love is magical
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Hi H4M, welcome back.
SIM is hauntingly beautiful. I get goosebump every time I hear the song.
BTW, I feel just like your screen name now.
*heading to the manhood thread nowz*
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Hi H4M, welcome back.
SIM is hauntingly beautiful. I get goosebump every time I hear the song.
BTW, I feel just like your screen name now.
*heading to the manhood thread nowz*
Yeah, I wondered the same thing...That's what I'm saying...Did they really pay very close attention to what he wrote?
love is magical
Proud Member
Lol... I guess you answer you own question. She's a dancer so she can do the MJ signature choreography at the end. So much of sticking to the lyrics huh? But, I'm not complaining. I found Sofia great to watch.
I bought two copies of Michael and Vision (iTune and physical disc). I will definitely buy the OTW re-issue; although I have two copies at home now. I also bought a $179 ticket for floor seat for the Cirque Du Soleil Show. I'm actually not too keen on the Cirque show (I fell aslepp once in their show before, oops.) However, I'm still looking forward to it because of Michael. I'm actually very excited about all these projects.
I am, too...Not all of them have been 'questionable'...Vision and Michael were sub par, but I still bought both...I bought TII on both BluRay and DVD...I have a ticket for Cirque as well....I am quite looking forward to it as I've never been to a Cirque show before...
love is magical
Proud Member
I bought the TII BluRay before I own a BluRay disc player. I saw TII 18 times in theatre. If the theatrical run was longer, I'd have seen the film more times. Seeing Michael Jackson in big screen is priceless.
I see myself as a big supporter of the Estate and Sony. But, I can't lie to myself and say "wow... the Vision and the album are great!!!"
Thetruthbetold
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always will love my michael this video is garbage
earthlyme
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:agree:I got you! What you say makes sense. Thats what I meant by if Michael was here, it would've been totally different. But everything is in their hands right now...so...
Thankyou for explaining though!
L.o.v.e.
Romi
:agree:I got you! What you say makes sense. Thats what I meant by if Michael was here, it would've been totally different. But everything is in their hands right now...so...
Thankyou for explaining though!
L.o.v.e.
Romi
Yes, and I've heard some interesting interpretations of the video and what the story is saying...Since Michael isn't here to lend his perfect touch and exact vision, I feel it's even more important for the people involved and responsible in carrying on his legacy to do just that - expose him for the genius he really is...he was a PROFOUND and deep songwriter and I just feel he never gets the credit he so truly deserves in that aspect of his talent...These types of situations, messages, and lyrics meant something to him, deep down...I hate to see this downplayed, so to speak...tricia70
Proud Member
I know some of you don't think the short film was dark enough, but I think it was dark maybe not as dark as Michael wanted it but still dark with a twist. Here is what I mean and my interpretation,
This girl who is going to Hollywood struggles to make it. You see her pretty down when she is waittressing and in the scene before she is doing the strip she is serious and glum, meaning she doesn't want to strip but she needs to survive so she does it anyway. If she seems like she is enjoying herself, well she's got to pretend she is, if she acted like she didn't want to be there she wouldn't be making any money. I do think Michael in his lyrics meant to say that they prostitute themselves to get in, but can you imagine a scene with her having sex w/ a stranger? the fans are already outraged by the strip/pole dance scene, I think it would be total chaos if they would have done a sex scene. So they did go lighter on that part , but it still follows what Michael was trying to say.
This is one twist that I thought was a nice touch in honoring Michael. When she struggles she thinks of Michael (the scene when she is walking and the billboards of Michael come to live is when she is thinking about him and starts smiling because she feels his passion and his courage and tells her not to give up on her dreams (this is just my interpretation).
Tthen she makes it and becomes famous with the paparazzi following her around, and so she is upset about it (maybe thinking this is not what fame what supposed to be) again, this is also the dark side of Hollywood and what Michael was trying to convey in his song.
The second twist is she again (once she becomes famous) goes to Michael for inspiration and support (the scene where she is caressing his star in the walk of fame) and after that you see her with a smile and a spring on her step. Clearly, imo, Michael tells her to have courage like he did and keep going. And at the very end she pays tribute to his idol and mentor for everything he's done for her throughout her life.
This is my interpretation as I see it. I love the whole concept and Michael Ithink is there all over in spirit for her during her rise and while famous. It may not be as dark as the song is conveying, but it is still dark with elements of hope, meaning Michael in it.
Since Michael is not here that may have been the twist for this concept. I thought it was a nice touch and a nice way to honor him. After all, Michael does give hope and inspiration to all his fans every day.
If Michael was here I believe he would have done a storyline with similar elements but w/o him inserted in the story, and yes very dark, but who knows.
This girl who is going to Hollywood struggles to make it. You see her pretty down when she is waittressing and in the scene before she is doing the strip she is serious and glum, meaning she doesn't want to strip but she needs to survive so she does it anyway. If she seems like she is enjoying herself, well she's got to pretend she is, if she acted like she didn't want to be there she wouldn't be making any money. I do think Michael in his lyrics meant to say that they prostitute themselves to get in, but can you imagine a scene with her having sex w/ a stranger? the fans are already outraged by the strip/pole dance scene, I think it would be total chaos if they would have done a sex scene. So they did go lighter on that part , but it still follows what Michael was trying to say.
This is one twist that I thought was a nice touch in honoring Michael. When she struggles she thinks of Michael (the scene when she is walking and the billboards of Michael come to live is when she is thinking about him and starts smiling because she feels his passion and his courage and tells her not to give up on her dreams (this is just my interpretation).
Tthen she makes it and becomes famous with the paparazzi following her around, and so she is upset about it (maybe thinking this is not what fame what supposed to be) again, this is also the dark side of Hollywood and what Michael was trying to convey in his song.
The second twist is she again (once she becomes famous) goes to Michael for inspiration and support (the scene where she is caressing his star in the walk of fame) and after that you see her with a smile and a spring on her step. Clearly, imo, Michael tells her to have courage like he did and keep going. And at the very end she pays tribute to his idol and mentor for everything he's done for her throughout her life.
This is my interpretation as I see it. I love the whole concept and Michael Ithink is there all over in spirit for her during her rise and while famous. It may not be as dark as the song is conveying, but it is still dark with elements of hope, meaning Michael in it.
Since Michael is not here that may have been the twist for this concept. I thought it was a nice touch and a nice way to honor him. After all, Michael does give hope and inspiration to all his fans every day.
If Michael was here I believe he would have done a storyline with similar elements but w/o him inserted in the story, and yes very dark, but who knows.
^^ tricia your very interpretation is exactly what I mean about them downplaying the seriousness of Michael's message. This is his ART; it should LIVE...And this video, to me, shows they didn't want to go down that path and, subsequently, it looked more of a tribute video than anything else. They could have made this very deep and dark (as the songs entails); It's Michael's MESSAGE that's important here, not a tribute to him...A nice way to honour him would be to portray his message/lyrics exactly the way he wrote them..using his handwritten lyrics, too..the profundity in those! They should not be ignored! To me, its like writing a book report and only reading about a quarter of the book. There is so much more to discover with this song. There is so much more to it. This is what disappoints me.
Look at his message in Black or White Panther Dance...The controversy that erupted there! But, he had an important message to get across and he went there! Michael was always about the visual aspect and getting to the crux of the issue - he did whatever he had to do to get his point expressed (when the whole world says NO, you say YES)...That should signal to people it was highly important to him. There are always going to be people ranting about sex in videos, but look at the controversial ones out there nowadays, and a lot of them dont have any deep lyrical message to them at all...
As I have stated a few times already, Michael Jackson is much more than a hat and a glove...Yes, the video portrayed love and inspiration, but that is not what the song is about (its a good thought though, of course, but this has been showcased already in the HMH video) Now, how about we reveal a completely different aspect of Michael Jackson...
These types of songs he writes are a fantastic way of showing THAT aspect of his talent - his songwriting, which I believe he receives very little credit for already. These types of songs he writes are also ways to express his concerns and feelings about all sorts of issues - greed, racism, political activism, neglect, abuse, struggles, prostitution, the plight of children, the earth and its entities etc., etc., etc. The man was very well read and had views, thoughts, and strong feelings about all of the above and more. He was MORE than just a performer.
I want people to remember him for MUCH more than a hat and a glove. I am quoting this from another member:
Whatever you think about Michael Jackson, he was GREATER.
That is all.
Look at his message in Black or White Panther Dance...The controversy that erupted there! But, he had an important message to get across and he went there! Michael was always about the visual aspect and getting to the crux of the issue - he did whatever he had to do to get his point expressed (when the whole world says NO, you say YES)...That should signal to people it was highly important to him. There are always going to be people ranting about sex in videos, but look at the controversial ones out there nowadays, and a lot of them dont have any deep lyrical message to them at all...
As I have stated a few times already, Michael Jackson is much more than a hat and a glove...Yes, the video portrayed love and inspiration, but that is not what the song is about (its a good thought though, of course, but this has been showcased already in the HMH video) Now, how about we reveal a completely different aspect of Michael Jackson...
These types of songs he writes are a fantastic way of showing THAT aspect of his talent - his songwriting, which I believe he receives very little credit for already. These types of songs he writes are also ways to express his concerns and feelings about all sorts of issues - greed, racism, political activism, neglect, abuse, struggles, prostitution, the plight of children, the earth and its entities etc., etc., etc. The man was very well read and had views, thoughts, and strong feelings about all of the above and more. He was MORE than just a performer.
I want people to remember him for MUCH more than a hat and a glove. I am quoting this from another member:
Whatever you think about Michael Jackson, he was GREATER.
That is all.
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love is magical
Proud Member
^Arklove, great post. Whenever I read the quote "However great you think Michael Jackson was, he was greater", I get tears in my eyes. Sam's words cut through my heart.
Michael Jackson himself was full of love and inspirational. The man himself was indeed all about love. If the director wanted to take the liberty and turned Hollywood Tonight into an inspirational story, I can understand. However, by doing so, the filmmaker downplayed Michael's profound song-writing skill - a talent of Michael's that truly deserves more recognition.
Michael Jackson himself was full of love and inspirational. The man himself was indeed all about love. If the director wanted to take the liberty and turned Hollywood Tonight into an inspirational story, I can understand. However, by doing so, the filmmaker downplayed Michael's profound song-writing skill - a talent of Michael's that truly deserves more recognition.
Yes, exactly...The video itself is a nice tribute, but it stifles his legacy....Continuing to rehash a hat, glove, and dancing only suffocates everything else he stood for. That's not continuing the legacy. It's stopping it dead in its tracks. Do we want future generations to only see one or two facets of his mind-blowing talent and extremely abundant career? Doing to this video what SHOULD have been done allows future generations to discover Michael Jackson as an exceptional lyricist and ultimately a real genius.
love is magical
Proud Member
You know what I'm afraid of after seeing the videos of HMH and HT. It seems the trend is to brand Michael Jackson as an extremely good dancer with a good voice. The other facets of his talents are often forgotten. They over-played the signature MJ choreography. The fedora, the glove, the sequin jacket and the dance will become cliche if they incorporate all these elements in all videos. To me, all the billboards with Michael's images and the group dance in the end seem very forced as if the filmmaker is trying to tell the audience THIS IS A MICHAEL JACKSON VIDEO YOU ARE WATCHING.
I hope to be proven wrong and I look forward to see something innovative in the video of BTM.
Yes, I'm looking forward to seeing it as well....It's hard not to be skeptical about it, though lol
souldreamer7
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I don't like the video. I can deal with the video for Hold My Hand. I am hoping Behind The Mask will be better...but...
:wub:
souldreamer7
:wub:
souldreamer7
prettygirlmj
Proud Member
I hope the Cirque Du Soleil Show comes out on DVD because I can't afford tickets to the show. I hope MJ kids go to see it because they love Cirque Du Soleil Show. Michael took them to a few I read.
dangerous_88
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ButterfliesAreFree
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I like the video. I think that the storyline, direction fit the song. I was pleased with the young woman in the video. She did it justice. I think people who are not happy with the video would have something wrong with it, even if Michael had been in it. Let's not forget how some of these same people criticized the wonderful and brilliant video "You Rock My World".
If you go back and read some of the posts, you'll realize that this isn't the case. I explained my reasons a trillion times.
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serendipity
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Nothing to be confused about. Videos don't have to follow the lyrics literally and exactly. In fact I find this type of videos a bit shallow. I like it when the video has a little twist, something that's not explicitly in the lyrics. A little bit of a different interpretation if you will, by either the artist or the director. There's nothing wrong with that and there are plenty of videos out there that are totally different from the lyrics and still manage to be fascinating.
And another reason is..... THE MUSIC!! Something some of you totally seem to ignore while focusing solely on the lyrics. The music ALSO has a message, not just the lyrics. And this song is a dance club banger. The message of the music is loud and clear -- get yo @ss on the dance floor!
So, it's not surprising to me at all that there is a dancer and a lot of dancing in the video.
I feel the same way about Slave To The Rhythm -- despite the lyrics being about an unappreciated housewife, I cannot imagine a video for that song without dancing. With that infectious rhythm and catchy melody, any other video would be doing the song an injustice IMO.
adamschoales
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I understand that, and agree with it... but when you're going to be SO CLOSE but off on one or two details it just doesn't make much sense to me.
love is magical
Proud Member
Michael's song is never just a club banger. Michael's lyrical message is equally or even more important than just beats people dance to.
Ms.MJ Fan2007
Proud Member
Oh yes I've ssen the video when it first permiers on Vevo/youtube & let me tell you it was great you gotta love the turbite to the king of pop!
souldreamer7
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You've quoted the wrong person. I never said anything as you've posted towards me above. My post is what it is. So,Please,don't put me into a category with someone(s) else. I did not come to this thread to 'argue' just because you have a difference of opinion than I do.
Since you've quoted me and added your opinion to it and decided to single my post out - I will say this - Yes, I would have liked to have seen Michael's vision for this 'video' but, Michael is no longer here, so that isn't possible.
To find a common ground between You and I - I can see your point of view that the storyline does 'fit' the song nicely. I just don't like the video as a whole. In my humble opinion it could have been better,deeper and more artistic,because Michael Jackson is all those things. So I know his vision would be better,have his unique stamp on it. But like I said, he's not here to bring his vision to us on film. Also where on earth did you get me stating I critcized "You Rock My World" ? Where are you getting that I wouldn't like the video even if Michael Jackson himself was in? :scratch:
Take Care.
:wub:
souldreamer7
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This is exactly what I mean....Some of YOU totally seem to ignore the LYRICS....Sure, everyone knows MJ wrote kick ass club bangers...But does everyone know the depth of his lyrics? He obviously put some real heart and soul into them; I'm not going to ignore that or at least not downplay it. I respect his art for all facets and I would love for future generations and the general public to know him for those reasons, too....Doesn't mean you can't dance to the song, and it doesn't mean you can't enjoy the video for what it is...
To me, this video screams 'Hey, this is Hollywood! I love this! I'm having a fucking blast, man!' They BRIEFLY showed her as an exotic dancer and the paps photographing her...That's it....Is that what Michael's message was reduced to? I mean, I'm glad they DID incorporate a bit of the message, but, gawd, he was just saying SO MUCH MORE than that....Read his handwritten lyrics..'the obstacles she underwent were UNBEARABLE'...The girl was a runaway, she was 15 years old! 15!...She prostituted herself!....This is some serious shit....Yet, she looked mighty happy in that video....He didn't put his blood, sweat, and tears into these records for nothing...
It's obvious the song is a club banger and it's awesome to dance to...But is it obvious what the song is REALLY about? No, it's not....not the way the video shows anyway...They had an opportunity to showcase this, and they pretty much reduced him (once again) to a song and dance man.
Now I`m starting to sound like a broken record...lol...I`m not moaning, bitching, or complaining about the video...I`m just looking at it for what it could have been...And, I`m not saying it COULD have been this way only if Michael were in it....I don`t believe that....They could have him live on through his messages....And, they`re not always about love and inspiration....That`s all I`m saying...I hope people can understand this and I`m not bashing anything or anyone....
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Love.him
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Just saw the video & I don't think she looks very conflicted about how things have turned out. I also don't think she looked as tanned I expected from the lyrics. I think it's mostly a good video. I just think she looks a bit too happy towards the end & that's not what the lyrics are depicting.
qbee
Proud Member
I have to disagree
with those stating a video should follow the lyrical content of the song.
I want to remind you that Michael never made a video that explicitly followed the lyrical content
of his songs. His videos were always outside the box and he took a more artistic and unexpected twist
or approach when making them.
We cant really say what Michael's vision would have been for this song. What we have and will always
have from now on is the vision of the directer who is inspired by Michael ... It wont be YOUR vision. . .
Just like MJ's own videos were NOT your vision.
Take Blood on the dance floor.
Its lyrical content is quite dark but he chose to make it something light enough to make people want to
dance to and not be totally depressed by the songs lyrical content.. and you didnt see blood oozing on the
dance floor either. So to reject the HT video for that reason doesnt fly in the realm of all Michal's other
videos or short films that dont follow the lyrics either.
Most of Michael Videos do NOT show the lyrical content throuout the song. He used his artistic expression
and made something quite unexpected from what the lyrics suggested to us_ He left a lot to the imagination
and allowed viewers to interpret his art in how it moved or touched them personally as most artists do. He
said he enoyed giving his fans somethign totally unexpected.
Just a few of MJ Videos & Short films that do NOT follow the lyrics
and have suprising or unexpected content
Blood on the dance floor
Black or white
Leave me alone
Remember the time
Jam
Scream
with those stating a video should follow the lyrical content of the song.
I want to remind you that Michael never made a video that explicitly followed the lyrical content
of his songs. His videos were always outside the box and he took a more artistic and unexpected twist
or approach when making them.
We cant really say what Michael's vision would have been for this song. What we have and will always
have from now on is the vision of the directer who is inspired by Michael ... It wont be YOUR vision. . .
Just like MJ's own videos were NOT your vision.
Take Blood on the dance floor.
Its lyrical content is quite dark but he chose to make it something light enough to make people want to
dance to and not be totally depressed by the songs lyrical content.. and you didnt see blood oozing on the
dance floor either. So to reject the HT video for that reason doesnt fly in the realm of all Michal's other
videos or short films that dont follow the lyrics either.
Most of Michael Videos do NOT show the lyrical content throuout the song. He used his artistic expression
and made something quite unexpected from what the lyrics suggested to us_ He left a lot to the imagination
and allowed viewers to interpret his art in how it moved or touched them personally as most artists do. He
said he enoyed giving his fans somethign totally unexpected.
Just a few of MJ Videos & Short films that do NOT follow the lyrics
and have suprising or unexpected content
Blood on the dance floor
Black or white
Leave me alone
Remember the time
Jam
Scream
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^^ Please explain how the Black or White short-film doesn't follow the lyrical content. That video screams of the rage against racism. It's also about bringing races together. Even though the Panther Dance and what it meant was heavily frowned upon! We live in a world that this is reality. Same with runaways, and Hollywood, and prostitution. Why do we ignore it? Why is it always silenced so much?
What an opportunity this could have been! He is not here physically to give us an epic video. However, his epic lyrics can!
BTW, I never said the video didn't follow the lyrical content. I also didn't say that I rejected the video in anyway. What I did say was the message was BIG and SERIOUS and could have been touched on much, much more...However, I do appreciate your post and agree with some of what you are saying
As for Mike's own short-films...When he was here with us, he could do whatever he wanted with them, as he was the master of his domain. Now that he's gone, there are people who have in their hands his life work. It's their responsibility to make sure it's showcased in such a way to make his legacy live on and grow to more and more generations.
Michael always wanted to be able to tell stories, to move people, to take them places they've never been before. Hollywood Tonight tells a story. So, why do I feel that I haven't heard the whole story?
They chose not to go that route, but hey, what can I say? I'm just another fan who is infinitely passionate about his lyrics..
What an opportunity this could have been! He is not here physically to give us an epic video. However, his epic lyrics can!
BTW, I never said the video didn't follow the lyrical content. I also didn't say that I rejected the video in anyway. What I did say was the message was BIG and SERIOUS and could have been touched on much, much more...However, I do appreciate your post and agree with some of what you are saying
As for Mike's own short-films...When he was here with us, he could do whatever he wanted with them, as he was the master of his domain. Now that he's gone, there are people who have in their hands his life work. It's their responsibility to make sure it's showcased in such a way to make his legacy live on and grow to more and more generations.
Michael always wanted to be able to tell stories, to move people, to take them places they've never been before. Hollywood Tonight tells a story. So, why do I feel that I haven't heard the whole story?
They chose not to go that route, but hey, what can I say? I'm just another fan who is infinitely passionate about his lyrics..
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qbee
Proud Member
I agree the beginning of the video shows love and tolernace of all nations and races and the panther
dance shows and screams of his intolernace against racism. But the song itself without the video
doesnt portray that vision so much. So he lyrics were more light hearted then the video.
The HT video did touch on the dangers and pits one can fall into but the directer chose not to take it to dark
That OK ..to show the dangers or evil in Hollywood he portrayed a stripper and dancing for money from strangers
and being drunk in a seedy bar was enough to imply the dark side and that she was being pulled into it.
This director also chose to show in this video that one can overcome these pitfalls if they keep their vision
and heart true to their dreams. What I saw was The girl in the END was wanting to be like Michael and not follow
the dark path of Hollywood. She would continue on with her dreams. That seems like a Michael message of hope
in the face of adversity to me. That we can overcome anything and acheive our dreams.
You, I and We all have our own vision of what we want or what we think this video should say or is saying
and that's alright. There is nothing wrong with that and there is also was nothing wrong with the directors vision
for the HT video. The way the director showed that Michael inspired this girl to go on and follow her dreams despite
her falling into the darker side was beautiful and inspiring to to me.
I respect your opinion also :cheers:just dont agree with all of it.
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