Michael Jackson To Unleash World Premiere Experience At Billboard Music Awards

[Birchey]

Will the video also include Alki's lies? Such as saying to CNN Hologram USA did it and it was recorded at his studio when we all know that ain't the truth? And so on. Actually you don't need to answer that. I already know the answer.

Nope not even going to touch on the court case or Alki's words etc. Its just a video to pull apart the illusion, show how it was done, show how and who the impersonator was and how head was created, show all the mistakes in the performance with the CGI tracking, the blemishes on the film screen, the actual film screen, which direction it was tilted, where the projector was position and where it came from, where the mirror was positioned, how once again ABC said their were live dancers on stage when there wasn't, how the people crying in the audience were either married to LA Reid or sleeping with the shows producer, talk about the clothing. That sort of factual evidence video which no one seems to give a sh!t about anymore

If you just don't like the fact I am calling The Estate and people who made this illusion out on there BS just say it. but this video will prove it, your call.

 

[Bubs]

WTF has this got to do with anything, don't try putting words into people mouths.

Sorry B but you are totally reaching.
You take his word because what he says about this whole issue supports your stance. Seriously!
I think it would be wise to wait for more info than take what Alki says as gospel.

 

[Tygger]

Nope not even going to touch on the court case or Alki's words etc. Its just a video to pull apart the illusion, show how it was done, show how and who the impersonator was and how head was created, show all the mistakes in the performance with the CGI tracking, the blemishes on the film screen, the actual film screen, which direction it was tilted, where the projector was position and where it came from, where the mirror was positioned, how once again ABC said their were live dancers on stage when there wasn't, how the people crying in the audience were either married to LA Reid or sleeping with the shows producer, talk about the clothing. That sort of factual evidence video which no one seems to give a sh!t about anymore

I would like to see that. It cannot be worst than whatever that was at Billboard.

What I would have liked to have see even more would be a full length documentary on the Xscape project instead of the 20+ minutes on the dvd. I would have liked to have seen the $400K spent on honoring, respecting, and appreciating Michael's art than the attempt to cheapen it with a parlor trick.

 

[Allusio]

Some comments sound to me like this:

How awful, it looked nothing like real Michael but they promised us Michael!!! Oh, that looked like real person with "fake" head so they used an impersonator to create this, no doubts. No matter how realistic that was – IT WAS CHEAP. How could they do that and now they promote it as magic, how dare they?!! They are lying for promotion. They must be hiding the fact they couldn’t bring Michael back so they fake the “hologram” …

IDK, but do you understand you “die” for nothing.IMO.

I just wonder maybe you think that over these executers owe you apologies?

 

[Bubs]

Music-wise I would've released the demos only. Xscape for example is perfectly fine as it is, no need to remix it. I do get the whole concept of the album, but then I would've named it a remix-album, not a regular version, as that's what it pretty much is. If I were to update old MJ tracks I would make sure to use the same kind of effects and tricks on those songs that Michael did ever since HIStory. It's not that difficult to follow those guidelines, Michael has made a lot of music and used a lot of the same kind of beats. Those kind of things could've been used in a more updated version of a song.

If the estate does according your plan, Michael's legacy dies with current fans. I want Michael's legacy to live beyond me, beyond next generation and so on. How to get new generation to listen MJ music is to release his music in a ways that younger generations can relate to it, thus they will find their way to Michael's back catalogue.

Do you think if they had released only Michael's demos, it would have attracted new fans, because I most certainly don't.
"MJ Estate "Our goal is to reach as many people as possible and to expand the community to include as many new fans as possible""

Seemingly what the estate is doing works, because releasing this album and hype around it, made people to go and buy other albums from his back catalogue.
Jackson's 2003 compilation Number Ones rebounds from #106 to #28 in its 176th week on The Billboard 200. The album returns to #1 on Top Catalog Albums. This is its 29th week on top of that chart.

Two other Jackson albums are streaking back up The Billboard 200. His 2005 compilation The Essential Michael Jackson rebounds from #75 to #67. His 1982 opus Thriller rebounds from #127 to #70.

The Essential Michael Jackson tops the 500K mark in U.S. digital sales this week. It's Jackson's best-selling digital album. Thriller is in second place with sales of 430K digital copies.

Jackson has sold 34,723,000 albums in the U.S. since January 1991. That puts him in 14th place on Nielsen SoundScan's running list of the best-selling artists in its history. He's sandwiched between two hit-makers of comparable sales but lesser stature: Kenny G and Shania Twain. In the week before he died in June 2009, Jackson ranked #47 on this running list. He had sales, to that point, of 21,737,000 albums.

 

[innuendo141]

If the estate does according your plan, Michael's legacy dies with current fans. I want Michael's legacy to live beyond me, beyond next generation and so on. How to get new generation to listen MJ music is to release his music in a ways that younger generations can relate to it, thus they will find their way to Michael's back catalogue.

Do you think if they had released only Michael's demos, it would have attracted new fans, because I most certainly don't.
"MJ Estate "Our goal is to reach as many people as possible and to expand the community to include as many new fans as possible""

Seemingly what the estate is doing works, because releasing this album and hype around it, made people to go and buy other albums from his back catalogue.
Jackson's 2003 compilation Number Ones rebounds from #106 to #28 in its 176th week on The Billboard 200. The album returns to #1 on Top Catalog Albums. This is its 29th week on top of that chart.

Two other Jackson albums are streaking back up The Billboard 200. His 2005 compilation The Essential Michael Jackson rebounds from #75 to #67. His 1982 opus Thriller rebounds from #127 to #70.

The Essential Michael Jackson tops the 500K mark in U.S. digital sales this week. It's Jackson's best-selling digital album. Thriller is in second place with sales of 430K digital copies.

Jackson has sold 34,723,000 albums in the U.S. since January 1991. That puts him in 14th place on Nielsen SoundScan's running list of the best-selling artists in its history. He's sandwiched between two hit-makers of comparable sales but lesser stature: Kenny G and Shania Twain. In the week before he died in June 2009, Jackson ranked #47 on this running list. He had sales, to that point, of 21,737,000 albums.

The Beatles have never had their demos contemporised. If anything they were treated like the holy grail and preserved and released as was for the anthology CD's.

The legacy of the Beatles did not die with their fans of the 60's and shortly after they disbanded. Nor would Michael's legacy die.

 

[Bubs]

The Beatles have never had their demos contemporised. If anything they were treated like the holy grail and preserved and released as was for the anthology CD's.

The legacy of the Beatles did not die with their fans of the 60's and shortly after they disbanded. Nor would Michael's legacy die.

You answered you your question yourself.
Just because The Beatles were treated like holy grail. Everything what MJ did was questioned, undervalued, or disrespected, and don't forget that Michael was seriously abused by media for decades. The Beatles don't have the same reputation on the media as Michael has.

You don't see media treating The Beatles like they treated Michael. Media is kissing their behind while they are lapping more shit over Michael, even he has been dead for 5 years.

Also I am yet to see any interview where Paul McCartney is questioned regarding his statements how MJ came to purchase Beatles catalogue. He bold blank lies on tv interviews and nobody says anything.

 

[Allusio]

The Beatles have never had their demos contemporised. If anything they were treated like the holy grail and preserved and released as was for the anthology CD's.

The legacy of the Beatles did not die with their fans of the 60's and shortly after they disbanded. Nor would Michael's legacy die.

Of course it will never day!

But will MJ be an innovator, number one then… will there be new records?

Will without it all the legacy be worth of the King?

In all honesty, the Beatles music is different and their fans are different.

So the approach is different.

Maybe you would appreciate demos only but a lot of fans would blame someone for being lazy.

 

[JustMe00]

If the estate does according your plan, Michael's legacy dies with current fans. I want Michael's legacy to live beyond me, beyond next generation and so on. How to get new generation to listen MJ music is to release his music in a ways that younger generations can relate to it, thus they will find their way to Michael's back catalogue.

Do you think if they had released only Michael's demos, it would have attracted new fans, because I most certainly don't.
"MJ Estate "Our goal is to reach as many people as possible and to expand the community to include as many new fans as possible""

Seemingly what the estate is doing works, because releasing this album and hype around it, made people to go and buy other albums from his back catalogue.
Jackson's 2003 compilation Number Ones rebounds from #106 to #28 in its 176th week on The Billboard 200. The album returns to #1 on Top Catalog Albums. This is its 29th week on top of that chart.

Two other Jackson albums are streaking back up The Billboard 200. His 2005 compilation The Essential Michael Jackson rebounds from #75 to #67. His 1982 opus Thriller rebounds from #127 to #70.

The Essential Michael Jackson tops the 500K mark in U.S. digital sales this week. It's Jackson's best-selling digital album. Thriller is in second place with sales of 430K digital copies.

Jackson has sold 34,723,000 albums in the U.S. since January 1991. That puts him in 14th place on Nielsen SoundScan's running list of the best-selling artists in its history. He's sandwiched between two hit-makers of comparable sales but lesser stature: Kenny G and Shania Twain. In the week before he died in June 2009, Jackson ranked #47 on this running list. He had sales, to that point, of 21,737,000 albums.

I don't see how one would go from "update the tracks but stay true to the Michael Jackson sound" to "only release demos only or nothing at all". For that reason, I fail to see your point. I was specifically speaking about how I would've handled Xscape.

I am all for keeping his legacy alive, but I am more concerned about his image and what they make of his legacy, rather than keeping it alive at any cost!

 

[innuendo141]

You answered you your question yourself.
Just because The Beatles were treated like holy grail. Everything what MJ did was questioned, undervalued, or disrespected, and don't forget that Michael was seriously abused by media for decades. The Beatles don't have the same reputation on the media as Michael has.

You don't see media treating The Beatles like they treated Michael. Media is kissing their behind while they are lapping more shit over Michael, even he has been dead for 5 years.

Also I am yet to see any interview where Paul McCartney is questioned regarding his statements how MJ came to purchase Beatles catalogue. He bold blank lies on tv interviews and nobody says anything.

I disagree. I think Michael's legacy and what he left behind will survive and stand the test of time a lot longer than anything post death, so I stand by what I think and say that Michael's legacy would not have died out if the estate did not release new albums like Xscape. That's what I think.

 

[LastTear]

I disagree. I think Michael's legacy and what he left behind will survive and stand the test of time a lot longer than anything post death, so I stand by what I think and say that Michael's legacy would not have died out if the estate did not release new albums like Xscape. That's what I think.

Michaels legacy would dwindle without new releases, just look at the increase in sales of his other albums following the release of Xscape. New releases or new projects draws attention to previous works.

 

[JustMe00]

Michaels legacy would dwindle without new releases, just look at the increase in sales of his other albums following the release of Xscape. New releases or new projects draws attention to previous works.

I really don't understand how people can think in such a narrow way. It's not "keeping his legacy alive" vs. "staying true to his music". It is possible to do both. And I think that is exactly what most people, who have a problem with Xscape are complaining about.

 

[Bubs]

I disagree. I think Michael's legacy and what he left behind will survive and stand the test of time a lot longer than anything post death, so I stand by what I think and say that Michael's legacy would not have died out if the estate did not release new albums like Xscape. That's what I think.

In a way I do agree with what you say. I have said this many times before, and say it again, anything that is released posthumously cannot tarnish or ruin Michael's musical legacy, but they can enhance it( kind of just to be sure.

Also, you cannot be that blind not to see that there are some media people trying to do their best that Michael's musical legacy is not to be remembered, but he is child m...r, thus doesn't deserve to be remembered.
If that sort of articles are the only thing to read about Michael, why would the next generation bother to buy his albums, become his fans and carry on his legacy? We need plenty of positive articles, music etc for younger generations to dig deep into mass of shit that has been lapped on Michael's legacy over the years.

Latest headline from MTV:
Black Keys To Michael Jackson: Beat It We're #1

Do you think Michael deserves that kind of treatment from any media outlet, especially from MTV, and do you think they would have put that sort of headline is the situation was some band beat Paul McCartney's album on charts?

Some historically valuable artists are treated differently than others, and the fact is Michael is not treated anywhere as respectfully as he should have.


Btw, I thought you were happy with this release?

 

[LastTear]

I really don't understand how people can think in such a narrow way. It's not "keeping his legacy alive" vs. "staying true to his music". It is possible to do both. And I think that is exactly what most people, who have a problem with Xscape are complaining about.

You are calling me narrow minded?

What you may call staying true to his music may not be what another fan may consider as staying true to his music.

 

[JustMe00]

You are calling me narrow minded?

What you may call staying true to his music may not be what another fan may consider as staying true to his music.

No I am not.

I don't think that kind of assumption is logical. Staying true to his music means just that. It doesn't mean it has to sound outdated (he sure as hell never did, and he had his own sound throughout the years...). Anyway, beating a dead horse here. Let's agree to disagree.

 

[innuendo141]

No I am not.

I don't think that kind of assumption is logical. Staying true to his music means just that. It doesn't mean it has to sound outdated (he sure as hell never did, and he had his own sound throughout the years...). Anyway, beating a dead horse here. Let's agree to disagree.

I agree. This is something that someone's opinion won't be swayed, least of all mine anyway which mirrors your views i believe

 

[LastTear]

No I am not.

I don't think that kind of assumption is logical. Staying true to his music means just that. It doesn't mean it has to sound outdated (he sure as hell never did, and he had his own sound throughout the years...). Anyway, beating a dead horse here. Let's agree to disagree.

Now you are calling me a dead horse? *joke* lol

We had better agree to disagree as this isn't the proper thread anyway, but in closing I must point out that in bringing his music up to date some (no one in particular) fans may be upset that his music is messed with around to much. Someone is always going to be upset.

 

[myosotis]

As for the hologram I told that I was at most neutral about it. There are a lot of things I didn't like about it. I stated how dance should be better and so on. I also stated my understanding of the technology required a body double and if that's the reality I won't go crazy about it. I see myself as a rational and realistic person and I can be reasonable and accept any limitations of the technology, time and/or money. As I also again mentioned before I never expected this hologram to be "Michael" and I guess it makes a difference how I react to this.

Regardless of how I feel and what I dislike about the hologram, I refuse to entertain Alki as a credible source especially not after his media and court statements differ as a fact and I haven't forgotten his secret son publicity stunt. As I explained that motivated my posts. If it's not clear for anyone I too think that hologram probably had a body double, though we have also given the information that CGI is also possibility. as I don't have necessarily expertise in the technology, I wouldn't make any definite statement. So I hope it's clear that I'm not debating about the possibility of a body double, I just can't understand willingness to give Alki any credibility.

This is a potentially serious situation for the Estate. It doesn’t really matter how the illusion was created, as long as the Estate did not lie in court about what technology was used. AD is already milking this for all it is worth, and he will never rest from pushing his views to the media (especially TV and paper) if the court concludes that it was misled about the Estate’s use of AD - licensed technology.
The Estate has MUCH more important issues to deal with than a legal suit from AD..I really don’t want the WR/JS case to be tainted by accusations that the Estate is not truthful in court. (And that includes errors of omission ie forgetting to mention something, as well as commission).

A few extra sales on an album are never worth the loss of reputation that misleading the court would bring, so I really hope that that did not happen in the AD case. AD may be an abrasive and opportunistic character, but that does not mean that he is not entitled to claim licence fees for a technology if he owns the patent and the technology was used.

My own opinion of the technology is that he is probably ‘chasing rainbows’ with his vision of how he can capitalise on it in future, eg with ‘virtual concerts. Personally, I watched TII at the cinema at least 10 times, and would have watched more often if I could. I don’t know how long the real MJ was on screen for…I’d think at least an hour. By contrast, even with a fairly spectacular setting, I didn’t find the MJ ‘CG/ hologram’ effect remotely riveting. (It was interesting in the sense of satisfying my curiosity about what such an effect would look like, but that is all). It would certainly not have held my attention for an hour or more. Furthermore, a ‘real’ concert has an enormous build-up; announcement of ticket sales, arrival of the star in the host city, newspaper and TV reports, in-person appearances, memorabilia sales at the event and the possibility of perhaps obtaining an autograph. A hologram concert would have very little build-up, and I think would leave rather an ‘empty’ feeling afterwards, a bit like eating candy floss (cotton candy). I don’t think the Estate has much to fear from AD’s technology, even if he could obtain rights to MJ’s image (which is highly unlikely).

 

[darkmed]

Bad CGI, Impersonator, Update music or not whatever is happening right now Estate/Sony/LA Reid managed to make you all go crazy just like MJ would have lol so mission accomplished

 

[Bonnie Blue]

By contrast, even with a fairly spectacular setting, I didn’t find the MJ ‘CG/ hologram’ effect remotely riveting. (It was interesting in the sense of satisfying my curiosity about what such an effect would look like, but that is all). It would certainly not have held my attention for an hour or more.

I feel exactly the same as you, i just viewed the bb mj experience as a curiosity,nothing more. I think it was a great way to create buzz for an artist who is no longer with us, but i don't personally have any interest in watching someone else, even if they're digitised to look like mj, perform mj's dance moves - as that (motion capture using someone else) for me is the only way they cd have produced this illusion (i don't believe in magic). Even watching smooth criminal a thousand times, i just can't seem to drag my eyes away from mj in the ensemble dancing - it was just the way his moves are so practised and so precise yet seem so fluid and almost organic with the music - that is matchless, if another dancer can replicate that then that dancer would be up there with the greats. I'm not knocking the attempt to do this, as the interest created amongst the general public was great, but it strikes me as odd to expect all fans to be all thrilled with this, a youtube of someone else perform as mj when we can watch plenty of youtubes of mj himself perform - mj was more than a few dance moves.

 

[Dtwmjj]

damien shields got confirmation from some people involved in the hologram but couldn't be identified due to an agreement that it is an impersonator

http://www.damienshields.com/hologr...ards-not-michael-jackson-but-an-impersonator/

 

[Bonnie Blue]

I think musion is more than just a company providing some projector technology. They were the company behind the 'hologram' of les dawson that got alot of publicity a year ago for an itv programme.

To mark the twentieth anniversary of the death of comedian Les Dawson, new multimedia holographic technology was used to bring him back on stage in front of a celebrity audience.

The technology used to create the Les Dawson hologram was a first anywhere in the world, fusing the work of a prosthetics and CGI team with that of an actor. Rob underwent an intensive week’s training learning Les’ original material, his mannerisms and his voice whilst being fitted out with full facial and hand prosthetics, a fat suit and Les’ actual clothes and jewellery.

After 3 hours in make up each day, the 12 hour shoot days involved painstakingly copying Les’ original movements. With no room for cut ins, the 5 different clips were shot in single takes and then, after 25,000 frames had been captured, the team put together a fully 3 dimensional Les to perform in front of a celebrity audience to perform the ‘audience with’ that Les had signed to do 2 weeks before his death.

http://www.actorum.com/les-dawson-an-audience-with-that-never-was/

To me this sounds as if the principle could be similar to what was done at the bb awards. However there is a huge contrast between the level of complexity between capturing a comedian, sitting down and moving his arms and standing up etc, to caputuring an all singing,dancing mj. The holgram of mj was a huge step forward.

 

[dewey]

Quick question for everyone. Do you think the "performance" would have been better, with say real unreleased footage of Michael, but used in a "Magical" style?

 

[WhoIsIt89]

Michaels legacy would dwindle without new releases, just look at the increase in sales of his other albums following the release of Xscape. New releases or new projects draws attention to previous works.

I heavily disagree. Michael's legacy as an artist, isn't going anywhere. The released music he left behind, the performances, the tours. All of that implanted him into the minds of music enthusiasts almost everywhere long before he passed. Even during the controversy, Michael was always considered one of the greatest entertainers of all time. It was the personal stuff that had his name being dragged through the mud, not what he did as a musician.

As an artist, Michael's legacy has always been intact, and judging from the past, it will remain so. The only one's who went out of their way to discredit Michael post '87 at every chance they got was Rolling Stone.

 

[WhoIsIt89]

I think musion is more than just a company providing some projector technology. They were the company behind the 'hologram' of les dawson that got alot of publicity a year ago for an itv programme.



To me this sounds as if the principle could be similar to what was done at the bb awards. However there is a huge contrast between the level of complexity between capturing a comedian, sitting down and moving his arms and standing up etc, to caputuring an all singing,dancing mj. The holgram of mj was a huge step forward.

Strange because literally every article that mentions all the instances of this tech being used in the past, all of them say a double was used in it's creation. Except for the explanation we've been given by the Estate.

Indeed it was a step up in the technology, but I don't think they managed yet to make a full CGI image and it's clothes move like that and have the clothing correspond in an identical way that it does when an actual person is wearing like a T-shirt with his arms outstretched. I'm positive they used a double.

Outside of the bad face, and the double. I really had no problem with this, I didn't think it was "unethical" or anything like that. I simply think it was overhyped and the tagline "Michael like you've never seen him before" was a flat out fib. Because in reality, I don't think it was Michael at all. I just expected so much more, and not just me but as soon as it began my grandmother goes "Who's that? That doesn't look like a hologram, just an impersonator..", at that point I attempted to explain to her that it's supposedly an evolved form of the Tupac hologram, but continuing to watch the performance for the first time, I had to agree with her. And she's not even a fan like I am, but she knew what Michael Jackson looked and moved like, as she was the one supporting my Michael addiction, during his heyday in the early 90's. I just didn't find it very feasible that those moves were made up or based on "Michael's past performances". The supposed "CGI" had the same tendency to mix in specific dance routines from different videos and performances, all into one act, as Earnest Valentino does. The guy does it all the time. Like at the MiJac party in London, when he's doing the medley, he mixes dances from RTT into his performance of ITC. Just like the "CGI" mixed in the BOW dance routine into the a bunch of other stuff for STTR.


I'm rambling, but my point is, the only issue I really have with this, is the Estate attempting to insult my intelligence. Were they just to be honest and say a double were used, I'd accept it for what it is...A decent yet flawed effort.

 

[LastTear]

I heavily disagree. Michael's legacy as an artist, isn't going anywhere. The released music he left behind, the performances, the tours. All of that implanted him into the minds of music enthusiasts almost everywhere long before he passed. Even during the controversy, Michael was always considered one of the greatest entertainers of all time. It was the personal stuff that had his name being dragged through the mud, not what he did as a musician.

As an artist, Michael's legacy has always been intact, and judging from the past, it will remain so. The only one's who went out of their way to discredit Michael post '87 at every chance they got was Rolling Stone.

No, I wish I could agree but I can't.

Within in the media I remember Michael being criticised for Rock my world (re-hashing Smooth) He was criticised for the album History, he was criticised for his 'angry' songs as being self serving, these are just off the top of my head. And most sadly of all is that if Michael was alive and had done that STTR performance he would have been criticised a) for the throne and b) for the dance moves. But Michael isn't here and the media are now happy to call him the greatest entertainer etc.

I do partially agree with you in that Michael has left a wonderful and impressive legacy but where we differ is that new releases add to that legacy by highlighting his past legacy.

 

[WhoIsIt89]

Sorry B but you are totally reaching.
You take his word because what he says about this whole issue supports your stance. Seriously!
I think it would be wise to wait for more info than take what Alki says as gospel.

See, posts like these make me feel like half of you haven't even read through this thread. NOBODY is taking Alki David's word for it, not ONE person. What we've said countless times, is his claim of an double having to be used only COINCIDES with everything we've already discovered. And that along with everything else, simply confirms to us, that it was an impersonator and not full CGI image, thus proving the Estate to once again be liars.

How in any possible way, do you feel that translates to us simply taking Alki David's word as gospel? As if that's all we have to go on?

No, I wish I could agree but I can't.

Within in the media I remember Michael being criticised for Rock my world (re-hashing Smooth) He was criticised for the album History, he was criticised for his 'angry' songs as being self serving, these are just off the top of my head. And most sadly of all is that if Michael was alive and had done that STTR performance he would have been criticised a) for the throne and b) for the dance moves. But Michael isn't here and the media are now happy to call him the greatest entertainer etc.

I do partially agree with you in that Michael has left a wonderful and impressive legacy but where we differ is that new releases add to that legacy by highlighting his past legacy.

Even with all of those criticisms, Michael died as one of the greatest entertainers of all time, by the majority of music industry. Even with all those criticisms of YRMW, it was still a hit record, #1 in America for quite some time, and elsewhere.. HIStory was criticized for many things, yet Michael still made it sell, he made a successful out of it, and continued to cement his legacy as one of the greatest entertainers of all time. Even with the criticism that album got of antisemitism and all that other stuff, it didn't make Michael any less of a star, it didn't make Michael any less of the icon that he was.

None of this stuff damaged his legacy as an artist, as an entertainer. All they did was make people point fingers and try to figure out Michael's personal life and how "weird" it was. Even the trial, it never hurt his legacy as one of the greats, it killed his momentum of trying to be a current, hit-making, album selling artist. But not once did it damage his overall legacy, I don't think.


If the Estate chooses not to release anymore albums, it does nothing to Michael's legacy. All it does is puts an end to him being a modern, album selling artist, so to speak. That's all it does. It doesn't make him any less of the magnificent entertainer he was.


And I highly doubt Michael would've been criticized for the Billboard Award performance had he still been alive. Why? Because it would've actually been Michael, not an impersonator. It would've been Michael, with all his facial emotion and aggression, with the crispness of all his dance steps and most of all, he'd show the effort into his dance and perform which made him magical. Michael most likely wouldn't even use the same dance moves that was used in that performance had it actually been him. So how do you come to the conclusion that he would've been criticized for that performance?

 

[WhoIsIt89]

Some comments sound to me like this:

How awful, it looked nothing like real Michael but they promised us Michael!!! Oh, that looked like real person with "fake" head so they used an impersonator to create this, no doubts. No matter how realistic that was – IT WAS CHEAP. How could they do that and now they promote it as magic, how dare they?!! They are lying for promotion. They must be hiding the fact they couldn’t bring Michael back so they fake the “hologram” …

IDK, but do you understand you “die” for nothing.IMO.

I just wonder maybe you think that over these executers owe you apologies?

Your interpretation completely goes against everything that was said in this thread. "Oh, that looked like a real person with a fake head, so that's how we know it was impersonator, for sure"...No, not once was that even alluded to.

A correct interpretation would be like this, "Oh, these people don't think it was CGI, yet simply an impersonator with a flawed CGI face. Hmm, lemme go see why they feel this way, what did they say? Oh, they here's a valid point, the CGI does share identical dance steps with a known double. Hmm, the jacket does cast a parallel shadow on his t-shirt with every movement, like clothes does in real life. Oh, they have a decent argument about the tribute artist clothing. I may not agree with them, but they do raise valid points."

That's a correct interpretation. I don't know how out of any of the posts made by me, Birchey, Tygger or anyone else did you get what you got of that. Hysterical tbh.

 

[LastTear]

See, posts like these make me feel like half of you haven't even read through this thread. NOBODY is taking Alki David's word for it, not ONE person. What we've said countless times, is his claim of an double having to be used only COINCIDES with everything we've already discovered. And that along with everything else, simply confirms to us, that it was an impersonator and not full CGI image, thus proving the Estate to once again be liars.

How in any possible way, do you feel that translates to us simply taking Alki David's word as gospel? As if that's all we have to go on?




Even with all of those criticisms, Michael died as one of the greatest entertainers of all time, by the majority of music industry. Even with all those criticisms of YRMW. HIStory was criticized for many things, yet Michael still made it sell, he made a successful out of it, and continued to cement his legacy as one of the greatest entertainers of all time. Even with the criticism that album got of antisemitism and all that other stuff, it didn't make Michael any less of a star, it didn't make Michael any less of the icon that he was.

None of this stuff damaged his legacy as an artist, as an entertainer. All they did was make people point fingers and try to figure out Michael's personal life and how "weird" it was. Even the trial, it never hurt his legacy as one of the greats, it killed his momentum of trying to be a current, hit-making, album selling artist. But not once did it damage his overall legacy, I don't think.


If the Estate chooses not to release anymore albums, it does nothing to Michael's legacy. All it does is puts an end to him being a modern, album selling artist, so to speak. That's all it does. It doesn't make him any less of the magnificent entertainer he was.


And I highly doubt Michael would've been criticized for the Billboard Award performance had he still been alive. Why? Because it would've actually been Michael, not an impersonator. It would've been Michael, with all his facial emotion and aggression, with the crispness of all his dance steps and most of all, he'd show the effort into his dance and perform which made him magical. Michael most likely wouldn't even use the same dance moves that was used in that performance had it actually been him. So how do you come to the conclusion that he would've been criticized for that performance?

Re Alki, readers will come to that conclusion when the CNN link is preceded by 'here's the proof', 'confirmation' or words to that effect.

As for his legacy, it would always be alive and well within us even if nothing else was ever released. But I am enjoying the rest of the world having to sit up and take notice of Michaels legacy and acknowledge him as the incredible entertainer he was - and it is doing so via these new releases.

My conclusion of STTR, I could almost hear the British tabloids having a field day with the self proclaimed king on the throne, but you are right, we have no idea how Michael would have performed it if he had chosen to do so.

 

[WhoIsIt89]

of course they wanted evidence, so would the other side. Evidence is not only the way to prove guilt but also the way to prove innocence. They emailed Weitzman on Saturday about preserve evidence. Sure said Weitzman, arranged for videotaping and pictures being taken of the technology. Apparently they aren't trusting the other side so Alki went to court on an emergency hearing on Sunday asking court to allow them access to the Billboard show. Estate didn't even respond and why would they? They had already agreed and arranged for preserving the evidence in the video format without a court order. And if they were infringing patents would you think they would be this easygoing in regards to agreeing to record evidence without being forced? Court ruled in Alki's favor at 4:52, they emailed Weitzman by 5:08 - 8 minutes after show started. Travel and getting access to the venue took sometime as far as we can see. When they were in the hologram part was over. But they had 90 minute access directly to the technology, being able to examine it and videotaping it themselves in person. Looks like there had been issues in regards to how long they investigated it (they wanted to examine it more and the other side thought they had done enough examination) and they didn't play the hologram for Alki's people - apparently show was over and the people who were playing it had gone. Now they have an emergency request for Estate to turn over any video.. I'm asking you why? If you (generally speaking) can look to a cell phone video and can identify the technology for certain, why would Alki's people need any more information than their 90 minute in person examination? Why the rush?

@WhoIsIt89 I think I was very clear with "it seems" and mentioning we only have bits and pieces. I'm not portraying it anything more than it actually is. Current situation does require us to connect pieces and come to conclusions - it's fine to call it an assumption. I have to say that while your approach to court documents are "nothing but assumptions", your approach to Alki was "he knows what he's talking about" when in fact he stated he had no knowledge and making assumptions. Kinda double standard, isn't it?

Honestly I'm tired of this. I explained myself multiple times and very clearly. I said what I wanted to say. It's not my issue if it's not being understood or if there's a refusal about it. It's your choice to believe unnamed sources or see Alki as credible. I personally refuse to entertain Alki as credible.

No, it isn't a double standard, at least I don't think, when I'm aware of what I viewed in the live fan footage. I never heard once Alki David say in that video, "I don't know what I'm talking about and making assumptions"..What I did hear was him explaining how he thinks it was done, based on the technology that he now patents, the same tech used to re-create Tupac. I find it hard to believe a guy would purchase a share of this technology, which I think may need to be done in order for him to personally "license" it to anyone, and he simply made no effort to find out about what he was getting himself into.

What you posted simply doesn't make "it seem" like anything. That's the fact of the matter, it's bits and pieces, you formed an opinion of what it may have meant, based on what you want to believe is the case. Others, like myself, formed an opinion on what WE may think it meant, based on the things we know and believe. However, neither of those opinions are more correct than the other, because we simply don't know. And to act as if it is, is just flat out incorrect. Not saying that's what you did, but I'm speaking in general.

Those court docs, didn't allude to anything. And the way that you first alluded to that they "found nothing", solely because those screens say how Alki & Co. had their people go into the Billboard awards and inspect, and then ask the creators and the Estate for videos, is surprising of you. Because from all of your past instances, I really believe you're better than that to jump to such an objective conclusion, with such an subjective statement in a court document.

Alki isn't reliable when it comes to Michael's personal life. Yet how does that coincide with us only believing something or someone when it fits our agenda? He has the patent to the tech, he has to know a bit of information about it. He has nothing, no title , no nothing to anything that relates to Michael's personal life. But that really has nothing to do with this specific discussion. It's apples & oranges. And I believe people are really reaching and just looking for a way, however flawed it may be, to say "You're wrong about everything", every time they bring that up about how Alki said whatever about Michael & B Howard. They're two separate issues, neither has to do with one another.


@ LastTears, except the CNN video wasn't preceded with "here's proof" or a "confirmation". Not the one I posted, I didn't see Birchey say that. What I saw was "along with everything else, this also confirms to me....". That's it, so I don't see how anyone can see that sentence, and then jump to some silly conclusion of us simply taking Alki's word as the end all, be all.