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Murray Trial - 12 October - Day 11 - Discussion

The witness stepped down, Flanagan asked him whether he made assumptions when determining his opinions, no, Flanagan, he made the assumption that all the substances present in Michael Jackson's body were administered by CM, yes, he did assume that, and by a drip.

Recross prosecution: even if Michael Jackson self administered any amount of medication, would CM still be a causal link in his death? Yes.

And everyone rested.
 
This doctor was a great witness. I loved how he said that 5 of his 6 points directly linked Murray's actions to Michael's death.

It is horrible thinking about the "if onlys" when it comes to Murray's actions.
 
This doctor is top notch! His educational background is Ivy League all the way . UC schools!!! Extremely well spoken.
Damn, I need to see him for my asthma!
 
classic;3510299 said:
It is horrible thinking about the "if onlys" when it comes to Murray's actions.
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Yes, Michael´s death was so avoidable. :cry:
 
mjzfille said:
Can someone tell me why does the judge take notes?
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So they have their own succinct notes of all the salient points. In the UK they use those when they're giving a summing up to the jury of all the main points to consider in. It's easier than probably having to go through the notes that are being transcribed by the court clerk.
 
more and more murray looks like a rank amateur. Why couldn't michael have met doctors like these...
 
cinzia said:
more and more murray looks like a rank amateur. Why couldn't michael have met doctors like these...
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That's what I was thinking, I just don't understand why he was never referred to a proper sleep analyst for his insomnia
 
Nader Kamangar says his use of Propofol is the most commonly for sedation for an endotracheal tube in the ICU.

He states that he says that in his training for Propofol, is that you need to be aware of the risks.

Propofol can have an effect on Blood pressure when used as Bolus.
 
ommon use of Propofol for induction, putting in breathing tube, sedation while tube is in place & attached to ventilator

Propofol is very restricted and only certain med staff are allowed to use it. Propofol has special training.
 
I feel very bitter about this...yes he should have been but who would have referred him? Klein, Murray? Which doctor was really truly looking out for Michael's health and not their own image or pocketbook?
 
cinzia said:
I feel very bitter about this...yes he should have been but who would have referred him? Klein, Murray? Which doctor was really truly looking out for Michael's health and not their own image or pocketbook?
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Looks like other doctors performed well outside a standard of care. Klein adams etc should all be held accountable
 
Nurse is always present. Monitoring vital signs continuously.

Monitoring EKG, blood pressure continuously perhaps every 2-3 mins, pulse oximeter with alarm, cap nometer - measures co2,
 
Typical Monitoring equipment in Nader Kamangar's practice would be an EKG Machine to monitor the pattern of a heartbeat to look for irregularities, a blood pressure machine, pulse oximeter.

Walgren: In the case of Michael, you found extreme deviations of care?

Nader Kamangar: That's correct.

Walgren: The setting in which Michael was given Propofol was also an extreme deviation of care?

Nader Kamangar: Yes, for someone in my position to use Propofol in that kind of setting is Inconceivable.
 
cinzia said:
more and more murray looks like a rank amateur. Why couldn't michael have met doctors like these...
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Because they probably wouldn't give him Propofol. And please don't tell me I'm insulting Michael. I'm just stating facts. It doesn't take away from what Murray did.
 
hey guys.. just got home.. who is the witness? whats his name/profession??
 
He says a patient should have a blood-pressure monitor that measures at least every 5 minute
 
Lack of bedside assistance was extreme violation by Dr Murray.
Assistance allows you to monitor the patient very closely.
Esp impt if your going to leave the patient alone, not to abandon your patient is a part of Hippocratic oath.
Always imperative to be prepared and be able to deal with unforeseen circumstances, should have non-invasive blood measure device, can measure at least every 5 mins, EKG monitoring, apparatus allows you to protect the airway. Patient can regurgitate stomach contents into their airway sometimes, so need suction catheter, crash cart, medication on hand.

He seems to be going over same stuff Dr Steinberg did.

Judge is telling them to slow down...he's going too fast.

lack of equipment on Murrays part is an extreme deviation and is gross negligence...wouldn't see a prudent doctor administering in these circumstances.

First time heard of propofol given at home.
 
Lack of equipment represents a department of standard of care?? Witness says Yes,
 
Witness says this was the first time he heard about propofol being adminstered in a home setting

Lack o charts is also gross of negligence

charts can prevent a catastrophe before it happens
 
Get him, Nadar!!! A doctor should NEVER leave their patient. Fundamental basics of the Hippocratic Oath! It would be abandonment.
 
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