to me and anyone with common sense would say they wanted hard evidence, its all fair examining the equipment but what do you produce in court?

 

[WhoIsIt89]

Those transcripts don't say anything, really. That's equal to TMZ jumping to conclusions assuming that the Estate expected to pay off the TMZ account at the end of 2012. There aren't any specifics in there, it's all assumption.


Them not finding what they were looking for being the assumption. I think they simply may have asked for the Estate to provide video to add that along to whatever they discovered when they inspected said equipment at the Award show, as evidence. But that too, is an assumption.

 

[ivy]

Wasn't doubting you, just wanted a source which I still don't have. just pieces cut out of a document, which to me and anyone with common sense would say they wanted hard evidence, its all fair examining the equipment but what do you produce in court?

of course they wanted evidence, so would the other side. Evidence is not only the way to prove guilt but also the way to prove innocence. They emailed Weitzman on Saturday about preserve evidence. Sure said Weitzman, arranged for videotaping and pictures being taken of the technology. Apparently they aren't trusting the other side so Alki went to court on an emergency hearing on Sunday asking court to allow them access to the Billboard show. Estate didn't even respond and why would they? They had already agreed and arranged for preserving the evidence in the video format without a court order. And if they were infringing patents would you think they would be this easygoing in regards to agreeing to record evidence without being forced? Court ruled in Alki's favor at 4:52, they emailed Weitzman by 5:08 - 8 minutes after show started. Travel and getting access to the venue took sometime as far as we can see. When they were in the hologram part was over. But they had 90 minute access directly to the technology, being able to examine it and videotaping it themselves in person. Looks like there had been issues in regards to how long they investigated it (they wanted to examine it more and the other side thought they had done enough examination) and they didn't play the hologram for Alki's people - apparently show was over and the people who were playing it had gone. Now they have an emergency request for Estate to turn over any video.. I'm asking you why? If you (generally speaking) can look to a cell phone video and can identify the technology for certain, why would Alki's people need any more information than their 90 minute in person examination? Why the rush?

@WhoIsIt89 I think I was very clear with "it seems" and mentioning we only have bits and pieces. I'm not portraying it anything more than it actually is. Current situation does require us to connect pieces and come to conclusions - it's fine to call it an assumption. I have to say that while your approach to court documents are "nothing but assumptions", your approach to Alki was "he knows what he's talking about" when in fact he stated he had no knowledge and making assumptions. Kinda double standard, isn't it?

Honestly I'm tired of this. I explained myself multiple times and very clearly. I said what I wanted to say. It's not my issue if it's not being understood or if there's a refusal about it. It's your choice to believe unnamed sources or see Alki as credible. I personally refuse to entertain Alki as credible.

 

[Birchey]

of course they wanted evidence, so would the other side. They emailed Weitzman on Saturday about preserve evidence. Sure said Weitzman, arranged for videotaping and pictures being taken of the technology. Apparently they aren't trusting the other side so Alki went to court on an emergency hearing on Sunday asking court to allow them access to the Billboard show. Estate didn't even respond and why would they? They had already agreed and arranged for preserving the evidence in the video format without a court order. Court ruled in Alki's favor at 4:52, they emailed Weitzman by 5:08 - 8 minutes after show started. Travel and getting access to the venue took sometime as far as we can see. When they were in the hologram part was over. But they had 90 minute access directly to the technology, being able to examine it and videotaping it themselves in person. Looks like there had been issues in regards to how long they investigated it and they didn't play the hologram for Alki's people - apparently show was over and the people who were playing it had gone. Now they have an emergency request for Estate to turn over any video.. I'm asking you why? If you (generally speaking) can look to a cell phone video and can identify the technology for certain, why would Alki's people need any more information than their 90 minute in person examination?

Honestly I'm tired of this. I explained myself multiple times and very clearly. It's your choice to believe unnamed sources or see Alki as credible.

I don't see Weitzman as credible in the slightest, I know he has lied directly to fans which includes me, I also don't trust this Alki guy. Fact is I guess there must have been some evidence to get this emergency motion and a reason why they would want to inspect/video it themselves. The emergency request doesn't matter does it as Howard promised to send them the film anyway and don't they have a deadline to respond? Maybe they want as much evidence as possible as soon as possible to get this thing moving, that would be the ideal situation.

Thing is, if this is about the projector, we know they used a Musion Eyeliner Projector.............a patented one. The only thing I can see different about this illusion is the material used on the film screen the projection was on :/

 

[ivy]

I don't see Weitzman as credible in the slightest, I know he has lied directly to fans which includes me, I also don't trust this Alki guy. Fact is I guess there must have been some evidence to get this emergency motion and a reason why they would want to inspect/video it themselves.

Like I said they emailed Weitzman on Friday/ Saturday asking about preserve evidence. He said sure. We can assume that they didn't trust Weitzman and that's why they went to court on Sunday, their argument was that after the show the technology can be dismantled and they would have no way to know what technology was used - which is a valid point. Estate didn't respond to their motion to get access to the technology - which we can easily conclude as not having an objection. Any reasonable person can conclude that if they had an objection, they would object. LOL

The emergency request doesn't matter does it as Howard promised to send them the film anyway and don't they have a deadline to respond? Maybe they want as much evidence as possible as soon as possible to get this thing moving, that would be the ideal situation.

Actually no it's quite weird. Normally you file a lawsuit and need to serve people in 120 days, they have 60-90 days to find lawyers and do initial response. Then comes the demurrer - asking to dismiss the case based on no legal basis argument. Only after that - if it survives- the discovery phase starts. In this instance no one is even served yet. Discovery time wouldn't come for months to a year. So I personally don't get the rush request for Estate's videos.

 

[Birchey]

Just found this, its on a site owned by FilmOn, but thats not a bad thing as this isn't a source of a source, but from the horses mouth, make of it what you will.

"The controversial holographic representation of Michael Jackson at the Billboard Music Awards in Las Vegas was performed despite a request for an injunction by Hologram USA. But Judge Nancy J. Koppe of the Nevada court ordered last minute emergency access and lawyers from both sides entered the backstage area of MGM with court videographers.
Accounts indicate that the technology used for the Jackson hologram was indeed that owned by Alki David‘s Hologram USA and Musion Das Hologram, which directly contradicts Pulse Entertainment CEO John Textor’s claim to the court that it was not using the same technology. Hologram USA’s attorneys and Musion CEO Giovanni Palma were also present for the inspection, as well as lawyers for the Jackson Estate. Read the full account of the lawsuit here.)

There was quite a bit of tension backstage as the team inspected every aspect of the set-up to create the hologram. And that tension turned into real drama when the visit also proved that James Rock, an ex-employee of Musion Das Hologram, was backstage working on the Michael Jackson hologram, despite the fact that Textor told the court Rock was not involved, and was not even in Las Vegas. The court videographers interviewed Rock backstage at the MGM.
It was as Rock was talking to the court officials that Textor went into an apoplectic, screaming, rampage, seemingly trying to clear the room. Accounts from those on the scene tell TV Mix that Textor screamed, “Get the f*ck out!”
When Textor began to threaten lawsuits against Palma’s Musion, Palma reportedly told him, “Alki will eat you.”

Meanwhile Hologram USA’s attorney issued a statement:
“Pursuant to a court order issued Sunday afternoon, Holgram USA was able to inspect the equipment used by Defendants to produce the Michael Jackson hologram,” said Hologram USA’s attorney Ryan G. Baker of Baker Marquart. “Based on that inspection, which Defendants had earlier refused to permit, it is apparent that Defendants have infringed Plaintiffs’ patents. Plaintiffs will continue to take discovery to bring Defendants’ misdeeds out of the shadows and into the light.”"


http://www.tvmix.com/jackson-hologram-bma-court-order-inspection/123

 

[Tygger]

Ivy, if either executor lurks here, I am sure they are content with your support.

There is no need for anyone to believe Alki or the Estate when using their own eyes. When this lawsuit is resolved, the media will most likely have moved on from this story and so will some fans (some fans were not interested at all with the lawsuit). Regardless, the trick will be revealed and those who are still concerned will know for fact that Michael was not shown as we have never seen him before. Only his vocals were used.

 

[ivy]

Just found this, its on a site owned by FilmOn, but thats not a bad thing as this isn't a source of a source, but from the horses mouth, make of it what you will.

see this is what I have a problem with. It's the same site he claimed he had done a DNA test but later proven by TMZ that he faked the test by creating imaginary labs and copying logos from google. He lies and he uses his website to spread the lies. But I guess he gets a free pass because he is saying what you believe. Suddenly he's all credible and knowledgeable.

Anyway have fun. I'm done with this topic. This is no longer a discussion.

 

[Birchey]

see this is what I have a problem with. It's the same site he claimed he had done a DNA test but later proven by TMZ that he faked the test by creating imaginary labs and copying logos from google. He lies and he uses his website to spread the lies. But I guess he gets a free pass because he is saying what you believe. Suddenly he's all credible and knowledgeable.

Anyway have fun. I'm done with this topic. This is no longer a discussion.

We know the cock lied about the DNA, but this is a court case with not just him but another major company as plaintiffs too, do you think posting lies about the defendants, court videographers and what happened during their inspection will help this case? Because if they are lieing its as good as over, but if they are telling the truth here its damning for the defense. I hope this isn't true but everything that I have seen points the other way.

You are the one with all the court documents that you know most of us wont be able to get ahold of easily but decide to fill in the blanks for us and then post the "selected" portions of said documents, and even suggesting just because they wanted additional evidence was because they could not find what they were looking for seems awfully biased in my opinion, especially because of your knowledge of the legal system and the common sense that requesting all the evidence is usually the best way to build a case. There must have been some evidence in there favour for them to get this emergency motion.

I post this stuff for people to see and review, like the projector company, the video showing the projection mirror on the roof and now this.

If you want to get to the bottom of something you have to research and review each side, ultimately we won't know the truth until its heard in court.

 

[marc_vivien]

Bad faith has no limit. When an article fits some fans' agenda, it's suddenly credible.

The problem here is the court docs filed by Alki David contradicts the FilmOn article.
Friday, he had no clue about the technology, but suddenly, because the judge granted
his injunction, he had some damning evidence.

Court videographers don't judge the case. Lawyer' comments are just comments and supportive
to his client. But in the court doc. it's different. Estate dfidn't oppose to their request. But, in your
view, they are hiding something.

The guy blatanlly lies on this CNN video about his involvment. But some fans are supportive.

 

[qbee]

Ivy, if either executor lurks here, I am sure they are content with your support.

They don't have time for that but Im sure they are appreciative for the many fans that do support them . Im sure Alki David and Taj malick is content with you supporting his and her views as well. (sarcasm) Now Maybe you should just knock it off and quit trying to back hand people with your OFFTOPIC insults. WTF. Don't play naive in what you are trying to imply with that statement either. That was totally unnecessary . maybe move on from that BS and just discuss the topic Thanks

 

[Tygger]

Qbee, feel free to report any post including mine that you are not happy with. This way you do not have to direct any latent venom you have towards me in the Estate spectacle thread rendering your post off topic.

Not surprising you are still trying to link me to TM for whatever your reasons. I do not support Alki any more than the executors. Try again.

 

[Birchey]

Bad faith has no limit. When an article fits some fans' agenda, it's suddenly credible.

No one said its credible, just saying at the moment, it fits with everything else we know so far that the tech used was Patented, apart from the film screen material they projected on and if it is a lie could damage their case, if so its their own fault.

The problem here is the court docs filed by Alki David contradicts the FilmOn article.
Friday, he had no clue about the technology, but suddenly, because the judge granted
his injunction, he had some damning evidence.

Are you following this or just making stuff up because it fits your own Agenda? They only had a feeling and possibly word from industry insiders on Friday, On Sunday they produced EVIDENCE which was good enough for the judge to grant their motion and they then got to inspect the equipment, as they say they found what they were looking for and more. Whether they are bullshitting we will find out in due course.

 

[ivy]

We know the cock lied about the DNA, but this is a court case with not just him but another major company as plaintiffs too

so he's a liar when we don't agree and totally credible when we agree with him? Is that it? And in a court case what matters is not lying on court documents. Lying out of court doesn't really have an effect on the case.

you know most of us wont be able to get ahold of easily

all it requires a credit card and willingness to pay for it. If you aren't willing to do that it's not my problem.

If you want to get to the bottom of something you have to research and review each side

and you reviewing each side? What I see is automatic dismissal for whatever comes from Estate. I don't see it as review.

ultimately we won't know the truth until its heard in court.

perhaps we will never know the truth. Tygger is probably correct about this. What Alki "owns" is nothing more than the projection system. So the nature of the hologram - whether full CGI or a body double - seems to be irrelevant to the issue of whether Musion eyeliner was used or not. The case - if it even happens- can determine what projection system was used but it might not provide any information about how the hologram was done.

awfully biased

and is there anyone that's not biased here? How about possible bias on Alki's own website?

But fine as I said I'm done with this topic. I won't post any more of my biased updates or documents. So either you can pay for the documents to get it yourselves or believe what Alki is feeding you.

 

[Birchey]

Right fair play, I think its time to get back to the performance rather than the court case. I will quote one thing though.

and you reviewing each side? What I see is automatic dismissal from whatever comes from Estate. I don't see it as review.

ABC News: But the Jackson Estate did tell us its not an impersonator or a hologram like the one used to resurrect rapper Tupac Shakur

They lied, on both accounts. Don't worry I am in the process of making a video to explain and prove all.

 

[ivy]

They lied, on both accounts. Don't worry I am in the process of making a video to explain and prove all.

Will the video also include Alki's lies? Such as saying to CNN Hologram USA did it and it was recorded at his studio when we all know that ain't the truth? And so on. Or not only will his lies be ignored but his select statements used to confirm your position? Actually you don't need to answer that. I already know the answer. So I'll pass.