L.A. Police Chief: Homicide or Accidental Overdose

I think that Mark Geragos was correct about people wanting their 15 minutes of fame and everyone wanting now to take credit for trying to save Michael Jackson. At this point, many are of low credibility. But, as far as these concerts:

1. I think that Michael did want to do the concerts. Remember that the initial contract was for 10; he would have had to accept the other 40; why would he not have been able to say he would only do 20 or 30? No one has yet to produce a contract that obligated him to do whatever number was set by AEG. Also, remember that AEG was itching for a world tour commitment that Michael had yet to officially give commitment to. If AEG was calling all the shots we would probably have been heard about the world tour.

2. Others with no connection in terms of finance or career have spoken about Michael's excitement about the upcoming tours. These included Mark Lester, Lionel Richie, and Lou Ferrigno (sp?). Would they have been "paid" off to make such comments? Why would Michael have shown excitement to them if he wasn't actually excited?

3. Remember Michael's disposition and attitude with Sony during the Invincible release? Remember Michael's fight for the auction to be called off? No matter how much the media attempts to say it, when Michael feels pushed or slighted or wronged, he fights back. Has any of those saying that he was unhappy about the shows offered proof of his fighting against so many?

4. If Rowe was trying to reduce the number of shows per week, what exactly was he going to reduce them to? How many shows was he doing per week? As someone said, if he couldn't do 2 to 3, then he probably couldn't do one. And is there any record of Rowe being at any of the rehearsals to actually witness his not being ready or unable to perform?

5. By nature Michael goes all out for his concerts or any projects. Based on what we have heard, he was involved in everything. I don't think this was by force, but by choice. That is simply Michael Jackson who by all accounts puts more pressure on himself than anyone else ever does. Does that mean he wasn't too stretched? No. But, again, we would have had to actually be there to know what he refused to give up or allow others to do or not to do. Does it mean that he would not have admitted to others that he was to stretched for the undertaking. We don't know.

6. Has anyone stated that they went to AEG representatives and said that they were trying to put together a major concert project with a man with a serious addiction problem?

7. If Michael could convince them to hire Murray for his personal physician based on the fact that he was the foundation of any of this hugely profitable undertaking, then he could convince them to organize the dates however he wanted. Now, there are a lot of questions concerning Murray and how he ended up so close to Michael. But, right now we can only go by what has been known. And so far, no credible source has said that they never saw Murray until the day Michael died. But, we also don't have all the info. that the police has. If there is any shadiness around him, he will be ready to save himself and tell of any other important connections.

8. What may have to be accepted is that Michael shared some things with some people and other things with other people and others things he just kept to himself. I say this because some say they were aware of a sleeping problem while others weren't; some were aware of his taking all these medications, while others weren't; some were aware of this and others weren't. Too many contradictions by people who all claimed to have been close to him. And if even some of the siblings were planning an intervention, wouldn't the others have at least known about it? And how many attempts at interventions and how frequent?

9. And how would Michael benefit AEG more in death than in life? With the exception of rehearsal footage and maybe some merchandising stuff, where would the profits come in comparison to the concert dates and possible world tour?

10. As for all these interventions, I would rather withhold judgment for now until I hear from Janet or his mother. They are always at the center of these intervention stories and I would love to hear the truth from their mouths, if they ever choose to address such.

I just hate to see the concerts taken away from Michael after all the work that he put into them and the pride that he apparently had in that work. That did show in the little video footage that we have of him. He was there engaged instead of barely showing up as had been rumored. He was making plans for upcoming projects. This show was coming together because of his efforts and creativity. At this point, while they try so hard to take everything else away from him, I'm not ready to say this should also be taken away--not without hard proof that his heart and soul was not in it. Otherwise it needs to stay a part of his legacy that he was still the creative genius that so many tried to deny.
 
The reason why the LAPD came out like that was to scare people in MJ's camp - so they (staff, aides, etc) could start talking and ratting others out. It's a scare tactic. Also, I do believe LAPD is close to an arrest. They are building a concrete case against a couple of doctors and the medical records will prove it. For every ailment MJ had, more than likely, a prescription was legitimately made. Anything pills outside of those prescribed medications for the proven ailments are illegal. So they have to reconstruct Michael's medical history to see what was legally prescribed and what wasn't.

And now I hear Dr. Kline and Dr. Murry aren't fully cooperating with the police with regard to Michael's medical records. Very interesting....

Trish,

I normally really value your posts. I definately valued your comment here. You make a lot of sense. You may also have some info I don't have. I am not writing so much in response to this post as the thread you closed. There was every conspiracy theory imaginable in there and some, not necessarily yours, were truly off the wall. You might be right. It is a nasty business and as you said, someone is lying. When I read that fans said Michael told them he wanted to not do all the shows in one place I figured it was possible either they never heard that or that he said it because he didn't want to hurt their feelings.... like you would find a way to not say you hate someones dress. I hope it is not an AEG conspiracy. I did not take what Barack said as a threat so much as fact; It would be next to impossible for Michael to recover. Noone had to wish him ill for that to be true. To point our fingers at AEG at this point when the opposite might be true, that that really took a chance on Michael with the best intent, I think is wrong. That is the real reason I don't want to start listing theories until I know more. Why harm someone with inuendo before we have facts. It is the unkind word that ripples outward never to retreive the harm it causes that bothers me. That is what people did to Michael. And btw Grace may have been recorded talking about Michael but did she know she was recorded? It seems like she was very trusting just like Michael. I admit I did not listen to the tape and only read Deepak's explaination on that.

At some point maybe we do need to go beyond what we are told but I think it is too early. I do believe Michael was a good person but I also believe he could be strong and stubborn. I see him as both tiger and lamb as we all are. Above all, whatever happened, it was tragic.

I know what I think but will also say I don't know and I won't post any speculation. I want justice, hope we get it, realize it is possible we won't.
 
When I read that fans said Michael told them he wanted to not do all the shows in one place I figured it was possible either they never heard that or that he said it because he didn't want to hurt their feelings.... like you would find a way to not say you hate someones dress.

Soooo weird you should say this. I thought they did hear it but that he said it because he didn't want them to feel bad and feel like he didn't want to do shows in other places. It really depends on what was said to Michael before he actually said all that. I never said anything at the time, because if he was trying to not make them feel bad - I like didn't want to "undo" it, you know? And everything seemed to be going so well. So many reports from so many people about Michael performing great, being excited. I just don't know. But I am glad I'm not the only one this occurred to.
 
While the media is going in overdrive about the medicines, one of the people on one of the shows tonight, either Larry King or Campbell Brown I believe, said something interesting when everyone was making a big deal about the number of pills that this bodyguard from the trial stated in a statement to police. One of the guests stated that 10 Xanax pills may not have been an abundant amount depending on the milligrams of the prescribed medicine, for example only 1/2 to 1 milligrams wouldn't be very much if 10 are taken. If you look back at TMZ's photos of medicine bottles, the one that I could make out was only 2 milligrams. Of course the others did not show the milligram amount. Also, the other "evidence" included a letter about detoxing off a medication. So it doesn't sound like Michael was necessarily overdosing on pills just because he may have taken a high quantity if the milligrams were so low. I guess it would depend on what the others were. Also, he seemed aware or wanting to get off certain medication.

Something is just so off about the whole drug addict storyline.
 
the medical stuff is so complicate... not one report I've read yet could convince me really the way it was written or even only said.

With xanax I know it's not only the dose (number of pills/to the mg)... it's also how long you've taken which dose etc.
One will most likely (most ppl do, but still not everybody) develope a tolerance with xanax. In (most) ppl a certain dose needs to be higher with time if you want to get the same effect often (not always).
and yes the likelihood is pretty high you will get addicted to xanax... many ppl do (not all) show some craving symptoms etc.
some do get down with a dose for a while till stress/anxiousty is rising again...
It's also possible not to take it regularly etc. etc. etc.
countless possibilities...

ok I'll better stop... I feel my english is not well enough to explain these complicate things
 
the medical stuff is so complicate... not one report I've read yet could convince me really the way it was written or even only said.

With xanax I know it's not only the dose (number of pills/to the mg)... it's also how long you've taken which dose etc.
One will most likely (most ppl do, but still not everybody) develope a tolerance with xanax. In (most) ppl a certain dose needs to be higher with time if you want to get the same effect often (not always).
and yes the likelihood is pretty high you will get addicted to xanax... many ppl do (not all) show some craving symptoms etc.
some do get down with a dose for a while till stress/anxiousty is rising again...
It's also possible not to take it regularly etc. etc. etc.
countless possibilities...

ok I'll better stop... I feel my english is not well enough to explain these complicate things

I know what you mean. It depends on what exactly it's for. The dose can start at .25 mg and then be titrated up to what is most effective. It can go as high as 10 mg a day but usually 5 or 6 mg. Titrated up or down for different needs and times. There are a lot of variations with that particular drug. And lots of reports we keep hearing aren't accurate about that. And then, if it's not working well anymore, the drug could be changed to something else. So it would make sense to have bottles of different drugs of the same sort - not all taken at the same time, just taking what is currently effective.
 
I know what you mean. It depends on what exactly it's for. The dose can start at .25 mg and then be titrated up to what is most effective. It can go as high as 10 mg a day but usually 5 or 6 mg. Titrated up or down for different needs and times. There are a lot of variations with that particular drug. And lots of reports we keep hearing aren't accurate about that.

yes very true. thank you.
 
Soooo weird you should say this. I thought they did hear it but that he said it because he didn't want them to feel bad and feel like he didn't want to do shows in other places. It really depends on what was said to Michael before he actually said all that. I never said anything at the time, because if he was trying to not make them feel bad - I like didn't want to "undo" it, you know? And everything seemed to be going so well. So many reports from so many people about Michael performing great, being excited. I just don't know. But I am glad I'm not the only one this occurred to.

I think the whole story was from the Sun anyway so who knows what they twisted or made up.
 
personally I didn't think that any of the meds that were posted in the photos of the Neverland raid on TMZ were all that full on in terms of medication. and it wasn't like they posted zillions of bottles of them (and believe me if there were zillions of them they would have posted them). i feel the drug story is being over pushed. also it REALLY bugs me how all this confidential evidence etc is being leaked
 
Chrystal if you really mean what you're saying here... you should edit the post and just delete it. Please see this way you're leading weak fans directly there.
 
Err no, it says dont look at it should someone be a regular reader of said paper. Why would anyone look at it if they know its gonna upset them?

Anyway, its not a real photo .. its one made up by computer graphics.
 
Err no, it says dont look at it should someone be a regular reader of said paper. Why would anyone look at it if they know its gonna upset them?

Anyway, its not a real photo .. its one made up by computer graphics.
because ppl do look cuz they wanna know what is upsetting you and wanna try if it's upsetting them... the more disgusting... the more clicks! Without your post they wouldn't even get the idea of looking for that tabloid stuff?!
Why even posting it in this thread? does it have anything to do with the investigation of the LAPD at all? Is it really news?
lol one could get the idea you're working for that paper.
 
Perhaps people should be more concerned about who would have something to lose if Michael did pull off these concerts?
 
because ppl do look cuz they wanna know what is upsetting you and wanna try if it's upsetting them... the more disgusting... the more clicks! Without your post they wouldn't even get the idea of looking for that tabloid stuff?!
Why even posting it in this thread? does it have anything to do with the investigation of the LAPD at all? Is it really news?
lol one could get the idea you're working for that paper.

fS.

I dont work for the paper - i work for the law .
 
sorry I'm not familiar with the fS if that's meant for me.

Not sure you'll answer my other questions if this has something to do with the LAPD investigation at all? But I can tell I've asked a mod to come in here and look for our posts... I'd just like a second opinion.
So either our conversation will be out of here soon I guess... or I'll step back and just let things be.
But to me you're driving attention on to a tabloid here. And because stupid me is helping you this way only... I'll better stop here and let the moderators decide.
Nevermind!
 
hat is also something that I question - Like why would LAPD go out to media and be like "Yo we believe this is either homicide or accidental overdose" if they haven't got anything back from the lab?
cause its gonna be one or the other. either mj took somethig he was prescribed but took to much or mixed and it was an accident or someone gave him something they shouldnt.which is homicide in which ever form. negligence manslughter,murder
 
i keep hearing about ppl saying mj only wanted to do 10 shows. respected fans in L.A who met/follow mj posted that mj told them the exact same thing in the last couple of months or so ontop of not being able to eat. the threads were shut down cause no one wanted to believe it.
 
i keep hearing about ppl saying mj only wanted to do 10 shows. respected fans in L.A who met/follow mj posted that mj told them the exact same thing in the last couple of months or so ontop of not being able to eat. the threads were shut down cause no one wanted to believe it.

I was wondering if someone here had heard something from someone they trusted. Thank you.
 
Last edited:
i keep hearing about ppl saying mj only wanted to do 10 shows. respected fans in L.A who met/follow mj posted that mj told them the exact same thing in the last couple of months or so ontop of not being able to eat. the threads were shut down cause no one wanted to believe it.

Then why have committed to doing more? Or spread the concerts out more? Everyone keeps saying that about these concerts but no one answers that one. He didn't have to agree to adding more concerts.

He didn't have to be as involved in putting together these concerts as he had been. He didn't have to be working on two albums--one pop and one classical. He didn't have to be meeting about other upcoming productions or deals. Why wouldn't he have told this to Ferrigno, Lester, or Richie if he was going to complain about it to fans?

Not saying that fans didn't hear it but could things have been misinterpreted, kind of like TMZ went around saying that Michael answered yes about doing the AllGood shows when he probably misheard the question since he was making it clear he wasn't doing the shows.

I will say again, there are also people who would have lost out on profits, credibility, and more if these shows had gone forward. People lied about how he was working to get these shows going. Why was it necessary to do that when there were plenty to see his hard work going into it? For what purpose? And if they knew he was really going to rehearsals why keep insisting that the shows weren't going to happen? Why is no one concerned about that? Do you guys think that Ortega was stringing people along about what he observed and discussed with MJ concerning the shows?
 
OMG, Trish you said this. And you know what I was thinking? What if this stuff was given to him while he was already asleep? I mean some are saying that he collapsed, but Michael didn't collapse. He was FOUND in the bed. So something happened to him between the time he went to bed and the time he was found.

Well maybe he was given the drug overdose by his doctor, the doctor went out, 30 mins later Michael had a rest, his muscles collapsed, his doctor came home in 10 mins and saw him there.

:cry:
 
People always wanted more and more and more from him...I believe he did want to do these concerts but I don't think he wanted to do as many as 50, one every 2 days...but fans were like "it's better for him to do a milion concerts in one arena than one big stadium concert" better for MJ or better for them? I don't understand how fans didn't worry. and on top of that they were jumping up and down about the delayed concerts and they were blaming it on MJ adding more to his stress, god knows he always did everything he could to please his fans
anyway back on topic - I think it was manslaughter, the doctor killed our beloved michael...stop blaming Michael, at least now in death stop blaming him!
 
the info was posted on the this board and others by fans who are well know and respected. i never saw the original thread cause it got taken down but read copies of what was said. itwas based off the sun artice where mj said he didnt want to do 5o and couldnt eat and wanted to do shows in other countries not just 50 in once place. the fans said mj didnt say anything about taking the hsows to other countries but he did say the rest
 
Then why have committed to doing more? Or spread the concerts out more? Ev
no idea im only talking about what he suposedly told fans. yes i find it hard to think AEG would anounce 50 shows without even telling mj and then really leaving him with no choice but to go on with it. there were also the stories of mj agreeing to 30 and xtras been added on that he didnt agree with. but these fans are respected so im not inclined to believe they would make it up either. i doubt we will ever know.
 
I don't see why fans will make anything up. For what?

But then it leaves you to the question, who decided the 50 dates?

I read somewhere, don't know if this is accurate, that he would be ok to do one or two concerts a week, not three.

It's all speculation, and who said what to whom will be hard to find out at this point, if ever.
 
tbh when u looked at how the concerts were spread out especially after the change it wasnt to bad there wernt to many times where u had loads of shows right after each other for example in one month u only had 10 shows hap. yes when its all added up its pretty crazy but not much difference to a normal tour where u have travelling ontop
 
I've said this before, but will add it again now. Follow the money, when life-insurance policies are cashed in. How much, and who gets the money?

It is POSSIBLE that AEG thought Michael would not be able to do the concerts, for whatever reasons. And so, they took out a massive life-insurance policy on him. Did anyone else do that? Who? We don't know, but that must be documented somewhere. Sure, AEG stood to make a huge amount of money if he completed the concerts. And if he couldn't? Did they think he couldn't? Hence, huge life-insurance policy. But then he was rehearsing and the show looked great. But maybe they still didn't think he'd be able to do more than a few shows, because he was underweight, or for whatever other health reasons? We just don't know yet, what kind of condition he really was in, so -- what if they never expected that he could do it? How could they still cash in? I'm not coming to a conclusion here, just speculating.

Follow the money. . . . .
 
^^^
that idea has already crossed my mind...

there are too many speculations here...why do we even need to be discussing this. Elvis dies, overdose, in the news, move on. John Lennon dies, murder, in the news, move on.....but of course when MICHAEL dies it HAS to be a mystery....typical, Mike...always making people wonder :p..... :( .... whatever the cause of death is though, i really hope it clears Mike's name.
 
Back
Top