Debbie Rowe Wants Michael Jackson's Kids Back -- Going To Court for Custody

[LastTear]

I posted the artile on my PC and it looks fine on that, but checking it on my ipad the text is all over the place. I would rather not post just the link, perhaps if we are a little patient a member of staff can shed some light on it.

EDIT I've tried deleting and re-posting but it hasnt made any difference..

 

[knowle]

I bought Sullivans book on the recommendation from TM, now hearing from you guys it is all pack of lies.What is going on with this family and this woman Rowe. Why aren't people happy with what they've got. I sit here in my little village utterly amazed and appalled with what I read. I lived in Hollywood many years go and it was nothing like this back then.:angry:

 

[HIStory]

I posted the artile on my PC and it looks fine on that, but checking it on my ipad the text is all over the place. I would rather not post just the link, perhaps if we are a little patient a member of staff can shed some light on it.

EDIT I've tried deleting and re-posting but it hasnt made any difference..

Try to copy&paste this:

Stay Away Mom! Late Pop Star Michael Jackson’s Son Prince Will Oppose Debbie Rowe’s Custody Bid

Posted on Apr 14, 2014 @ 7:51AM | By Jen Heger - Assistant Managing Editor

Getty
Michael Jackson‘s eldest son, Prince Michael, will formally oppose his biological mother, Debbie Rowe‘s bid to gain custody of him, because the junior in high school wants nothing to do with his father’s second wife, RadarOnline.com.com is exclusively reporting.
“Prince is absolutely disgusted by Debbie’s plans to go to court to try and gain custody of himself, Paris and Blanket,” a Jackson family source told Radar.
“First, Debbie wasn’t around for years, and Prince doesn’t consider her his mother. As far as Prince in concerned, Debbie was basically a surrogate mother.
“Second, Debbie wants the kids to come live with her in Palmdale. Prince is a junior in high school in Southern California, and will be turning eighteen next February. Uprooting his entire life and moving to Palmdale would jeopardize all of the hard work and progress he has made in school. Debbie thinks Prince doesn’t have enough supervision, and is out of control….yet, Prince has a 4.2 GPA and is on track to graduate with honors.

The source told Radar that Prince will have the law on his side in this situation.
“Thankfully, in California, there is tremendous consideration given to teenagers in custody cases, and they can usually determine which parent or guardian they would like to live with,” the source told Radar.
“The Jackson children have a court appointed attorney, a guardian ad litem, Margaret Lodise. Prince will be speaking with her and telling her in no uncertain terms would he want to move in with Debbie. This is all very disruptive to his life, and is truly the last thing he needs.”

Rowe DOES plan on seeking legal custody of her two biological children with the late King Of Pop, along with Blanket, 12 Radar has confirmed.
On Friday, reports that Dr. Arnold Klein’s former employee’s legal overtures come under the rationale that their current co-guardians, their 83-year-old grandmother Katherine and nephew T.J., while well-intentioned, are not effective in their current roles, as Katherine is too disconnected to the teens, and T.J. is too busy with his work in the music industry.

In addition, Rowe, 55, is skeptical that the family’s Calabasas compound is a suitable place for Paris, 16, and Prince, 17, citing concerns about the negative impact the teens will have being around the Jackson family members — in particular, Jermaine.
Rowe, according to reports, thinks that the poor influence of the Jackson brothers have most egregiously manifested in Prince’s behavior, as he’s been known to use salty language with no disciplining.

Prince Michael “wants nothing to do with Debbie, now, or ever. He doesn’t trust her, and questions the motives of the timing of her planned legal action. It’s very upsetting to Katherine, which obviously distresses Prince because of his grandmother’s health. If Debbie does take this to court, Prince will get up on the stand and testify about things he doesn’t think Debbie would want the world to know,” the insider added.
Request for comment from Katherine Jackson and Debbie Rowe’s attorneys by Radar weren’t immediately returned.

 

[LastTear]

^^^^ Where the recommendation came from should have had alarm bells ringing.

Radar has another story which features Lester. Smdh I won't post because a) I'm not sure we want to read it and b) I'm worried it will be messed up like the other.

But weisner makes a quote saying he laughed off Rowe and Schaffel's engagement saying it would make a good movie.

 

[Snow White luvs Peter Pan]

That radar article looks like they made up what people actually said. It wouldn't surprise if Jr. doesn't consider Deborah his mother. Like I said before, a mother doesn't only conceive you and gives birth.

 

[LastTear]

@Respect77 Thanks, I tried but it's not letting me edit now, so I can't even delete it. I will flag it and hopefully it won't take long, at least people can read yours.

Edit, it's been dealt with and we can use Respect77 copy for reference.

 

[Snow White luvs Peter Pan]

And why does radar put Blanket into this mess? DR has no legal rights over him.

 

[michaeljackson&lisamarie]

And why does radar put Blanket into this mess? DR has no legal rights over him.

this is what I was wondering about myself, but a poster told me because the court wouldn't want separate the kids.

 

[LastTear]

And why does radar put Blanket into this mess? DR has no legal rights over him.

Because according to the TMZ article she is also seeking custody of Blanket, I don't think any court would separate them.

I note on the radar article that they say they have confirmed that Debbie will be seeking custody.

 

[Tammy86]

That radar article looks like they made up what people actually said. It wouldn't surprise if Jr. doesn't consider Deborah his mother. Like I said before, a mother doesn't only conceive you and gives birth.

I agree with you on the last sentence you wrote. Anyone can make a baby, But it takes a real man or woman to be a parent.

 

[WhoIsIt89]

Just like Sneddon and Diane Diamond bullied MJ, Debbie is now the target of hate and jealousy. Debbie now knows exactly what MJ endured. It is cruel and mean to be so hateful towards Debbie. There are no acceptable excuses.

Oh please. Poor Debbie, we're simply bullying her, and we're treating her how they treated Michael....NOPE!

Debbie will never know how or what Michael felt during those years of his life, never not in any day during her lifetime. What she's doing now is simply not needed, she deserves whatever shit is being thrown at her right now. Prince wants nothing to do with her, why is she seeking custody of a child who doesn't consider her his mother or anything else. Prince seems happy just where he is, Blanket seems content with it, Paris is the only one who reportedly enjoys her relationship with Debbie. Good for her, if she wants to go stay with her mother that's her prerogative. But fact is, she should be given a choice of the matter. Debbie filing for custody isn't giving either of the three a fair choice, it's forcing a situation upon them using the law.

Later for that whole "sympathy for Debbie" motto.

 

[Lisha]

. It is cruel and mean to be so hateful towards Debbie. There are no acceptable excuses.

Well, Joyce, it's cruel and mean and self-destructive to be so hateful towards anyone,

but,

it can't be denied that a lot of these things fans have brought up have put Debbie in a very unattractive light. If these things are actually based on true facts, or spun stories from tabloid journalism, still might need to be worked out in some of these things.

Debbie filing for custody isn't giving either of the three a fair choice, it's forcing a situation upon them using the law.

I think you may have a point here.

I agree with Prince that his college prep studies should not be interrupted...he is on track to fulfill a goal of his; that should be respected. He has his sites on USC...a competitive school, as far as who gets in or not. He needs that strong GPA, a high SAT/ACT score, community service, examples of leadership, etc. No doubt he has been working hard towards all of this so his application shines. He is a focused young man; he doesn't need any grief or hassle about where he is going to end up living (or who with) in the next year or so.

But again, I do not know exactly what is true or not. Prince hasn't tweeted to confirm his thoughts on all of this. We haven't heard from him personally...only a "supposed source" via Radar Online.

 

[WhoIsIt89]

True, but this isn't the very first time that we've heard Prince wishes no relations between him and Debbie, it first started being said the moment Michael died and it was up in the air who got the children, Debbie or Katherine. We heard it again during the whole situation with Paris, multiple times even by more than one source. And we're hearing it again now.


It's like the old saying goes, where there's smoke, there's fire.

 

[pug]

this is what I was wondering about myself, but a poster told me because the court wouldn't want separate the kids.

There's also six years of child support attached to Blanket.

 

[marebear]

We don't know what they think they don't want to move now. Prince is confident and seems to have his father's work ethic. He wants to go to university and he shouldn't have anything or anyone interfere with that. Blanket doesn't know Debbie and he won't want to live with her. With Paris, who knows but it should be a choice as said and not forced on them.

 

[jamba]

Same for me.

Prince has always kept his distance from Debbie, but Paris is her own person. Prince might have told his opinion to Paris but it was Paris' decision to decide what she wants to do with Debbie. He cannot control Paris just because he's her older brother.

But who knows what happened between Debbie and Paris since their very public "bonding".

I feel sorry for Paris because she's obviously in need of a parent figure after Michael's death, but she will have to be cautious with Debbie. It sucks so much that these kids cannot trust anyone. Just like their father Michael couldn't.

Yes, I agree that Paris the the one in need right now, and it was said in some reports that before her suicide attempt she had a falling out/argument/fight with Prince re Debbie--that he did not want to go visit her, get to know her, but Paris did. So maybe the 2 kids have 2 different opinions/wishes/needs--in fact, it's obvious I would say.

It's disturbing that this is being played out with 'inside sources' threatening each other and claiming to speak for the parties involved. I find it all quite disturbing and unethical and not good for the kids to have this handled via the media!

Re the exposure of Paris to the media, starting at age 11, by the Jacksons, I compiled the following list:

Here are some of the media appearances Paris has made, starting at age 11. (I list the primary event, not the voluminous secondary coverage by other media outlets.)

2009
July 7, 2009. The Michael Jackson Memorial, Paris speaks to an audience of one billion, all 3 children on stage.

2010
February 1, 2010. Grammy Awards where there was a performance of Earth Song. Paris and Prince speak on stage.

May 25, 2010. Paris, Prince, and Blanket signed a designer belt sold to raise $ for museum in Gary, IN. The children did not appear in person.)

November 8, 2010. Oprah (first interview, Paris is 12), all 3 children interviewed.

2011
February 24, 2011. Good Morning America show where all 3 children and Mrs. Katherine Jackson were interviewed by Robin Roberts.

August 9, 2011. The children donate Michael Jackson’s art work to L.A. Children’s Hospital.

October 8, 2011. Michael Jackson Tribute Concert in Cardiff, Wales, all 3 children speak on stage.

October 29, 2011. Prince signs MJ replica jackets.

November 30, 2011. Prince, Paris and Blanket attend The X-factor tribute to Michael Jackson. Prince and Paris speak about Immortal, the Cirque du Soleil show just opening, and the X-Factor show.

December 3, 2011. Cirque du Soleil Premier of Michael Jackson Immortal. All 3 children attend.

December 15, 2011. Ellen De Generes show. Paris is interviewed. Prince and Blanket are in the audience.

December, 2011. Three of the original Jackson Five hold the first of two tribute concerts to Michael at the National Stadium in Yoyogi, Tokyo. The children make an appearance via video at the concerts.

2012
January 26, 2012. The children make imprints of their hand-prints and Mr. Jackson’s footprints in cement at Grauman’s Chinese Theater. Paris and Prince speak on stage.

June 10, 2012. Oprah (second interview), an extended interview with Paris.

August 29, 2012 (Michael Jackson’s 54th birthday). The children are in Gary, Indiana, for a 4-day festival Goin’ Back to Indiana: Can You Feel It? Ms. Katherine Jackson was to hold a press conference but Prince and Paris went alone instead. The children are much exposed to the media, including an appearance to promote a perfume sponsored by Joe Jackson.

September, 2012. Paris is interviewed by Glamour magazine.

October 12, 2012. Mr. Pink (a soft drink), Premier Launch. The children are interviewed on camera to promote this beverage.

2013
Febuary 2013. Prince Jackson is named on-air correspondent for Entertainment Tonight. His first assignment is interviewing the director and actors of the recent Oz movie.

April 2013. An extended interview with Paris Jackson in Event magazine. Paris is on the cover, full-page photos of her inside, and an interview with her and Mrs. Katherine Jackson inside.

Now, I know there is an argument to be made that some of these media appearances were appropriate and to honor Michael, and that's fine, but some clearly were not, and the constant exposure IMO was not a good idea, esp. after a major trauma and when there was a huge need for readjustment to a totally different life than the one the kids were living before. I think Paris being a devoted Daddy's girl made it esp. hard for her.

 

[Petrarose]

Those statements from the Jenn article about what Prince said, I don't know, but it sounds like another made up source statement. We all know Prince stays away from Debbie, and the publication knows that also. That was the same magazine among others that was giving wrong information about where Paris was. They were sure too..

Jamba you forgot the big Charity event where the kids were on camera promoting the fake charity. They even had titles and were posted on the charity page. How about the contract binding the children for life which is illegal. Maybe you mentioned those and I missed them?

 

[HIStory]

Yes, I agree that Paris the the one in need right now, and it was said in some reports that before her suicide attempt she had a falling out/argument/fight with Prince re Debbie--that he did not want to go visit her, get to know her, but Paris did. So maybe the 2 kids have 2 different opinions/wishes/needs--in fact, it's obvious I would say.

I would be careful with accepting such rumours as the truth though. It was an obvious attempt by a tabloid to try to blame Paris's suicide attempt on Prince.

 

[SheilaMJFan4Ever]

Re: Debbie Rowe Wants Michael Jackson's Kids Back -- Going To Court for Custody Read more: http://w

Since when are paid surrogates considered mothers? Debbie is, was and always will be a JOKE. She got her payday when she agreed to carry those kids for Mike and part of the agreement was she give up any parental rights (and she DID). Let's not forget the only thing on her mind when Mike died was if the financial agreement he set up with her would still be honored.

I'm still disappointed that Mike chose such a classless woman to carry his children. He seems to have gotten it right with Blanket's surrogate. So far she's honored their arrangement and not try to whore for attention and more money.

 

[HIStory]

Trying to connect some dots:

Debbie tweeted she's currently in South Korea. Who else is in South Korea? Ian Thomas. So it seems the trip has to do with this guy who Schaffel manages:

They will be releasing both a Korean and English version of their duet song. It was also revealed that Ian Thomas had arrived in Korea on April 13 in order to record with them.

http://www.kpopstarz.com/articles/8...-sing-duet-with-belgian-singer-ian-thomas.htm

Another article I found on the guy says Thomas will be on Entertainment Tonight on April 24:

Op 24 april doet het Amerikaanse Entertainment Tonight een special rond onze landgenoot Ian Thomas.

Google translate:

On April 24, the U.S. Entertainment Tonight doing a special on our compatriot Ian Thomas.

http://www.hln.be/hln/nl/944/Celebr...1893/2014/04/14/Ian-Thomas-goes-America.dhtml

I find this very odd, because I can't see why the US media would be interested in this Belgian Justin Bieber-wannabe. So I guess Schaffel and Debbie are using their connections with the media (which stems from their connection to MJ and and his kids) to heavily promote this guy.

I wonder if ET agreed to show him and his video in exchange of Debbie giving them an interview or something... Because I can't see why otherwise ET would be interested in this guy.

If the whole custody threat is a part of a PR stunt to promote Ian Thomas and to stir up things before an upcoming Rowe interview to make it interesting then Debbie is crazier and more irresponsible than even I thought before.

 

[LastTear]

^^^^^ And that is exactly what I think this is. She apparently moans about TJ's work taking him away and yet takes on a project that will require travelling.

Debbie has done nothing to confirm or deny, it suits her that this story is running and she is making headlines - Great stuff for your kids to read, that will help them sleep soundly!

 

[michaeljackson&lisamarie]

Re: Debbie Rowe Wants Michael Jackson's Kids Back -- Going To Court for Custody Read more: http://w

Since when are paid surrogates considered mothers? Debbie is, was and always will be a JOKE. She got her payday when she agreed to carry those kids for Mike and part of the agreement was she give up any parental rights (and she DID). Let's not forget the only thing on her mind when Mike died was if the financial agreement he set up with her would still be honored.

I'm still disappointed that Mike chose such a classless woman to carry his children. He seems to have gotten it right with Blanket's surrogate. So far she's honored their arrangement and not try to whore for attention and more money.

I agree with you. and I'm also sickened that he told debbie rowe yes to carrying his kids. he didn't exactly choose her though. debbie was obsessed with michael. she kept offering to have kids for michael for years. even before he even got together with lisa marie. he use to always tell debbie NO though. he use to always turn her down.

then he and lisa fell inlove and got married. at one point the honeymoon stage was over. they started to have problems. they had so much pressure. the media was against them, attacking them at every turn. calling their marriage a sham. then to add lisa's mother priscilla didn't like michael and wanted the marriage to be over. the main problem though was that michael wanted to have children right away, but lisa didn't want to have them at the time.

so michael use to confide in debbie about the whole baby thing. instead of debbie being a true friend and supporting michael, telling him to stay strong and work it out with his wife. she saw it as an opportunity for her to get payed and try to take michael for herself. so again she started offering her womb to him. telling him that she will carry his kids for him. michael was really vulnerable and desperate at the time. so he finally gave in and said yes.

debbie got a rude awakening later though. she really thought carrying michael's kids would make michael fall inlove with her, NOT. michael just wasn't feeling her that way. yes, he married her, but it wasn't for the reason that it should be when two people get married. michael wasn't in love with debbie. he married debbie to get proper rights over his kids. he didn't even want debbie living with him. when michael married debbie. he bought her, her own place. he did not want her living with him at neverland. and when debbie realized she couldn't get michael to fall for her. that's when she started to show her true colors and the rest is history.

 

[Mechi]

Someone who truely loves the children would not do this to them this way. And that's the whole story!

Paris is in such a vulnerable state. Prince is not talking to Debbie and seems not wanted to be involved with her in any way. Blanket doesn't know this woman.

A person interested in the childrens well being would never ever do this.

I hope it's only tabloid garbage for sensationalism... but even if it is only that... it's ashame!

 

[Lisha]

Re: Debbie Rowe Wants Michael Jackson's Kids Back -- Going To Court for Custody Read more: http://w

Once again, let me say I am not necessarily a fan of Debbie's, (there's lot's being presented that would give one "pause") nor am I necessarily against Lisa Marie or for her...but I want to be objective here and fair, so let me ask you some questions about some things you present like facts you know for sure,

debbie got a rude awakening later though. she really thought carrying michael's kids would make michael fall inlove with her, NOT. michael just wasn't feeling her that way. yes, he married her, but it wasn't for the reason that it should be when two people get married. michael wasn't in love with debbie. he married debbie to get proper rights over his kids. he didn't even want debbie living with him. when michael married debbie. he bought her, her own place. he did not want her living with him at neverland. and when debbie realized she couldn't get michael to fall for her. that's when she started to show her true colors and the rest is history.

I was of the understanding that is was Debbie who opted to continue with her job and remain in LA in her apartment while being married to MJ. And that she on weekends traveled up when she could to Neverland. And that this was in agreement with him, with MJ willingly helping her and paying for to live somewhere where there could be more security...because once becoming MJ's wife...one will not be left alone but vigorously sought out, harassed and photographed by the paps.

My question, where did you learn as FACT that MJ "did not want her living with him at Neverland"?

These same reasons I give above is why I thought that he was so reasonable and generous with her at the time of their divorce, once she said she couldn't take the stress of being married to a high profile celebrity such as he, and together, meaning he willingly (and their friendship still being in place at this time) helped her find and purchased for her a home with a high surrounding hedge that would be secure feeling for her. He didn't leave her to fend for herself out there, initially...he knew it could be hard, and he generously did what he could to set her up right. This says more about Michael, than Debbie; he did the decent thing.

One can't be married to MJ for a time and then try to go off and live their own life and expect to be "left alone" and do fine in any ol' apt./condo/home. And MJ understood that. At least this seems to be the way things went...I do not profess to know these things as fact. Does anyone know where I am in error here?

 

[HIStory]

^ This was posted by Ivy on another forum a couple of days ago. It is from court documents etc. Just to put things into a context:

She filed for divorce six months later – accepting a pay-off worth £4.2million over nine years, in return for giving up her custodial rights to the children.

-----------------------------------------------------------

In the 2005 custody hearing, Jackson's lawyer Thomas Hall told Judge Stephen Lachs, "Mr. Jackson was under an agreement with petitioner [Rowe] here, which he was to pay her -- did pay her about $4 [million] or $5 million up front, gave her a mansion in Beverly Hills, and then was to pay $900,000 a year for a number of years if she abided by agreement terms."

-------------------------------------------------------------

Rowe Vrs. Jackson Court Case, NYPost, 25th August, 2006

Back in 1999, Michael Jackson gave Debbie Rowe over $8 million in support and legal fees in their divorce settlement. Los Angeles Superior Court Judge Robert A. Schnider ordered Michael Jackson to pay ex – wife Deborah Rowe $60,000 to go to lawyers fees that she incurred while trying to win visitation rights to the couple’s two children. Judge Schnider noted that Rowe had already received a financial settlement of $8 million from Michael, commenting “She has millions of dollars, so she should be able to contribute to her own fees.”

----------

So you can see from two court records the settlement / alimony was $8 Million + house. She got half of it upfront and the rest in yearly installments. If you go with $900,000 a year it would end the payments in mid 2000s, if you go with 9 years it would end it around 2008. So I would think that the alimony/ settlement payments to Debbie was completed before Michael died and that's why the Estate isn't paying anything to her now.

One can try to romanticize it but this was more a business deal than anything else. And whenever the money flowing from Michael to Debbie dried up she started to threaten custody battles or did indeed start a lawsuit and whenever the money started flowing again her alleged concerns about the kids disappeared again. I would not call that a friend, to be honest.

 

[Lisha]

One can try to romanticize it but this was more a business deal than anything else. And whenever the money flowing from Michael to Debbie dried up she started to threaten custody battles or did indeed start a lawsuit and whenever the money started flowing again her alleged concerns about the kids disappeared again. I would not call that a friend, to be honest.

Your choice of word "romanticize"...well, I see what you mean, for didn't MJ himself in an interview while He and Debbie were married say it was not the type of love you would find in the movies or books? It seems he was describing a friendship/love, not a romantic love.

Again I may be weak on the facts, Ivy is so good at staying with the facts, I love that about her!...but I thought there was only one incident where Debbie was not getting her agreed upon payments (is that what you could mean by "dried up") and she went to her attorney for legal help because she was now very dependent on that cash to help with her new business/ranch she was starting up (need lots of capital for that)..so she was up a creek. MJ could not be reached nor could she get his attention so she could talk things through with him, and her attorney figured out a way to get his attention (not condoning this AT ALL)... There was apparently continued resistance to work things out (I'm sure MJ felt he did not need another trying thing to deal with at this already very hard time in his life), so the custody battle thing began. That "worked"; then things began to move and MJ realized he could be considered as having legally reneged on their legal agreement (sadly, if you recall, he had others at this time looking over his finances that were taking advantage of him and were negligent in getting people MJ owed money to, paid. And he was out of the country).

It was a mess, but there were two sides to this.

But, this does indicate perhaps a pattern in both Debbie, and her fiancé, that when they can't get an audience with someone/MJ they will use tactics to get the attention they are after. Marc during his lawsuit with MJ got some unflattering stories of MJ out there in the media, isn't that true, and Debbie now is getting stories out there in the media? Some fans have suggested she is trying to get someone's attention...the Jackson family? Paris? Prince? Or is it for publicity/promotion? There ya go again, is it true that all is fair in love, war, and entertainment?

I don't know...I am not a big fan of manipulative or strategic behavior used in order for one to get what they want. Yet, MJ himself was quite good at this, so what do I do with that? It all began at Motown many, many years ago...that was modeled to him, and a young conscientious lover of all things entertainment, was a golden student.

I always want to remember that people can change; they can evolve and become better people. What someone has done in the past does not necessarily represent who they are today.

Yet, some people don't change. Has Marc changed for the better over time? Is Debbie a good person with a good heart and safe for MJ's children today? How can we know for sure any of these things; we can't see inside anyone's heart.

I think that is what makes things hard for MJ's fans. It's just so much guess work and we just want to know everything is going to be okay. We want that assurance. Sad that that won't most likely happen for us.

We can think we can know someone through and through by their behavior alone, but we can't. There is always more to a person; both good and bad.

 

[michaeljackson&lisamarie]

Re: Debbie Rowe Wants Michael Jackson's Kids Back -- Going To Court for Custody Read more: http://w

Once again, let me say I am not necessarily a fan of Debbie's, (there's lot's being presented that would give one "pause") nor am I necessarily against Lisa Marie or for her...but I want to be objective here and fair, so let me ask you some questions about some things you present like facts you know for sure,



I was of the understanding that is was Debbie who opted to continue with her job and remain in LA in her apartment while being married to MJ. And that she on weekends traveled up when she could to Neverland. And that this was in agreement with him, with MJ willingly helping her and paying for to live somewhere where there could be more security...because once becoming MJ's wife...one will not be left alone but vigorously sought out, harassed and photographed by the paps.

My question, where did you learn as FACT that MJ "did not want her living with him at Neverland"?

These same reasons I give above is why I thought that he was so reasonable and generous with her at the time of their divorce, once she said she couldn't take the stress of being married to a high profile celebrity such as he, and together, meaning he willingly (and their friendship still being in place at this time) helped her find and purchased for her a home with a high surrounding hedge that would be secure feeling for her. He didn't leave her to fend for herself out there, initially...he knew it could be hard, and he generously did what he could to set her up right. This says more about Michael, than Debbie; he did the decent thing.

One can't be married to MJ for a time and then try to go off and live their own life and expect to be "left alone" and do fine in any ol' apt./condo/home. And MJ understood that. At least this seems to be the way things went...I do not profess to know these things as fact. Does anyone know where I am in error here?

hi lisha, I'll try to see what I can find to help you out.

 

[michaeljackson&lisamarie]

^ This was posted by Ivy on another forum a couple of days ago. It is from court documents etc. Just to put things into a context:



One can try to romanticize it but this was more a business deal than anything else. And whenever the money flowing from Michael to Debbie dried up she started to threaten custody battles or did indeed start a lawsuit and whenever the money started flowing again her alleged concerns about the kids disappeared again. I would not call that a friend, to be honest.

yes, i completely agree with you. and if I'm not mistaken I believe karen faye a while back admitted on twitter or facebook one of them, that michael's marriage to debbie was a buisness arrangment. I believe someone asked her about it and she confirmed it.

 

[HIStory]

Your choice of word "romanticize"...well, I see what you mean, for didn't MJ himself in an interview while He and Debbie were married say it was not the type of love you would find in the movies or books? It seems he was describing a friendship/love, not a romantic love.

When I say some people romanticize the relationship between MJ and Debbie, I do not only mean romantic love (IMO it's obvious that they never had that), but I also mean this huge, mega everlasting friendship. They might have had a friendship back in the past, before the baby project, but I don't think they remained friends after their marriage. Michael knew Debbie more than any of us and apparently he did not want her in his children's life. I think by know we should be able to see many of the reasons why if we open our eyes and do not try to excuse everything Debbie Rowe does.

By "romanticizing it" I also mean things when fans say Debbie gave a "gift" to Michael. Sorry, but you do not pay for a gift... It was a business arrangament, not a friendly gift.

Again I may be weak on the facts, Ivy is so good at staying with the facts, I love that about her!...but I thought there was only one incident where Debbie was not getting her agreed upon payments (is that what you could mean by "dried up") and she went to her attorney for legal help because she was now very dependent on that cash to help with her new business/ranch she was starting up (need lots of capital for that)..so she was up a creek. MJ could not be reached nor could she get his attention so she could talk things through with him, and her attorney figured out a way to get his attention (not condoning this AT ALL)... There was apparently continued resistance to work things out (I'm sure MJ felt he did not need another trying thing to deal with at this already very hard time in his life), so the custody battle thing began. That "worked"; then things began to move and MJ realized he could be considered as having legally reneged on their legal agreement (sadly, if you recall, he had others at this time looking over his finances that were taking advantage of him and were negligent in getting people MJ owed money to, paid. And he was out of the country).

It might be that MJ was in breach of an agreement but I think she should have then addressed strictly that agreement and not try to manipulate and act like she's all of a sudden all concerned for the children - the same children about whom she previously said she had no interest in raising them and they are best with Michael. If she had worries about her cash-flow then address that, but do not fake "concern" for the kids - which concerns then miraculously disappear when she is paid again.

But, this does indicate perhaps a pattern in both Debbie, and her fiancé, that when they can't get an audience with someone/MJ they will use tactics to get the attention they are after. Marc during his lawsuit with MJ got some unflattering stories of MJ out there in the media, isn't that true, and Debbie now is getting stories out there in the media? Some fans have suggested she is trying to get someone's attention...the Jackson family? Paris? Prince? Or is it for publicity/promotion? There ya go again, is it true that all is fair in love, war, and entertainment?

I don't know...I am not a big fan of manipulative or strategic behavior used in order for one to get what they want. Yet, MJ himself was quite good at this, so what do I do with that? It all began at Motown many, many years ago...that was modeled to him, and a young conscientious lover of all things entertainment, was a golden student.

As far as I am concerned it's totally different matter to "manipulate" in entertainment, showbiz - which is an accepted part of the game -, and to do it in family matters and using your children as a leverage. Let's not mix up the two and try to defend Debbie by suggesting that MJ was just as bad. MJ would have NEVER pimped out his children to the media for publicity. He would have NEVER have used them for his own benefit. He protected, raised and loved them all his life. Debbie Rowe can never even dream about being as great of a parent as Michael was.

I always want to remember that people can change; they can evolve and become better people. What someone has done in the past does not necessarily represent who they are today.

Yet, some people don't change. Has Marc changed for the better over time? Is Debbie a good person with a good heart and safe for MJ's children today? How can we know for sure any of these things; we can't see inside anyone's heart.

I think that is what makes things hard for MJ's fans. It's just so much guess work and we just want to know everything is going to be okay. We want that assurance. Sad that that won't most likely happen for us.

We can think we can know someone through and through by their behavior alone, but we can't. There is always more to a person; both good and bad.

Past? We are talking about present here. The subject of this thread is very much present. So what does tell you that Debbie Rowe changed for the better?

 

[michaeljackson&lisamarie]

@lisha I'm still working on getting some information for you. for the time being though, yea the marriage was a buisness arangment. like I said they weren't living together and he bought her, her own place. your right though it is said that michael didn't want the paps stalking and harassing her. so he bought her a house away from all that with security or something. If that was really the case though, why didn't michael just have debbie live with him at neverland, his WIFE? there would have been no safer place for her then with him at neverland. NO BODY could even try to get into neverland without permision.