Well said.
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Cascio Tracks Debate Thread
- Thread starter larry141094
- Start date
Well said.
Dark Artist
Proud Member
This.
mariemarie
Guests
So answer me this, all of you who thinks the songs are fake (in the booklet it says it has additional vocals; James Porte so..........) why do you think they faked it? And why you think Jason did it? Don't you realise that if it's true, it is completely dumb and illegal thing to do?
I don't hear Jason at all, and whoever sings what verse, and I know MJ's vocals are in there, I love all three songs. I was struggling with BN at first, cuz hey, that shit was crazy, but now it's an cool song. The whole Michael album makes you want to get up and dance.
I feel sorry for the fans who can't find themselves to enjoy it. If you thinks the whole album sucks, that's ok, but hate it just because, you're missing out the great feeling that music brings.
I don't hear Jason at all, and whoever sings what verse, and I know MJ's vocals are in there, I love all three songs. I was struggling with BN at first, cuz hey, that shit was crazy, but now it's an cool song. The whole Michael album makes you want to get up and dance.
I feel sorry for the fans who can't find themselves to enjoy it. If you thinks the whole album sucks, that's ok, but hate it just because, you're missing out the great feeling that music brings.
Re: So, what's the general consensus on Keep Your Head Up?
KYHU is fake as hell!!! What I don't understand is that you guys keep talking about processing and shit while the 3 Cascio songs sound like the most complete and finished songs on the album, as a matter of fact they do sound just finished. Ad-libs, complete verses, don't you guys think this is a bit suspicious??? 12 complete finished Cascio songs, while the audio quality on some of the other songs on 'Michael' clearly lead me to beliieve they were just demos, later finished. Now here is the funny part, the Cascio songs don't sound like demos, it's like MJ made a complete album with the Cascios (supposedly 12 songs). Haha give me a break.... the voice on those 3 songs doesn't sound like MJ and they even don't sound like demos, but complete finished songs. And the excuse of Teddy Riley and Sony is that they had to a lot of processing.
Lies, lies, lies people................... as MJ once said: 'Lies run sprints but the truth runs marathons'.
KYHU is fake as hell!!! What I don't understand is that you guys keep talking about processing and shit while the 3 Cascio songs sound like the most complete and finished songs on the album, as a matter of fact they do sound just finished. Ad-libs, complete verses, don't you guys think this is a bit suspicious??? 12 complete finished Cascio songs, while the audio quality on some of the other songs on 'Michael' clearly lead me to beliieve they were just demos, later finished. Now here is the funny part, the Cascio songs don't sound like demos, it's like MJ made a complete album with the Cascios (supposedly 12 songs). Haha give me a break.... the voice on those 3 songs doesn't sound like MJ and they even don't sound like demos, but complete finished songs. And the excuse of Teddy Riley and Sony is that they had to a lot of processing.
Lies, lies, lies people................... as MJ once said: 'Lies run sprints but the truth runs marathons'.
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MJ Crazy
Proud Member
Re: So, what's the general consensus on Keep Your Head Up?
It's Michael and it's a beautiful song.
It's Michael and it's a beautiful song.
Re: So, what's the general consensus on Keep Your Head Up?
Well, to be honest, the only thing I find wrong with Johan's post is saying 'fake'...although, i'm sure that's just his/her opinion....Otherwise...I can agree with him/her...
KYHU is fake as hell!!! What I don't understand is that you guys keep talking about processing and shit while the 3 Cascio songs sound like the most complete and finished songs on the album, as a matter of fact they do sound just finished. Ad-libs, complete verses, don't you guys think this is a bit suspicious??? 12 complete finished Cascio songs, while the audio quality on some of the other songs on 'Michael' clearly lead me to beliieve they were just demos, later finished. Now here is the funny part, the Cascio songs don't sound like demos, it's like MJ made a complete album with the Cascios (supposedly 12 songs). Haha give me a break.... the voice on those 3 songs doesn't sound like MJ and they even don't sound like demos, but complete finished songs. And the excuse of Teddy Riley and Sony is that they had to a lot of processing.
Lies, lies, lies people................... as MJ once said: 'Lies run sprints but the truth runs marathons'.
Well, to be honest, the only thing I find wrong with Johan's post is saying 'fake'...although, i'm sure that's just his/her opinion....Otherwise...I can agree with him/her...
Totally agree....
kopwatcher
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The questions in your first paragraph have been asked, and answered, and discussed, time and time again. So I won't repeat that.
In response to your third paragraph: I would wager that every single fan on this board (and in general) would have wanted to love the album as much as you do. It's not a pleasant experience to be disappointed by the authenticity of certain songs. I wanted the Cascio songs to be MJ. The fanbase has had enough drama.
We just wanted a straightforward posthumous release we could all enjoy. Unfortunately that isn't the case, and we're left with another diabolical mess thanks to Sony. Don't get me wrong, there are some songs I really enjoy. But it could have been so much more.
Re: So, what's the general consensus on Keep Your Head Up?
Well the point of my point was that I don't believe MJ has recorded 12 songs with the Cascio's that sound as complete/finished as the songs we have heard on the Michael album. Let's for a minute assume that MJ did record (almost) 12 complete songs with the Cascios, then where are the other songs from that period in MJ's life??? Answer: there aren't any, it's just Hold My Hand, the rest is just Work In Progress.
Now just add 1 plus 1 (12 complete finished Cascio songs and no other finished songs from that period (coincidence???), just songs that were work in progress), plus the fact that the person singing on those 3 Cascio songs doesn't sound like MJ (despite the lame excuse from Teddy Riley and Sony that they had to do a lot of 'processing' to his voice).
This leads me to believe there can only be one conclusion: IT'S NOT MJ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it's a duck.
Well the point of my point was that I don't believe MJ has recorded 12 songs with the Cascio's that sound as complete/finished as the songs we have heard on the Michael album. Let's for a minute assume that MJ did record (almost) 12 complete songs with the Cascios, then where are the other songs from that period in MJ's life??? Answer: there aren't any, it's just Hold My Hand, the rest is just Work In Progress.
Now just add 1 plus 1 (12 complete finished Cascio songs and no other finished songs from that period (coincidence???), just songs that were work in progress), plus the fact that the person singing on those 3 Cascio songs doesn't sound like MJ (despite the lame excuse from Teddy Riley and Sony that they had to do a lot of 'processing' to his voice).
This leads me to believe there can only be one conclusion: IT'S NOT MJ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it's a duck.
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dangerous_88
Proud Member
Re: So, what's the general consensus on Keep Your Head Up?
I cannot give you as much reputation as I want to these days. Another post worth of praise.
I cannot give you as much reputation as I want to these days. Another post worth of praise.
Superstition
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Re: So, what's the general consensus on Keep Your Head Up?
Decent song music-wise, but the lead vocals ruin my enjoyment of the song.
Decent song music-wise, but the lead vocals ruin my enjoyment of the song.
Re: So, what's the general consensus on Keep Your Head Up?
Yes, I agree with you...
Thanks :blush:
Well the point of my point was that I don't believe MJ has recorded 12 songs with the Cascio's that sound as complete/finished as the songs we have heard on the Michael album. Let's for a minute assume that MJ did record (almost) 12 complete songs with the Cascios, then where are the other songs from that period in MJ's life??? Answer: there aren't any, it's just Hold My Hand, the rest is just Work In Progress.
Now just add 1 plus 1 (12 complete finished Cascio songs and no other finished songs from that period (coincidence???), just songs that were work in progress), plus the fact that the person singing on those 3 Cascio songs doesn't sound like MJ (despite the lame excuse from Teddy Riley and Sony that they had to do a lot of 'processing' to his voice).
This leads me to believe there can only be one conclusion: IT'S NOT MJ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it's a duck.
Yes, I agree with you...
Thanks :blush:
foreverdaking
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man, months ago we were so happy for looking forward to the album
now we are confused and think about his vocals......so effin sad
....btw....are the cascio songs, this kinda like songs (unfinished, heavely proccesed or what ever) wel´ll hear in da future?!?
now we are confused and think about his vocals......so effin sad
....btw....are the cascio songs, this kinda like songs (unfinished, heavely proccesed or what ever) wel´ll hear in da future?!?
Please, we do not need your pitty.
As far as I'm concerned, there's 7 Michael tracks on that album. And I still enjoy them. But, hell no. I won't accept the fact that they used another person to record 3 of the songs of the album and pretend it's Michael! Are we serious here? I knew from the moment I heard "Breaking News" that THAT wasn't Michael. Same thing with "Keep Your Head Up" and "Monster". Whoever sings on those tracks sounds like a damn goat! The vibrato is COMPLETELY different to Michael's! The tone of the voice, the accent, everything! And anyway, apart from "Monster", the other 2 songs are really bad in my opinion.
Just listen to "Keep Your Head Up" and then "Best of Joy" or "Much Too Soon"... Same person?? REALLY??
serendipity
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Re: So, what's the general consensus on Keep Your Head Up?
Why is the song bad? It's very similar to Cry and it's a very Michael-ish song, so to say he would have never wanted it released is weird.
Why is the song bad? It's very similar to Cry and it's a very Michael-ish song, so to say he would have never wanted it released is weird.
BabeBeMine
Proud Member
Re: So, what's the general consensus on Keep Your Head Up?
Funny how non fans love Keep your Head up and Monster. I think MJ would be happy.
Saying MJ would not want this song released is not fact, but your opinion. MJ wrote the track, i hope you know that right. Have you read the lyrics?
Many can relate to these lyrics, which is why non fans like it.
Funny how non fans love Keep your Head up and Monster. I think MJ would be happy.
Saying MJ would not want this song released is not fact, but your opinion. MJ wrote the track, i hope you know that right. Have you read the lyrics?
Many can relate to these lyrics, which is why non fans like it.
Re: So, what's the general consensus on Keep Your Head Up?
To BabeBeMine: Well, I think it goes without saying that's it's my opinion, I never said it was a fact. Also, the say MJ wrote the track. Maybe he did, maybe he didn't. All I know is that his vocals are not on it.
To serendipity: If you want to compare KYHU to Cry, then good for you. I think they're incomparable. When I listen to Cry I hear perfection, whereas in KYHU I hear a goat-like vibrato that doesn't sound like the man I've been listening to the last 24 years.
And yes damn it, it makes me wanna CRY because they're destroying this man's legacy by releasing this crap under his name!
To BabeBeMine: Well, I think it goes without saying that's it's my opinion, I never said it was a fact. Also, the say MJ wrote the track. Maybe he did, maybe he didn't. All I know is that his vocals are not on it.
To serendipity: If you want to compare KYHU to Cry, then good for you. I think they're incomparable. When I listen to Cry I hear perfection, whereas in KYHU I hear a goat-like vibrato that doesn't sound like the man I've been listening to the last 24 years.
And yes damn it, it makes me wanna CRY because they're destroying this man's legacy by releasing this crap under his name!
larry141094
Proud Member
Alright it's getting too hot in here so lets turn down the heat a bit eh?
Now Jason Malachi and using YT music comparisons as "proof". There are two problems with this
1. We will all hear something different
Now Jason Malachi and using YT music comparisons as "proof". There are two problems with this
1. We will all hear something different
larry141094
Proud Member
You are breaking almost every rule when you post, and on the VIBRATO, it was added in by melodyne software, it's the same thing that Jason Malachi uses to make his vibrato.
And btw don't undermine people
larry141094
Proud Member
NEW RULES:
Ok i think this is becoming a bash session, i think ONTOP of the rules we have in place that these two new rules will be put in place.
6. Every week a new debate topic is put forward
7. STAY ON THE TOPIC!!!
And at the end of the topic i will compare the arguments from both sides. Now as this is a DEBATE, and i am studying law at uni, we will be taking the LEGAL perspective of "Innocent until proven guilty", if you don't like it, then don't come to the thread.
THIS WEEK'S TOPIC IS: 'Street Cred' Who's More Credible? we have the 'Jacksons' who say the vocals are fake and then we have 'The Estate', Michael's Producers, Friends and Colleagues as well as Sony Music themselves.
Questions to answer;
1.If Michael's voice is on the tracks why would the Family lie
2.If Michael's voice IS NOT on the tracks why would The estate, the producers, MJ's friends and Sony Music lie.
3.What kind of legal trouble would Sony be liable for?
4.Why haven't the Jackson's taken legal action?
Please stay on topic, and try to answer questions that are for the opposing side, it might broaden your mind
Ok i think this is becoming a bash session, i think ONTOP of the rules we have in place that these two new rules will be put in place.
6. Every week a new debate topic is put forward
7. STAY ON THE TOPIC!!!
And at the end of the topic i will compare the arguments from both sides. Now as this is a DEBATE, and i am studying law at uni, we will be taking the LEGAL perspective of "Innocent until proven guilty", if you don't like it, then don't come to the thread.
THIS WEEK'S TOPIC IS: 'Street Cred' Who's More Credible? we have the 'Jacksons' who say the vocals are fake and then we have 'The Estate', Michael's Producers, Friends and Colleagues as well as Sony Music themselves.
Questions to answer;
1.If Michael's voice is on the tracks why would the Family lie
2.If Michael's voice IS NOT on the tracks why would The estate, the producers, MJ's friends and Sony Music lie.
3.What kind of legal trouble would Sony be liable for?
4.Why haven't the Jackson's taken legal action?
Please stay on topic, and try to answer questions that are for the opposing side, it might broaden your mind
BUMPER SNIPPET
Guests
Samhabib raised an excellent point here: how come that we ALL, with no exception whatsoever did never ever questioned Michael's voice on an extremely bad quality phone line, while on the other hand there is such a big fuss and dilemma over three tracks that were recorded in a STUDIO!?
Isn't that sole argument enough to put an end to the speculation that the voice on Cascio tracks were rough demos or in bad quality?
It would be really helpful if we could hear the voice before Teddy Riley "heavily processed it". Wouldn't that help?
By the way, I am not criticizing anyone here, but I just can't help but wonder how is it possible that people hear exactly the same voice on:
2000 Watts, Privacy, Shout, Why you wanna trip on me, Get it (with Stevie Wonder) on the one hand, and Monster and Breaking News on the other?
Hearing the same voice between 2000 Watts, Privacy, Shout, Why you wanna trip on me, Get it AND Hollywood tonight YES! But on Monster and BN????? I am tempted to say that newer fans who haven't been listening to Michael all the time would claim that Michael is singing on Monster and BN, but I must admit that I am actually surprised to see some hard core fans claiming that they hear Michael's voice on Monster and BN. I just try to understand what is this little something that they believe it is Michael?
Isn't that sole argument enough to put an end to the speculation that the voice on Cascio tracks were rough demos or in bad quality?
It would be really helpful if we could hear the voice before Teddy Riley "heavily processed it". Wouldn't that help?
By the way, I am not criticizing anyone here, but I just can't help but wonder how is it possible that people hear exactly the same voice on:
2000 Watts, Privacy, Shout, Why you wanna trip on me, Get it (with Stevie Wonder) on the one hand, and Monster and Breaking News on the other?
Hearing the same voice between 2000 Watts, Privacy, Shout, Why you wanna trip on me, Get it AND Hollywood tonight YES! But on Monster and BN????? I am tempted to say that newer fans who haven't been listening to Michael all the time would claim that Michael is singing on Monster and BN, but I must admit that I am actually surprised to see some hard core fans claiming that they hear Michael's voice on Monster and BN. I just try to understand what is this little something that they believe it is Michael?
dangerous_88
Proud Member
to me, it is Michael singing in Monster and BN, but definitely not just him. KYHU on the other hand, I believe it is just Michael. Who knows, I might be wrong.
@ BUMPER SNIPPET
In my opinion, the "heavily processed" vocals are bullshit. KYHU vocals are the clearest vocals on the album.
HT on the other hand, have very processed vocals. Only "a bit" compared to the other tracks though according to Teddy.
In my opinion, the "heavily processed" vocals are bullshit. KYHU vocals are the clearest vocals on the album.
HT on the other hand, have very processed vocals. Only "a bit" compared to the other tracks though according to Teddy.
BUMPER SNIPPET
Guests
I am sorry Larry, but, firstly, we have moderators for those who do not respect the rules.
Secondly, you do not change the subject of the debate when it has already begun. For a new subject create a new thread.
And finally, no offense, I understand your good intentions, but people do not know you enough to give you credit to decide whose arguments are valid or not. In other words, who can vouch for your neutrality? Do you have references? I am sorry to put it this way, but being a law student at the uni can certainly contribute to many legal issues, however it does not give you more credit than to all other fans discussing and debating the subject that you've launched. Many of us have been graduated long time ago, have aquired experience at work in different areas of expertise and are not necessarily acting as judges or throwing our diplomas and resume into the face of others.
1.If Michael's voice is on the tracks why would the Family lie
Exactly. Why would they lie? And doesn't it struck you as weird that before the album was released there was this hype from Michael's family that some of the tracks on the album are fake, and now just suddenly no one's coming forward to say anything. No "Hey, we were wrong, the tracks really are authentic" or "We still believe the tracks are fake". I don't know about you guys but I think something's going on here. And I'm not a "consipary theory" kind of person.
2.If Michael's voice IS NOT on the tracks why would The estate, the producers, MJ's friends and Sony Music lie.
To cash in. Simples. The only people who supported that everything is authentic on the album is the people who will profit from the sales. The Cascios, Teddy Riley and Sony.
3.What kind of legal trouble would Sony be liable for?
I don't know the answer to this question but I hope closure. This is probably why we will never know the truth.
4.Why haven't the Jackson's taken legal action?
I don't know the answer to this question either, but I'm hoping that if they really believe what they say [that the Cascio tracks are fake], then maybe we will see some legal action from the Jacksons soon.
And by the way, I'm sorry if I sound a bit aggresive on my previous comments, I just strongly believe that the Cascio tracks are fake and that frustrates me beyond imagination. I don't have anything against anyone in here of course, quite the contrary. We're all Michael's fans. But when you have people saying they pitty you because you believe something that they don't, then I'm sorry, but I have to defend myself.
Exactly. Why would they lie? And doesn't it struck you as weird that before the album was released there was this hype from Michael's family that some of the tracks on the album are fake, and now just suddenly no one's coming forward to say anything. No "Hey, we were wrong, the tracks really are authentic" or "We still believe the tracks are fake". I don't know about you guys but I think something's going on here. And I'm not a "consipary theory" kind of person.
2.If Michael's voice IS NOT on the tracks why would The estate, the producers, MJ's friends and Sony Music lie.
To cash in. Simples. The only people who supported that everything is authentic on the album is the people who will profit from the sales. The Cascios, Teddy Riley and Sony.
3.What kind of legal trouble would Sony be liable for?
I don't know the answer to this question but I hope closure. This is probably why we will never know the truth.
4.Why haven't the Jackson's taken legal action?
I don't know the answer to this question either, but I'm hoping that if they really believe what they say [that the Cascio tracks are fake], then maybe we will see some legal action from the Jacksons soon.
And by the way, I'm sorry if I sound a bit aggresive on my previous comments, I just strongly believe that the Cascio tracks are fake and that frustrates me beyond imagination. I don't have anything against anyone in here of course, quite the contrary. We're all Michael's fans. But when you have people saying they pitty you because you believe something that they don't, then I'm sorry, but I have to defend myself.
serena williams
Proud Member
Re: So, what's the general consensus on Keep Your Head Up?
What 's the problem with the word "fake"
What you guys want us to use as a word
"Fake" means for me that they use some TRUE michael's vocals here and there (and sometime 0 % of mj's vocals) and as he couldnt finish the song they used another person IMITATING michael's voice to fill in the holes ( I am not even talking about the arrangements and the music itself but only the VOCALS )
This is the main problem IMITATION
As soon as they IMITATE to fill the gaps this is FAKE
I dont see a better word than this one otherwise tell us and at the same give us the definition of a FAKE song since you seem not to agree with this word
KYHU is 80% IMITATION and 20% TRUE mj vocals = FAKE
What 's the problem with the word "fake"
What you guys want us to use as a word
"Fake" means for me that they use some TRUE michael's vocals here and there (and sometime 0 % of mj's vocals) and as he couldnt finish the song they used another person IMITATING michael's voice to fill in the holes ( I am not even talking about the arrangements and the music itself but only the VOCALS )
This is the main problem IMITATION
As soon as they IMITATE to fill the gaps this is FAKE
I dont see a better word than this one otherwise tell us and at the same give us the definition of a FAKE song since you seem not to agree with this word
KYHU is 80% IMITATION and 20% TRUE mj vocals = FAKE
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