Why I think The 2002 Will is a fruad

[Victory22]

I think it's fascinating how most of us are willing to believe a lawyer and an accountant over those who knew him the best. Some of us can come up with a thousand reasons why Lisa Marie, La Toya and Janet were "probably" lying when they spoke of Michael being afraid, and knowing "they" would kill him, but will not point the finger at the estate; those people who gave us "Michael" the album... :no:

If we want to create crazy conspiracy theories and randomly point finger at people without evidence to back it up then this must be said. The people with the most motive to murder Michael are the Jackson’s. As LaToya so eloquently pointed out “Just follow the money”. See how easy it is to slander?

 

[Bubs]

If we want to create crazy conspiracy theories and randomly point finger at people without evidence to back it up then this must be said. The people with the most motive to murder Michael are the Jackson’s. As LaToya so eloquently pointed out “Just follow the money”. See how easy it is to slander?

I agree.
I want add that I don't think Michael ever specified who were the people he referred as"they", could be some of the Jackson, could be Tohme, but he never named Branca, that one came out from family and some of the fans.

 

[JustMe00]

If we want to create crazy conspiracy theories and randomly point finger at people without evidence to back it up then this must be said. The people with the most motive to murder Michael are the Jackson’s. As LaToya so eloquently pointed out “Just follow the money”. See how easy it is to slander?

Yeah I really don't think the Jacksons & Lisa Marie would talk about Michael's fears if they were the one killing him. Regardless of who did it, most of his money will always go to his children, and the Jacksons know that.

I agree.
I want add that I don't think Michael ever specified who were the people he referred as"they", could be some of the Jackson, could be Tohme, but he never named Branca, that one came out from family and some of the fans.

Yet, he spoke to La Toya, Lisa Marie and Janet about it. Do you really think he'd not name that person of the Jackson family, he was afraid of? lol It was not a Jackson.

 

[shelly_webster]

I think we should not forget that latoya only saw him 4 times in 20 years, Lisa Marie never spoke to him from 2005 to 2009 (same as latoya). Accordinge to Gatlin he only spoke about Tohme Tohme.

 

[ivy]

I think it's fascinating how most of us are willing to believe a lawyer and an accountant over those who knew him the best. Some of us can come up with a thousand reasons why Lisa Marie, La Toya and Janet were "probably" lying when they spoke of Michael being afraid, and knowing "they" would kill him, but will not point the finger at the estate; those people who gave us "Michael" the album... :no:

see "who knew him the best" is the point that makes you lose this argument. Latoya in her book said that she only saw Michael 4 times in the last 20 years, Janet herself admitted that she didn't see Michael for years, similarly Lisa Marie did not have much of a communication with him.

That being said Michael mentioned conspiracy and his conspiracy was about his catalogs. He believed people wanted them. He believed the 2003 accusation - 2005 trial was happening due to he butted heads with Mottola. There are other people that even testified to this at several lawsuits. Michael's main issue was with Mottola, and the people he believed to be close with Mottola.

however the issue with this is that Michael's catalogs is safe and sound and nothing happened to them. So without that, it's just a theory.

 

[Victory22]

Yeah I really don't think the Jacksons & Lisa Marie would talk about Michael's fears if they were the one killing him. Regardless of who did it, most of his money will always go to his children, and the Jacksons know that.



Yet, he spoke to La Toya, Lisa Marie and Janet about it. Do you really think he'd not name that person of the Jackson family, he was afraid of? lol It was not a Jackson.

The question is how much of what LaToya, Lisa Marie and Janet have said can actually be believed. Their stories tend to change depending on how public opinion of Michael changes. Are we expected to believe Michael told them he was in fear for his life when he had distanced himself from all three of them over the past few decades? Do we disregard the fact they also said he was a pedophile; a manipulating master who used marriage to control the press reporting about him. Did he have ulterior motives for his actions and resist repeated attempts at addiction interventions? In addition to telling them he was in fear of his life was he also in total denial he had a serious drug problem? Wouldn’t Michael tell the media, the police and members of his security force he was afraid? Why have none of these sorces confirmed he expressed these concerns?

 

[jrsfan]

Wow... noticed that jrsfan used the same three words to describe the will as the letter written by the Rogue Five - fake, flawed fraudulent ...

I have always felt that something was wrong with the will & I liked the sound of "fake, flawed & fraudulent" so that is why I used it. I do not think he would ever have put in a clause that if one of his loved ones KJ or any of his children were to challenge the will, they would be disinherited.

 

[loveforever]

People need to keep in mind when Michael said there was the conspiracy against him and people wanted him to die, it was during the 03-05 trial. The time is very important because that's his most vulnerable time and He was right to feel this way. Firstly The trial is the life or death to michael. If he was convicted, that's the death to him. So whoever wanted him to convicted wanted him to die. Furthermore, we all know the whole trial is because of that Martin Bashir distorted documentary. Bashir set him up and played with his trust, then later rewarded the big promotion from that mockumentary. Then we had Tom Sneddon a obsessed mj hater witch-hunting Michael for decade. We had FBI secretly investigated Michael for a decade. We had tom sneddon's PR team in media to get the conviction in public when the trial not even started. We had the greedy Arvizo family went to see the chandlers' lawyer before they even met Michael. All this injustice, mistreatment, media assassination, schemes and craziness can be called the conspiracy. It's also reasonable if Michael speculated bashir's/media's character assassination and the domino effect after that may have the link with mottola. Of course all the above i wrote just assume what those so called family or ex claimed on TV after his death were not the lies or half truth. They made michael sound like the nuts. Funny we heard nothing about these 'concerned' people when Michael was alive. After the trial, these people are the first he avoided and escaped from.

Whoever used alleged Michael's words around the trial to push their now agenda needs to shut tf up.

 

[JustMe00]

see "who knew him the best" is the point that makes you lose this argument. Latoya in her book said that she only saw Michael 4 times in the last 20 years, Janet herself admitted that she didn't see Michael for years, similarly Lisa Marie did not have much of a communication with him.

regardless of how often they met in person, these were the people who knew him the best. he isolated himself, it's not their fault. you know your brother, as you know yourself. I don't know about La Toya, but Janet said she was in contact with Michael all the time. Lisa Marie also said that they'd still call each other etc. You don't stop knowing someone, even if they go on hiatus for years. They're your blood and family.

The question is how much of what LaToya, Lisa Marie and Janet have said can actually be believed. Their stories tend to change depending on how public opinion of Michael changes. Are we expected to believe Michael told them he was in fear for his life when he had distanced himself from all three of them over the past few decades?

I don't like when words and motives get twisted around like this. Even if it were true that their stories had changed, it'd prove nothing. Michael's stories changed all the time too, it's not uncommon when you're talking to a member of the media. What matches up in all 3 of their stories is that Michael was afraid, and Michael felt "they" were after his catalogue. He certainly wouldn't tell that to a person he doesn't trust. Even if you believe nothing else, I think the fear Michael had was the absolute truth. As for him isolating himself from everyone... We don't know why.

Do we disregard the fact they also said he was a pedophile; a manipulating master who used marriage to control the press reporting about him. Did he have ulterior motives for his actions and resist repeated attempts at addiction interventions? In addition to telling them he was in fear of his life was he also in total denial he had a serious drug problem? Wouldn’t Michael tell the media, the police and members of his security force he was afraid? Why have none of these sorces confirmed he expressed these concerns?

Too many questions without answers. Dunno, won't know. Best to accept it.

 

[Rhilo]

Are some people actually questioning Michael's innocence here? :busted:

 

[Bonnie Blue]

That being said Michael mentioned conspiracy and his conspiracy was about his catalogs. He believed people wanted them.

Only time i know about when somebody was hellbent on wresting control of mj's catalogue from him was during the trial and randy and his financier pal, don stabler, was trying to strongarm mj into selling it. So if we're going by the theory that the atv catalogue was the goal of the anti-mj conspiracy, it seems randy is right in the frame. Does that help at all?

 

[Victory22]

I have always felt that something was wrong with the will & I liked the sound of "fake, flawed & fraudulent" so that is why I used it. I do not think he would ever have put in a clause that if one of his loved ones KJ or any of his children were to challenge the will, they would be disinherited.

Michael was a very smart man and he knew Joe and the cubs would try to talk mother into challenging his will so he put the disinheritance claws in to stop her dead in her tracks. LOL! Love my brilliant MJ!

 

[Victory22]

regardless of how often they met in person, these were the people who knew him the best. he isolated himself, it's not their fault. you know your brother, as you know yourself. I don't know about La Toya, but Janet said she was in contact with Michael all the time. Lisa Marie also said that they'd still call each other etc. You don't stop knowing someone, even if they go on hiatus for years. They're your blood and family.

I don't like when words and motives get twisted around like this. Even if it were true that their stories had changed, it'd prove nothing. Michael's stories changed all the time too, it's not uncommon when you're talking to a member of the media. What matches up in all 3 of their stories is that Michael was afraid, and Michael felt "they" were after his catalogue. He certainly wouldn't tell that to a person he doesn't trust. Even if you believe nothing else, I think the fear Michael had was the absolute truth. As for him isolating himself from everyone... We don't know why.


Too many questions without answers. Dunno, won't know. Best to accept it.

I accept the fact that LaToya, Lisa and Janet are talking out of the side of their hats and know nothing about what was going on with Michael. Even more to the point is the fact that they didn't care.

 

[Victory22]

Are some people actually questioning Michael's innocence here? :busted:

Not me our Michael proved that everything he tried to tell the world was the absolute truth.

 

[Ashtanga]

:blink:

 

[JustMe00]

Are some people actually questioning Michael's innocence here? :busted:

Dunno what you're referring to, but I wasn't / am not.

 

[Bubs]

Simple. Debilitating grief was taken advantage of.

I had forgotten the infamous The Jackson's a Family Dynasty tv series.
That was filmed before and after Michael's death, and I missed debilitating grief other than Jermaine was crying how he was left behind with Motown. Frankly, there were not much grief at all as they started gearing up with all the business opportunities that Michael's death offered them, and still do.

 

[Bonnie Blue]

I had forgotten the infamous The Jackson's a Family Dynasty tv series.

It's coming back to channel 5 next month - the greed, the money, the glamour. Actually it's dallas, but same type of thing, different family.

 

[ivy]

I do not think he would ever have put in a clause that if one of his loved ones KJ or any of his children were to challenge the will, they would be disinherited.

It's a very standard clause used in many wills. Without that - especially in high value estates - everyone would have challenged the will endlessly. Plus that clause is irrelevant as the judge had allowed Katherine to challenge the executors WITHOUT getting disinherited. She didn't do it.

regardless of how often they met in person, these were the people who knew him the best. he isolated himself, it's not their fault. you know your brother, as you know yourself. I don't know about La Toya, but Janet said she was in contact with Michael all the time. Lisa Marie also said that they'd still call each other etc. You don't stop knowing someone, even if they go on hiatus for years. They're your blood and family.

I disagree based on life experience. I was at another country away from my family for 5 years. Although I did keep in contact pretty regularly I didn't know my brother as I knew myself and he didn't know me as he knew himself. There was distance among us, we were living two different lives and our exchanges and knowledge was limited. He didn't know my biggest heartache and how it changed me until years later and I didn't know how the struggle of a new life changed him until years later when we were again in close proximity and having heart to hearts. For example due to fall out I haven't seen a part of my family (uncles / aunts) for over a decade, I cannot be able to tell you the first thing about them. Similarly I have no idea about what's going on in my ex-fiance's head even though we are friends on social networks and talk occasionally.

Just because people are related does not mean they automatically know the person. People change. The knowledge all depends on how close people are and what are their exchanges like.

For example Latoya might know the 70s Michael better than anyone as they have been real close but she says she didn't see him or talk to him directly for 15+ years and then says one of the 3 times she saw him was when she randomly ran into him while shopping I can call her claims of knowing Michael a BS.

 

[Bubs]

^^
I fully agree with Ivy's post. I'm in the same position, I've been living in the different country than my siblings for 12 years, and without going too much into detail, I know things are different from what they were 12 years ago.

 

[MIST]

You don´t have to live in other countries than your siblings to live separate lifes.
We are not exactly the same persons when we are older than when we were children or teenagers
Life is a school and we all learn from it and change.
You can be close to your siblings but there still can be things you can´t talk about,you can have a duty of confidentiality ,it could be other things you don´t talk about in the interest of other persons.
Actually I don´t always know what my own reaction will be to things so I don´t even know myself 100%.

 

[Bubs]

It's coming back to channel 5 next month - the greed, the money, the glamour. Actually it's dallas, but same type of thing, different family.

It was fascinating viewing to watch Jermaine turn everything about himself, me me me me me me:doh:
Crying about siblings leaving him to Motown was priceless comedy
I had to remind myself that this happen 1975, and it still makes him cry, not to mention, it was his own fault but still blames others.
Some things never change, its is always someone else's fault.:wacko:

 

[la_cienega]

As for him isolating himself from everyone... We don't know why.

I thought Paris summed it up best when someone told her via twitter, "Now people understand why Michael stayed away from his family," and she said "EXACTLY!" and also favorited a couple of comments like that.

So, you choose to not know, whereas one of the only people who had full time contact with Michael seems to understand full well.

 

[Bubs]

Michael didn't isolate himself from "everyone", just from certain people.
Everyone is entitled to select the people they want in their lives, this includes Michael too.

 

[TheChosenOne]

My brother and I live in the same house and he knows absolutely nothing about my life. Nothing. The notion that blood makes people closer and forever bonded may be true in some cases. But it does not apply in all.

 

[Victory22]

I have a sister and we live in the same state but have only spoken to each other a handful of times over the past 10 years. The first time we actually saw each other in 15 years was June 2, 2012 at my nephews wedding. She knows almost nothing about my life over the years accept what she has heard from others.

 

[Ashtanga]

:ermm:

 

[jrsfan]

Klein on the will:

[h=1]Howard Weitzman and his best friend Harvey Levin or how you buy tourist buses in LA[/h] Posted on August 25, 2012 by AWKMD

Howard Weitzman and Harvey Levin Part Part 1
While covering the O.J. Simpson case for KCBS-TV in Los Angeles, Levin reported that prosecutor Marcia Clark had entered Simpson’s residence before a search warrant had been executed. When Levin was proven wrong, he attempted to blame his mistake on a technician who “mis-timed” the video’s clock during the editing process, however the original lawyer was Howard Weitzman! His action almost got the case dismissed.


Howard Weitzman and Harvey Levin Part 2
TMZ posted my totally incorrect illegally released medical records of Michael Jackson on TV as the lawyers were settling MJJ’s estate with a Will that is absolutely erroneous. It was signed on 7/7/02 in LA while Mjj, Al Sharpton and I were were in New York and Michael was speaking in Harlem.

 

[Petrarose]

Haaa. This thread...

 

[Ashtanga]

Haaa. This thread...

:fear: