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Where did the Moonwalk/Michael's dance moves originate?

Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

eternitys_child said:
Well I hope you don't mean you think he didn't practice it.

I was looking for the quote from Daniel saying he asked Michael what took Michael so lonbg to do it and Michael said he wanted to make sure he had it right. I didn't find it but found this instead. Check it out. There are interviews with Daniel, Jermaine, and Janet about that first performance. Yes, they do say that Michael did not know what he was going to do ahead of time that night.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nQGSa5BvKAQ
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That'll be weird because we already have FOOTAGE of Michael practicing the moonwalk from the Private Home Videos thing. :lol:
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

troubleman84 said:
That'll be weird because we already have FOOTAGE of Michael practicing the moonwalk from the Private Home Videos thing. :lol:
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I may have never seen all of PHV. I suppose it is on you tube like everything else? I only recently got dsl so I have some catching up to do.

I read somewhere that Michael hadn't decided whether or not he was going to do the moonwalk that night. It was considered risky because he did not know how it would be received. It isn't like he hadn't considered it though. It was just that he did it only when it felt right I guess.

I still like AllForMJ's post the best.
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

If Mike says he got it from the kids in the streets, then he means that is where HE got it from. Of course it goes way back farther than that 'cause we all know, there ain't nothin' new under the sun. We also know Mike loves to watch old movies so he may have picked something up from an old movie like he did the move where he goes up on his toes after a spin. He got that move off of James Cagney in the movie, "Yankee Doodle Dandy". If you ever get a chance to see that film, it has got to be where Mike got that from. In that old film with Bill Robinsin, I did see him kind of on his toes too though so who knows. We will have to ask Mike where he got that move from.B)

Ticie,
The JACKSONOLOGIST
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

THE JACKSONOLOGIST said:
If Mike says he got it from the kids in the streets, then he means that is where HE got it from. Of course it goes way back farther than that 'cause we all know, there ain't nothin' new under the sun. We also know Mike loves to watch old movies so he may have picked something up from an old movie like he did the move where he goes up on his toes after a spin. He got that move off of James Cagney in the movie, "Yankee Doodle Dandy". If you ever get a chance to see that film, it has got to be where Mike got that from. In that old film with Bill Robinsin, I did see him kind of on his toes too though so who knows. We will have to ask Mike where he got that move from.B)

Ticie,
The JACKSONOLOGIST
Click to expand...

Maybe he didn't wanna do it initially UNTIL he saw the "kids" doing it. :lol:
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

Michael only loosely worked out his routine for Motown 25, but he hadn't planned it out step for step, obviously. The beggining was choreographed, most of the rest was improvised, except the sequence with the moonwalk and the spin and then up on the toes.

Jeff Daniels and Geron, and then Poppin' Pete and Poppin' Taco have all taught Michael certain steps, hip hop flavored steps, popping mostely. But ain't none of em' half as good as Michael when it comes to straight up pure dancing, lol. You can see him outdance Daniels and Geron in the "Bad" video and Daniels in the video for "Smooth Criminal". So they can take as much credit as they want, they still ain't half as good, lol. People try to use the fact that Michael's hired these guys to teach him steps as a way to demean Michael's talent as a dancer, but that's bull. Everyone learns steps and styles from somewhere, even those guys, so... Where you pick somehting up doesn't matter, what matters is how good you are naturally, and none of them are as good as Michael, not for straight up movement from one pose to another.
 
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Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

wannabestartinsomthin21 said:
Michael only loosely worked out his routine for Motown 25, but he hadn't planned it out step for step, obviously. The beggining was choreographed, most of the rest was improvised, except the sequence with the moonwalk and the spin and then up on the toes.

as Jeff Daniels and Geron, and then Poppin' Pete and Poppin' Taco have all taught Michael certain steps, hip hop flavored steps, popping mostely. But ain't none of em' half as good Michael when it comes to straight up pure dancing, lol. You can see him outdance Daniels and Geron in the "Bad" video and Daniels in the video for "Smooth Criminal". So they can take as much credit as they want, they still ain't half as good, lol. People try to use the fact that Michael's hired these guys to teach him steps as a way to demean Michael's talent as a dancer, but that's bull. Everyone learns steps and styles from somewhere, even those guys, so... Where you pick somehting up doesn't matter, what matters is how good you are naturally, and none of them are as good as Michael, not for straight up movement from one pose to another.
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Absolutely. They're not half as good. Sure others had done it before him, but when MJ did it, people went crazy, literally. The whole world went nuts and to this day are still in awe over MJ's moonwalk. The others do not compare to him. Daniels and Popping Pete and the others need to be quiet really, because what Michael has as a dancer is a God given gift. Something they don't have. Not that they aren't good. But they are not in his league. No one is.
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

Michael would never go on stage not knowing what he was going to do. I don,t even care where it came from it was Michael who made it a hit and no one but Michael. Who else could even come close to doing it like our Michael Jackson , no one. Michael Jackson is the star of stars and that s just the way it is. I,m so proud of him. He is in a class of his own .
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

I wanna see this Daniels guy in SMOOTH CRIMINAL, which one is he?
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

the MOONWALK was innovated (Not invented) by Michael.. It was derived from the back float which has less of a GLYDE feel..the motown 25 moonwalk was more of a back float than a 'moonwalk.'

Moonwalk was originally the name of the beginning of airwalking.. it actually kind of looked like a mixture between the sea-walk and the 'in place' moonwalk.. kinda like what Michael does with that one kid in the bad ara where that kid is trying to dance like Michael and is shuffeling/glyding his feet in place..

Once Michael did the "BACKFLOAT" on motown 25. People start calling it the moonwalk and it just stuck.. Since motown 25 Michael changed the backfloat A LOT. He added alot to it.. 1) much more of a glyde effect 2) the 'being pulled' effect. which became the NEW moonwalk..

Bill Bailey's back float was alot more simular to Michael MOONWALK than Jeff Daniels..

http://youtube.com/watch?v=2VbPd2iu4bg

Jeff daniels original back float looked more of a shuffle.. Like motown 25.. Very short strydes.. But after Michael chaged the backfloat into the new moonwalk with long strydes, Daniels also changed his

Many of Michael popping styles came from Jeff Daniels..

The top people (not in order) that Michael studied, and was heavily influenced by are..

Michaels JAZZ flavor, style, and steps came a lot from BOB FOSSY
^ Studying and watching his films early 80's^
http://youtube.com/watch?v=L8mJsgPj1iU

Michaels some POPPING style was derived from JEFF DANIELS
^ Meeting and planning dances early 80's/ they got ideas from each other^ (Daniels likes to take ALL creadit though as if he's the teacher)
http://youtube.com/watch?v=JWF3tqIhCjo

Michaels tapping was influnced by the Nicolas Brothers
^ Taught Michael some basic moves to APPEAR like tap in mid 70's^
http://youtube.com/watch?v=jOIMqu0TesE

Michaels feet movements, stage ideas, and much style came from JAMES BROWN
^ Watching him as a child starting in the 60's^
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Ux3joe0GdTA

Michaels Miming was influenced by Marcel Marceau
^early to late 90's he met and learned from^
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Xj8oIrdGNiw
 
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Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

KOPV said:
the MOONWALK was innovated (Not invented) by Michael.. It was derived from the back float which has less of a GLYDE feel..the motown 25 moonwalk was more of a back float than a 'moonwalk.'

Moonwalk was originally the name of the beginning of airwalking.. it actually kind of looked like a mixture between the sea-walk and the 'in place' moonwalk.. kinda like what Michael does with that one kid in the bad ara where that kid is trying to dance like Michael and is shuffeling/glyding his feet in place..

Once Michael did the "BACKFLOAT" on motown 25. People start calling it the moonwalk and it just stuck.. Since motown 25 Michael changed the backfloat A LOT. He added alot to it.. 1) much more of a glyde effect 2) the 'being pulled' effect. which became the NEW moonwalk..

Bill Bailey's back float was alot more simular to Michael MOONWALK than Jeff Daniels..

http://youtube.com/watch?v=2VbPd2iu4bg

Jeff daniels original back float looked more of a shuffle.. Like motown 25.. Very short strydes.. But after Michael chaged the backfloat into the new moonwalk with long strydes, Daniels also changed his

Many of Michael popping styles came from Jeff Daniels..

The top people (not in order) that Michael studied, and was heavily influenced by are..

Michaels JAZZ flavor, style, and steps came a lot from BOB FOSSY
^ Studying and watching his films early 80's^
http://youtube.com/watch?v=L8mJsgPj1iU

Michaels some POPPING style was derived from JEFF DANIELS
^ Meeting and planning dances early 80's/ they got ideas from each other^ (Daniels likes to take ALL creadit though as if he's the teacher)
http://youtube.com/watch?v=JWF3tqIhCjo

Michaels tapping was influnced by the Nicolas Brothers
^ Taught Michael some basic moves to APPEAR like tap in mid 70's^
http://youtube.com/watch?v=jOIMqu0TesE

Michaels feet movements, stage ideas, and much style came from JAMES BROWN
^ Watching him as a child starting in the 60's^
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Ux3joe0GdTA

Michaels Miming was influenced by Marcel Marceau
^early to late 90's he met and learned from^
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Xj8oIrdGNiw
Click to expand...

:yes: Michael learned from the masters of dance and emulated their styles to make a better dancing machine. B)
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

anyone mentioned that footage from around the 30's with some guy doing the moonwalk. think its on utube

mj saying he got it from the kids is nothing more to me than P.R. it sounds good rather than saying i saw JD do it on soul train and rang him and asked him to teach me it for eg.
 
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Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

Great links KOPV.

We had the motown audition one already and you sure can see James Brown's influence in it.

I didn't realize the moonwalk changed after Motown 25. What was the date of Motown 25? I see Daniels on stage doing a long glide in July 1982.

I sure can see Bob Fossy's style in what Michael does as well. I had never seen that clip before and although I had heard of Bob Fossy am not sure I had ever seen his dancing, at least not that I can recall.

The clip of Michael dancing with the Nicolas Brothers is great as well. I had forgotten about that. (I like the one of them dancing on the steps. They were amazing dancers.) I know WBSS will be in here any minute to point out that Michael's movements are cleaner though. lol
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

elusive moonwalker said:
anyone mentioned that footage from around the 30's with some guy doing the moonwalk. think its on utube

mj saying he got it from the kids is nothing more to me than P.R. it sounds good rather than saying i saw JD do it on soul train and rang him and asked him to teach me it for eg.
Click to expand...

Yeah but people think that was 1955 when Bill Bailey did it. The footage looks more '30s/'40s to me too.

I have to give Bill Bailey his props. I think Michael was seriously watching footage of him (you know because he likes to watch old movies...right?). I'm sure he's looking at the video of Bill Bailey doing it. :yes:
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

eternitys_child said:
Great links KOPV.

We had the motown audition one already and you sure can see James Brown's influence in it.

I didn't realize the moonwalk changed after Motown 25. What was the date of Motown 25? I see Daniels on stage doing a long glide in July 1982.

I sure can see Bob Fossy's style in what Michael does as well. I had never seen that clip before and although I had heard of Bob Fossy am not sure I had ever seen his dancing, at least not that I can recall.

The clip of Michael dancing with the Nicolas Brothers is great as well. I had forgotten about that. (I like the one of them dancing on the steps. They were amazing dancers.) I know WBSS will be in here any minute to point out that Michael's movements are cleaner though. lol
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Or that his was better. :lol:

Nicole's like that song that has the lyric:
"Anything you can do, I can do better
I can do anything better than you
(No you can't!)
Yes I can
(No you can't!)
Yes I can..."

:rofl:
 
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Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

^^ really '82 long strydes?? I don't think I have seen him do it in 82.. I think the earliest clip I have seen Daniels do it like that was LATE 1983

Motown 25 was taped March 25th 1983 and aired on May 16th 1983.

hmm! maybe Michael learned it the old way, and once he saw the new way, he took it from there... I know it has changed in the early 80's.. the backfloat is SHORT strydes..

You guys will probably like to see this..

HOWEVER.. One thing that has ALWAYS annoyed me is.. The two dancers WORKED together. Yet Jeffery Daniels always tries to make it out he made it all and taught it to Michael.. You'll get that feel from this video. He always gives mike creadit.. But not for being innovative.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=K0-isEu89aA&feature=related

Here too..
http://youtube.com/watch?v=nQGSa5BvKAQ&feature=related

look at how HEFFERY does the "backfloat/backslide" see the difference?
 
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Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

I saw him doing that. The backslide has been interpreted so many times either they let their shoes glide or their legs glide or float. Bill and Mike were gliding when they were doing what they were doing. Like you said, Jeffrey was floating.
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

KOPV said:
^^ really '82 long strydes?? I don't think I have seen him do it in 82.. I think the earliest clip I have seen Daniels do it like that was LATE 1983

Motown 25 was taped March 25th 1983 and aired on May 16th 1983.

hmm! maybe Michael learned it the old way, and once he saw the new way, he took it from there... I know it has changed in the early 80's.. the backfloat is SHORT strydes..

You guys will probably like to see this..

HOWEVER.. One thing that has ALWAYS annoyed me is.. The two dancers WORKED together. Yet Jeffery Daniels always tries to make it out he made it all and taught it to Michael.. You'll get that feel from this video. He always gives mike creadit.. But not for being innovative.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=K0-isEu89aA&feature=related

Here too..
http://youtube.com/watch?v=nQGSa5BvKAQ&feature=related

look at how HEFFERY does the "backfloat/backslide" see the difference?
Click to expand...
I saw that one. It might already be linked here. I am losing track. lol. Here is one of Daniels in July 1982. I guess that is shorter strokes than Michael does.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=9ImkBve8OW8&feature=related


In one of the clips that talks about Daniels teaching Michael, you hear a short comment from what sounds like Quincy saying something like "He asked to see Michael". I thought that was interesting. I wonder if Daniels actually initiated it.
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

Ya ^ those are shorter strydes.. The big difference in the two is that Michael appears to be PULLED back while TRYING to walk forword..(as if someone is pulling him back by the upper sholder area) His backfloat simply looks like he's walking forword but going backwords.

it's basically the same thing.. But people that KNOW there stuff would pick on it..

I have worked with Daniels at a couple workshops, we've had some good deep talks on dance.. He knows his stuff, but he does act like he's the creator of dance.. He makes it sound like, he striked the match that made MJ's dance blow up, then what we see today..

Never said it, tries to be nice about it.. Givin' MJ alot of props.. But u could tell, when it comes down to it.. he thinks he's the SH**
 
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Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

Michael’s ability to glide across the stage did not start with the “Moonwalk.” He’s always been light on his feet. Even when he used to do the Robot, he looked like he was gliding across the stage.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P7GptrjsboA

Actually, it was when Michael started doing the Robot that we knew how good of a dancer his is.

Also, the dances that are seen on television and at the movies do not begin on television and at the movies. They begin with the folks at home. It’s just that other people do not see them, until they see them on television and at the movies.
 
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Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

AllForMJ said:
Michael’s ability to glide across the stage did not start with the “Moonwalk.” He’s always been light on his feet. Even when he used to do the Robot, he looked like he was gliding across the stage.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P7GptrjsboA

Actually, it was when Michael started doing the Robot that we knew how good of a dancer his is.
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Yep, yep. We knew the boy could glide, check the 1968 audition! :yes: Jeffrey didn't teach him sh*t! :lol:
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

Exactly, Timmy. He's been an excellent dancer from the time that he was little Michael.
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

KOPV said:
Ya ^ those are shorter strydes.. The big difference in the two is that Michael appears to be PULLED back while TRYING to walk forword..(as if someone is pulling him back by the upper sholder area) His backfloat simply looks like he's walking forword but going backwords.

it's basically the same thing.. But people that KNOW there stuff would pick on it..

I have worked with Daniels at a couple workshops, we've had some good deep talks on dance.. He knows his stuff, but he does act like he's the creator of dance.. He makes it sound like, he striked the match that made MJ's dance blow up, then what we see today..

Never said it, tries to be nice about it.. Givin' MJ alot of props.. But u could tell, when it comes down to it.. he thinks he's the SH**
Click to expand...
Wow. You worked/took lessons with Daniels? That's cool. Here in the states?

It does seem like Daniels contributed a lot. I guess it must be a bit hard for him because he really doesn't get acknowledged for any of it and if he says anything he is going to look too much like he is trying to take away from Michael. Just looking at him in a couple of those clips he is very good. I like the thing he does coming up from the splits. Did Marceau do that as well though. Sorry. I got a little off topic. The splits thing is one I don't think I've ever seen Michael do though.
 
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Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

Ya we were both at a workshop teaching.. Our spots were set up together working in the same section.. It was pretty much by chance. It was in the hip-hop section of the workshop I was representing the college dance production and he was representing as a celeb guest.. I presented him, danced a bit with him.. I ended up kinda being his assistant teacher for a few hours.. I tried talking to him as much as possible, about MJ mostly lol!

Ya he did contribute alot.. DANCERS in general do not get much credit.. They are behind the scene too much in my opinion.. You have to be more than a DANCER to really get known'. Either revolutionize a type of dance, be the BEST, or do some acting or something to get the name known.
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

eternitys_child said:
Didn't Michael himself once say it was from kids on the street?

Currently whoever wrote what is on Wiki credits Marcel Marceau.

One dance site I found says it goes back to the 30's (as WBSS says) but as used by mimes and that is its origin.
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Yes, Jackson did say it was from kids, but he never mentioned any concrete names of people and groups.

Maybe because all of them think they "taught" "Moonwalk" to Michael (even though, obviously, this can not that way simultaneously), he does not want to upset anyone :lol:
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

troubleman84 said:
Or that his was better. :lol:

Nicole's like that song that has the lyric:
"Anything you can do, I can do better
I can do anything better than you
(No you can't!)
Yes I can
(No you can't!)
Yes I can..."

:rofl:
Click to expand...

HEY! :lol:

Well, he IS cleaner. I think the Nicholas Brothers were obvioulsy very good dancers, to be honest, I think they were better when they were kids, lol. I know that sounds stupid, but they were more neat back then. They got to be more like acrobats to me then dancers later on.

Bob Fosse is a good mention, because out of every dancer, I think Fosse's style most influenced Michael. He dances style wise most like Fosse, who was a REALLY good dancer. I think in terms of body type and initial motion type, Michael is most like Astaire, but style wise, he's most like Fosse.
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

KOPV said:
Ya ^ those are shorter strydes.. The big difference in the two is that Michael appears to be PULLED back while TRYING to walk forword..(as if someone is pulling him back by the upper sholder area) His backfloat simply looks like he's walking forword but going backwords.

it's basically the same thing.. But people that KNOW there stuff would pick on it..

I have worked with Daniels at a couple workshops, we've had some good deep talks on dance.. He knows his stuff, but he does act like he's the creator of dance.. He makes it sound like, he striked the match that made MJ's dance blow up, then what we see today..

Never said it, tries to be nice about it.. Givin' MJ alot of props.. But u could tell, when it comes down to it.. he thinks he's the SH**
Click to expand...

Yeah, my dad actually pointed that out once while watching Michael do "Billie Jean". He said Michael looks like he's being pulled backwards against his own will, as he described it. He really does look like he's being thrown back or something. He looks better doing it then anyone else.

And Jeff Daniels ain't sh*t as a dancer comapred to Michael. He can take as much credit as he wants but, bottom line, he's not as fluid or as clean or as quick as Michael, so he can keep talking. Nobody taught Michael how to dance, Michael just can. People have taught him certain steps, but nobdoy taught him how to move, you can't teach that. He was dancing like a wunderkind long before he even knew who Daniels or any of these people were.
 
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Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

denisrs said:
Yes, Jackson did say it was from kids, but he never mentioned any concrete names of people and groups.

Maybe because all of them think they "taught" "Moonwalk" to Michael (even though, obviously, this can not that way simultaneously), he does not want to upset anyone :lol:
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He upsets me. Michael's old ass didn't learn it from no "kids". :lol: He just KNEW people wouldn't know who the hell Bill Bailey was. ;)
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

wannabestartinsomthin21 said:
Damn straight Timmy! You know where its at, lol.
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It's the truth. Plus he looked at all those old movies by dancers from Fred to Bob to Gene, James, Bill (Bailey and Bojangles), Sammy, Nicholas Bros, etc., so he was trying to give too much credit to the b-boys who were gonna speak up any damn ways. :lol:
 
Re: Where did the Moonwalk really originate?

wannabestartinsomthin21 said:
HEY! :lol:

Well, he IS cleaner. I think the Nicholas Brothers were obvioulsy very good dancers, to be honest, I think they were better when they were kids, lol. I know that sounds stupid, but they were more neat back then. They got to be more like acrobats to me then dancers later on.

Bob Fosse is a good mention, because out of every dancer, I think Fosse's style most influenced Michael. He dances style wise most like Fosse, who was a REALLY good dancer. I think in terms of body type and initial motion type, Michael is most like Astaire, but style wise, he's most like Fosse.
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Yep, them brothers were BAD-ASS! B)
 
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