Michael - The Great Album Debate

[samhabib]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

To be fair. This is not evidence at all.

Which part of it wasn't fact?

 

[samhabib]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

So, moving on to the alleged meeting. Weitzman says that Dr Freeze, Bruce Swedien, Teddy Riley et al all met and agreed the vocals were Michael. However, we have not heard from ANY of these people directly, bar Riley. So again, we're expected to take Weitzman's word without ANY proof that this was the case. Furthermore - Cory Rooney was AT THAT MEETING and he says that they did NOT all agree that the vocals were authentic.

Brilliant post, Casey. Just to add that Taryll was also at the meeting and said pretty much the same as Cory - that Teddy knew they weren't Michael's vocals.

 

[mjjesamor]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

I think teddy's latest tweets are interesting. I gather he may not be getting any more work from this project, he has a 'hater' in the mix and they are not going to use his mix of hollywood tonight. When someone suggested he leak his mix he said he thought about it but doesn't want to be responsible for album sales 'escalating' He also claims he was used to get the album finished and now that 'they' got what they wanted he wonders if they will keep their word (and he's not talking about sony)
Samhabib...what you just posted-I think these latest comments tie in very well with what cory and taryll say went down with teddy.
I have a feeling this mess is going to get even uglier.

 

[samhabib]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

I think teddy's latest tweets are interesting. I gather he may not be getting any more work from this project, he has a 'hater' in the mix and they are not going to use his mix of hollywood tonight. When someone suggested he leak his mix he said he thought about it but doesn't want to be responsible for album sales 'escalating' He also claims he was used to get the album finished and now that 'they' got what they wanted he wonders if they will keep their word (and he's not talking about sony)
I have a feeling this mess is going to get even uglier.

Ah my heart bleeds, Teddy. And he did it all for love and didn't get paid? You couldn't make this up!

 

[BUMPER SNIPPET]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Just out of interest;

Did you side with La Toya when she, live on TV, stated that her brother was a child molester?

Or does she only lie 'sometimes'?

You are picking things only to suit your conclusion, but you are omitting to say that La Toya herself admitted she had lied about the child molestation thing. You omit to say that La Toya was side by side when MJ had to face the court. And, Michael did not reject her presence.

Having said that, her previous forced lies have nothing to do with the recognition of her own brother's voice. What interest does she have in saying it is not Michael? None!

 

[mjjesamor]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

I know sam... Boohoo teddy. Very much in line with cory and taryll's version of events. That teddy was promised he could work on 'real' mj tracks if he went along with the cascio tracks.....

 

[deano]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

You are picking things only to suit your conclusion, but you are omitting to say that La Toya herself admitted she had lied about the child molestation thing. You omit to say that La Toya was side by side when MJ had to face the court. And, Michael did not reject her presence.

Having said that, her previous forced lies have nothing to do with the recognition of her own brother's voice. What interest does she have in saying it is not Michael? None!

Because as always - samhabib could probably find you loads of 'evidence' of this, though I doubt it would suit his agenda, so he won't - the Jackson family have always been a weight around Michael's neck (apart from Janet who made her own money). They relied upon him in life for money (even though they must have known he was 'cash poor' (asset rich)), and they repeatedly 'used' him to try and get their own failed careers/projects in the lime light.

Even when he had only just died, his father was trying to plug his own (and his sons) projects - yuk! La Toya tried to get her hands on everything she could, and the other Jackson brothers have milked his death any way they could (does anyone know what happened to Jermaine's 'Tribute Concert' - no doubt featuring himself, the 'J5' and 3T as 'Top of the bill'??).

The Jacksons have no reason to lie and force there way into Michael's Legacy or future projects? Don't make me laugh!

You would have seen nothing but support for this, or any other album, had 3T and the Jackson brothers/sisters been the lead producers/vocalists/writers/musicians et al.

Janet is the only one who has never tried to abuse having Michael as her brother. The rest of them? I wouldn't trust them one bit. Imagine La Toya being almost bankrupt, someone offering her a book deal for a million dollars, but only if she confirmed her 1993 beliefs that MJ was a child molester. Would you trust her to turn it down? Would you really!?

Poor Michael, to have a family like that.

 

[BUMPER SNIPPET]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Because as always - samhabib could probably find you loads of 'evidence' of this, though I doubt it would suit his agenda, so he won't - the Jackson family have always been a weight around Michael's neck (apart from Janet who made her own money). They relied upon him in life for money (even though they must have known he was 'cash poor' (asset rich)), and they repeatedly 'used' him to try and get their own failed careers/projects in the lime light.

Even when he had only just died, his father was trying to plug his own (and his sons) projects - yuk! La Toya tried to get her hands on everything she could, and the other Jackson brothers have milked his death any way they could (does anyone know what happened to Jermaine's 'Tribute Concert' - no doubt featuring himself, the 'J5' and 3T as 'Top of the bill'??).

The Jacksons have no reason to lie and force there way into Michael's Legacy or future projects? Don't make me laugh!

You would have seen nothing but support for this, or any other album, had 3T and the Jackson brothers/sisters been the lead producers/vocalists/writers/musicians et al.

Janet is the only one who has never tried to abuse having Michael as her brother. The rest of them? I wouldn't trust them one bit. Imagine La Toya being almost bankrupt, someone offering her a book deal for a million dollars, but only if she confirmed her 1993 beliefs that MJ was a child molester. Would you trust her to turn it down? Would you really!?

Poor Michael, to have a family like that.

I agree with all you said about his money hungry family. But we should also know how to make a difference when they seek money and when a question arises such as: "do you hear Michael in this song or not?"

Knowing that they are trying to take advantage of Michael's fame, what is their interest in saying it is not Michael singing. People can lie about some things, but it would be foolish to assume that whatever they say is a lie. Especially when your own ears hear the same thing as theirs and as many other fans'. This affair goes beyond any kind of interest for those who claim it is not Michael.

 

[samhabib]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Because as always - samhabib could probably find you loads of 'evidence' of this

Again, a desperate attempt to turn a debate personal and nasty.

They relied upon him in life for money (even though they must have known he was 'cash poor' (asset rich)), and they repeatedly 'used' him to try and get their own failed careers/projects in the lime light.

And this differs from the Cascios selling 12 acapella tracks to Sony for $5 million dollars in which way???

 

[deano]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Again, a desperate attempt to turn a debate personal and nasty.



And this differs from the Cascios selling 12 acapella tracks to Sony for $5 million dollars in which way???

Not turning personal at all. I just know you are a 'stickler' 'evidence'.

The difference? The Cascios have a product to sell. The Jacksons are on the scrounge but have nothing to give in return.

Speaking about 'evidence', do you have any for that figure of $5 million dollars, as you are putting it forward as 'fact'?

Also, for you and others, I keep answering the question "What do the Jacksons have to gain from lying", but none of you seem to be listening. I'll try it one more time for the hard of understanding;

The Jacksons want as much control of MJ's Estate, catalogue, and future products as possible - they want to 'keep it in the family'. Discrediting 'Michael' and controlling future projects themselves is a big win.

Why? MONEY!

What does everybody think about my hypothetical example of La Toya being broke, being offered $1 million, and selling MJ down the river? Is $1 million too low do you think? Or would it have to be nearer $10 million, now his back catalogue is doing so well?

One thing is for sure, when it comes to most of the Jackson family (even Katherine if 'Oprah and the children' is anything to go by), "They'll do anything for money"!

 

[donalb]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Not turning personal at all. I just know you are a 'stickler' 'evidence'.

The difference? The Cascios have a product to sell. The Jacksons are on the scrounge but have nothing to give in return.

Speaking about 'evidence', do you have any for that figure of $5 million dollars, as you are putting it forward as 'fact'?

Also, for you and others, I keep answering the question "What do the Jacksons have to gain from lying", but none of you seem to be listening. I'll try it one more time for the hard of understanding;

The Jacksons want as much control of MJ's Estate, catalogue, and future products as possible - they want to 'keep it in the family'. Discrediting 'Michael' and controlling future projects themselves is a big win.

Why? MONEY!

What does everybody think about my hypothetical example of La Toya being broke, being offered $1 million, and selling MJ down the river? Is $1 million too low do you think? Or would it have to be nearer $10 million, now his back catalogue is doing so well?

One thing is for sure, when it comes to most of the Jackson family (even Katherine if 'Oprah and the children' is anything to go by), "They'll do anything for money"!

As the Estate would directly benefit from the success of 'Michael', I do not see the motivation for the Jacksons to discredit this album as they have done, especially La Toya. She has nothing to gain either way. Moreover, should the Estate/Sony only decide to release Greatest Hits as a result of this mess, there would be even lesss of an opportunity for the other Jacksons to promote their own collaborations, etc., on these albums. With respect to La Toya, I am happy to hear that she was apparently against the idea of burying Michael at Nevertheland despite the amount of money, etc., etc., this could have potentially generated unlike some of the others.

 

[samhabib]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Not turning personal at all. I just know you are a 'stickler' 'evidence'.

I'll show you why.

The difference? The Cascios have a product to sell.

A contentious product.

The Jacksons are on the scrounge but have nothing to give in return.

Said with absolutely ZERO evidence.

You see how it works?

 

[GiveItUp123]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

No one can honestly say Michael Jackson is singing on the Cascio tracks.

The imposter singer is trying way too hard on the vibrato to sound like MJ for starters.

Even Quincy Jones said when Roger Friedman interview him that he couldn't tell if it was MJ. Quincy worked in the studio with MJ from The Wiz to Bad where he sung countless different styles. Even on heavily layered vocal tracks like Don't Stop 'Til You Get Enough and Leave Me Alone you can easily tell it is MJ.

Around 1974 do you think there was all this talk about who is on J5/MJ tracks when MJ's voice was changing? No.

Do you think there was any talk of who sang on the songs with different vocal styles such as Someone Put Your Hand Out? Or the first time MJ sang an 'angry' song? No.

For the Cascio's to say 'he' sounds different on their tracks due to their poor studio is a joke. When MJ sings at a concert he is not in a studio, just him and a mike! The demos we have of Workin' Day and Night and Billie Jean are some of the most primative demos you can get and it is clearly him. Beautiful Girl is heavily layered (like Breaking News) and recent, yet no arguments there because it is clearly him. We all heard Michael sing loud and clear on This Is It and his voice hadn't changed one bit.

To be honest, I wish it was MJ on all 10 tracks but it's simply not the case.

 

[samhabib]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Ouch... looks like Teddy Riley is going the same way as the 'hacked' Jason Malachi...

What happened to 'doing it for love' Teddy? "I don't wanna be the cause of MJ sales escalating". Wow...

From Twitter:

# @phillytt Thought about that but I don't wanna be the cause of MJ sales escalating. about 1 hour ago via Twitter for Android in reply to phillytt

# @Dangerous_Inc Now that they got what they want let's see if they keep their word. I'm not talking about Sony either. about 1 hour ago via Twitter for Android in reply to Dangerous_Inc

# @Dangerous_Inc I'm taking the backseat...we will see what everyone thinks of the mix. I was used to get the record its to the finish. Cont about 1 hour ago via Twitter for Android in reply to Dangerous_Inc

# @Dangerous_Inc This is MJ world that's controlled by the estate so they have Joe blow doing the mix on Hollywood tonight. Cont

 

[Garden]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

I don't know... what do we know as facts about how things are now between de family and the estate? One thing especially bothers me, that is the businessagreement from Howard Mann with Katherine Jackson. There are articles and there have been posts about it but I didn't research them yet. At the moment it's too much for me to go extensively into it.
I don't know if it could have anything to do with anything but I still don't feel good thinking of the Howard Mann link to Opus None on TMZ site, first he put it there in Katherine's name. And then there is the different between Branca and McClayn. Is this only about the Cascio tracks or is there more? Maybe there could be more than some of the family just "not hearing" Michael in the Cascio tracks. Howard Mann has the "Secret Vault", doesn't he? Did HE put someone under pressure? That's another history... Maybe I search connections that don't exist between facts (and supposed facts)... I don't know. Maybe I am too much into connecting everything to everything. Anyway, does anybody know if this subject has a thread somewhere? I'ld like to know more about it...

Sorry for this off topic, actually I just wanted to state that there is so much going on and maybe there are things interfering with other things... that we don't know.

 

[samhabib]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Very interesting what Teddy says. "Now that they got what they want let's see if they keep their word. I'm not talking about Sony either." I wonder if that ties in with what Taryll said about Teddy working on the Cascio tracks in order to get a 'real' MJ track. He also says 'I was used to get the record its to the finish' in regards to Hollywood Tonight.

Wow... MJ's legacy gets dragged through the mud once again... well done everyone!

Unreal.

 

[deano]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

I'll show you why.



A contentious product.



Said with absolutely ZERO evidence.

You see how it works?

Zero evidence!?

May I ask you how long you have been a fan of MJ? Have you not followed him - and his trials with his shamless family - in the years before his death!?

His father & brothers making promises 'in his name'. The family bullying him into the 1984 Victory tour (with dodgy dealing 'promoter' Don King), where he was so fed up and disgusted with it all that he gave all his money to charity? I could go on, but I'm sure you have Google to help you with MJ's family problems over the years.

There was a very good reason why MJ stayed away from most of his family for decades, and why he would never be 'forced' to tour with them ever again after the 1984 fiasco - he would have ended up like them!

Surely you would think it was enough for MJ to carry most of his family whilst he was alive, surely they could let him be in death?

Certain members of the family want the new projects to fail - they can live off his catalogue for now. If and when they do fail (with their help), then they can go to Sony and the Estate and say; "Look what happens if you don't do what we say. Give us more input or we will continue to disrupt everything you try to do."

Well, the Jacksons are stupid, but obviously not stupid enough to say that out load. But I'm sure they will make sure Sony and the Estate well aware of what their intentions are going forward.

For the Jackson family, I'm sure it's a case of 'short-term loss, for long-term gain'!

They'll do anything for money.

 

[GiveItUp123]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Zero evidence!?

May I ask you how long you have been a fan of MJ? Have you not followed him - and his trials with his shamless family - in the years before his death!?

His father & brothers making promises 'in his name'. The family bullying him into the 1984 Victory tour (with dodgy dealing 'promoter' Don King), where he was so fed up and disgusted with it all that he gave all his money to charity? I could go on, but I'm sure you have Google to help you with MJ's family problems over the years.

There was a very good reason why MJ stayed away from most of his family for decades, and why he would never be 'forced' to tour with them ever again after the 1984 fiasco - he would have ended up like them!

Surely you would think it was enough for MJ to carry most of his family whilst he was alive, surely they could let him be in death?

Certain members of the family want the new projects to fail - they can live off his catalogue for now. If and when they do fail (with their help), then they can go to Sony and the Estate and say; "Look what happens if you don't do what we say. Give us more input or we will continue to disrupt everything you try to do."

Well, the Jacksons are stupid, but obviously not stupid enough to say that out load. But I'm sure they will make sure Sony and the Estate well aware of what their intentions are going forward.

For the Jackson family, I'm sure it's a case of 'short-term loss, for long-term gain'!

They'll do anything for money.

Dude, you need to pipe down a bit. You're just being malicious and it has nothing to do with the authenticity of the tracks.

For one the Jacksons aren't stupid. A family that can come from the lower class of society to the highest high aren't that stupid.

You a running on tangents about wanting projects to fail etc. This is clearly ridiculous. This Is It, The Michael Jackson Experience, Michael, other record sales etc are rolling in cash.

"So fed up that he gave his cash to charity." That has nothing to do with being fed up. It's just the heart Michael had. Not to mention he was riding the wave of Off The Wall and Thriller at the time so has more than enough money in the bank. He did the same for Dangerous by donating proceeds to the Heal The World foundation.

You're carrying on about how Michael didn't want to be around his family. Dude, he moved out of Encino at 29, he doesn't need to talk to his family every damn day. Catching up once a year or whatever is fine. It's what heaps of families do when the children grow up because everyone has their own lives. He went to Joe's and Katherine's anniversay just before he passed for goodness sake. Not to mention high profile public events such as the 30th anniversary celebration, 1997 J5 Hall of Fame induction, recording with 3T etc. So it's not like he avoided his family at all cost.

Michael even said in his Oxford speech that he knew his Dad loved him.

"Short term loss for long term gain." I think you are way off the mark here. With all due respect to Katherine and Joe Jackson but they are very old and I'm sure they're not plotting like you're suggesting they are.

Finally, I'm sure the family will make their intentions to Sony and the Estate very clear since the Jacksons form part of the Estate!

So back to the topic. Does this sound like Michael Jackson's voice on the Cascio tracks? No.

 

[Tony R]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Dude, you need to pipe down a bit. You're just being malicious and it has nothing to do with the authenticity of the tracks.

For one the Jacksons aren't stupid. A family that can come from the lower class of society to the highest high aren't that stupid.

You a running on tangents about wanting projects to fail etc. This is clearly ridiculous. This Is It, The Michael Jackson Experience, Michael, other record sales etc are rolling in cash.

"So fed up that he gave his cash to charity." That has nothing to do with being fed up. It's just the heart Michael had. Not to mention he was riding the wave of Off The Wall and Thriller at the time so has more than enough money in the bank. He did the same for Dangerous by donating proceeds to the Heal The World foundation.

You're carrying on about how Michael didn't want to be around his family. Dude, he moved out of Encino at 29, he doesn't need to talk to his family every damn day. Catching up once a year or whatever is fine. It's what heaps of families do when the children grow up because everyone has their own lives. He went to Joe's and Katherine's anniversay just before he passed for goodness sake. Not to mention high profile public events such as the 30th anniversary celebration, 1997 J5 Hall of Fame induction, recording with 3T etc. So it's not like he avoided his family at all cost.

Michael even said in his Oxford speech that he knew his Dad loved him.

"Short term loss for long term gain." I think you are way off the mark here. With all due respect to Katherine and Joe Jackson but they are very old and I'm sure they're not plotting like you're suggesting they are.

Finally, I'm sure the family will make their intentions to Sony and the Estate very clear since the Jacksons form part of the Estate!

So back to the topic. Does this sound like Michael Jackson's voice on the Cascio tracks? No.

Hurrah for every word!

 

[Kapital77]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Hurrah !!!!

 

[mjjesamor]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Hurrah indeed

 

[deano]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Dude, you need to pipe down a bit. You're just being malicious and it has nothing to do with the authenticity of the tracks.

For one the Jacksons aren't stupid. A family that can come from the lower class of society to the highest high aren't that stupid.

You a running on tangents about wanting projects to fail etc. This is clearly ridiculous. This Is It, The Michael Jackson Experience, Michael, other record sales etc are rolling in cash.

"So fed up that he gave his cash to charity." That has nothing to do with being fed up. It's just the heart Michael had. Not to mention he was riding the wave of Off The Wall and Thriller at the time so has more than enough money in the bank. He did the same for Dangerous by donating proceeds to the Heal The World foundation.

You're carrying on about how Michael didn't want to be around his family. Dude, he moved out of Encino at 29, he doesn't need to talk to his family every damn day. Catching up once a year or whatever is fine. It's what heaps of families do when the children grow up because everyone has their own lives. He went to Joe's and Katherine's anniversay just before he passed for goodness sake. Not to mention high profile public events such as the 30th anniversary celebration, 1997 J5 Hall of Fame induction, recording with 3T etc. So it's not like he avoided his family at all cost.

Michael even said in his Oxford speech that he knew his Dad loved him.

"Short term loss for long term gain." I think you are way off the mark here. With all due respect to Katherine and Joe Jackson but they are very old and I'm sure they're not plotting like you're suggesting they are.

Finally, I'm sure the family will make their intentions to Sony and the Estate very clear since the Jacksons form part of the Estate!

So back to the topic. Does this sound like Michael Jackson's voice on the Cascio tracks? No.

"Dude".

I'm not to blame if you can't intellectually get the point I'm trying to make. But I'll try and show you the connection here, just one more time.

On many occasions the lie has been trotted out;

"The Jacksons say it not MJ on the songs, and they are to be believed before all others as they are a trustworthy, loving, devoted, unselfish family who have done nothing but good!" (or words/intentions to that effect).

I am putting forward the opinion, after 30+ years of watching MJ deal with his family, that they are no such thing.

Now do you see the connection?

 

[samhabib]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Dude, you need to pipe down a bit. You're just being malicious and it has nothing to do with the authenticity of the tracks.

For one the Jacksons aren't stupid. A family that can come from the lower class of society to the highest high aren't that stupid.

You a running on tangents about wanting projects to fail etc. This is clearly ridiculous. This Is It, The Michael Jackson Experience, Michael, other record sales etc are rolling in cash.

"So fed up that he gave his cash to charity." That has nothing to do with being fed up. It's just the heart Michael had. Not to mention he was riding the wave of Off The Wall and Thriller at the time so has more than enough money in the bank. He did the same for Dangerous by donating proceeds to the Heal The World foundation.

You're carrying on about how Michael didn't want to be around his family. Dude, he moved out of Encino at 29, he doesn't need to talk to his family every damn day. Catching up once a year or whatever is fine. It's what heaps of families do when the children grow up because everyone has their own lives. He went to Joe's and Katherine's anniversay just before he passed for goodness sake. Not to mention high profile public events such as the 30th anniversary celebration, 1997 J5 Hall of Fame induction, recording with 3T etc. So it's not like he avoided his family at all cost.

Michael even said in his Oxford speech that he knew his Dad loved him.

"Short term loss for long term gain." I think you are way off the mark here. With all due respect to Katherine and Joe Jackson but they are very old and I'm sure they're not plotting like you're suggesting they are.

Finally, I'm sure the family will make their intentions to Sony and the Estate very clear since the Jacksons form part of the Estate!

So back to the topic. Does this sound like Michael Jackson's voice on the Cascio tracks? No.

Brilliantly put.

And not to mention the last concert he ever performed live was with his brothers. But hey... what did Michael know, right?

 

[deano]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

GiveItUp123.

Your quote;

You a running on tangents about wanting projects to fail etc. This is clearly ridiculous. This Is It, The Michael Jackson Experience, Michael, other record sales etc are rolling in cash.

Your memory must be pretty short term if you don't remember the Jackson family trying to de-rail the 'TII' project.

'Body Double' ring any bells?

 

[deano]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Brilliantly put.

And not to mention the last concert he ever performed live was with his brothers. But hey... what did Michael know, right?

And he couldn't wait to get them off the stage once they had finished their 'old' J5 routine.

If I remember rightly, there were non-family members on the stage longer than most of the Jacksons!

Once tour in 1984 - which he hated - and a contractual obligation to do a 30th special 17 years later.

Oh yes, he couldn't wait to get back with his brothers could he!?

I didn't see them lined up for his 'TII' tour schedule, did you?

 

[deano]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

GiveItUp123.

Your quote;

"So fed up that he gave his cash to charity." That has nothing to do with being fed up. It's just the heart Michael had. Not to mention he was riding the wave of Off The Wall and Thriller at the time so has more than enough money in the bank. He did the same for Dangerous by donating proceeds to the Heal The World foundation."


The 'Dangerous' tour donations were completely different to the 'Victory' tour. You may want to read up on MJ's feelings about it. He couldn't wait for it to finish so he could get back on with his life/career. It was no more than an 'obligation' he felt - with more than a bit of bullying from his Father - and he was in no rush ever to repeat the experience, as we saw.

 

[GiveItUp123]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

"Dude".

I'm not to blame if you can't intellectually get the point I'm trying to make. But I'll try and show you the connection here, just one more time.

On many occasions the lie has been trotted out;

"The Jacksons say it not MJ on the songs, and they are to be believed before all others as they are a trustworthy, loving, devoted, unselfish family who have done nothing but good!" (or words/intentions to that effect).

I am putting forward the opinion, after 30+ years of watching MJ deal with his family, that they are no such thing.

Now do you see the connection?

First you are questioning the Jackson's intelligence now you are undermining mine.

 

[deano]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

GiveItUp123.

Your quote;

"Finally, I'm sure the family will make their intentions to Sony and the Estate very clear since the Jacksons form part of the Estate!"

You might want to check that little fact, as this is the main part of the problem as I see it - they are not!

Perhaps if Mj had left everything in their hands, we would have seen even more of a 'circus' than we have with them so far.

Can you imagine Pappa Joe, Jermaine, Randy 'NOI', and La Toya in charge!!??

On second thoughts, best not contemplate about that!

 

[samhabib]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

And he couldn't wait to get them off the stage once they had finished their 'old' J5 routine.

And this is based on what exactly?

If I remember rightly, there were non-family members on the stage longer than most of the Jacksons!

Like who?

a contractual obligation to do a 30th special 17 years later.

Where did you get this little nugget of information from? Because it's completely untrue.

 

[GiveItUp123]

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

And he couldn't wait to get them off the stage once they had finished their 'old' J5 routine.

If I remember rightly, there were non-family members on the stage longer than most of the Jacksons!

Once tour in 1984 - which he hated - and a contractual obligation to do a 30th special 17 years later.

Oh yes, he couldn't wait to get back with his brothers could he!?

I didn't see them lined up for his 'TII' tour schedule, did you?

Oh my God, please get some perspective.

Of course non-family members were on the stage more than the Jacksons. That show went for ages with a whole raft of performers and MJ was barely on the stage very long himself.

I can't comment about the contractual obligation to perform a 30th anniversary special made way back in 1984 because that's the first I've heard of it. To be honest I wouldn't be surprised if this is plucked from thin air. Although I could be wrong and I have no issue with being corrected.

No, you didn't see the family members on the This Is It tour schedule because it was a Michael Jackson solo venture. So what's your point?

Again, this has nothing to do with the authenticity of the tracks...