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Prelim Hearing-4/1/11 Discussion Thread-All discussion here

  • Thread starter elusive moonwalker
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gerryevans said:
I'm no Karen fan, but you tend to remember if you've been yelled at, and the person doing the yelling might not even think that's what they did.
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If it were somebody else, I "may" agree with you, but since we are talking about Karen Faye, I chose Kenny Ortega's testimony over her's.

In my opinion, her CREDIBILITY has been an issue from Day 1 and this is not the first time she has said something that is not true.

I'm down with the Shanti, Shanti (LOL), but I don't trust Karen Faye, she has her OWN agenda and in my opinion, it has nothing to do with "Justice For Michael Jackson."
 
I don't know who to believe Kenny or Karen. I am scared that people who say they love Michael will end up helping Murray somehow. I want him held responsible for his actions.
 
LOS ANGELES (AP) — Choreographer Kenny Ortega, the last person to work with Michael Jackson on his ill-fated concert tour, has told a Los Angeles judge that the superstar seemed unwell and not in condition six days before he died, and went home early from rehearsals at his suggestion.

The testimony Tuesday came in a preliminary hearing to determine if Jackson’s physician, Dr. Conrad Murray, stands trial on a charge of involuntary manslaughter for administering the powerful anesthetic propofol to the singer to help him sleep.

Ortega says that the morning after Jackson left rehearsal early he was summoned to Jackson’s home and was told by Murray to not try to be Jackson’s doctor or psychiatrist. He says Murray suggested Jackson should not have been sent home because he was physically and emotionally fine.

Murray has pleaded not guilty.

http://www.suntimes.com/entertainment/3152212-417/jackson-murray-hearing-manslaughter-michael.html
 
Karen Faye was telling everyone Michael weighed 108 pounds. Michael's autopsy proved that there was nothing wrong with him she was the one saying Michael was so sick and when the autopsy came out she said it was a lie.
 
athina_livadi said:
I have both Karen Faye's twits and Kenny's from back then!
Hare are Karen's twits, what a happy woman she was!
I really think she is disgusting and doesn't have what it takes to stand up for Michael
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Thanks for those. The quote that always makes me smh is the June 27th one. For someone who honestly felt her friend had been killed or worked/pressured to death, she seems rather calm and positive about his reasons for doing the shows. It's only after a certain group started bombarding her with questions and accusations that she started going the "he was killed" route. Whatever.

I think she accounts for some truthful events. However, she's been wishy washy about quite a few things that give me pause. So I take what she says with a grain of salt until I get corraboration from someone I deem more credible (credible in my eyes, at least).
 
This is a legal court case, Karen shouldn't be running to twitter everytime. It can prove to be detrimental to the case as a whole.
 
Seems like Karen's lost in her own delusion about what's right and wrong... she should get on with her life. A make-up artist isn't the same as a long-time friend, she has no right to speak on Michael's behalf. All she's doing is stirring.
 
ivy;3172609 said:
LOS ANGELES (AP) — Choreographer Kenny Ortega, the last person to work with Michael Jackson on his ill-fated concert tour, has told a Los Angeles judge that the superstar seemed unwell and not in condition six days before he died, and went home early from rehearsals at his suggestion.

The testimony Tuesday came in a preliminary hearing to determine if Jackson’s physician, Dr. Conrad Murray, stands trial on a charge of involuntary manslaughter for administering the powerful anesthetic propofol to the singer to help him sleep.

Ortega says that the morning after Jackson left rehearsal early he was summoned to Jackson’s home and was told by Murray to not try to be Jackson’s doctor or psychiatrist. He says Murray suggested Jackson should not have been sent home because he was physically and emotionally fine.

Murray has pleaded not guilty.

http://www.suntimes.com/entertainment/3152212-417/jackson-murray-hearing-manslaughter-michael.html
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I remember a video about TII before this movie aried from the october 2009 where Kenny was saying that Michael was helathy, happy and ready to perform. LIAR.
AEG will blame Murray for everything to cover their own asses.
 
Justthefacts said:
Karen Faye was telling everyone Michael weighed 108 pounds. Michael's autopsy proved that there was nothing wrong with him she was the one saying Michael was so sick and when the autopsy came out she said it was a lie.
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Thank you for pointing that out, I had forgotten about the "108" pounds story Karen was spreading, getting the fans all up-in-arms and then her version of the story turned out not to be true.

And that's one of the reasons I said, her credibility has been an issue since Day 1.

LOL! Now of course, everything will be deemed a lie by Ms. Faye. Looks like the chickens have come home to roost!
 
I've either eaten my dinner too fast or reading all these updates is not doing me any good :( Hate having to relive all these moments :cry:
 
Big Apple2 said:
If it were somebody else, I "may" agree with you, but since we are talking about Karen Faye, I chose Kenny Ortega's testimony over her's.

In my opinion, her CREDIBILITY has been an issue from Day 1 and this is not the first time she has said something that is not true.

I'm down with the Shanti, Shanti (LOL), but I don't trust Karen Faye, she has her OWN agenda and in my opinion, it has nothing to do with "Justice For Michael Jackson."
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I know. She's a flake. But when Kenny says, they never talked, that's hard to believe. Never talk about his condition? Believable.

That's why I'm saying maybe it's the specific issue he's referring to when he says they never talked.
 
marebear said:
I don't know who to believe Kenny or Karen. I am scared that people who say they love Michael will end up helping Murray somehow. I want him held responsible for his actions.
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Actually, absolutely nobody is obligated to 'take sides' or to do anything that somebody else tells them to do.

They only obligation I see here is to keep an open mind so that the actual truth may unfurl.

And that truth might not be in anyone's 'possession' but sort of has to be gleaned in a process.

That's why I find it completely counterproductive to vilify or love someone beyond the pale here.

I want the truth, not pledge unnecessary allegiance to any one witness called to testify. (which is why I find it these twitter rants so irritating, people have so much BS going on among each other)

My loyalty belongs to Michael, his children and those that truly love him.
 
but why did michael let karen faye a part of this tour? if she is like you said????

And i thought fans went to stapples centre to say to michael they are concerned? and the topic about the this is it movie was that he looked fragil and thin,,,

so that is not good for the pros. and good for the defense right?

i dont understand it right maybe but i got the feeling the whole michael was fine thing is not a good way, because a lot of fans doubted that... where is the hulk (logan?) in this? he trained michael?

he autopsy said propofol overdoses, then it does not mathher right if he was fine or not???
 
Asedora said:
I remember a video about TII before this movie aried from the october 2009 where Kenny was saying that Michael was helathy, happy and ready to perform. LIAR.
AEG will blame Murray for everything to cover their own asses.
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Because Michael was not feeling well on one or more occasion does not mean that he was not in generally good health. There are days when I feel like crap but I do not run to the doctor because not feeling well does not necessarily mean that I am at death's door!
 
This is just all to heartbreaking....to listen of the accounts from Michael's last few days...how he was when the paramedics got there....its all to much., Murray didn't give a shit about Michael.
 
I've always believed that's exactly what Murray did. He convinced MJ he would address the issue instead of encouraging MJ to get proper medical treatment in a hospital because he didn't want his cover blown. h
Soundmind said:
Ok, it seems the defense is going to use all the family supporters to impeach the prosecution witnesses. Ortega told investigators they sent MJ to get some rest and Murray was against that, was telling them he was fine. Maybe that's what he told MJ after he called Lee.
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The Lost Child said:
Karen Faye

On Tuesday 4th January 2011, @wingheart said:

The prosecution is not "really" on Michael's side. You must understand that. They are only about winning the case for the state. So they will only submit what they know THEY can win.
http://www.twitlonger.com/show/7u10h6
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Karen just needs to shut it. She has proven herself to be anything BUT credible. I guess to show they are "really" on Michael's side they needed to state that despite all MEDICAL evidence Michael was a frail, controlled, drugged up, frightened man who wasn't in his right mind. **rolls eyes** I trust Kenny Ortega and the Prosecution rather than any so-called friend or so-called "close" family member.

So again, KAREN SHUT IT!
 
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as asedora says

remember a video about TII before this movie aried from the october 2009 where Kenny was saying that Michael was helathy, happy and ready to perform. LIAR.
"
Thats what my post meant although im not calling him a liar i just dont understand the whole switsching of storys..

one he was fine
then he wasnt fine
then he was fine
now he was not fine but the are saying in pros he was fine..
so strange
 
Asedora said:
I remember a video about TII before this movie aried from the october 2009 where Kenny was saying that Michael was helathy, happy and ready to perform. LIAR.
AEG will blame Murray for everything to cover their own asses.
Click to expand...

Well, the June 19th situation has been the only one of it's nature, mentioned so far. So if he had one day where he didn't feel well and couldn't rehearse, but was fine all the other days, that doesn't make Kenny a liar, now does it?

Ingelief said:
but why did michael let karen faye a part of this tour? if she is like you said????

And i thought fans went to stapples centre to say to michael they are concerned? and the topic about the this is it movie was that he looked fragil and thin,,,

so that is not good for the pros. and good for the defense right?

i dont understand it right maybe but i got the feeling the whole michael was fine thing is not a good way, because a lot of fans doubted that... where is the hulk (logan?) in this? he trained michael?

he autopsy said propofol overdoses, then it does not mathher right if he was fine or not???
Click to expand...

Lou Ferrigno was training Michael for the tour, not Hulk Hogan.
 
xthunderx2 said:
This is just all to heartbreaking....to listen of the accounts from Michael's last few days...how he was when the paramedics got there....its all to much., Murray didn't give a shit about Michael.
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Not at all. He was too busy covering his a$$.
 
We all have our good and bad days! Michael was stressed and excited about the concerts. Not feeling well from time to time isn't a tomb stone!
 
Ingelief said:
but if kenny said he wasnt fine the 20 and two days later and then he was fine again.. that means that there was something wrong with michael right? and that is a good statement for the defense?

where would that video be?
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IMO, there's nothing wrong with someone being "not fine" one day and "fine" days later. How many of us are "fine" everyday? You can't someone is of ill health just becuz they feel bad. People get sick, have aches and pains for whatever reason, have incompetent doctors giving them God-only-knows-what, that may contribute to them being "not fine" for a particular time. The point is Michael was, for the most part, healthy. Whatever was making him feel bad or ill was not becuz of poor overall health, it was becuz of whatever Murray was giving him or doing to him. Add to that the fact that when he's rehearsing or channeling, he doesn't sleep, eat, etc. Sigh.

Sometimes I wonder WHY did he agree to do ANY shows. There must have been other ways to give his career/finances a boost and Heal the World. :(
 
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