[Discussion] Sexual Abuse Claims Against MJ Estate - Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe

Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

She's been obsessed in getting Michael's reputation to break and though he's gone, her obsession continues. Still she's partially responsible that Michael's gone, if she hadn't quit all her obsession he would still be around.
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

Agree matty. Been watching all those interviews. One of the guys who was raped at nine talking about how he knew it was wrong etc. And the one who broke down talling about getting off the train at m.keynes as thats where his abuser lives.
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

My mother just text me this:

Your mother is spot on. Watching W.R. is like watching someone talk about what they had for dinner the night before. So matter of fact and no emotion at all. I'm not familiar with the British footballers you mentioned but i can imagine the contrast between the two.
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

My mother just text me this:

Those British footballers who've recently been in the news about being abused as children - they're how you'd expect victims to be. Not like that Wade Robson. I saw an interview with them and it was heartbreaking.

I actually found it really upsetting seeing them interviewed. The guy on there was broken, could barely finish a sentence for crying. He seemed really effected. Miles away from Wade Robson.

Exactly. I looked at that case too and the difference is striking.

Here are the interviews:
https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...ictim-steve-walters-victoria-derbyshire-video

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...an-jimmy-savile-case-says-andy-woodward-video


Real victim Andy Woodward

andy.jpg

andy2.jpg



vs.

non-molested phony parasite Wade Robson


robson.jpg

robson2.jpg


I wonder if someone had asked the Bennell victims after he was caught and investigated
whether they would have been interested in holding an umbrella for him and be an extra in his videos,
take vacations on his ranch and defend him under oath how many would have said of course, what he did
was not abuse it was consensual and it was my idea and I don't think there was anything wrong with it.

Some moron on twitter tried to compare them to Robson and Safechuck because they didn't come forward
earlier then was challenged to show just one Bennell victim who said they kept defending him
until age 29 because before that they believed what Bennell did was love and not abuse and of course
she didn't answer.
 
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Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

Exactly. I looked at that case too and the difference is striking.

Here are the interviews:
https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...ictim-steve-walters-victoria-derbyshire-video

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...an-jimmy-savile-case-says-andy-woodward-video


Real victim Andy Woodward

andy.jpg

andy2.jpg



vs.

non-molested phony parasite Wade Robson


robson.jpg

robson2.jpg


I wonder if someone had asked the Bennell victims after he was caught and investigated
whether they would have been interested in holding an umbrella for him and be an extra in his videos,
take vacations on his ranch and defend him under oath how many would have said of course, what he did
was not abuse it was consensual and it was my idea and I don't think there was anything wrong with it.

Some moron on twitter tried to compare them to Robson and Safechuck because they didn't come forward
earlier then was challenged to show just one Bennell victim who said they kept defending him
until age 29 because before that they believed what Bennell did was love and not abuse and of course
she didn't answer.
That moron on twitter just want to believe this nonsense when it is clear these guys were lying. One thing our election showed me is that some people want to be stupid.
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

Edit: Already said.
 
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Those morons do not get it that we do not deny that there are cases where people keep a story of childhood sexual abuse to themselves for decades. Yes, that happens and no one denies that. However, the specific circumstances of MJ's life make such a story a very unlikely story here.

Robson/Safechuck/Jane Doe claim things like they didn't know until recent therapy that it was wrong/abuse - even though there have been two public rounds of allegations against MJ that were all about how wrong such a thing is and how much it is abuse. Robson testified for him in 2005 and all of them supported him in 1993. This guy who first went public with this story against the football coach last week, Andy Woodward, he didn't just wake up recently and made a U-turn on previous claims he has made about this coach to file a lawsuit for money. He did not previously - and voluntarily - say this coach made him believe in the pure goodness of mankind, nor did he invite him to BBQs. He actually was traumatized by his presence. Of course, you know it, even as a kid, that rape is wrong but at latest as an adult you know it is wrong, especially when there is a criminal trial that is all about how wrong such things are. And actually, Woodward did tell his story of abuse to authorities when Benell was investigated in the 90s. His story is only news to the public but it isn't to authorities or the people around him: he testified against the guy (and not for him!) during that investigation against him in the 90s.

And yes, there are people who keep such a thing to themselves and never tell anyone a word, but those people usually also do not walk around praising their abuser saying they make them believe in the goodness of mankind and things like that. They just bury the thing and don't talk or think about their abuser at all and do not want to be near them at all if they have a choice. Or if it is someone they know (eg. someone in the family) and they have to be around him then they quietly suffer by his presence - like Woodward was telling (his abuser married his sister):

"The wedding took place in 1991 and Woodward, at 18, had to go through the hellish ordeal of seeing the man who had exploited, controlled and abused him for years become his brother-in-law. “I had to live with that on top of everything else,” he says. “I had to attend that wedding, standing in the church when I really wanted to rip his throat out. It was torture – that’s the only word to describe it.”

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/nov/16/andy-woodward

Compare that to Robson inviting MJ to his wedding, to family BBQs in Vegas or him praising MJ as the epitome of human goodness.

Then put this already suspicious change of Robson and Safechuck's stories in the context of their lawsuits and this whole nonsense of MJ's companies being the "most sophisticated child sexual abuse procurement and facilitation organization the world has ever known" - that based on things like secretaries handling fan mail, putting Joy Robson on the phone with MJ (at Joy's request) or bodyguards opening gates - and people generally just doing their mundane, everyday jobs. The struggle of them trying to turn MJ's companies into this child sex abuse maffia based on things like that, but never once mentioning the responsibility of their parents. When it was the parents who were there with MJ and the kid, who could observe the situation from close up etc. But they are not responsible. A secretary writing fan mail or a bodyguard opening a gate is. And of course that claim has nothing to do with the fact that they have to find a way to implicate MJ's companies to win money. Sure, sure...

Oh, and when Benell was previously accused, after the initial accuser several others came out to join. It wasn't a struggle for authorities to find other victims. They didn't have to resort to questionable practices to create other victims. Like claiming people to be victims who themselves denied being victims. Or convincing a child of "memories" that he didn't have before talking to the police - that during MJ tickling him he was touched improperly when he did not remember any such thing before the police blatantly told him what he should "remember". Benell actually has dozens, if not several hundreds of victims. The police set up a hot line last week and only in the first hour they received 50 calls. Remind me again of the results that hotline brought that Sneddon set up in 2005? And when Robson's lawyers are victim fishing they come up with the likes of Safechuck who should pay royalties to Victor Gutierrez for his story or "Jane Doe" who only messes up the previous narrative...
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

Dam bennel married his sister?
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

I think people forget the internet exists and public record are... well... Public! We can put 2 and 2 together
 
Bennell arranged for him to stay at his house on the edge of the Peak District. “It was like a treasure trove, a child’s dream,” Woodward says. “When you walked through the door there were three fruit machines. He had a pool table. There was a little monkey upstairs in a cage who would sit on your shoulder. He had two pyrenean mountain dogs. He even kept a wild cat. It was my dream, remember, to be a footballer and it was like he was dropping little sweets towards me: ‘You can stay with me and this is what I can do for you.’ Plus he had a reputation as the best youth coach in the country. So I’d stay at weekends and summer holidays and even take time out of school sometimes. I’d go to all the Crewe matches with him. He liked dark-haired boys. I was a kid, I trusted him to begin with.”


For Bennell two dogs, a wild cat a little monkey, three fruit machines and a pool table was enough to keep boys in his house.

But Michael Jackson? He needed a full amusement park, a full zoo with giraffes, elephants, orangutans, reptiles, an Indian Village, an arcade with every imaginable games, a movie theater, two trains, a train station, a toy room, a cartoon collection and spend tens of millions on building and maintaining all these because unlike Bennell kids didn't like him and were never interested in spending time with him....except Chandler, Robson Safechuck Arvizo did their very best to get close to him somehow.

The morons fail to realize how MJ was totally unlike any pedo. Instead they say look MJ was like Bennell. Bennell too had animals and games in his home.


When the abuse started, Bennell used threats and blackmail to make sure his victims did not go against him. “What he’d do sometimes, to show the fear factor and make sure I never told anyone, was get out some nunchucks,” Woodward says. “He was a master with them. He’d tell me to hold out a piece of paper. I’d be physically shaking. Then he’d hit it with enough force to split it in half and make a little comment: ‘You see what I can do, you see how powerful I am?’
“It was either threats of violence or he’d use football to manipulate control. If I upset him in any way, he’d drop me from the team. ‘At any point,’ he’d tell me, ‘you will go, you will disappear and that dream won’t happen.’ It was emotional blackmail, all the time.”

How damn lucky MJ was. He didn't need any such "tricks".
He ran into Safechuck who even got jealous of Brett when MJ picked Brett for abuse not him.
Then he ran into Robson who looked forward to it.
Then he ran into Chandler who saw nothing wrong with it because it felt good.

I went shopping at Tesco that Sunday night and – boom – I don’t know what hit me. I genuinely thought I was going to collapse and die. My heart was racing. All the adrenaline had rushed to my head. I managed to get home, called an ambulance and went to hospital and they explained it was a panic attack.”

But Safechuck had to leave his Spanish class his attack was sooo severe.

In his worst moments, Woodward has been “a mess, spiralling to the point where I wasn’t going to be here any more. I’ve parked in my garage with a pipe. I’ve been to woods with a rope. I’ve had tablets, ready to go. I took it to the point where I couldn’t be here any more. I’ve been there, physically, and it frightened the life out of me. People talk about it being for attention or a cry for help but I can say, categorically, mine was because I didn’t know how I could live. The only thing that ever stopped me was knowing the devastation it would cause others.”


I'm sure Woodward will feel sad when Bennell dies because there won't be any chance to have a normal relationship with him anymore.


The brave victim, who came forward in 2013, was present during the sentencing hearing and read out impact statements from behind a screen. He said he’d ‘suffered a great deal’ as a result of the abuse and described how it had significantly affected his relationships throughout his life. Trust, he said, ‘has become a real issue’, adding: “The things he did to me will never go away and I live with that every single day.”


Like Chandler, Francia, Arvizo, Robson, Safechuck suffered a great deal and lived with it every single day and that is so obvious from
Chandler's "exuberant and whimsical" behavior, Francia's Oscar worthy performance in court, Arvizo's jokes in court, Robson's
desire to direct a tribute show for MJ and Safechuck's sudden need for therapy after he saw Robson's multi-million dollar lawsuit.

“I didn’t tell anybody until the police started their investigation. At first, I told them nothing happened but then I couldn’t bottle it up any longer and that was the moment my family found out. That’s been one of the hardest things, seeing the devastating effect it has had on my family. My sister has suffered massively. She left him immediately. My parents know everything and have to live with it every day.


But MJ was so lucky that Safechuck Robson Jane Doe all could bottle it up despite being questioned by the police, lawyers, the media , the DA.

But the truth is that going back to Crewe haunted me. It took a lot of inner strength on the coach heading down the motorway and I haven’t been there since. I avoid Crewe now. I will never set foot anywhere near that town again.”

Like going back to Neverland haunted Safechuck and Robson. Not.
 
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Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

Edit: Off topic.
 
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Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

Wade and his lawyers are trying to pull out all the stop their main goal now it to force the Estate into a settlement and by adding Jane Doe their really believe that will help their case not so.
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

Dam bennel married his sister?

Wait what..??????.... :puke:
You mean to tell me that sick pig who molested those men so many years ago actually married his sister???? WTF!!!!!!!


And ppl still think mj was the sicko.. :doh:
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

Wait what..??????.... :puke:
You mean to tell me that sick pig who molested those men so many years ago actually married his sister???? WTF!!!!!!!


And ppl still think mj was the sicko.. :doh:

IT'S CALLED LOGIC

They just say MJ is a child molester, everyone loses their shit.

Because EVERYONE believes the media and their sick lies...
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

^ This thread is not for stupid nonsense and conspiracy theories like that, but for a serious discussion of the allegations, so please keep that out of here. Thanks.
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

Anybody who calls Michael a "sicko", they're the real sickos and it makes me sick and wishing the should just to shut them the f#%^ up.

The media, tabloids and bull$#!^ lies just makes me sick and very angry at the very least. Makes me wanna punch those b@$^@#%$ right their fricking faces and I swear on it.
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

the media tosses words around just to give Michael a 'sick' portrayal.. "Weird" "strange" "bizarre" "eerie" "odd" ... people real 1000 captions with his name, it seeps in for sure!!
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

Anybody who calls Michael a "sicko", they're the real sickos and it makes me sick and wishing the should just to shut them the f#%^ up.

The media, tabloids and bull$#!^ lies just makes me sick and very angry at the very least. Makes me wanna punch those b@$^@#%$ right their fricking faces and I swear on it.

On top of it the double standard is just mindblowing.

Look what pictures are in this exhibition.
The very same ones the redneck sheriff in his primitive biased report called "sexualized children"
and Radar Online and the rest of sickos in the media used so effectively to "prove" MJ was sicko.

Simen Johan's Room to play photos in the Yossi Milo Gallery.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=co7_mHsBj0I&t=92s

I wonder how many people in that room would agree the photos prove
MJ was a boy molesting pedophile.
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

Looking at the ppls in the video i would say none would agree. The pictures are on display for the public to see. Radar, Wade and his lawyers are using these pictures to prove to the world that Michael Jackson has molesting young boy how sick can you be anything to get money. The truth will be reveal and this will all be over soon.
 
#MJforever57;4177001 said:
Looking at the ppls in the video i would say none would agree. The pictures are on display for the public to see. Radar, Wade and his lawyers are using these pictures to prove to the world that Michael Jackson has molesting young boy how sick can you be anything to get money. .

The part of the police report which talks about Room to play is such a dead giveaway that the SBSD was
hellbent on ruining MJ no matter what and desperate to create evidence out of no evidence.

room.jpg


It's not only that they neglected to mention that this was an art photography book which didn't have a single
picture of a nude boy let alone a frontal boy nude in it, the very thing they accused MJ of being attracted to,
they deliberately used the word children instead of GIRLS knowing full well if they told the truth about those pictures
it would contradict their entire narrative. There is no exposed male genitalia in this book at all.
Only female. How a picture like this would be used by a boy molester Sneddon didn't bother to explain
in fact even Sneddon realized that Room to play cannot be effectively used to support his attacks on MJ
because other than introducing them into evidence he didn't say a word about it.

479c8145222aa979f13b093937008df4.png


It's interesting how Simen Johan talked about children and animals.

Johan:

When did you start photographing animals and why?

Around 2005. Animals, like children, exist within a primal realm that I’m interested in. They’re guided by intuition more than intention and are closer to pure being. The subject matter I use is not as important to me as are the connections and tensions I create within each composition.

http://everythingaboutdesign.com/interview-with-simen-johan/

MJ:

Well, there's a certain sense that animals and children have that gives me a certain creative juice, a certain force that later on in adulthood is kind of lost because of the conditioning that happens in the world. ...It's that same kind of innocence, that same level of consciousness, that you create from. And kids have it. I feel it right away from animals and children and nature.

http://www.thesilencedtruth.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=175&Itemid=73

“I find in animals the same thing I find so wonderful in children. That purity, that honesty, where they don’t judge you, they just want to be your friend. I think that is so sweet.“
http://michaeljacksonmagic.tumblr.com/post/120355378291/myinspirationmj-via-uk-loves-mj-many


I wonder whether the dirty minded ordinaries would understand Johan and his interest in children and animals.
They clearly don't understand MJ.
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

Do you really think Wade and his lawyers were going to mention where they got these pictures from No
 
#MJforever57;4177421 said:
Do you really think Wade and his lawyers were going to mention where they got these pictures from No

Well, he certainly didn't tell exactly what books and tapes MJ supposedly showed him
just that in 1990 1991 MJ showed him porn books, magazines and videos.

books.jpg


1. Why would someone need porn magazines AND porn books AND porn videos to groom boys? Wouldn't
one type of such material suffice? Robson is trying very hard to explain why MJ had adult books, magazines
and DVDs (because the real reason why he had them would discredit him big time)
What an improvement. Zonen didn't even bother to comment on MJ's DVDs or the books with naked
women. He only focused on his magazines. Which boy was groomed with Double dicking Caroline
and Pimps up hoes down? Still a mystery.

2. The raids in 1993 and 2003 didn't find any porn videotapes. If MJ had porn videos in 1990 1991
where were they during the 1993 raid? I'm sure we would have heard about them if they had found any.

3. If MJ already had adult magazines in 1990 where were they during the raid? With him on tour?
If so how does Robson explain that MJ took adult magazines with him on a tour where he was all alone?
Did he want to groom himself? Oh well, I'm sure he did but that totally undermines this whole idea
that MJ bought adult magazines because he wanted to "educate" boys instead of what straight
guys use these type of magazines for.

4. Robson doesn't name any book but in a deposition and in court he would be asked. I wonder
what he would come up with. In 2005 Zonen showed him a gay sex book which was published
before 1990 but no doubt got onto the ranch long after that, it was found in a cardboard box
which had tons of other books among them those published long after 1997, like Room to play
which was published in Feb 2003.
The other adult erotic books they found in 2003 were

Scenes D'Interieur by Alexandra Dupouy, which was published in 2000
The Art of Dave Nestler: Wicked Intentions published in 2002
Gynoids: Genetically Manipulated by Hajime Sorayama published in 2001
Naked as a Jaybird by Dian Hanson published in 2003

None existed in 1990 1991.
So what porn books is Robson talking about? Wouldn't you like to watch him
as he struggles to answer that question? I sure would.


More nonsense regarding Charlie Michaels' story.
Michaels said he saw MJ grab Wade's crotch in the dance studio:

15 Q. Were there periods of time when you were at Neverland and working with Mr. Jackson on dance
17 routines?
18 A. No. I mean, we would mess around and dance
19 a little bit in the studio every now and then, yes.
20 Q. Was there ever an occasion where you were on the dance floor with Mr. Jackson and he was showing you a routine and he grabbed your crotch in a manner similar to how he would grab his own crotch while doing those performances?
25 A. No, that’s not true.
26 Q. You have no recollection of that?
27 A. No.
28 Q. That didn’t happen? 9112
1 A. No.

At the same time Michaels said that Joy Robson was not allowed to see Wade while he was with MJ in the dance studio.

dance.jpg


So MJ made sure Joy Robson would not see him molesting Wade in he dance studio but he didn't care
if Charli Michaels saw him do that. How did Charli Michaels end up in the studio at all? Why did she walk in there
in the first place? What business did she have there? Never explained it.

Robson once again failed to match his lies to an employee's lie: there's no mention of the crotch grabbing incident
at all in his complaint.

And then there's this little contradiction:

room.jpg



15 Q. Okay. Now, during the six-month period, I
16 want to just concentrate on the period that we’re
17 talking about, the May visit, you also visited the
18 ranch on occasion, did you not?
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. And when you visited the ranch on those
21 occasions, you slept in the guest cottage, correct?
22 A. No, I slept in the house.
23 Q. And where in the house?
24 A. In the rose bedroom. In the rose bedroom.
25 Q. Okay. And your son slept with Mr. Jackson?
26 A. Yes
.
 
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Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

Like i have said before this is all to force the Estate into a settlement. Wade has no case so his lawyers are makeup stories hoping the media will pick it up so far just the TB ppls don't have time for this nonsense. Michael Jackson is not here to defend himself these cases need to be throw out and it could happen in summary judgement.
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

yeah there is nothing like straight porn and teenager to get a kid fee comfortable to do sexual things with an adult man ... That makes so much sense! (sarcasm)

At the very least youd think they'd make up a story or Michael showing them young boys being 'loved' by a man to groom... But wait non of that was In Neverland..





How people buy into It is beyond me.
 
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Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

That what i do not understand how can you believe a lie and not the truth.
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

That what i do not understand how can you believe a lie and not the truth.
I agree. You see what is going on now with our election and FAKE NEWS stuff are seeing now even now with someone goin by fake news reports about Clinton in a child sex ring which is a fake story but a nut job drove from NC to DC and shot in a pizza place. It is getting pathetic. See, when you go along with lies, it will soon come back on your front door. This story made me think about what we have been talkin about when it comes to MJ and what Radar online did to MJ this year.
 
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Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

I agree. You see what is going on now with our election and FAKE NEWS stuff are seeing now even now with someone goin by fake news reports about Clinton in a child sex ring which is a fake story but nut drove from NC to DC and shot in a pizza place. It is getting pathetic. See, when you go along with lies, it will soon come back on your front door. This story made me think about what we have been talkin about when it comes to MJ and what Radar online did to MJ this year.


You are right. Michael said it If you tell a lie long enough you stared to believe. Wade and his lawyers have believe every lie they have told and what the media to believe it. Lying come easy to Wade when money is at stake.
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

Just everything from the 'grooming' tactics of these stories.. with Arvizos how that even made it to trial after they changed the dates of the supposed molestation when the first dates showed that Michael was in Florida.. The 'captive' story while Janet Arvizo gets her nails done, the security footage of the kids breaking into the wine cellar, saying they never knew what day/time it was when there are more clocks on that property than probably Disneyland.. The huge clock on the hill?!?

To me its beyond obvious when these BS stories take place... And the media acts like they had no negative effects on public perception when they mentioned positive news mentioning's in passing while any perceptive negative would have it's highlight special on TV
 
Re: [Discussion] Sexual abuse claims against MJ Estate (Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe)

Just everything from the 'grooming' tactics of these stories.. with Arvizos how that even made it to trial after they changed the dates of the supposed molestation when the first dates showed that Michael was in Florida.. The 'captive' story while Janet Arvizo gets her nails done, the security footage of the kids breaking into the wine cellar, saying they never knew what day/time it was when there are more clocks on that property than probably Disneyland.. The huge clock on the hill?!?

To me its beyond obvious when these BS stories take place... And the media acts like they had no negative effects on public perception when they mentioned positive news mentioning's in passing while any perceptive negative would have it's highlight special on TV

Yuuup the media does love to pick and choose their targets......like Malcom X once said they can make the innocent look guilty, and the guilty look innocent.
 
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