Documents prosecutors believe will put Michael Jackson's doctor behind bars

[elusive moonwalker]

yeah i agree .we need to stick to the facts as theres so much info it gets confusing. so if a theory is debunked it needs to stay debunked and ppl not keep ruuning with it as fact just casue it suits their theory. thats not about getting jsutice for mj thats someone wanting something to be true cause it suits their theory of what happened.

 

[Ashtanga]

i think there were some posts that said murray was not in the ambulance (No evidence of that) in the conspraicy section. that is prob is whats confusing ppl.

I never had doubts.

**image removed and replaced with link** If someone wants to view the image they may. There are others that still a sensitive to these things...thanks**
http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/5723/murray2.jpg

 

[MJJLaugh]

Oh man, that article, even if it was News of the World, and all those charts are hard to read.

Facts - Murray did go in the ambulance with MJ and paramedics
Facts - Murray did not tell the paramedics that he gave MJ propofol.

But if they see an IV drip in his leg, the paramedics would ask two questions I think
1) why in his leg ?
2) what was in the IV drip ? ( according to Murray just fluids to rehydrate and the injection of Lorazepam)

Questions - how much Lorazepam did Murray say he gave ?
Questions - timeline - finding Michael and calling

If it was possible MJ was dead "tens of minutes" is it possible that he was killed by the bolus injection of propofol at 11.40 ?

Very heartbreaking to see all those charts and the cold, hard facts.......

 

[Sophielo]

Cold hard facts are often the toughest things to read. Reading all this has just gotten me more angry. This should not be an involuntary manslaughter case and everyone knows that. Too many people with their own personal agendas stopping justice. I read earlier that the the judge preceeding over this case, Melville, his wife is a doctor. How is that not a conflict of interests for a start?

 

[ivy]

Yesterday when I saw this I was instantly saddened and could not even continue to read it. Today I see that it basically the more detailed version of what we have already knew/heard from several sources (such as news reports and autopsy findings).

The one major thing is that Murray did not tell the paramedics about propofol and other medicines that he gave. This will be important in the trial.

One question if there are any medical experts out there. Is this part means that Michael was dead for a short period of time or not? How long the muscles flick after death?

There was some "pulseless electric activity" meaning the heart muscle was still flickering even though the singer was dead.

On a side note I'm also sad to see that everything private related to Michael leaks.

 

[Vici]

This was such a hard read.

Of all crap he had to go through and this is how it ends? Its too much to deal with

We won so many battles to lose the war.

 

[JMie]

I never had doubts.

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/5723/murray2.jpg

omg, I haven't seen this photo before. Heartbreaking :no::no::no:

 

[StaceyMJ]

This was such a hard read.

Of all crap he had to go through and this is how it ends? Its too much to deal with

We won so many battles to lose the war.

You're right. It's like someone played a sick joke on us all. So hard to stomach.

 

[elusive moonwalker]

Of all crap he had to go through and this is how it ends? Its too much to deal with :sad:

We won so many battles to lose the war.

thats exactly how i feel, the pain is unbearable

 

[elusive moonwalker]

Questions - how much Lorazepam did Murray say he gave ?

cant remember the exact figure but it was some thing like 2 and half time less than what they actually found in mj.so he lied again

If it was possible MJ was dead "tens of minutes" is it possible that he was killed by the bolus injection of propofol at 11.40 ?

well we dont know the exact time it was given as murrya kept changing the story. i doubt it was given at 11.40 as murray was on the phone then. its diffiucltto work things out. one theory id give is he gave the drugs at around 10.40 as he first claimed then made his phonecalls and didnt notice mj until 12.but the problem with that is IF it was bolus and it killed him within minutes murray didnt make his first phonecall until 11.18. so that doesnt really fit. if had given the injection at 10.40 and the first phonecall started at 10.45 it would be more of an argument.

At 11:18am he called his Las Vegas office for 32 minutes

at 11:49am he called another Las Vegas phone for 3 minutes

at 11:51am he phoned somebody in Houston for 11 minutes.

at 12:05 pm he called MJ's assistant.

at 12: 21 pm paramedics were called

 

[Maria MJ]

I still haven't managed to read the whole article.
It's too painful going over these agonizing last minutes again and again.
Like in a nightmare,to try to intervene but in vain.
Why would they mess with our feelings if it's not even partially true?
Haven't we been through enough already?

 

[honeysucklejasmine]

There was some "pulseless electric activity" meaning the heart muscle was still flickering even though the singer was dead.
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One question if there are any medical experts out there. Is this part means that Michael was dead for a short period of time or not? How long the muscles flick after death?

True pulseless electrical activity (PEA) is defined as no heart muscle activity in the presence of organised electrical activity picked up on the ECG/EKG so that News of the World quote is a bit misleading. Not sure of the max length of time PEA can be sustained in humans if there is no attempt at resuscitation and there is obviously no way of finding this out. Studies using animal models have shown PEA lasting for at least 20 minutes after removing the oxygen supply with no other attempt at resus during that time.

 

[PrettyYoungThang]

im sure you guys realise by now that the ambulance photo was photoshopped??!!

 

[elusive moonwalker]

no it wasnt thats a theory from the conspiracy ppl. the fans who were at the house that day and in previous days know the pap who took the picture.

 

[angelofhope]

very upsetting.

 

[bubbyduck4MJ]

So did Murray demand the 3rd round of drugs just to make it look like he desperately tried to save Michael? When really there's so many time gaps. Bahh.

This was such a hard read.

Of all crap he had to go through and this is how it ends? Its too much to deal with

We won so many battles to lose the war.

 

[elusive moonwalker]

o did Murray demand the 3rd round of drugs just to make it look like he desperately tried to save Michael? When really there's so many time gaps. Bahh. :sad:

yes and he didnt want it called at the house as it changes the situation with the police etc

 

[angelofhope]

This was such a hard read.

Of all crap he had to go through and this is how it ends? Its too much to deal with

We won so many battles to lose the war.

totally agree. Very well put Vici.
Why did Michael have to leave us like that? with no dignity? no goodbye?

 

[angelofhope]

How about we write up a right and wrong list going, makes the facts clear and then add the conspiracy part and then when its rebuffed or proven we add it to the list with credible sources.

We could make a dedicated thread in the case call Fact and Fiction or summat like that.

But getting back on topic its plainly obvious the News Of The World are sensationalising some of this, however it is a very tough read given we are where are with MJ.

totally agree Gaz.
The fact or fiction thing sounds a good idea, it will be even more important in the coming months.