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Janet Jackson on Dateline - Sunday, Feb.13th

Maybe Janet isn't grieving or doesn't feel sad because she no longer looked at MJ as her brother.. Didn't she say on Oprah last year that she 'lost Michael as a brother around the Thriller era'.. If she no longer saw him as a brother she was close to maybe that's why she doesn't feel any sorrow over his death. This is the only thing that I can come up with as far as her attitude towards MJ.
 
Alayasha said:
Self esteem is internal, it is how YOU feel about yourself. Yes, others can say things that can compound the problem. However, the problem existed before the comments. For example, I don't know if you've ever seen an overweight person wearing a revealing outfit in the midst of snide comments, snickers, etc. Some people may internalize that while there are some who are comfortable within themselves not to give a damn what others think. Janet has had many people tell her she's beautiful. Yet, she chose to internalize the few bad comments, possibly made worse because they were said by family. To me, somewhere along the way, someone with importance and authority in her life ingrained in her the her self worth was dictated by her body image and she choses to hold on to anything that re-enforces that. Again, no one can go into your concious mind and take your self worth. If being told she's beautiful didn't boost her self esteem, being called a cow didn't take it away. Her inner voice was formed by something toxic and that inner voice is shaped as we are infacts and toddlers and it's re-enforced throughout our lifes. So I disagree with you, as an adult one should take ownership of one's life. Access your childhood baggage and dump the junk that's weighing you down. Its easier said than done but its necessary and no one else can do it for you.
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I agree with you. But not 100%. Yes your self esteem is how you view yourself... But we as people get some of our self esteem based off on how others view us. If from ten you are being told that you need to lose weight and that we have to bind your breast down because that too big, it will have an effect on you and it will help start to create a distorted view of ones self that they are inadequate. I also think that the environment she was in(Hollywood) and the fact that she is an entertainer helped. I read something about how she went to some camp to lose weight around the time of control. I'm sure there was pressure for her to be slimmer. Also to me, being told you're beautiful isn't something that should raise you're self esteem.

StacyJ said:
Maybe Janet isn't grieving or doesn't feel sad because she no longer looked at MJ as her brother.. Didn't she say on Oprah last year that she 'lost Michael as a brother around the Thriller era'.. If she no longer saw him as a brother she was close to maybe that's why she doesn't feel any sorrow over his death. This is the only thing that I can come up with as far as her attitude towards MJ.
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Janet never said she wasn't grieving or feeling sad. She actually said the opposite. Yea she said she felt she lost him as a brother around thriller. She wasn't saying that she didn't view him as her brother anymore though. During thriller and after they weren't as close as they were before
 
ginvid said:
She said nothing catastrophic, but she did say sonething that wad incorrect (even though that was explained in PM that that was not what was meant).
And you are incorrect, it was not Kathetine's religion that "constricted" her so that she stayed with Joe. It was because she chose to. Do Not put the blame on JW's for Kath's actions.But yes, Tipareth, after you explained yourself, I can day I undetstand. It is easy to come to misunderstandings over computers. But when we are open to listening, we explain ourselves and we get over it. And when we mistakenly offend there is nothing wrong with apologizing. It really shows your humility. And, it is admirable.:)

You are very sweet and I am grateful for that. :wub:
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She's not putting the blame on religion, but saying it may have been an influencing factor. Actions of religious people are shaped by their religious teachings/convictions
 
Alayasha said:
I understand what you are saying. I think most of us are use to seeing all of a person's "problems" die with them and all of their good qualities celebrated. Even Richard Nixon received this treatment after his death. I think one of the problems is that we try to compare how Janet should honor her brother based on how youy or I would act. One very telling statement she made to Oprah is that she had lost Michael as a brother around the time of Thriller. I know there are some who will interpret her words based on what they believe she meant or what they want her to mean; however, I will take Janet at her word. She chose her words deliberately. She didn't say they lost closeness or couldn't spend as much time together, she said she lost him as a brother. If he ceased being like a brother, emotionally, what was he to her at point? Maybe this could explain why she isn't responding like many expect a sister to do. Also, as Michael's body lay in thee freezer at FL for weeks, a family friend/relative gave an interview to a paper and the person seemed livid. He/she said that the Jackson's were fighting over where to bury him, etc... and they treated Michael more like a celebrity than a brother. I will try to find this article when I get home because it can explain a lot about what we are seeing now.

As far as Janet's book is concerned, she has every right to tell her story and I think most mature people would agree that derogatory name calling is wrong. I don't know if she discusses it in her book and it has been ignored by the media but there has been some big issues abscent from her interviews. Namely, the role of the parents, teasing/name-calling being accepted in her family. Also, when Michael knew better, he apologized. Noone can un-say something so the best Janet could get was an apology. Finally, self-esteem is just that, self-esteem. No one can take your self esteem, you give it away. Hopefully she discovers what it is within her to internalize negativity and take ownership of it. That's not her brothers fault, that's all her own. The pics of Michael that she told Oprah that she loves to look at all come from the period that she says he called her those names so there is something much deeper than the name calling going on.
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She did say the bolded part. I also agree with everything you wrote.

I wonder if she told him that over the years.

If she no longer saw him as her brother, that might explain their behaviour and her not mourning his death.

When you add everything together, a sad & disturbing picture is emerging of Michael's relationship with those that are called his family.
 
Well I've been saying for a long time Memefan that something was very disturbing about the way the family reacted to MJ's death. I've never in my life seen a family that acted the way they did over a murdered family member. First thing they thought about, including Katherine was the will.. And then after that they all went on tv spewing about his alleged painkiller addiction and other crap before they even knew how or what he died from. It was very sad and I realized then what MJ had been through all of those years with his evil and abusive father who used him to death and his so called meek and mild mother who also used him for her benefit and the benefit of her other children.

It's just sad all the way around and I hope MJ is resting in peace!! He deserves it because Lord knows he couldn't get it here on earth and his family did nothing to give him peace
 
ginvid said:
And you are incorrect, it was not Kathetine's religion that "constricted" her so that she stayed with Joe. It was because she chose to. Do Not put the blame on JW's for Kath's actions.
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0..0 I was simply trying to comfort that poster, who also happens to be my friend and has got enough serious problems to worry about, that she doesn't need more unnecessary pain and being put down for expressing her opinion. Esp since she did that humbly.

And, unless you were in Katherine Jackson's mind to be able to determine for certain, 100 % sure, what influenced all her decisions in life regarding Joseph (the 'head' of the family), you can't ask of others to feel a certain way. 'Do Not put the blame'? That's a bit off and defensive to say, if you ask me, for I wasn't putting any blame, just expressing an opinion.

..

Here's something to find offensive from another poster:

"What a hypocritical &^%$*

She wrote that for MJ's fans...I hope none of you will pick up that hot mess.

[...]

The mourning continues....my ASS!!!!"

That certainly isn't an opinion, so I hope sth can be done about this type of Ongoing poison that is recurrent around here. No matter how one feels inside about a person, and no matter how right they are to think that they are wrong, heinous comments like that never did any good to anyone, it's just counterproductive meanness that incites to similar emotions in some others. For really, when one keeps on being mean about others, say, even though, they deserve to be mean about, they're no better than those they criticize using bad words or saying hateful comments, they're just succombing in their safe darkness, when there are better ways to not be accepting crap from others. ..
 
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Alayasha said:
Self esteem is internal, it is how YOU feel about yourself. Yes, others can say things that can compound the problem. However, the problem existed before the comments. For example, I don't know if you've ever seen an overweight person wearing a revealing outfit in the midst of snide comments, snickers, etc. Some people may internalize that while there are some who are comfortable within themselves not to give a damn what others think. Janet has had many people tell her she's beautiful. Yet, she chose to internalize the few bad comments, possibly made worse because they were said by family. To me, somewhere along the way, someone with importance and authority in her life ingrained in her the her self worth was dictated by her body image and she choses to hold on to anything that re-enforces that. Again, no one can go into your concious mind and take your self worth. If being told she's beautiful didn't boost her self esteem, being called a cow didn't take it away. Her inner voice was formed by something toxic and that inner voice is shaped as we are infacts and toddlers and it's re-enforced throughout our lifes. So I disagree with you, as an adult one should take ownership of one's life. Access your childhood baggage and dump the junk that's weighing you down. Its easier said than done but its necessary and no one else can do it for you.
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i agree with ur both post.
 
mijaons said:
She's not putting the blame on religion, but saying it may have been an influencing factor. Actions of religious people are shaped by their religious teachings/convictions
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Alma said:
0..0 I was simply trying to comfort that poster, who also happens to be my friend and has got enough serious problems to worry about, that she doesn't need more unnecessary pain and being put down for expressing her opinion. Esp since she did that humbly.

And, unless you were in Katherine Jackson's mind to be able to determine for certain, 100 % sure, what influenced all her decisions in life regarding Joseph (the 'head' of the family), you can't ask of others to feel a certain way. 'Do Not put the blame'? That's a bit off and defensive to say, if you ask me, for I wasn't putting any blame, just expressing an opinion.

..

Here's something to find offensive from another poster:

"What a hypocritical &^%$*

She wrote that for MJ's fans...I hope none of you will pick up that hot mess.

[...]

The mourning continues....my ASS!!!!"

That certainly isn't an opinion, so I hope sth can be done about this type of Ongoing poison that is recurrent around here. No matter how one feels inside about a person, and no matter how right they are to think that they are wrong, heinous comments like that never did any good to anyone, it's just counterproductive meanness that incites to similar emotions in some others. For really, when one keeps on being mean about others, say, even though, they deserve to be mean about, they're no better than those they criticize using bad words or saying hateful comments, they're just succombing in their safe darkness, when there are better ways to not be accepting crap from others. ..
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You are both now taking what I said as way off base. So I will apologize and I will make myself clear. I can tell you 100% without being in Kath's mind that her religion did not influence her staying by Joseph despite all of the crap he did. In order for her religion to influence her one way or the other, it has to be some edict or rule in the religion to make her go a certain way.

For instance, If a person wanted to have an abortion, but their religion teaches that it is wrong, a person who chooses not to have one is being influenced by their religion in whatever decision they make. Or if a person wanted to have sex before marriage and chose not to, they are being influenced by their religion in their decisions. Well, it wasn't because of a religious conviction but because of a personal conviction that Katherine stayed. How can I explain this? In the Bible we have laws and we have principles. We have things that we are told expressly not to do and then we have things that we personally put upon ourselves because of how our conscience guides us. The "law" is that once you marry, you are bound to your husband or wife until death. Howveer, if one of them is unfaithful, you may divorce and remarry. Katherine was not by law obligated to stay with Joe, if she did, it was because of her decision to do so.

Katherine choosing to stay with joseph was not because of a teaching from JW's, it was not because of a law or because she "had to" or was prevented by some teaching of theirs to do so. It was because Katherine, for whatever personal reason decided to do so. That is the ultimate reason. And there have been many people on the board who have said straight out, "Katherine stayed with Joe because she was a JW and she had to". Or "that it was something in the religious teachings that made it difficult for Katherine to leave or 'constricted' her". It would be incorrect for anyone to say that. And that is initially what I though Tiarepeth was trying to say, and it is what many others thought she was trying to say as well, hence the feedback from the comments after her statement.

However, as I said, she sent me a PM to clear up and she apologized in the thread which was very sweet of her to do since she realized so many took it the wrong way. I'm sorry Tiarepeth is having a hard time now, but you have no idea what other members on here go through on a daily basis either. You have no idea what may be driving a person to respond a certain way because of what they have to face. Tiarepeth seems to understand this and so she apologized not wanting to offend where this was not the intent. Your wanting to comfort her does not have to be at the expense of others on the thread who so obviously misunderstood what she was trying to say. Who are you to demean their opinions and act as if they are nothing? Or say something is too extreme or blown out of proportion? That comment of yours is what I was reacting to.

But anyway, this is getting too way off topic. I am always open to PMs if you want to discuss this in any depth.
 
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mijaons said:
She's not putting the blame on religion, but saying it may have been an influencing factor. Actions of religious people are shaped by their religious teachings/convictions
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To say it may have been an influencing factor is one thing but to say witnessses believe this or that is something different altogether. There are divorced witnesses and on many issues Katherine does as she chooses. I understand what the poster was trying to say but she stated witnesses believed something specific which was inaccurate and witnesses are still individuals with their own power of choice.
 
I agree with the insider who said Jacksons treat MJ like a celebrity. I think they were greatly impacted by his success which really is incomparable to other artists. I think they stopped knowing how to relate to him. Still as a fellow human being they should know how cold and disrespectful they come across highlighting what they feel are his shortcomings with very little emphasis on his good points. I think they are very angry and resentful as a whole and should just not say more about MJ. As far as Janet I think her comments have improved but the damage is done for me.
 
yaazgurl said:
To say it may have been an influencing factor is one thing but to say witnessses believe this or that is something different altogether. There are divorced witnesses and on many issues Katherine does as she chooses. I understand what the poster was trying to say but she stated witnesses believed something specific which was inaccurate and witnesses are still individuals with their own power of choice.
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I am apologising one more time. Please, I was so exhausted and feeling ill when I've wrote this anyway... I am so sorry... :( On top of this I am not English native, maybe from here comes part of me not explaining better enough...

My intention was not to single YW religion out.

My personal opinion ( and I am free to have one, I hope )
is that in many religions are texts that enhance the superiority of men. Priesthood for example is mostly a man job and duty and women are kept away of this. For centuries and centuries, till now. Only now some things slightly begin to change in some religions not all... Some women get very passive if they are too much into religion at some point in their life, or their upbringing. Psychologists wrote studies on this, is nothing new...


It was not a bad critic, it was just reflection and observation on some realities... I am a person that admires and study religions, I believe in God, and respect different religions, beliefs, and wants to know them more and more, but I cannot pretend that I do not see what's poking me in the eye... obvious facts.... that are very alike in many religions. I am into comparative religious studies, reading and trying to see what's is common or different in them...

Also, discussing Katherine, I didn't want to say this is the cause, this is the only cause. Only that it's one of the causes... it might explain some things... Even Mike spoke about some problems he got because of religious stuff.... was he wrong bringing it up? was he crossing borders? is it interdicted?

Anyway one again sorry and please forgive me, is was not my intention. God bless you all. :angel:
 
ginvid said:
However, as I said, she sent me a PM to clear up and she apologized in the thread which was very sweet of her to do since she realized so many took it the wrong way. I'm sorry Tiarepeth is having a hard time now, but you have no idea what other members on here go through on a daily basis either. You have no idea what may be driving a person to respond a certain way because of what they have to face. Tiarepeth seems to understand this and so she apologized not wanting to offend where this was not the intent. Your wanting to comfort her does not have to be at the expense of others on the thread who so obviously misunderstood what she was trying to say. Who are you to demean their opinions and act as if they are nothing? Or say something is too extreme or blown out of proportion? That comment of yours is what I was reacting to.
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Thank you for all the JW history. Though, we didn't ask for it, esp since you've already clarified on some of their teachings before to make the Katherine point. I was simply making an opinion that You blew out of proportion. Not anyone else.

Where did I claim I know what other members here go through? Is it okay for some to call others, be they Jackson family members, hypocritical in that way, and curse them out? Like this happens all the time on this subforum? Do They have the right to be demeaning them constantly and, say, stoop to their level? Demeaning members' opinions? .. And I don't have the right to be against that? I think you may have some personal misunderstanding going on or dislike of me to be jumping on my throat like that. You once accused me of pushing my own agenda in my posts and other lying crap like that. How was that a fair thing to do? What are you doing now?... Take it to PM, though, please, don't turn this thread into a circus. Who am I? Somebody. Who are You? Somebody. This is a discussion forum, and people - different people - have got opinions to express, and even truths. You exposed the truth about the JW at large, so others have the right to share theirs too. Not venomously, like it often happens on here, but within some moral terms, which Tipareth, for instance, did. And she is still apologizing for her opinion. ...That is extreme, to be venomous and spiteful, like it so happens on this subforum and I pointed that out. And I have the right, just as everyone else on a forum said to follow freedom of speech and some moral values (that Michael Jackson, for instance, would have in plenty), to say that it is extreme when others continuously spread their hatred in every single thread. Yeah, we do have that right, thank you for allowing us.

I appreciate the apologies, btw...


ginvid said:
But anyway, this is getting too way off topic. I am always open to PMs if you want to discuss this in any depth.
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Yeah, it is. .. And okay, this rhymes with my own suggestion above. So thank you. ..
 
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Tipareth said:
I am apologising one more time. Please, I was so exhausted and feeling ill when I've wrote this anyway... I am so sorry... :( On top of this I am not English native, maybe from here comes part of me not explaining better enough...

My intention was not to single YW religion out.

My personal opinion ( and I am free to have one, I hope )

It was not a bad critic, it was just reflection and observation on some realities...


Anyway one again sorry and please forgive me, is was not my intention. God bless you all. :angel:
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I hope it's clear enough for some.

And again, please don't apologize to anyone. Not anew, at least; you have done so even via PM. You have said nothing wrong. You have expressed an opinion, which is what discussions forums are for. A reasonable opinion for that matter too. If others still can't see that, it's their problem, not yours. Who are others to deny you/influence your way of replying that on a public forum? ... You haven't offended anyone's beliefs or religion, and, as I said before, hope that's clear enough now.

....
 
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Alma you can't make blanket statements about whether others have been offended or not. We have a right to respond to erroneous statements made and their have been many. You can't tell people they can't express their opinion on Jcksons and then insist others are not offended when their religion is misrepresented.
 
Edited,

You know what, that was kind of mean. And, I was upset. I will just PM or just leave it alone.
It's off topic anyway.

Thank you.
 
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Alayasha said:
I understand what you are saying. I think most of us are use to seeing all of a person's "problems" die with them and all of their good qualities celebrated. Even Richard Nixon received this treatment after his death. I think one of the problems is that we try to compare how Janet should honor her brother based on how youy or I would act. One very telling statement she made to Oprah is that she had lost Michael as a brother around the time of Thriller. I know there are some who will interpret her words based on what they believe she meant or what they want her to mean; however, I will take Janet at her word. She chose her words deliberately. She didn't say they lost closeness or couldn't spend as much time together, she said she lost him as a brother. If he ceased being like a brother, emotionally, what was he to her at point? Maybe this could explain why she isn't responding like many expect a sister to do. Also, as Michael's body lay in thee freezer at FL for weeks, a family friend/relative gave an interview to a paper and the person seemed livid. He/she said that the Jackson's were fighting over where to bury him, etc... and they treated Michael more like a celebrity than a brother. I will try to find this article when I get home because it can explain a lot about what we are seeing now.

As far as Janet's book is concerned, she has every right to tell her story and I think most mature people would agree that derogatory name calling is wrong. I don't know if she discusses it in her book and it has been ignored by the media but there has been some big issues abscent from her interviews. Namely, the role of the parents, teasing/name-calling being accepted in her family. Also, when Michael knew better, he apologized. Noone can un-say something so the best Janet could get was an apology. Finally, self-esteem is just that, self-esteem. No one can take your self esteem, you give it away. Hopefully she discovers what it is within her to internalize negativity and take ownership of it. That's not her brothers fault, that's all her own. The pics of Michael that she told Oprah that she loves to look at all come from the period that she says he called her those names so there is something much deeper than the name calling going on.
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thank you for this post...I agree with you.....if that is how Janet feels about Michael...then so be it...she is entitled to her own opinion....that doesn;t mean that I have to agree with it....I really don't know what she bases her opinion on but...its whatever at this point I guess....she should just keep it to herself then...the rest of the world really doesn't want HER opinion on her brother Michael...that she lost during the Thriller era. I think as far as us fans are concerned.....we have heard Michael being judged unfairly enough...we didn't need to hear his own family joining in. And I really feel bad for Janet if she cannot put that name calling behind her...adults need to put childhood things into perspective and move on from them..IF she cannot ...then maybe she should get counseling for it,
 
The way I see it is Janet is entitled to say how her brothers (Michael included) made her feel the same as Michael was allowed to say how his family members made him feel.

I do not necessarily think Michael's intentions were to be cruel to Janet but I could not possibly say that she's making it up when she says it did affect her self esteem as it may well have done, whether Michael intended it to or not. Chances are if she had told him (and maybe she did) how it made her feel, especially in later life, he would have been deeply sorry.

She has talked about this before as I remember reading about this a few years ago, so chances are it was discussed between them.

I can't say I think Janet is just making it up, what reason would she have to do that? She was always very obviously on Michael's side over things as far as I could always tell so I doubt she would make things up maliciously.

We're all mature enough to know Michael was a person and people make mistakes, even really good ones. It seems these things happened when they were children/adolescents and that can be a challenging time where even the nicest kid/teen in the world can do the odd wrong thing.

It hasn't changed my opinion of either Michael or Janet.
 
lifeismagical said:
Mj was a beautiful soul, a humanitarian but he is someone who had a very difficult time loving himself. Part of it was parentage, the other part was societal and then there was the difficulty with finding himself in the mist of such overwhelming fame. He was human a very sensitive one at that, and he was not perfect. He developed strange habits to compensate for his lack of self-love and emotional stability and one of them was wanting and requesting dangerous medical treatments. That would qualify him as a type of addict even if he didn't shoot up herione or do this all of the time. That he would allow himself to undergo such treatment and doctor shop alone is proof. Don't be delusional. Love him as a human being, not as some flawless demi-god. I bet Janet wishes he could have learned self-love before he passed away and so its very fitting that this book is dedicated to him. Maybe true and enlightened fans can learn to stop defending him so much that they lose sight of reality.
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Because i trully want to became an enlightened and true MJ fan can you please tell how this interview by Janet Jackson can help me became one because i don't quite understand it.Maybe i am stupid or something
 
lifeismagical said:
Mj was a beautiful soul, a humanitarian but he is someone who had a very difficult time loving himself. Part of it was parentage, the other part was societal and then there was the difficulty with finding himself in the mist of such overwhelming fame. He was human a very sensitive one at that, and he was not perfect. He developed strange habits to compensate for his lack of self-love and emotional stability and one of them was wanting and requesting dangerous medical treatments. That would qualify him as a type of addict even if he didn't shoot up herione or do this all of the time. That he would allow himself to undergo such treatment and doctor shop alone is proof. Don't be delusional. Love him as a human being, not as some flawless demi-god. I bet Janet wishes he could have learned self-love before he passed away and so its very fitting that this book is dedicated to him. Maybe true and enlightened fans can learn to stop defending him so much that they lose sight of reality.
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If we dont defend him...WHO WILL???? The same people who call him a drug addict....Thats all I want to say!!
 
I don't think MJ needs a whole lot of defending. His legacy speaks for itsself - his immortalized. Sometimes all that defending cauld actually be worse PR for him actually.
 
I just want the media to stop being negative on Michael. They don't care what Jermaine and the other brothers said or did. Just Michael and then it gets twisted and such. Nobody had their character criticised more than Michael did. Everyone has their issues but he kept going and was looking forward to the future when his life was taken from him. Nobody says Janet can't write a book. If she has been planning this for a long time then she finished it. She is aware that the interest is with Michael and no offense to the other brothers. The media take things out of context all the time and she knows that.
 
lifeismagical said:
Mj was a beautiful soul, a humanitarian but he is someone who had a very difficult time loving himself. Part of it was parentage, the other part was societal and then there was the difficulty with finding himself in the mist of such overwhelming fame. He was human a very sensitive one at that, and he was not perfect. He developed strange habits to compensate for his lack of self-love and emotional stability and one of them was wanting and requesting dangerous medical treatments. That would qualify him as a type of addict even if he didn't shoot up herione or do this all of the time. That he would allow himself to undergo such treatment and doctor shop alone is proof. Don't be delusional. Love him as a human being, not as some flawless demi-god. I bet Janet wishes he could have learned self-love before he passed away and so its very fitting that this book is dedicated to him. Maybe true and enlightened fans can learn to stop defending him so much that they lose sight of reality.
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Maybe you should take a break from reading TMZ and learn about self-love yourself.
 
I actually cried this morning watching Janet talk about Joe insisting he call her Joe and not Dad and how she longed for the kind of relationship with her father that her friends had. I've heard this before but it's just so sad. Janet and the other siblings (MJ already was brave enough to speak out) should be more open about this subject (physical and emotional abuse from a parent).
 
lifeismagical is entitled to his/her opinion. However members are encouraged not to presume that their opinion is indeed fact! We have no idea if Michael died without feeling 'self-love'. We have an investigation that indicates that Michael was not 'doctor shopping'. So those are presumptions that should not be stated as fact.

While some may not agree with lifeismagical (myself included) let us disagree in a constructive and respectful way.

On a personal note, I am tired of people assuming that once you are defending Michael you are doing so because you think he was perfect and he could do no wrong. Yes, some fans need Michael to be perfect for their own peculiar reasons. But most of us recognise Michael as a extraordinary HUMAN BEING. He was a HUMAN BEING who was unfairly and consistently maligned for over 20 years. All fans want is for him to be treated fairly and with dignity.

If the wonderfulness (I know it is not a word) was highlighted and discussed as much as the 'negative' side I, for one, would not be as passionate as I am. Instead, what we get is one story after another that blames Michael for everything. He was not perfect but he was also not the unrelenting villain either. What we are seeking is balance! Plain and simple.
 
Memefan said:
Maybe you should take a break from reading TMZ and learn about self-love yourself.
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Ugh, I hate TMZ and I don't like all of the negative, judgmental people that post on there. I can't remember the last time I went to that site. And as for self-love, I'm fortunate enough to have been given the space and time to develop that. I had that ability because I wasn't forced into the limelight at a very young age, I didn't have people telling me who I should be and how I should be all of the time (well except for mom, its easier to ignore one person instead of million people). I did not live behind a prison of fame. I feel for MJ because he was beyond gorgeous inside and out and so is his sister Janet. Its sad that they had to feel self-loathing for so long. I just think its silly that people are attacking everyone and everything in defense of MJ. The media is nuts, its a beast of its own and it will do what it does. We can defend all day but it makes things worse if we deny that MJ did in fact wrestle with his own demons. And he was very brave about acknowledging that.
 
suzynyc said:
I actually cried this morning watching Janet talk about Joe insisting he call her Joe and not Dad and how she longed for the kind of relationship with her father that her friends had. I've heard this before but it's just so sad. Janet and the other siblings (MJ already was brave enough to speak out) should be more open about this subject (physical and emotional abuse from a parent).
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I guess I just never understood why a parent would want their children to call them by their first name and then allow a child by another woman to call them dad.
 
Cool it now. Each and every member are entitled to their own opinion but do not present your opinions as fact and do not talk about Michael doctor shopping. There is no proof of that and any insinuation will not be tolerated.
 
TheChosenOne said:
lifeismagical is entitled to his/her opinion. However members are encouraged not to presume that their opinion is indeed fact! We have no idea if Michael died without feeling 'self-love'. We have an investigation that indicates that Michael was not 'doctor shopping'. So those are presumptions that should not be stated as fact.

While some may not agree with lifeismagical (myself included) let us disagree in a constructive and respectful way.

On a personal note, I am tired of people assuming that once you are defending Michael you are doing so because you think he was perfect and he could do no wrong. Yes, some fans need Michael to be perfect for their own peculiar reasons. But most of us recognise Michael as a extraordinary HUMAN BEING. He was a HUMAN BEING who was unfairly and consistently maligned for over 20 years. All fans want is for him to be treated fairly and with dignity.

If the wonderfulness (I know it is not a word) was highlighted and discussed as much as the 'negative' side I, for one, would not be as passionate as I am. Instead, what we get is one story after another that blames Michael for everything. He was not perfect but he was also not the unrelenting villain either. What we are seeking is balance! Plain and simple.
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Thank you. ...
 
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