Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins & Bush /Update Controversy surrounding autographs

[StellaJackson]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

There is a picture of the J5 that was auctioned with all their signatures on. One problem: it is actually a picture of the Jacksons and "Jermaine" has signed his name over Jackie's picture.

http://www.julienslive.com/view-auctions/catalog/id/77/lot/33677/

 

[loveforever]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

The whole Julien's catalog was sold, nothing was left out. So either that Bush's/estate's statement was untrue (which is very unlikely), or the deal was made before the collection went to Julien. I'd love to know what he donated to the estate then. In my opinion most of the pieces Gaga bought where iconic, and although Gaga will probably take good care of them, I would have preferred them to belong to the estate.

And that issue with the LA Gear stand signature is still open...

i think bush wrote on his Facebook he will give back some to the estate or the talk to let michael's family chose some to take home Just last month. But the catalog, the collections had been put to Julien long long time ago. Now It seems all the talks are just talks. After all he relied on those iconic pieces to bring him big money.

 

[jamba]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

"Why? She should do as she pleases. I don't think MJ fans are in any position to dictate what should be done with these clothes. She, unlike Bush has no connection to MJ. She wasn't his employee."

Yes, they are hers and she can do as she pleases, as you wrote. But people can still have an opinion and express that here and to whomever they wish.

 

[Bubs]

Post auction release from Julien's:

BREAKING NEWS
For immediate release:

The Collection of Tompkins & Bush
Lives Up to the Legend of the King of Pop

At Julien's Auctions - Sunday, December 2, 2012

Beverly Hills, California – December 2, 2012 … In a day full of as much anticipation as any Michael Jackson concert, Julien’s Auctions, the premier celebrity and entertainment memorabilia auction house, created a day full of special moments, worldwide bidding and the opportunity for museums, collectors and fans from around the world to bid on costumes and other items from the Collection of Tompkins & Bush, longtime fashion designers and friends of Michael Jackson. Darren Julien, founder and CEO of Julien’s Auctions, and Martin Nolan, Executive Director, led their entire team in a fitting tribute to the King of Pop by wearing sequined gloves specially made for the auction event. The one-year anniversary of the passing of Dennis Tompkins was also observed with a moment of silence at the beginning of the collection offering.

Highlights included a cross-section of every era of Michael Jackson’s spectacular career. A Michael Jackson BAD tour jacket sold for $240,000, a white Michael Jackson fantasy glove sold for $192,000 with a second crystal glove selling for $115,200, Michael Jackson’s 1973 Oscar performance ensemble sold for $51,200, Michael Jackson’s signed loafers sold for $10,000, a Michael Jackson signed Captain EO shirt sold for $9,375, a Michael Jackson multi-signed record set sold for $15,360, a White House jacket worn by Jackson to a visit with President George Bush sold for $144,000, a Michael Jackson “We Are the World” jacket sold for $40,625, a Michael Jackson BAD tour shirt sold for $144,000, a BAD tour belt sold for $37,500, a Michael Jackson military style jacket sold for $40.625 and a Michael Jackson signed and worn jacket sold for $156,000.

A portion of the proceeds of the auction benefits two charities, Guide Dogs of America (GuideDogsofAmerica.org) and Nathan Adelson Hospice in Las Vegas (www.nah.org). Both have special meaning to Michael Bush.

"We are so very grateful for everything Julien's Auctions and Michael Bush have done for us," said Lorrie Benson, Media and Community Liaison, Guide Dogs of America. "So many people who come to Guide Dogs of America for help will now gain their independence from their sincere generosity. We feel honored to have been a part of such a wonderful program."

"It has been so incredible to be involved with this auction and the support we have received from Michael Bush and Darren Julien, as well as the late Dennis Tompkins," said Carole Fisher, CEO of Nathan Adelson Hospice of Las Vegas. "Every day we deal with the reminder that life is precious and to know generosity still exists like this is remarkable. We shall surely help many people with their generous donation."

Other highlights were not limited to record prices but also for unprecedented memories. Debbie Jackson, a lifetime fan of Michael Jackson who has dedicated her life to preserving his memory, flew thousands of miles from New Zealand to attend the special event. Serious collectors, museum curators and fans from as far away as Japan, France and other countries attended the all day event, bid by phone or online. It was a spectacular day made for music history.

More auction highlights included a “Dirty Diana” video worn shirt which sold for $68,750, a Michael Jackson Pepsi and Awards jacket sold for $68,750, a white beaded jacket worn by Michael Jackson as he escorted Madonna to the 63rd Academy Awards in 1991 sold for $180,000, a Michael Jackson L.A. Gear photo shoot jacket sold for $204,000, a Michael Jackson military outfit sold for $118,750, Michael Jackson L.A. Gear denims worn in an ad campaign sold for $50,000, a Michael Jackson signed white fedora sold for $6,400, Michael Jackson officer badges sold for $7,500, a Michael Jackson signed and worn hat sold for $11,250, a pair of Michael Jackson signed boots sold for $22,400, a Michael Jackson belt buckle sold for $4,875, a Michael Jackson V-8 jacket sold for $68,750, a Michael Jackson Dangerous tour jacket sold for $216,000 and a Michael Jackson Dangerous tour costume sold for $87,500.

The Michael Jackson “Beat It’ tour jacket sold for $156,000, a Michael Jackson HIStory teaser film jacket sold for $118,750, a Michael Jackson costume signed sketch sold for $5,120, a Michael Jackson gold lamé suit sold for $16,250, a Michael Jackson signed “Scream” prop sold for $3,750 while the Michael Jackson “Scream” costume sold for $156,000.

There is no doubt that Michael Jackson was a global fashion icon as well as an award winning and beloved musician. His wardrobe dictated many of the styles throughout the last few decades. Jackson played a very intimate role in the designs and completion of every costume and piece of clothing he wore both on stage and in his personal life. Dennis Tompkins and Michael Bush shared a very personal and close 25 year relationship with the artist.



“You know Dennis picked the date of this auction when we first began this process and ironically it was the exact date in which he passed two years ago. It’s as if Michael is still working his magic from up above,” said Michael Bush, fashion designer and author of King of Style: Dressing Michael Jackson. “I am so honored to know that museums, respected collectors and the fans were able to obtain a special piece of Michael Jackson today at Julien’s Auctions as I know they will be cherished for many years to come.”

The Collection of Tompkins & Bush auction event raised more than $5 million.

http://www.juliensauctions.com/press/2012/tompkins-and-bush-auction.html

 

[myosotis]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

The whole Julien's catalog was sold, nothing was left out. So either that Bush's/estate's statement was untrue (which is very unlikely), or the deal was made before the collection went to Julien. I'd love to know what he donated to the estate then. In my opinion most of the pieces Gaga bought where iconic, and although Gaga will probably take good care of them, I would have preferred them to belong to the estate.And that issue with the LA Gear stand signature is still open...

I hope that when Gaga eventually decides to sell some / all of these pieces (no matter how far distant into the future), she will give Michael's children / grandchildren 'first option'.

 

[ivy]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

The whole Julien's catalog was sold, nothing was left out. So either that Bush's/estate's statement was untrue (which is very unlikely), or the deal was made before the collection went to Julien. I'd love to know what he donated to the estate then. In my opinion most of the pieces Gaga bought where iconic, and although Gaga will probably take good care of them, I would have preferred them to belong to the estate.

i think bush wrote on his Facebook he will give back some to the estate or the talk to let michael's family chose some to take home Just last month. But the catalog, the collections had been put to Julien long long time ago. Now It seems all the talks are just talks. After all he relied on those iconic pieces to bring him big money.

some fans were at an event this last friday - just before the auction. They asked Bush this question and he told them Estate and Michale's kids had the first pick before the auction.

Also I must note that even though the auction was announced April / May, the auction catalog wasn't released until Mid October. So it's possible that Estate / MJ's kids picked some items before the catalog was finalized in mid October.

And that issue with the LA Gear stand signature is still open...

It's inconclusive. We have court records that say the deal was done in March 2009 and Michael saw and approved items in early June 2009. You have Latoya Jackson (see the video below) confirming this by showing an autographed T-shirt and saying "only few, two were made."

People are focusing on the sale of these merchandise to the general public which seems to be October 2009 - after the second deal with MJ Estate was signed in August 2009.

However it's highly probable that Michael had access to early prototypes and final product samples before the mass production started. Latoya Jackson is a source that's confirming this.

So you can see that it'll probably cannot be proven either way. It might be an early prototype that is signed by Michael - in other words totally legit. Or it could be produced after his death and be a fake.

Unless a top Bravado executive says they absolutely did not do a prototype of this specific standee the odds are against the people who thinks this is fake because both Latoya and a sworn affidavit under perjury is mentioning the existence of early designs / prototypes.

There is a picture of the J5 that was auctioned with all their signatures on. One problem: it is actually a picture of the Jacksons and "Jermaine" has signed his name over Jackie's picture.

http://www.julienslive.com/view-auctions/catalog/id/77/lot/33677/

Well we also have Michael Jackson signing Kim Fields records. I don't think it means anything. It seems like an later year signature. So it could be for example something signed at 30th year anniversary during rehearsals and Jackie might not be present at that moment and Jermaine might not care where he signed.

 

[Bubs]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

Ask yourself.....Bill Whitten was MJ's designer for years before Michael Bush. Why is it that MJ didn't "gift" him all his costumes like Bush is claiming? I was at the fan Fest ....there were several Whitten designs...lots of gloves & other pre-Bush costumes.

If MJ thought it was important to keep those '80s costumes, why are we so quick to accept Bush's version that MJ didn't care much about safekeeping & gave all away.

His story makes no sense to me.

This comes a bit late but I was looking Julien's website and came across these (might have been from older auction)
http://www.juliensauctions.com/auctions/2009/music-icons/michael-jackson-51.html
There was more Bill Whitten stuff sold at auction if you click pics.

 

[ivy]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

Oh and a tidbit. I don't know how credible it is but Mike Frost from Paas has posted a message and later an email threatening that Julien's will sue him as well as the autograph magazine for slander.

 

[Bubs]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

^^ Who is Mike Frost from Paas?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
All these items were sold yesterday:
http://www.julienslive.com/view-auctions/catalog/id/77/

Was there another seller or were all these items from MBT collection?

 

[ivy]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

^^ He's an authentication expert. If you didn't follow: Autograph magazine had an article saying the autographs might be fakes. Mike Frost and I believe Epperson gave their opinion saying that they were fakes. Another authenticator Mueller said it was a deliberate slander campaign.

And now apparently Julien's is saying he will pursue a slander lawsuit against Autograph magazine owner and two authenticators Frost and Epperson. Mueller is apparently saying he'll be an expert witness for Juliens.

 

[loveforever]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

Ok so Bush said the estate has already get some clothes back. Can someone ask the estate online team to confirm this? About the LA gear stand, before or after michael's death, Bravado knows.

 

[mdiegee210]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

I don't understand, how was Michael Bush and Juliens auction able to auction off the J5 items?

 

[Vici]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

I don't understand, how was Michael Bush and Juliens auction able to auction off the J5 items?

Im sure the J5 items were given to Juliens by the family. I think it have been confirmed that some stuff in the auction were co-signed by fam members.

 

[barbee0715]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

I

I was expecting for the bidder 462 to be some celebrity, huge Michael fan, but never thought of Lady Gaga.....it could've been much worse though, could've been jb lol

I wonder if we will ever see those precious things again and how, when?

I had such mixed feelings about this auction in the beginning because I had been longing to see everything together in a musuem in Vegas or even one day in Hayvenhurst (dream on), but after #462 bought two huge things in the beginning and was going after the Bad tour shirt, belt, pants and jackets I realized this is great-everything might be kept together and not scattered all over the globe. So I started rooting for him. I was absolutely shocked at the end of the night to find out it was Lady Gaga-and I do think she'll do right by all these costumes-she already knows the importance of wearing iconic, memorable clothes and I think we'll see them donated for traveling shows, etc. I'm very happy she's the one that bought them.

 

[barbee0715]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

I don't understand, how was Michael Bush and Juliens auction able to auction off the J5 items?

I had the impression that the J5 stuff was part of the "Idols" auction and was auctioned off by other people-they just put it at the beginning of the Tompkins and Bush collection.

 

[CaptainEoLove85]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

I know some don't like Gaga, but I'm cool with her and I'm actually glad she bought the clothes instead of some random person. I'm sure she'll take good care of them like she said. Still sad to see them go though.

 

[ivy]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

Ok so Bush said the estate has already get some clothes back. Can someone ask the estate online team to confirm this? About the LA gear stand, before or after michael's death, Bravado knows.

There's no sense in asking. Estate already sent out a statement confirming what Bush said. Asking them again would be redundant.

Similarly I have seen some people trying to contact Bravado customer service. Those low level reps would have no idea about the specific details of the deals with artists, prototype manufactured and so on. You can only confirm it with the high level people / people that directly worked with Michael at Bravado and those people would be impossible to reach by regular fans.

 

[marebear]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

I don't dislike Lady Gaga at all. I was just worried what she wanted to do with them. But from her message I feel she will take good care of them. If she is a fan than she will. I just can't help but feel sad to see them sold. I just hope the estate and Michael's kids picked good ones to have.

 

[ivy]

Inside Michael Jackson's $5 Million Memorabilia Auction
+ Comment now

The King of Style: Michael Jackson.

Two decades ago, costume designer Michael Bush created an ornate fencing jacket for Michael Jackson to wear on tour. Fittingly enough for the King of Pop, the gilded garment echoed ones worn by European monarchs of old. Bush and his partner, the late Dennis Tompkins, overnighted their creation to Jackson when it was done.

Two days later, though, Bush received a call from the singer. He was elated by the creation, but there was a slight problem. “I gave away your coat,” Jackson said. “I need another one.” That was when Bush and Tompkins decided to start documenting their work.

“We just started taking photos with detailed shots of everything, for fear that he was going to come back and want a duplicate made,” Bush recalls. “And at one point he saw these hundreds of 35-millimeter slides I had, just for research for us for security blanket, and he kept on saying, ‘You should do a book!”

22 images
Photos: The Top Earning Dead Musicians of 2012
27 images
Photos: The Top Earning Musicians of 2012

Michael Jackson's Personal Debts Paid Off, Just In Time For Bad 25
Zack O'Malley Greenburg
Forbes Staff

My Next Book: Michael Jackson, Inc.
Zack O'Malley Greenburg
Forbes Staff
Bush finally ended up publishing that tome, a generously-proportioned coffee-table book called The King of Style, last month. Many of the items depicted on its pages—including the aforementioned fencing jacket—were sold yesterday by Julien’s Auctions in Beverly Hills, Calif.


The hundreds of items on the block generated over $5 million, easily besting expectations of $1-$2 million. A portion of proceeds from the auction will be donated to Guide Dogs of America and the Nathan Adelson Hospice in Las Vegas.

Many of the pieces sold for six figures, including a jacket from Jackson’s Bad tour ($240,000), two of his bedazzled white gloves ($192,000 and $115,200), a jacket worn by Jackson on a visit to the White House in the 1990s ($144,000), and another jacket signed and worn by the singer ($156,000).

“Most of this stuff in the auction has been under my bed, in a closet, sometimes in a garage,” says Bush. “Nobody saw [it]. This way, it’s out in the world like his music is. … It will be spread, hopefully, all over the world. Because, unfortunately, if it all went into one museum, if you’re not in that one city, you never get to experience it.”

Even so, some Jackson fans have expressed concern that the items sold at auction will be squirreled away by private collectors, hidden forever from those who’d like see the pieces with their own eyes. Not to worry: Lady Gaga was among the bidders on Sunday, buying 55 pieces, and hinted that she’d be willing to display them.

A fashion diva in her own right, Gaga tweeted that she plans to keep all the Jackson items she acquired “archived and expertly cared for in the spirit and love of Michael Jackson, his bravery and fans worldwide.”

Indeed, Bush himself pointed out that many of the items auctioned off will need to be preserved by professionals if they’re to stand the test of time.

“It’s fabric, it will eventually break down if it’s not preserved correctly,” he says. “This is like Tutankhamun’s tomb, and hopefully it can be saved like that stuff was. It’s like a lost treasure that’s being preserved, and everyone can experience what this is.”

Still, the auction’s $5 million haul is barely a blip next to the sums of money being generated by the sale of Jackson’s music and the continued success of his business assets. Buoyed by recent projects including Cirque du Soleil’s Michael Jackson Immortal World Tour and old holdings like the singer’s 50% stake in the Sony/ATV publishing catalog, the estate pulled in $145 million over the past year alone.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/zackoma...chael-jacksons-5-million-memorabilia-auction/

 

[Vici]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

Ive seen people saying Bush made three of each piece.. and the estate has one pair. Is it true? so many rumours going around.

 

[marebear]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

I just want to say and I hope this doesn't sound dumb but I liked in her comment that she said Michael was brave. You don't hear people say something like that much.

 

[Arklove]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

I just want to say and I hope this doesn't sound dumb but I liked in her comment that she said Michael was brave. You don't hear people say something like that much.

That's not dumb

Where did she say that?

 

[marebear]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

That's not dumb

Where did she say that?

Thanks. It was in her tweet when she said she was going to have it archived and taken care of. She said it was for Michael and his bravery and the fans too. I liked that because I always felt that Michael was brave and had a lot of courage in his life.

 

[Arklove]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

Thanks. It was in her tweet when she said she was going to have it archived and taken care of. She said it was for Michael and his bravery and the fans too. I liked that because I always felt that Michael was brave and had a lot of courage in his life.

Ooooh, right...I missed that part...

I like Gaga, she has always been respectful of MJ and seems to be a genuine fan

 

[sfosteredi]

I'm one of those who would loved to see these costumes in Michael Jackson museum.
"Each costume piece is marked on the interior in gold marker “2/2” or “2/2 M.J.J,” indicating that two costumes were created for Jackson’s famous video shoot."

So MB has at least one of two of these costumes, who has the second one, estate?

I guess the estate is ok with the sale as Branca wrote forward to his book.

This is an excellent point. Let's hope that there is another set and that the other costumes are safety stored somewhere for PPB to have someday.

 

[Nadia1981]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

Ive seen people saying Bush made three of each piece.. and the estate has one pair. Is it true? so many rumours going around.

Let's hope that there is another set and that the other costumes are safety stored somewhere for PPB to have someday.

Yes, the Estate has a lot of these costumes too. They were displayed at the O2 Exhibition in London and at the Vegas Fanfest.

Here are some pictures I collected in London and the ones I took myself in Vegas, where you can see some of the costumes the Estate has in their posession:

http://s53.beta.photobucket.com/use...ichael Jackson Exhibition-London Feb13th 2010

http://s53.beta.photobucket.com/use...hael Jackson Exhibition-Vegas FanFest Dec2011

 

[mdiegee210]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

I see Mihcael's Rolls Royce in the items the estate have, Michael had a line of cars. Does any one know were they are now?

 

[bluesky]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

I have to admit the people who questioned the autographs have raised an interesting point.

This autographed standee of Michael has sold for $2,812.50

http://www.julienslive.com/view-auctions/catalog/id/77/lot/33868/

You can clearly see that the date on it is 2009.

Where these standees manufactured before Michael's death?

** this was posted from the other forum regarding this standee

Reply by Sandy Stadler 4 hours agoOkay I just spoke to Felix at Bravado.
I was probably not the best person to do that because I'm easily steam rolled on the phone because I get nervous...but didn't sound like anyone else was focusing on this.

He was very aware of it and has said he has gotten about 50 emails from 50 different people and they are looking into it, WORKING CLOSELY WITH THE ESTATE.
When I mentioned about the concern of the fan community regarding the estates involvement and John Btanca wrote foreword to Bush's book, etc... he said the estate is aware of what is going on and will fully support truth whatever that may be.
He seemed slightly rushed and annoyed at having to discuss this with some random person that called him.

He would not commit to a date of when the standee was made but did agree it was 2009.

from another poster

Reply by Justin 1 hour ago .. and it was made after Michael had died. Michelle and i have that in writing from Felix. he would not say if there was a prototype. but since he's dealing with all this through the proper channels and will not disclose anymore with me. i'm guessing there wasn't one presented to Michael!





http://live.autographmagazine.com/f...ale?id=3524372:Topic:308435&page=110#comments

 

[Rhilo]

Re: Juliens Auction Dec 2 - The Collection of Tompkins and Bush Auction

I am pretty sure those standees were released after Michael's death. The outpouring of sympathy and publicity made Bravado bring out a whole heap of merchandise such as buttons, t-shirts, posters, mugs, etc.

That is very strange, and will be the best proof for those who have been questioning the legitimacy of the autographs.

 

[qbee]

They were suppose to be released and of course it was after June 25. MJ had just viewed and approved the prototypes in March 2009. The deal was already set in place and John Branca didnt finalize it untill after MJs death. But we know Michael did review the Bravado Merchandise prototypes before his death andvery well could of took some of the items with him. We seen in the auction that he did save a lot of MJ merhandise. I believe there is a article or statement from Branca stating he finalised merchadising deals Michael was working on as well as the court statement Ivy showed where MJ did meet with bravado in March to view and approve the merchandise. We shouldn't always assume the worst. hopefully we will get further clarification

Okay no need to panic. I spoke too early. I went back to HTWF case in which Bravado gave a witness statement. This is from it. It takes the agreement to march 2009 and it's possible for over 300 prototypes dating before MJ's death to exist.

In or around March 2009, Bravado entered into arrangements with AEG Live, LLC (“AEG&#8221 to serve as the merchandising company for Michael Jackson related merchandise in connection with AEG’s agreement with Michael Jackson for the then scheduled “This Is It Tour” of live performances of Mr. Jackson.

In connection with Bravado serving as the merchandising company for Mr. Jackson’s “This Is It Tour,”
Bravado created over 300 designs of Michael Jackson related merchandise.

Tom Bennett of Bravado presented all of those Jackson merchandise designs to Mr. Jackson personally in Los Angeles, California. At a meeting attended by Mr. Bennett as well as Mr. Jackson in early June 2009.

Mr. Jackson personally approved approximately 295 of the Jackson merchandise designs presented to him for creation and sale in connection with the “This Is It Tour” and the official Jackson merchandise website

8/31/09
Bravado has entered into an agreement with the estate of Michael Jackson to be the exclusive manufacturer and distributor of merchandise for one of the most successful, prolific and iconic artists of all time, Michael Jackson. The announcement was made by John Branca and John McClain, the Co-Special Administrators for the Estate of Michael Jackson, and Tom Bennett, Chief Executive Officer of Bravado.
This new agreement builds upon the deal already in place between Bravado and AEG Live that placed Bravado as the exclusive merchandiser for Mr. Jackson's tour at The 02 arena in London.
http://www.bravado.com/news-story/n...is-exclusive-merchandiser-for-michael-jackson