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I Am a Fan, But... (What Makes You Heretic Among Other Fans?)

Annita said:
I am not sure about some people you have listed. I think he was friends with the Cascio-family since the mid 80`s until his death. So in this timeline you would declare them as really good and loyal friends and you would not assume what happens after his death, not speaking of the Wade Robson-family and what they did. Not sure what is wrong with Sigfried an Roy. Michael was a fan of their show since the 80`s and there also pictures with him in the Bad-era.
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I really only declared the Casios thinking of what they did, the controversy surrounding them. It's not really a hypothetical thing. You did say the mid 80s so it was post Thriller... Idk, just something he didn't ultimately gain so much from. That was when he started working with Frank Dileo and the fake tabloid stories started happening so things were already changing. I didn't agree with all of that but that's a lot to unpack.

Sigfried and Roy as people, I'm not really commenting on them. It's just the aesthetic, idk. I say them really because he seemed to end up with worse and worse variations of them.
 
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1. Speechless and The Lost Children are the highlights of Invincible. The album should have focused on songs written exclusively by Michael.

2. Forever, Michael (1975) and Goin' Places (1977) are criminally underrated albums.

3. If Hollywood Tonight were completed it would be infinitely better than You Rock My World.

4. Dirty Diana, Black Or White, Give in to Me and Morphine > Beat It

5. Love Never Felt So Good and Best Of Joy are on the same level as the songs Michael released in his lifetime.
 
83magic said:
I enjoy a lot of the remixes - particularly the house/dance ones💜
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I say that most remixes are very enjoyable, if not outright good.

It's not a sin to listen to them and MJ accepted them. Meanwhile, think of it like this; house and dance music already exists, and will continue to exist anyway. Adding an MJ tint or flavor is not sacrilegious. It can and does Co exist.

The Speed Demon remix by Nero was pretty great in particular. It's like a 2010 version of the song, shows how enduring the melody is and how it could easily have been made in today's century.
 
AlexBoing_BestOfJoy said:
1. Speechless and The Lost Children are the highlights of Invincible. The album should have focused on songs written exclusively by Michael.

2. Forever, Michael (1975) and Goin' Places (1977) are criminally underrated albums.

3. If Hollywood Tonight were completed it would be infinitely better than You Rock My World.

4. Dirty Diana, Black Or White, Give in to Me and Morphine > Beat It

5. Love Never Felt So Good and Best Of Joy are on the same level as the songs Michael released in his lifetime.
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I'll give you Give In To Me and Morphine. But Beat It is still such a powerful riff.
 
Mister_Jay_Tee said:
I say that most remixes are very enjoyable, if not outright good.

It's not a sin to listen to them and MJ accepted them. Meanwhile, think of it like this; house and dance music already exists, and will continue to exist anyway. Adding an MJ tint or flavor is not sacrilegious. It can and does Co exist.

The Speed Demon remix by Nero was pretty great in particular. It's like a 2010 version of the song, shows how enduring the melody is and how it could easily have been made in today's century.
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dance is my favourite genre (house, garage, disco, edm, etc..) aside from pop & some r&b. it’s not just the remixes commissioned by Michael that I enjoy, it’s also ones that were sampled and made hits by other artists. it’s an alternative way to enjoy the classics, and it can add another layer to them.
 
zinniabooklover said:
Apart from BOTDF and Invincible I don't like the covers of any of Michael's albums. Thriller is my least favourite album cover.
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Agonum said:
Dangerous?
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@Agonum

I don't love the cover of Dangerous but I think it lent itself very well to the exhibition back in 2018 in London. I didn't go to the exhibition but I do love this picture of the room they created based on the album cover. The content and design of the cover is quite baroque*, imo. That's partly why I don't like it but it's also why it fits in so well at the National Portrait Gallery. Especially bc Mark Ryden created the album cover as a proper painting, it wasn't computer generated.

* or do I mean 'rococo'? Art history is not my superpower, lol. Baroque? Rococo? It's one of the two! :ROFLMAO:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1648355719224123394
 
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zinniabooklover said:
@Agonum

I don't love the cover of Dangerous but I think it lent itself very well to the exhibition back in 2018 in London. I didn't go to the exhibition but I do love this picture of the room they created based on the album cover. The content and design of the cover is quite baroque*, imo. That's partly why I don't like it but it's also why it fits in so well at the National Portrait Gallery. Especially bc Mark Ryden created the album cover as a proper painting, it wasn't computer generated.

* or do I mean 'rococo'? Art history is not my superpower, lol. Baroque? Rococo? It's one of the two! :ROFLMAO:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1648355719224123394
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Oh, it’s so iconic. Love it in that format, too! Makes you appreciate all the details.

It’s not always easy to separate baroque and rococo – they’re siblings, after all! I would say baroque in this case, but I may very well be wrong (we don’t talk about rococo in music).
 
Agonum said:
Oh, it’s so iconic. Love it in that format, too!
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It was a really clever idea. The photos of the room look amazing.

Agonum said:
It’s not always easy to separate baroque and rococo – they’re siblings, after all!
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This is my problem, lol.

Agonum said:
I would say baroque in this case,
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I definitely lean towards baroque for the cover.

Agonum said:
but I may very well be wrong (we don’t talk about rococo in music).
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oh sure, but I'm talking specifically about the cover artwork so it is relevant. Looking at the furnishings in Michael's house I'd say he likes the baroque style quite a lot.
 
zinniabooklover said:
oh sure, but I'm talking specifically about the cover artwork so it is relevant. Looking at the furnishings in Michael's house I'd say he likes the baroque style quite a lot.
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Yes, I believe so, too. In regards to architecture. Musically, and based mainly upon the selection of music he chose as intro to some songs (Will You Be There, Little Susie), he’s leaning toward romance.
 
Lacra said:
Bal à Versailles enters the chat again.

Guys, everything makes sense now.

We just should call the whole era "BAV" And Michael's taste in furniture too. BAV! It's all BAV!
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omg, you are so right!

Michael really seemed to love baroque, he was fascinated by European royalty and military - as in, clothing, uniforms, insignia, medals etc. His taste in furnishings also echoes European aristocratic styles - 18th century? Or a bit earlier? With fine art he definitely seemed to lean more towards the Old Masters, afaik.

You're right! It's all BAV.

Bad.

BAV :ROFLMAO:
 
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I am a fan but i hate the estate and will boycott them.
 
I think michael thrived the most during the vhs 📼 era.

I think Greg phillinganes deserves just as much credit as Quincy jones for helping to flesh out michael’s musical ideas 💡
 
83magic said:
I think michael thrived the most during the vhs 📼 era.

I think Greg phillinganes deserves just as much credit as Quincy jones for helping to flesh out michael’s musical ideas 💡
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He helped flesh them out, yeah. He basically co produced some.
 
I resent the "90s were the best" fans. Especially when they only say it was just a handful of them were that the best. And most of them originated from the 80s....

Bad was his best and it was a comprehensive time. Everything went right for MJ. And Thriller was just a stomp the whole way through.
 
I think sometimes people allways have the US-sight. Im my impression Michael was in the 90 in Europe probably bigger then in the 80s- History was huge and generated many great hits in Europe and many news fans. You can see a lot of teens in his concerts becoming his fans until today.
His reception from the audience was extraordinary.

 
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Annita said:
I think sometimes people allways have the US-sight. Im my impression Michael was in the 90 in Europe probably bigger then in the 80s- History was huge and generated many great hits in Europe and many news fans. You can see a lot of teens in his concerts becoming his fans until today.
His reception from the audience was extraordinary.
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I'm neutral on whether Michael was bigger in the 80's vs. the 90's but posting this bc, omg, it never stops being awesome.

@andjustice4some
"[...] before social media, before cell phones, before YouTube and before cable television was in every home, Michael Jackson's Black or White video premiered in 27 countries with 500 MILLION people watching. A HALF A BILLION viewers in 1991 [...]"
 
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zinniabooklover said:
I'm neutral on whether Michael was bigger in the 80's vs. the 90's but posting this bc, omg, it never stops being awesome.

@andjustice4some
"[...] before social media, before cell phones, before YouTube and before cable television was in every home, Michael Jackson's Black or White video premiered in 27 countries with 500 MILLION people watching. A HALF A BILLION viewers in 1991 [...]"
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Yes I suddenly remember waiting for it to premiere on tv with my family!! Maybe I even taped it, I taped a lot of MJ stuff from tv on VHS. Might check next time at my parents house
 
I would rather MJ have sang about what he did than if he sang about love making, romance, and the stuff generic R&B always does. When MJ made love songs, they were too catchy for me to ever "make love" to. Hearing MJ sing about his "stroke game" or whatever would've been far more awkward to me than The Lost Children or anything like that. I saw MJ pretty much as behind those basic human things lol.
 
I love every second of MJs singing voice, and yet I find it the least "important" thing we lost. His composition skills, Songwriting, general knowledge and focus, and of course, his dancing and even his directorial vision, were all one of a kind and have been completely irreplaceable. We have "demoes", not all of them complete but still, every little bit founte, and can still hear MJ in new ways, but we'll never see or "experience" him again.
 
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