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L.A. Police Chief: Homicide or Accidental Overdose

AllTheLovelyFlowers said:
I'm getting to the point where I don't want to hear anything else from the media until the toxicology reports are ready.
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That is also something that I question - Like why would LAPD go out to media and be like "Yo we believe this is either homicide or accidental overdose" if they haven't got anything back from the lab?
 
Victoria83 said:
At this point, I believe NOTHING I hear on CNN. You do realize that "the source" for a lot of this is Ian Halperin, right? I will not believe about the drugs unless/until a toxicology report is made public. Remember the vast amount of tabloid-type misinformation during the trial? This is more of that same garbage. Just because it's in print or on the air, does not make it factual.

If this was a "crime scene," then the LAPD took down the caution-tape too soon and allowed access to a lot of people. Anything found after the tape went down, could have been planted.

Follow the MONEY. To whom was Michael more valuable dead than alive? Who had insurance policies on him, and for how much? WHO will cash-in? Follow the money in the coming days/weeks. Therein will be the answer, I think. . . . . . .
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EXACTLY!.......so I'm not listening to no talking heads who don't know shit but just speculating their asses off!
 
The reason why the LAPD came out like that was to scare people in MJ's camp - so they (staff, aides, etc) could start talking and ratting others out. It's a scare tactic. Also, I do believe LAPD is close to an arrest. They are building a concrete case against a couple of doctors and the medical records will prove it. For every ailment MJ had, more than likely, a prescription was legitimately made. Anything pills outside of those prescribed medications for the proven ailments are illegal. So they have to reconstruct Michael's medical history to see what was legally prescribed and what wasn't.

And now I hear Dr. Kline and Dr. Murry aren't fully cooperating with the police with regard to Michael's medical records. Very interesting....
 
i was told diprovan only takes ten minutes to leave ur system. could explain the lame ass conflicting reports of calling 911 three minutes after he 'fell' or thirty minutes after he was 'found'
 
Somebody, please tell me this is all just some cruel nightmare that we can't seem to awake from!:timer::(

Months ago rumours began appearing about Michael's health, most notably from Ian Halperin, the cancer rumours, the transplant stories...predictions about his impending death etc. Fast forward a few months and he is indeed dead. Something is not right here! How did we all go from being elated about the O2 shows to now being in a state of mourning for Michael? This stinks to high hell!

Its all so unreal to me!
 
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Soso Deaf said:
i was told diprovan only takes ten minutes to leave ur system. could explain the lame ass conflicting reports of calling 911 three minutes after he 'fell' or thirty minutes after he was 'found'
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That was one of the things that has been weighing on my mind. No matter how I look at this it comes down to seeming like something that never should have happened and that makes it hurt even more.

And I am no legal expert and know you would have a better handle on this than me but for others on here I'm pretty sure death due to negligance can also be homicide.
 
BruceWayne said:
You've got to look at the context of it... why at least I claim that he's worth more alive is to "defend" my belief in that nobody would've like to take Michael's life for the sake of money.

Of course it would be inhuman to talk about money just for the sake of money. :)
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Depends on how you look at it. I've heard some say the idea that Michael's not here anymore to spend money and create more debt means his estate can make more profit. This also means those with whom he has deals with can make more money, too, becuz shared assets won't have debts propped up against them. The bottom line would be heftier for all? And then there's the issue that some folks simply did not want to see Michael prosper and were patiently waiting for him to self destruct if they could not destroy him with allegations and whatnot. We've seen what all has been thrown at him everytime he was ready to do something great.

After the trial, I figured there was nothing anyone could throw at him worse than that. There would be only one thing that could stop him as far as I could see. And I'll be darned if that "one thing" hasn't happened....JUST before he was about to do something great again...something a lot of the "experts" and "critics" thought was next to impossible. It's incredible how this pattern has never let up since 1993. People have kicked him down and like Al Sharpton said, he kept getting back up. And now he has mysteriously died just as he about to get up in an explosive way....defying so-called odds. Too much of a coincidence, imo. Sad part is the profiteers will continue to profit without him for the mere fact that the value of everything goes UP after a person dies. It's already being predicted that his debts could be paid off within a year or less the way things are going now.

Having said that, I agree with Chayna that it's kinda icky and disrespectful to be discussing Michael's value in death :( , so after this post, Imma try to stay away from this sort of discussion. I have grossed myself out...just wanted to offer an alternative view on the point you made, BruceWayne.

AllTheLovelyFlowers said:
I'm getting to the point where I don't want to hear anything else from the media until the toxicology reports are ready.
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I'm thinking the same thing. 2 weeks down, two to three more to go. :(
 
emmah24 said:
The nurse ( if this is true) who came forward and claimed that a call was made to her in Florida by one of Michaels people, with Michael being in the background saying please come and see me.....who was the person making the call I wonder. Murray? Frank? Tohme Tohme? Security?

There has to be people around Michael aware of his health and what he wanted in the run up to his death.
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That's my question exactly. Someone had to have been making that call. Where is this person to tell us exactly what happened? Unless of course that nurse is lying through her teeth - which is personally what I believe. Funny how she didn't reveal her story until days after his death and then approximately 2 or 3 days before they find Diprivan in his house, she comes along out of the blue, specifically naming that very drug. Then they magically find it in his house. What a coincidence :smilerolleyes:


AllTheLovelyFlowers said:
My thing is this....if Michael said he was not feeling well the night before, then why didn't someone take him to the hospital? Something could have been wrong with Michael before he went to bed that night and it probably had nothing to do with a drug overdose. This is highly plausible.
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A lot of times when people don't feel well, they just shrug it off and go to bed thinking they'll rest, and wake up fine in the morning. If he felt bad before he went to bed, he couldn't have felt THAT bad if he didn't go to the hospital. Plus, I suppose he figured since he had a doctor in the house, he could call out for him in the middle of the night if he didn't feel well or needed anything.
Then of course, it depends whether you believe the nurse's story or not. She claimed that that very Sunday, he had called her with the story that one side of his body was cold and the other hot. IF this is true, perhaps that was already the start of something failing in his body, but he ignored it, then perhaps it went away for a few days, so he felt fine enough to go on with rehearsals, and then something finally hit him on that Thursday. You never know. Of course I will only believe this if no drugs are found in his body whatsoever.
 
wendy2004 said:
JUST before he was about to do something great again...something a lot of the "experts" and "critics" thought was next to impossible. It's incredible how this pattern has never let up since 1993. People have kicked him down and like Al Sharpton said, he kept getting back up. And now he has mysteriously died just as he about to get up in an explosive way....defying so-called odds. Too much of a coincidence, imo.
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I completely agree. I find it incredibly strange that exactly a week before he was flying off to London, he dies. Something could have happened any month or week leading up to it, but the week before he's about to fly out? As if someone said "we need to get this done NOW, before he leaves the country". So strange.
 
Trish said:
The reason why the LAPD came out like that was to scare people in MJ's camp - so they (staff, aides, etc) could start talking and ratting others out. It's a scare tactic. Also, I do believe LAPD is close to an arrest. They are building a concrete case against a couple of doctors and the medical records will prove it. For every ailment MJ had, more than likely, a prescription was legitimately made. Anything pills outside of those prescribed medications for the proven ailments are illegal. So they have to reconstruct Michael's medical history to see what was legally prescribed and what wasn't.

And now I hear Dr. Kline and Dr. Murry aren't fully cooperating with the police with regard to Michael's medical records. Very interesting....
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No surprise at ALL, that Murray and Klein aren't cooperating. What's that shredding sound I hear? Medical records disappearing into the shredder? Uh huh. And then there was Murray's vanishing act the next day. He was NO WHERE. His car was towed off. That is not the behavior of an innocent person.

Michael was always intensely private about his medical history. And then there is Klein, in his hour of fame on the Larry King show, divulging about the lupus, and a lot else. He needed to keep his trap SHUT, out of respect. Tell it to the police, not the universe.

I hope there will be arrests, and soon.
 
I still dont believe he was murdered... Who on earth would have done that? Michael brought much more joy than anything else.
 
Yall, I am watching LKL right now and he has some doctors on there who are saying that they would be shocked if Diprivan was at Michael's home. They say that only anesthesiologists and hospitals are allowed to even purchase that medication. Geragos is saying when he was around Michael, he didn't see any evidence of Michael with drugs. He thinks a lot of it is speculation and thinks that the people who are out there saying this stuff are not really being truthful. He says it is a lot of speculation right now....says that the only people who know are the ones that were around him lately.

The general view of the panel is that there is too much speculation right now. Geragos is taking a shot at the websites and media reporting all this speculation and how it does a disservice. Very good show.

And in the background, they are showing Denise Williams singing at the memorial in Indiana. Jesse Jackson is there and there are a lot of other singers out there.
 
Okay, I had to LOL @ the "shredding sound" part. I think I hear it, too.

Topflux said:
I still dont believe he was murdered... Who on earth would have done that? Michael brought much more joy than anything else.
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Ohhh don't get me started. :ermm: As far as I'm concerned there's a few ppl who I could see having a motive, but Imma shut up and not go down that road right now. I'll patiently wait for the tox results and see what turns up there.
 
Man, Geragos was mounting a very strong defense of Michael on LKL tonight. He is lashing the media for putting all this speculation out there when we haven't even gotten a report yet. They are talking about where all this stuff even came from.

When you really look at it, where did this whole Diprivan thing come from anyway?

What if we find out that Michael didn't die of a drug overdose anyway? What if he died of lupus complications....which is highly possible? A lady in my church had lupus and live until she was in her 40s and finally succumbed. And I think lupus can cause complications with your lungs and breathing.
 
OMG, now Leonard Rowe is there getting HIS 15 minutes of fame!

He is on CNN talking about how Michael was not ready nor physically fit. Michael hired him to handle the financial area of the tour. Says Michael told him he only wanted to do 10 shows. Rowe says he tried to talk to Phillips about this, but Phillips denies ever talking to Rowe about this.

Rowe says that Michael was weakened by his addiction to prescription drugs. So he is on the drug bandwagon. He says he told Michael he was underweight and Michael told him he didn't have an appetite.
 
BruceWayne said:
That is also something that I question - Like why would LAPD go out to media and be like "Yo we believe this is either homicide or accidental overdose" if they haven't got anything back from the lab?
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Coroners have said they probably have almost all the toxicology reports in if not all the reports. On CNN they said they were waiting on coroborating evidence from the coroners office. The LAPD already has some information which probably includes a cause of death. They need to know which drug or drugs caused his death and who prescribed the drug.
 
AllTheLovelyFlowers said:
Man, Geragos was mounting a very strong defense of Michael on LKL tonight. He is lashing the media for putting all this speculation out there when we haven't even gotten a report yet. They are talking about where all this stuff even came from.

When you really look at it, where did this whole Diprivan thing come from anyway?

What if we find out that Michael didn't die of a drug overdose anyway? What if he died of lupus complications....which is highly possible? A lady in my church had lupus and live until she was in her 40s and finally succumbed. And I think lupus can cause complications with your lungs and breathing.
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The thing about lupus tho is that if MJ was in such a state that he would die from complications of the disease, HOW on earth did he pass a 4-5 hour medical exam months ago? Either he was healthy or having a good day and passed that exam OR another doctor looked the other way and gave him a clean bill of health for AEG's sake. There's a few things making me question that exam and AEG's request to have "accidental overdose" covered in the insurance papers. There was an article from someone at the insurance company who said she thought it was odd when AEG asked to have that put in the paperwork and she also questioned Randy Phillips openly discussing the policy on national television after Michael died. It surely made me go Hmmmmm....
 
wendy2004 said:
There was an article from someone at the insurance company who said she thought it was odd when AEG asked to have that put in the paperwork and she also questioned Randy Phillips openly discussing the policy on national television after Michael died. It surely made me go Hmmmmm....
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Yeh that makes me go hmm as well...something anit right...
 
wendy2004 said:
The thing about lupus tho is that if MJ was in such a state that he would die from complications of the disease, HOW on earth did he pass a 4-5 hour medical exam months ago? Either he was healthy or having a good day and passed that exam OR another doctor looked the other way and gave him a clean bill of health for AEG's sake. There's a few things making me question that exam and AEG's request to have "accidental overdose" covered in the insurance papers. There was an article from someone at the insurance company who said she thought it was odd when AEG asked to have that put in the paperwork and she also questioned Randy Phillips openly discussing the policy on national television after Michael died. It surely made me go Hmmmmm....
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But with lupus you can be fine and everything okay, I guess I mean like a remission. Then you can get flare ups which is when treatment is needed.
 
Lacey said:
But with lupus you can be fine and everything okay, I guess I mean like a remission. Then you can get flare ups which is when treatment is needed.
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But if he was having a flare-up at the time he died, how could he have completed that full rehearsal the night before he died? No one said he looked to be in pain or ill or anything....unless it hit him when he got home that night...hence him calling the doctor over for not feeling well. :( Could it really have been this simple? :unsure:

ahhhhhhhh!!!!!! We need some answers! All these possibilities are doing my head in.
 
My turn I guess. I don't think Murray gave Michael anything and I think that may have been the part that would keep him safe in case anything happened to Michael. But I believe he KNEW who did give the possible drug to Michael, hence when he says he didn't do it he's telling the truth.

I'm not saying they purposely murdered him (they could have) but I believe they all knew what they were messing with and in a conspirital (is this a word?) sort of way planned their 'out' in case anything happened. So basically they played russian roulette with his life. (and I hate even thinking this.) I don't think he simply died of natural causes.

There are too many questions unanswered that have already been pointed out like why did murray wait 30 minutes to have the bodyguard (supposedly only the dr was there when he found Michael) call 911? Panic. Maybe he was trying to revive Michael on his own before 911 was called - like trying to cover his butt. What time was it that he went in to check on Michael? Wasn't it around 1pm? If he's earning $100,000 to keep an eye on Michael why did he only check on him once - and when it was too late?

Someone or "someone's" know EXACTLY what happened to Michael but I doubt they're going to tell the truth.

Honestly I'm trying to find something positive to end on but I still miss him so much and have huge regrets that I never saw him live. I watched the live concert from Bucharest today and was thrilled for almost 2 hours. So, I'm grateful that we have the ability to pop in a DVD or CD and bring him into our homes.
 
resonnant said:
My turn I guess. I don't think Murray gave Michael anything and I think that may have been the part that would keep him safe in case anything happened to Michael. But I believe he KNEW who did give the possible drug to Michael, hence when he says he didn't do it he's telling the truth.
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But he DIDN'T say he didn't do it. He said he did not INJECT any drugs. IV is not injection it's infusion. He said he didn't give anything that should have caused it. He did not say he didn't give him something that did cause it, only that what he gave shouldn't have.

Very careful, precise terminology. So I just don't know.
 
I think ppl should get ready to never know the whole truth.

The ppl who could know will probably never speak out about it.

And the police will have problems to prove.



If Michael had sleeping problems and wanted some stuff knowingly illegal given to him... he knew he could get it different ways always... and probably just got it. insomnia knowing what the immense physical and psychological stress of having to do 50 shows... that's worse than torture could express.
I'll not judge him.
But we do know now another case why it is illegal to just use this stuff however you like at home.
Are these doctors involved guilty also... well if you can PROVE their involvement, which is probably not easily possible if not impossible. Every doubt will go to their advantage and they will have to be at least 'called' innocent in the end.

Ppl should get ready to never really know the facts or better the whole truth.
 
I get the feeling THE WHOLE TRUTH.....will never get out :(
 
I think everyone should stop arguing and wait for the final results. Those are the only ones that are valid. Imagine how his family feels at this moment. Trust me, they will do all they can to find out the truth, it's not in our hands.
 
General question that's been on my mind a lot: What excactly makes it so perfectly OK for the media to even pry into Michael's personal business even in death? Would they do that with any other celebrity? It would be totally off limits. What makes Michael any different? In life he had to put up with that also, but to continue to force themselves into his personal matters even in death, that's just wrong.
 
Well, on a more positive note...Hits Daily Double is predicting our man will AGAIN take the top spot on the Billboard Charts next week for the third week in a row! If the current sales figures hold true, Number Ones could sell 350,000+ copies providing sales are strong this weekend so get out there and buy some MJ albums!!
 
smooth_criminal05 said:
Well, on a more positive note...Hits Daily Double is predicting our man will AGAIN take the top spot on the Billboard Charts next week for the third week in a row! If the current sales figures hold true, Number Ones could sell 350,000+ copies providing sales are strong this weekend so get out there and buy some MJ albums!!
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Unbelievable. Still breaking records, selling more than most artists today can ever dream of. He will live on forever through the music, that's for sure.
 
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