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These photo's are further proof that Michael was not using needles.

Yeah I've seen this pic before and they showed some footage too where he was trying on the clothes. You can definitely see how incredibly thin he is, it just boggles the mind that all those ppl working with him could go on pretending that nothing is wrong. Worried about their jobs like Asedora said....
 
Usually I would just go along with this, but even Janet - the most reliable sibling - said he had problems with drugs. I'm pretty sure the only way he could get those drugs would be by IV?

The only proof I see here is that he wasn't covered in needle marks, but he must have had at least a few. Can't you reuse a spot you've poked?
 
These are what track marks look like, right?

scan2asmall.jpg


I can definitely see now how they'd be more visible. I've never seen a picture of track marks until now.

That still doesn't explain Janet's story unless Michael was only taking things orally, which could be possible?
 
Michael was healthy, losing wieght is not amedical issue it is a psychological one, he needed rest that's all but this is it team did not let him have enough rest.
also , for that who talk about about Kenny asking Michael and Michael 's opinion was not important...this trash , cuz these things discussed before between MJ and Kenny and they only seem to let the crew know that it was MJ's dicission . Michael and Kenny discuss everything before hand at his house or on the phone then they let the others know about the last outcome. Kenny and Michael were like a twin in the rehearsals understanding each other without words.
 
So, does anyone know the date these pictures in this thread were taken?
Being that the autopsy shows several punture wounds on MJ's arms, and he didn't have them here, when did they start pumping him full of drugs? How many days between these pictures and the autopsy?
 
I think these pics might be quite recent, as they were quite late with the costumes, I think.
I don't know the date - the data says something that does not make sense and probably due to wrong (this time) camera settings.
 
Michael Jackson's body looks tiny to me in those photos like a teenage boy he is very slim.
But his arms look healthy and there are no marks on them and he looks happy.
 
Falcon said:
You`re no expert, but you ARE right...

People should compare this with some of the unofficial Black or White -era photo`s where you can see that part of his chest...he has discolourisation there..plus a few chest hairs, lol..
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Still, Vitiligo spots are not permanent, they come & go. So if he had a spot there now but none 10 years ago, it still doesn't say anything nor does it disprove/prove anything either.

Also MJ was 120lbs on his driver's license during Bad in the 80s & on his mugshot in 00s. Plus at the end of the Victory tour he dropped to 105lbs & according to Landis' wife who was MJ's costume designer for Thriller, he was 99lbs at that time. So, yes, MJ has been thinner in the 80s or the past than he was during TII when he was 136-140lbs.

I agree MJ looked incredibly thin & gaunt in this, I wish he had gained 10lbs more at the very least! But MJ probably wanted to maintain his former weight w/c is why he looked how he did now. Brosnan for James Bond was interviewed for his weight gain in his last Bond film. He explained that initially he had tried to get back to his former weight in Golden Eye, but the effect was just not the same. He looked less fit, more gaunt, his face became thinner, & he just did not look healthy. W/c was why he decided to get back more lbs to at least look (w/ clothes) closer to himself in GE though he weighd considerably more than back then. The same thing happened w/ my mom when she lost 10-15lbs, she was trying to lose weight, to get back her figure, but the weight came off from her face & she looked older & more gaunt. I think te same thing may have happened to MJ here, though he weighed more than he did during Thriller.
 
xthunderx2 said:
I know that if I make the picture large..I can see Michael's veins on his chest...almost like the spider veins..his skin looks incredibly translucent.....IDK if that to is from the vertiligo.....I also see tannish marks on his jaw and face...maybe vertiligo ??.....I also Do see some spots that I WOULD call bruising on his chest area(
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Oprah said the same thing. When she interviewed him back in 93, he looked translucent, you could see his veins & it was because of the Vitiligo, he didn't have pigment to counter tat effect.
 
Victoria83 said:
That could be it? Injured during rehearsals? Right. I can't imagine he weighed 136. Maybe that initial report of 108 was correct? We've never had any specifics, except for that very brief tox-report. This is incredibly stressful! :ph34r:
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So you think the Coroner lied about the official autopsy report of MJ's but Karen Faye who has been spreading the 108lbs drug addict myth who sold MJ's crypt to Splash tv is correct?
 
MJJ7777 said:
I know people say that he looked skinnier during thriller but he was healthy looking and skinny during thriller...now he's skinny and not healthy looking
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There's a reason for that as explained above. MJ was lighter back during Thriller/Victory. & History was MJ at his biggest, I think it's more prudent & logical to compare MJ in TII to MJ in the 80s rather than using MJ heaviest period to distort facts.

I agree though that MJ needed to gain more weight but keep in mind the O2 concerts was a residency concert extravaganza, they were not the stressful tours he so loathed. Though MJ insisted on hating tours he did them anyway for almost every album, he was planning an Invincible tour before 911 happened, after the trial happened, he was supposedly considering continuing that afer the O2 concerts. Still, MJ was most at home during performances or concerts, not tours, but on stage bonding & feeling the love of his fans. Resident stage performances cannot be compared to touring stage performances, the stresses are different.
 
Rawr said:
Usually I would just go along with this, but even Janet - the most reliable sibling - said he had problems with drugs. I'm pretty sure the only way he could get those drugs would be by IV?

The only proof I see here is that he wasn't covered in needle marks, but he must have had at least a few. Can't you reuse a spot you've poked?
Click to expand...

Don't be so quick to find Janet very reliable just because she's in the spotlight. Didn't you find her interview weird? Like she had a grudge w/ MJ somehow? If MJ was this addict they keep insisting, why are they making a big ruckus all over the media w/ it? Why not go to the cops or to those who actually have something to do w/ it? Why try to brandish it to destroy MJ's remaining legacy as a mere drug addict? W/ proclamations that would help Murray & the defense rather than MJ's murder? Why didn't they stage this intervention when MJ went t a family gathering a month before he died? Why were they so ecstatic about the initial will, applauding 3x until perhaps it was later clarified that they're not getting zilch from the estate nor from Katherine? Has Janet even contributed to the upkeep of her siblings & parents or was it just all on MJ's shoulder's alone? Could sweet Janet be a tad pissed w/ reliable ol MJ for leaving her in a spot as the new Jackson cash cow? Could all these drug addicted tale w/c will be well utilized by Murray be used to paint MJ as a nut who didn't know what he was doing when that will was signed? Don't you find any of these circumstances & strange actions from the family who supposedly had a 2nd autopsy & yet are clueless suspicious in any way or form?

Randy Philips is an @zzhole but we that doesn't mean he's a killer. & I certainly don't find Ortega to be the murderer people are painting him to be. Has anyone seen the TII bluray? MJ had choreography rehearsals & he looked meatier, when was this taken? Also, if AEG were trying to coverup MJ's health to such a degree like putting a footage of him eating 1 fry just as a devious part of a plan, why would they allow these 2 photos where MJ looked miserably thin?
 
MJ was way under weight.
It is not fair to compare someone to a weight they were when in their teen and 20's vs their 40's or 50's.

MJ's fully developed adult body was the one he had during the Dangerous era. Most people, no not all but most people gain weight further as they age. As we age our metabolism slows down so the average person gains weight.
Even go back and look at MJ during the Killer Thriller party in London when he talked about Evil Sony. He was healthy! Look at him in New York when he release Invincible! That is what Michael should have been looking like! The terrible skinny Michael started during that dam trial. He stopped eating because someone was trying to kill him! Dick Gregory took him to the hospital. Maybe he thought the same again, for good reason I'de say, and he again stopped eating? Something was wrong.

Does anyone know the date of the pictures in this thread? I am trying to make sense of the puncture wounds in the autopsy.
 
earth child said:
MJ was way under weight.
It is not fair to compare someone to a weight they were when in their teen and 20's vs their 40's or 50's.

MJ's fully developed adult body was the one he had during the Dangerous era. Most people, no not all but most people gain weight further as they age. As we age our metabolism slows down so the average person gains weight.
Even go back and look at MJ during the Killer Thriller party in London when he talked about Evil Sony. He was healthy! Look at him in New York when he release Invincible! That is what Michael should have been looking like! The terrible skinny Michael started during that dam trial. He stopped eating because someone was trying to kill him! Dick Gregory took him to the hospital. Maybe he thought the same again, for good reason I'de say, and he again stopped eating? Something was wrong.

Does anyone know the date of the pictures in this thread? I am trying to make sense of the puncture wounds in the autopsy.
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I think MJ always looked good. I think he looked good in 2002. That 2005 trial took everything out of him he was never the same after that.
I don't believe the drug addict stories I think he was murdered.
 
EarthSong100 said:
I think MJ always looked good. I think he looked good in 2002. That 2005 trial took everything out of him he was never the same after that.
I don't believe the drug addict stories I think he was murdered.
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I'm with ya! That is why I am trying to figure out how many days between the pics, and the autopsy! There are a lot of puncture wounds on that autopsy!
 
nenabunena said:
There's a reason for that as explained above. MJ was lighter back during Thriller/Victory. & History was MJ at his biggest, I think it's more prudent & logical to compare MJ in TII to MJ in the 80s rather than using MJ heaviest period to distort facts.

I agree though that MJ needed to gain more weight but keep in mind the O2 concerts was a residency concert extravaganza, they were not the stressful tours he so loathed. Though MJ insisted on hating tours he did them anyway for almost every album, he was planning an Invincible tour before 911 happened, after the trial happened, he was supposedly considering continuing that afer the O2 concerts. Still, MJ was most at home during performances or concerts, not tours, but on stage bonding & feeling the love of his fans. Resident stage performances cannot be compared to touring stage performances, the stresses are different.
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Nena you make so much sense. Also, during Thriller he was darker and didn't have the effects of the vitiligo hence the translucent skin that looks unhealthy. When you see him in Dirty Diana when he is taking off his shirt you could see his bones sticking out.

That bruising you are talking about on his chest may very well be from poor lighting or reflection of something after all it was taken by a cell phone from what I understand. His has facial hair that's all that is,which is nice to see. When I saw the film his face did not look sunken in or gaunt like he did at the end of his trial in 05, even my mom noticed it and commented he looked much better.

Yes, he could have used gaining some weight, of course, but to say he was on his death bed is a little exaggerated.

AND Karen Faye has said those things about him???And if he knew that why didn't she do anything about it?? Afraid to lose her job I guess. These so called friends never cease to amaze me!! My God why am I not surprised. Here I thought she was a friend of his. Who was his friend = anyone?
 
nenabunena said:
Don't be so quick to find Janet very reliable just because she's in the spotlight. Didn't you find her interview weird? Like she had a grudge w/ MJ somehow? If MJ was this addict they keep insisting, why are they making a big ruckus all over the media w/ it? Why not go to the cops or to those who actually have something to do w/ it? Why try to brandish it to destroy MJ's remaining legacy as a mere drug addict? W/ proclamations that would help Murray & the defense rather than MJ's murder? Why didn't they stage this intervention when MJ went t a family gathering a month before he died? Why were they so ecstatic about the initial will, applauding 3x until perhaps it was later clarified that they're not getting zilch from the estate nor from Katherine? Has Janet even contributed to the upkeep of her siblings & parents or was it just all on MJ's shoulder's alone? Could sweet Janet be a tad pissed w/ reliable ol MJ for leaving her in a spot as the new Jackson cash cow? Could all these drug addicted tale w/c will be well utilized by Murray be used to paint MJ as a nut who didn't know what he was doing when that will was signed? Don't you find any of these circumstances & strange actions from the family who supposedly had a 2nd autopsy & yet are clueless suspicious in any way or form?

Randy Philips is an @zzhole but we that doesn't mean he's a killer. & I certainly don't find Ortega to be the murderer people are painting him to be. Has anyone seen the TII bluray? MJ had choreography rehearsals & he looked meatier, when was this taken? Also, if AEG were trying to coverup MJ's health to such a degree like putting a footage of him eating 1 fry just as a devious part of a plan, why would they allow these 2 photos where MJ looked miserably thin?
Click to expand...

Agree - :agree: I did see a sig from a fan where Michael was rehearsing choreography in a black short sleeved shirt and looked pretty good, not as thin as the pics here. And why doesn't this family just shut the hell up! I had no idea Janet was talking too, and to say he had problems with drugs?? well, why didn't she help him then???
To me if he was wearing short sleeved shirts during rehearsals, as we have seen, then there is no way he had track marks- and that tells me something I've always believed that he was not a drug addict! Could the needle marks from the autopsy come from the injections from Murray the night before? Didn't he give him quite a few drugs? And could some of them be from trying to resuscitate him??
 
I seem to remember that Joe said that he talked to Prince, and that Prince said that MJ didn't have any track/needle marks on his arms.
 
eighthnoterojo said:
I seem to remember that Joe said that he talked to Prince, and that Prince said that MJ didn't have any track/needle marks on his arms.
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True, so again, how did he end up with so many on that autopsy? Someone must have been injecting him. Are they all from that same night? If so, that is sort of telling, isn't it?
 
nenabunena said:
So you think the Coroner lied about the official autopsy report of MJ's but Karen Faye who has been spreading the 108lbs drug addict myth who sold MJ's crypt to Splash tv is correct?
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there's a quite reasonable but morbid explanation for 136 vs 108 lbs thing. Don't read the rest if these kind of things affect you.


If you have read the autopsy report you have seen that many organs, brain etc were removed for tests. Karen said that the mortician told her that weight and it could be the weight with removed organs and drained bodily fluids for the embalming process.

Also dead bodies lose weight (some say up to 25%) due to lost of fluids, empty bladder, bowels and stomach as well as decomposition over time.
 
ivy said:
there's a quite reasonable but morbid explanation for 136 vs 108 lbs thing. Don't read the rest if these kind of things affect you.


If you have read the autopsy report you have seen that many organs, brain etc were removed for tests. Karen said that the mortician told her that weight and it could be the weight with removed organs and drained bodily fluids for the embalming process.

Also dead bodies lose weight (some say up to 25%) due to lost of fluids, empty bladder, bowels and stomach as well as decomposition over time.
Click to expand...

You all believe what you want but I can see with my own two eyes that MJ didn't weigh 136lbs!
Remember this?
michael_jackson.jpg


120lbs at the time of his arrest. Does anyone really believe that Michael gained 16 lbs since then? Or did it look more likely that he lost 8 to 10?
I choose to believe what my eyes tell me, not what anyone else says and that includes Karen and the Coroner.
 
earth child said:
You all believe what you want but I can see with my own two eyes that MJ didn't weigh 136lbs!
Remember this?
michael_jackson.jpg


120lbs at the time of his arrest. Does anyone really believe that Michael gained 16 lbs since then? Or did it look more likely that he lost 8 to 10?
I choose to believe what my eyes tell me, not what anyone else says and that includes Karen and the Coroner.
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No way he was heavier now than in 2003. There is absolutely no question about it.

bluetopez said:
This picture was taken a week before he died, I heard and I see no marks on his arms! Plus on the blu ray double disc DVD they have a special feature called dancing machine, MJ has on a black t-shirt with short sleeves on and u see his arms and they look fine, no marks!
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OK, I expect on blue ray and at home you could have even better vision than in theatre.
 
This is my take on the family and the drugs. They are telling the press about it now. It was more important to go to the press when he was alive. It could have possibly saved his life. I don't know everything they tried but if you can talk now to the public you could have said something then.

The follower fans didn't care about embarrassing Mike to a point they just wanted to save him. WHICH IS MORE IMPORTANT.
 
earth child said:
True, so again, how did he end up with so many on that autopsy? Someone must have been injecting him. Are they all from that same night? If so, that is sort of telling, isn't it?
Click to expand...

MJ got several injections from the paramedics during the resuscitative efforts.
 
earth child said:
120lbs at the time of his arrest. Does anyone really believe that Michael gained 16 lbs since then? Or did it look more likely that he lost 8 to 10?
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oh that was discussed in another topic. Apparently when they arrest you they take your height/ weight info from your driver's licence. So that 120 lbs is what MJ weighted when he got his licence at the 80's not what he weighted at 2003.

and i think he looked less gaunt in the last years than 2003, so probably he was weighting a bit more than he did at 2003.
 
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