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How did murray expect to get the Propofol into England?

IDK....maybe Murray being a doctor he is allowed to carry meds on board a plane in a carry-on-bag.......seeing as we know it is not a regulated med he could just take it on the plane.
 
Couldn't he just have his girlfriend send it to him in London? It was coming to her house. Or am I just wrong?
 
elusive moonwalker said:
well i doubt murray was gonna tell the pharmacy what he was using it for and where he was gonna use it
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Yeah exactly, Murray wouldn't want to tell anyone anything, but in the uk it's the pharmacist's duty to find out and be satisfied themselves, or else no supply. Foreign doctors's requests are always looked at more closely in the UK, the pharmacist would have to check they are allowed to practice and are registered etc.

I reckon mail would have probably been the way intended it to get it in the UK. Less personal.

In the Vegas Pharmacy, who knows if the pharmacist checked anything out. Maybe Murray lied to them about the use? Like I said I don't know the ins and outs of pharmacist's responsibilities in the US but they can't be that different in principle.
 
daisydaisy said:
In the Vegas Pharmacy, who knows if the pharmacist checked anything out. Maybe Murray lied to them about the use? Like I said I don't know the ins and outs of pharmacist's responsibilities in the US but they can't be that different in principle.
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daisydaisy I agree that the things should have worked like you said, unfortunately they did/do not.

On the other hand even if the pharmacy tried to check out the medicines probably they could not do it due to the fact that there was a lot of aliases used on prescriptions.

also I'm curious is there a central system in UK that shows any medicine prescribed/ being taken by a patient? To my best knowledge in US there's not one, every pharmacy keeps their own records meaning you can get conflicting medicines from different pharmacies without raising a red flag.
 
An anesthetist could bring it to the country for his patient like his last doctor during HIStory but not Dr M he was not even supposed to use that medicine or drug on anyone, especially not without the right equipment. I find it hard to believe that he really could be so stupid. Maybe he was not supposed to make it to UK because he would have a fare investigation there no payments no conspiracy who knows … maybe that was the whole plan.
 
ivy said:
daisydaisy I agree that the things should have worked like you said, unfortunately they did/do not.

On the other hand even if the pharmacy tried to check out the medicines probably they could not do it due to the fact that there was a lot of aliases used on prescriptions.

also I'm curious is there a central system in UK that shows any medicine prescribed/ being taken by a patient? To my best knowledge in US there's not one, every pharmacy keeps their own records meaning you can get conflicting medicines from different pharmacies without raising a red flag.
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I agree, if aliases were used then they probably couldn't check for interactions etc. Also, no there is not a central system in the UK yet either, which definitely allows for more mis-prescribing, but pharmacists have to use other resources, like talking to the patient and doctor if necessary before supply. But that's a whole other issue.

All I was saying is that I doubt a UK community pharmacist would ever give a general anaesthetic to a doctor, and definitely not without making sure of the circumstances. Yes this did happen in this case in the US, rightly or wrongly, but I can't see that Murray would have been able to do the same in the UK.

Also, in terms of propofol supply, the patient's name or drug history is not really that relevant, it's a no-brainer that supplying a general anaesthetic is very risky. I'm thinking Murray ordered it from the pharmacy 'for use in his practice' and not on a prescription for a particular patient.
 
kasume said:
Exactly. They weren't planning for Michael to go to London.

And I didn't know it would be a trouble to bring propofol into England.....so I guess it's illegal? Tell me if I'm wrong.

And I doubt Michael would become addicted to propofol when he knows he won't be able to take it to London.



It doesn't matter. That wouldn't have stopped him. Look at "Dr." Thome Thome, also "ambassador for the state of senegal."

If Murray didn't have a license to practice medicine abroad, then all he had to say was "yes, I do have a license."
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It would be near impossible to bring propofol into the UK, it would have to have been literally smuggled in.
Also, Murray would be totally unable to get propofol here officially as it is very very tightly controlled and only used in hospitals- for surgery.
The only way to come into contact with propofol in the UK is if you are an anesthetist in an operating theatre.
The idea that Murray could just walk into a hospital and get some propofol here is totally utterly ludicrous!!!
The only way Murray could get hold of propofol here is on the black market!
 
MJsno1Girl said:
It would be near impossible to bring propofol into the UK, it would have to have been literally smuggled in.
Also, Murray would be totally unable to get propofol here officially as it is very very tightly controlled and only used in hospitals- for surgery.
The only way to come into contact with propofol in the UK is if you are an anesthetist in an operating theatre.
The idea that Murray could just walk into a hospital and get some propofol here is totally utterly ludicrous!!!
The only way Murray could get hold of propofol here is on the black market!
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Exactly what I was trying to say earlier, but you said it better! The idea that Murray could just walk into a pharmacy on the street and get propofol is even more ludicrous!
 
daisydaisy said:
This is so wrong.
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Slightly off topic perhaps but I clicked on all their Diprivan supplies as if to buy it and everytime it said "Currently not available".
I doubt that this practice of selling it online, without any control whatsoever, will be allowed much longer, based on what happened with MJ.
 
Murray doesnt even have a license to practice medicine in England.
 
Well, I think it would have been difficult to impossible to get propofol in England, and that has nothing to do with pharmacists. It's not a prescription drug and not available in pharmacies. Doctors have to order it for their practices and the same for hospitals (except for particular pharmacies who also supply doctors and facilities). Whether or not Murray could have brought it with him or had it shipped, who knows? I don't think Michael would have felt he needed it that much once the tour started because there were days between shows, and he would not have had to keep the same schedule and could have napped/slept whenever he needed to to catch up - maybe? I don't know, but just thinking out loud I guess. Because I was thinking his insomnia was a huge issue when he had to go to rehearsals every day/night about the same time and spend long hours there, then couldn't fall asleep before he had to get up and do it all over again. The way the tour was set up would have given him some space, I think.
 
British law states that to practice medicene in the UK you have to register with the GMC. Murray would have had to do that seeing as they were going to be in England for quite a long period. My understanding is that propofol is stocked in pharmacies but its for hospital use only.
 
sloride said:
British law states that to practice medicene in the UK you have to register with the GMC. Murray would have had to do that seeing as they were going to be in England for quite a long period. My understanding is that propofol is stocked in pharmacies but its for hospital use only.
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I guess that propofol is different in England then. Because in the U.S. it wouldn't be stocked in the majority of regular pharmacies because prescriptions are not ever written for it and hospitals/medical centers don't order from regular pharmacies. It would be ordered from particular pharmacies that mostly deal with hospitals/medical facilities, or even directly from the manufacturer who would ship in quantity to facilities.
 
Lacey said:
I guess that propofol is different in England then. Because in the U.S. it wouldn't be stocked in the majority of regular pharmacies because prescriptions are not ever written for it and hospitals/medical centers don't order from regular pharmacies. It would be ordered from particular pharmacies that mostly deal with hospitals/medical facilities, or even directly from the manufacturer who would ship in quantity to facilities.
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I don't know if its stocked in every pharmacy. I'm just going by what a friend told me who works in a pharmacy.
 
It would only be in hospital pharmacies, not a general one you get on the high street.
 
It would be near impossible to bring propofol into the UK, it would have to have been literally smuggled in.
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why? its not an illegal drug hes a doctor. is it that easy? he has it in his suitcase with documented paperwork?
 
wondering why IU threads have been moved into here. one is enough
 
StaceyMJ said:
It would only be in hospital pharmacies, not a general one you get on the high street.
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Yes it is only found in hospitals and I don't even know if it would be in a hospital pharmacy or if the operating theatres get it procured directly.

However, high street pharmacies have quite sophisitcated ordering systems and they usually have every drug on there available to order. Not sure if propofol aka diprivan would be on this list but maybe. That's not to say a pharmacist would EVER order it in though.
 
StaceyMJ said:
It would only be in hospital pharmacies, not a general one you get on the high street.
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Exactly. Propfol is not a "Pharmacy Item" per say but an anesthetic. Just like you can't go to a pharmacy and expect to be able to buy an anesthesia agent such as Isoflourane (gas used for a lot of procedure when you are knocked out), the same applies for Propofol.

And as a side note, until I was laid off recently I was a manager for an Animal Hospital. Meaning that part of my job was to order supplies i.e. medications, hospital supplies, anesthesia etc. Propofol is also used in surgeries in animals. In fact we used it all the time. And it's not a controlled substance. Just like a gas anesthesia is not a controlled substance.

So my thought is that Murray's office manager could probably order the Propofol, just as I could for the Vet's Office I worked at as it's manager, and then just have it shipped via Fed Ex to where ever Michael was....

Murray didn't have to order it, his staff could have....
 
With the amount of cargo on MJ's plane, at times it's impossible for customs to check each and every detail.

The doctor would have a case or crates of medication. They would peruse through, look at the inventory and clear it.

You think 2 or even 10 customs staff have the time to open each and every crate and suitcase item in a fully loaded Boeing 747 jet?

You see checking just one bag thoroughly takes them ages.

MJ's doctor would have declared the drugs one way or another. Even if it's declared as propofol, firstly the customs guy wouldn't have a clue what propofol is, and as long as it's not listed on prohibited drugs, it would have cleared as part of a medical consignment.

At customs the doctor does not need to declare how they will use the medicine, so they can carry what may be extra medication that may not be used.

Other celebrities who travel with doctors definitely the doctor has packs of different drugs and with customs i believe all they do is to check amount carried is not too excessive and also not prohibited.

Think of those who have high blood pressure or other conditions, they have packs of medicine carried by doctors which are not purchased locally.

An anaesthetic I believe would easily be cleared
 
Murrey would not have been able to get Propofol in the UK without being licened to practice here, even then he couldn't just write a prescription and go to a chemist and collect it.
 
rsw22 said:
With the amount of cargo on MJ's plane, at times it's impossible for customs to check each and every detail.

The doctor would have a case or crates of medication. They would peruse through, look at the inventory and clear it.

You think 2 or even 10 customs staff have the time to open each and every crate and suitcase item in a fully loaded Boeing 747 jet?

You see checking just one bag thoroughly takes them ages.

MJ's doctor would have declared the drugs one way or another. Even if it's declared as propofol, firstly the customs guy wouldn't have a clue what propofol is, and as long as it's not listed on prohibited drugs, it would have cleared as part of a medical consignment.

At customs the doctor does not need to declare how they will use the medicine, so they can carry what may be extra medication that may not be used.

Other celebrities who travel with doctors definitely the doctor has packs of different drugs and with customs i believe all they do is to check amount carried is not too excessive and also not prohibited.

Think of those who have high blood pressure or other conditions, they have packs of medicine carried by doctors which are not purchased locally.

An anaesthetic I believe would easily be cleared
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yeah i agree
 
hilliver said:
Murrey would not have been able to get Propofol in the UK without being licened to practice here, even then he couldn't just write a prescription and go to a chemist and collect it.
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This would not be possible, as I have said earlier a pharmacist would not hand it out, even to a doctor.
 
Mugsysam said:
And as a side note, until I was laid off recently I was a manager for an Animal Hospital. Meaning that part of my job was to order supplies i.e. medications, hospital supplies, anesthesia etc. Propofol is also used in surgeries in animals. In fact we used it all the time. And it's not a controlled substance. Just like a gas anesthesia is not a controlled substance.
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Ok, this made me pause for a while. The person who commented on TMZ boards, the one who put the blame on Tohme et all, said this on those boards. In July! I told you guys, the ones who also visit the IU, about this person.

He or she said that Propofol was being sent to Neverland (that it dates that far back), for the animals that lived there. I think I have saved the vet's name somewhere in my hard drive, as he only gave clues, and everyone did research.
 
Murray was trying to ween MJ off of the propofol. I don't think he had any intention of bringing it into England.

That female British doctor said MJ had begged her to get propofol for him so it sounds like MJ was planning to get it from elsewhere.
 
that femal doc is a loony tune who isnt credible though. she claimed mj aksed her to have his baby aswell. i doubt she ever met or knew mj

Murray was trying to ween MJ off of the propofol. I don't think he had any intention of bringing it into England.
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no he wasnt.lol thats his argument becasue hes trying to say mj was a druggie as thats his only defence he was hired for the sole purpose of giving/being involved in giving the drug. he asked other doctors to join him in treating mj anethatist (sp) etc they turned it down. so murray obviously told mj no problem ill do it myself.
 
mjlover1988 said:
Murray was trying to ween MJ off of the propofol. I don't think he had any intention of bringing it into England.

That female British doctor said MJ had begged her to get propofol for him so it sounds like MJ was planning to get it from elsewhere.
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Mj wasn´t addicted to propofol he just needed something he could sleep on.He was able to sleep on other drugs the night before he died.
The doctor tried other drugs the night Mj died too but it didn´t work.
 
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