"A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

I've got to say and I really don't mean to mock this but those two additional rewards lol, they want $499 to interview me/us/anyone and then $249 for being on a conference call, so but can't help but go REALLLYYY!!!!.
 
"A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about...

Loved Michael since I was 12 years old, wrote him a letter of support in 1993, thanking him for his contribution to mankind and for his inspiration to me as a musician.

I love getting out the big guns of Beethoven comparisons when talking about Michael's oeuvre, the innovation, the love and hope for mankind.

But: These songs do not define Michael.
I understand the motivation and the drive to get to the bottom of all things.
However, for some reason I feel and see no threat to Michael and his accomplishments by these songs. I don't. What he did in his life, his work, his music is here to stay. It's a done deal, these few songs do not define him. Others clearly disagree, but I'm just trying understand just why perhaps this project isn't resonating as hoped for.

I see no danger of 'Monster' being performed at the Vatican any time soon, but Michael's music and message are unmistakeable.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about...

But: These songs do not define Michael.However, for some reason I feel and see no threat to Michael and his accomplishments by these songs. I don't. What he did in his life, his work, his music is here to stay. It's a done deal, these few songs do not define him.

That's exactly how I feel (and wrote years ago) and it's not only limited to Cascio songs, it applies to all of the posthumous releases. I think MJ's music is defined by what he did when he as alive. I don't hear any posthumous releases on the radio and I don't think any of them will become favorite of the masses.

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Anyhow with less than 9 days remaining it looks like they won't be able to reach to their goal. So what's next? Is it over or will there be a second campaign to fund a cheaper option such as a free e-book?

and did any of the Jacksons RT'd any of the ATU tweets?
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

Teddly Riley is coming to BlogTalk radio, people can submit questions regarding Cascio's songs!!
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about...

and did any of the Jacksons RT'd any of the ATU tweets?

Not one and Damain Shields has constantly asked Jackson-family members to retweet him and to support his procect.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about...

That's exactly how I feel (and wrote years ago) and it's not only limited to Cascio songs, it applies to all of the posthumous releases. I think MJ's music is defined by what he did when he as alive. I don't hear any posthumous releases on the radio and I don't think any of them will become favorite of the masses.

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Anyhow with less than 9 days remaining it looks like they won't be able to reach to their goal. So what's next? Is it over or will there be a second campaign to fund a cheaper option such as a free e-book?

and did any of the Jacksons RT'd any of the ATU tweets?

Time to move on and bury this where it belongs.

For me at the end of the day Michaels discography ended when he passed everything from then on is only ever a demo and unfinished. I will only ever consider something of value that Michael was directly involved in and Finnish and wanted to release to is his fans. Anything else is just not what he wanted me to hear.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

If a crime has taken place it should not be buried.

I think this has failed simply because of a lack of information from ATU and then scepticism and distrust from potential backers. People simply don't know what they have. Still, I wish a lot more MJ fans could have at least put $10 down.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

And you base that a crime has been committed on what - your opinion, sorry but that's by far not enough for me to even consider a legitimate argument. When u have something in concrete I will listen, until then it's all a matter of conspiracy.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

Well I did say "if a crime has been committed". I didn't inject my opinion at all. And I think it's pretty clear that it is in fact a possibility and not just a conspiracy. I thought most fans were on board with that no matter what side of the debate the were on. All you have to do is press play on one of the Cascio tracks to know it's a little bit more than a conspiracy. It's a real issue.
 
How Michael’s musical legacy was compromised by these tracks is not fully understood and I believe that is why this project was not funded to the level it should have been by fans. Some fans are reluctant to accept they may have been deceived and who they may have been deceived by which I believe also prevented proper funding. Provided these tracks are proven to be false without doubt, it is a truth that will be extremely difficult for some to accept.

The idea of appealing to fans may have seemed reasonable in theory however; it is not in reality for these reasons. This team will fare better by simply petitioning a wealthy sponsor or small group of wealthy sponsors who are Michael Jackson fans and understand how Michael’s legacy was compromised. These types exist as they purchase rather expensive Michael Jackson memorabilia through auctions around the world.

The Jacksons were pretty clear they did not support those tracks in 2010. How many celebrities retweeted? If any of the celebrities did, they most likely are not concerned with how those in the industry will perceive them.
 
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Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about...

That's exactly how I feel (and wrote years ago) and it's not only limited to Cascio songs, it applies to all of the posthumous releases. I think MJ's music is defined by what he did when he as alive. I don't hear any posthumous releases on the radio and I don't think any of them will become favorite of the masses.

-----------------------------------------------

Anyhow with less than 9 days remaining it looks like they won't be able to reach to their goal. So what's next? Is it over or will there be a second campaign to fund a cheaper option such as a free e-book?

and did any of the Jacksons RT'd any of the ATU tweets?

I think they failed to reach their goal because outside a small vocal group, most people do not care. The fake song debate is over three years old now and everyone has made up their minds. People who think the songs are fake are not going to change their minds and the same goes for people who think they are real. People have largely moved on and are waiting for the next album.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about...

I think they failed to reach their goal because outside a small vocal group, most people do not care. The fake song debate is over three years old now and everyone has made up their minds. People who think the songs are fake are not going to change their minds and the same goes for people who think they are real. People have largely moved on and are waiting for the next album.

I think it is a shame that Michael is given so little respect as an artist that people can so easily move on from such a mess being made of his art. The truth is there and nobody should be afraid of it.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

StellaJackson, I understand however Michael's legacy is not his fans legacy and vice versa. These song compromise Michael's musical legacy but not the individual fans' legacy so it is fairly simple for some to not be concerned. How we respond to Michael's musical legacy being compromised is our legacy.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

Fascinating.... the attempt to shift blame for the failure of the initiative to fans.

It's not a fear of having been deceived or a lack of concern or care for MJ's legacy that makes me view this project with skepticism. Nope, that is informed by the poorly defined business plan (why exactly $40k?) and confusing mission statement from the participants.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

Will fans who do not support this team's method for funding find another method of getting this information documented and distributed?

It is unclear if some are simply against the Kickstarter initiative or if they are against this information being documented and are using the Kickstarter initiative to mask that.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

The fact remains that these are the only people that have done any real ground work and pounding of the pavement to get to the bottom of this. A lot has been uncovered that we will never find out on our own. Is it not worth a measly $10 to see what their work has uncovered? This is an important project and I wish fans would get over their skepticism and give them a chance. They are fans like us. Fans that care. They are not asking each fan for $40,000.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

The fact remains that these are the only people that have done any real ground work and pounding of the pavement to get to the bottom of this. A lot has been uncovered that we will never find out on our own. Is it not worth a measly $10 to see what their work has uncovered? This is an important project and I wish fans would get over their skepticism and give them a chance. They are fans like us. Fans that care. They are not asking each fan for $40,000.


How do we know that? It will be more interesting if they can show or provide some tidbits to make it more appealing to the readers.
So far, they talking about their plan, but we don't see any commitment from any people that they plan to talk to?
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

If you read through The Great Album Debate thread you'll see little gems of information dropped by a certain user that were almost certainly learned from information given by a person or persons involved in this project. The group have already interviewed a lot of people and as much as we'd all like more information at this point, the group have said that they can't divulge too much as they have to protect their sources. I think it's worth a $10 leap of faith to find out when the book is released.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

Well I did say "if a crime has been committed". I didn't inject my opinion at all. And I think it's pretty clear that it is in fact a possibility and not just a conspiracy. I thought most fans were on board with that no matter what side of the debate the were on. All you have to do is press play on one of the Cascio tracks to know it's a little bit more than a conspiracy. It's a real issue.

Of course I understand that but at the end of the day how long are we going to flog a dead hoarse. Especially when those that were directly involved are staying tight lipped.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

Fascinating.... the attempt to shift blame for the failure of the initiative to fans.

not surprising. In the mindset of "you are a real fan if you support what I do and you are a fake fan if you don't", it is expected that the fans would be blamed for the failure and not the merits of the projects. I mean probably some of us are being blamed for even asking questions.

Will fans who do not support this team's method for funding find another method of getting this information documented and distributed?

It is unclear if some are simply against the Kickstarter initiative or if they are against this information being documented and are using the Kickstarter initiative to mask that.

why are you asking this question to the fans? Ask it to the founders of ATU. If they want they can do their interviews using internet (removing the need for travel costs) and publish their findings on a website/blog etc for free (hence removing all the publishing, licensing etc costs). There were more cheaper alternatives to do what they wanted to do. It's not fans, it's the team of ATU has choosen this method and $40,000 cost to fund.

The claim that fans are "against this information being documented" is meaningless. What is stopping Damien from publishing what he uncovered on his blog? Nothing!

The fact remains that these are the only people that have done any real ground work and pounding of the pavement to get to the bottom of this. A lot has been uncovered that we will never find out on our own. Is it not worth a measly $10 to see what their work has uncovered? This is an important project and I wish fans would get over their skepticism and give them a chance. They are fans like us. Fans that care. They are not asking each fan for $40,000.

If you read through The Great Album Debate thread you'll see little gems of information dropped by a certain user that were almost certainly learned from information given by a person or persons involved in this project. The group have already interviewed a lot of people and as much as we'd all like more information at this point, the group have said that they can't divulge too much as they have to protect their sources. I think it's worth a $10 leap of faith to find out when the book is released.

I love how you make definitive statements with all the secrecy surrounding the project. Some of the information shared on great album debate is google detective work and speculation. Also you are kinda answering Gaz's previous question that will that book have anything that's not on the great album debate thread. If you are saying the information is there then it means there won't be any substantial new info on the book.

Let me ask you this. For whatever reason people aren't making that leap of faith and aren't giving the $10 or whatever. It doesn't look like they would make their goal. So what is next? Could this really need to be a book? Why can't Damien share that "A lot been uncovered" on his blog for free?


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To everyone: I don't get why some of you act like money is absolutely needed to document and distribute the information uncovered. It isn't. A book with hardcover and pictures etc is fancy but that's not a requirement to circulate information. Hopping on a plane and interviewing people face to face might be desired but it isn't required. This could have been done in a lot of other ways and for a lot less in costs. This is ATU's choice.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

It's very important to me, so I'll flog the dead horse until it starts breathing again ;)
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

Ivy, I know you love to debate, but I'm not going to get into it with you if you're going to twist my words.

If you are saying the information is there then it means there won't be any substantial new info on the book.

Perfect example. Where did I say that? I said gems of information have been dropped. You take that and turn it into this. I can't be bothered with it.

Let me ask you this. For whatever reason people aren't making that leap of faith and aren't giving the $10 or whatever. It doesn't look like they would make their goal. So what is next? Could this really need to be a book? Why can't Damien share that "A lot been uncovered" on his blog for free?

You have to ask them. As for why they've decided to go this route and put out a book, they've already answered it very succinctly. There's really no need to keep asking that same question over and over.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

Ivy, I know you love to debate, but I'm not going to get into it with you if you're going to twist my words.

I don't love to debate. I love a good discussion. There's a difference.

Perfect example. Where did I say that? I said gems of information have been dropped. You take that and turn it into this. I can't be bothered with it.

While reading what I wrote the keywords are "kinda" and "if". I wasn't making any definitive statements. They are a supposition -aka uncertain belief- by definition. But you are right, gems of information have been dropped. That is relevant to what Gaz said.


You have to ask them. As for why they've decided to go this route and put out a book, they've already answered it very succinctly. There's really no need to keep asking that same question over and over.

I was asking for your opinion, I wasn't asking you to provide an answer for them. We will wait and see what they'll do in the upcoming days. My point was you can't blame the fans for ATU's decision of pushing for a book. Hopefully they have a worst case scenario plan.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

What I hope they will do is lower the $40,000 asking price and start again. I think a book is a good idea.
 
I'm surprised at the blasé attitude of some about the $40K. Ultimately though, if ATU chooses not to share unless they get their funding, that's THEIR decision and not the fault of fans who have reservations about this project. I still don't understand if it's the "truth" that matters, why a book is even needed. Dissemination of information these days is pretty easy.
 
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Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

I think a book is a good idea.

based on current information we have, I disagree. the 161 pledges/donators demonstrate to me that a book does not have the potential to sell. The effort to publish a book would be waste of time,effort and resources IMO.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

Funding is a two party proposition so yes, fans do have to shoulder blame if the initiative is not funded which equates to inactivity. It is our response, active or inactive, that is our own legacy.

If this initiative is not funded, there are some who will feel a sort of vindication. This means the concern was primarily about securing this team's failure using the outlet available to them and Michael's musical legacy is a distant thought if one at all.

If this team is not funded, it will be interesting to see if anyone will take on this task. Maybe those who feel they know better will do better.

For the ATU team: this is only the start, not the finish. Try again and you will get your information out there as long as you do not give up.
 
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Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

I often wonder just how many MJ fans are hardcore fans of his music. As in they own everything from Steeltown up until the end, study it back to front and care and are greatly interested about the back-stories of songs and the creation process.

I'm one of those fans you speak of..and I'm only 14..lol :D

When I compare MJ's fan base with that of other classic artists, from Elvis and Sinatra to Prince and the Beatles, I always notice two things.

One is that all of the people who were fans of his whe he was coming out with the great Jacksons albums like Destiny and Triumph or even Off the Wall and Thriller seem to have evaporated. I'm talking about people who would be in their 40's or 50's now. Basically people MJ's own age. If you go on a Beatles' discussion board, you have a bunch of younger fans who recently discovered their music, but you also have all of those old-timers who were around when they went on Ed Sullivan's show. With MJ, you seem to only have the new generation of fans. All of the old fans seem to have forgotten him, or see his music only as a fun, silly nostalgia thing, not a canon of work worth exploring.

The second thing, which is linked to the first, is that a lot of his fan base is made up of people who love his music, but also love and defend the man, or at least his public persona that they've chosen to believe in.If you go on any other music-related forum, fans routinely criticize or make fun of aspects of the artist's life and career. They'll study the music and every detail of the artist's career, but they don't see their interest as a sort of vocation or crusade to defend a victimized person.

I think that these two aspects might explain this initiative's failure, but also the fact that nothing serious has been done in 3 years. We're talking about a fan base that skews younger, and that has less money and expertise to invest in a serious challenge. And their hyper-emotional devotion to the artist hampers their credibility, and makes them less likely to have an almost scholarly, "historian" view of his career, which is a big motivation for getting to the bottom of the Cascio controversy -- for me at least.

I highly doubt the older generation of fans forgot about him. In fact, they're the ones who probably talk about him more than the younger ones (except for me of course lol) From my experience, I know way more older generation fans that absolutely love him than I do from my generation. Nobody forgot about Michael, and no one sees him as a 'silly, nostalgia thing'. Stuff like that is for the other irrelevant artists.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

Never said much until now. I am a much older fan - some 66 years old. A fan since the very beginning with J5 and a collector with a HUGE collection of Michael's music and also memorabilia. Guess you could say I have a little experience. I have no intention of donating a halfpenny because I honestly think it a waste of time. . From all I have read on this thread I find little evidence that anything is going to be discovered, pure speculation at the moment. I don't want to be part of a book, however fancy it could end up looking, that doesn't tell me 100% of what the authors allege is 'the truth'. This is my opinion and how I really feel about everything.
 
Re: "A Truth Untold" GOES LIVE. Book publication aimed to present the truth about the Cascio songs.

Never said much until now. I am a much older fan - some 66 years old. A fan since the very beginning with J5 and a collector with a HUGE collection of Michael's music and also memorabilia. Guess you could say I have a little experience. I have no intention of donating a halfpenny because I honestly think it a waste of time.From all I have read on this thread I find little evidence that anything is going to be discovered, pure speculation at the moment. I don't want to be part of a book, however fancy it could end up looking, that doesn't tell me 100% of what the authors allege is 'the truth'. This is my opinion and how I really feel about everything.

I'll admit I'm not entirely sure of the situation itself , In regards to the book , I pretty much agree with you on that as well..
 
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