Michael - The Great Album Debate

[Pentum]

oh oh I see your point. I heard a lot of Jason Cascio track comparison but it actually doesn't convince me. Does anyone do MJ/ Cascio similarity comparison? I just can not believe that Branca, Teddy Riley, Sony and all those people would risk their reputation and face millions lawsuit if they don't have enough evidence to prove MJ is the lead vocal.

To me, the lead vocal sounds like very immature demo with lots of cut and paste but I still hear MJ. I think the J family should really go to do some forensic analysis and sue them if they really think it's fake.

Someone please show this lost fellow TPI's comparisons ^^

 

[wolfrevenant]

oh oh I see your point. I heard a lot of Jason Cascio track comparison but it actually doesn't convince me. Does anyone do MJ/ Cascio similarity comparison? I just can not believe that Branca, Teddy Riley, Sony and all those people would risk their reputation and face millions lawsuit if they don't have enough evidence to prove MJ is the lead vocal.

To me, the lead vocal sounds like very immature demo with lots of cut and paste but I still hear MJ. I think the J family should really go to do some forensic analysis and sue them if they really think it's fake.

A lot of corporations willingly risk their reputation and eventually face lawsuits in the million dollar range, whether due to shoddy business or willing participation in fraud. Of course, I'm thinking in terms of audit firms and the firms in which they audit. But to think and assume that those with huge economical power and influence would never dare do something risky or shady just because they have more to lose than gain, is foolish.

 

[Billyjeanplxiv]

I listened to runner up yesterday 10 times.

 

[Chamife]

I listened to runner up yesterday 10 times.

"Got my heartbeat racing and I'm the boy chasing, it goes on and on and on and on....."

That's a nice part. Some of Jason Malachi's songs aren't bad, but it's not my 'cup of tea'.

 

[Billyjeanplxiv]

Runner up is my favorite, as its catchy. I dont like him, but ill listen to that song

 

[kreen]

Someone please show this lost fellow TPI's comparisons ^^

The comparisons are futile. They're pointless. All they prove is that Jason Malachi -- the best MJ impersonator around -- actually sounded like MJ, especially when MJ wasn't at his best and his vocals were overproduced and overprocessed.

Forget about the comparisons. THINK.

 

[Grent]

Stop thinking. LISTEN.

Ok, let's think for a moment. Why did Teddy Riley lie about the vibrato being caused by Melodyne? Well, I THINK the question is pointless since you seem to have no idea about music production (overproduced, overprocessed, ...).

You think the singer in Fall in Love sounds overprocessed?
Did you actually get to listen to Fall in Love ?

 

[Calisto]

Kreen, the vocal tracks were processed to sound more like Michael Jackson, not less.

Just compare the early mix of Monster to the album version. The former contains rawer vocals that—to no surprise at all—sound even further away from Michael's voice.

Edit: Jason's own producer believes that the tracks were pitched to mask Jason's voice and even went so far as to provide a video demonstration.

 

[missred07]

A lot of corporations willingly risk their reputation and eventually face lawsuits in the million dollar range, whether due to shoddy business or willing participation in fraud. Of course, I'm thinking in terms of audit firms and the firms in which they audit. But to think and assume that those with huge economical power and influence would never dare do something risky or shady just because they have more to lose than gain, is foolish.

But they can just drop all those songs to avoid the risk. It's not like they had to put out those 3 songs without choice unless all the MJ songs in the vault were gone and they don't have other material. Don't understand the logic why put three fake songs when you have other choices. I myself think they even better just drop those songs to avoid controversy from the beginning.

 

[MusicMan26]

^ In my opinion I think they did it to see if they can get away with it and keep doing it in the future (therefore constantly recording new stuff and having an unlimited amount of songs).

 

[ivy]

^ In my opinion I think they did it to see if they can get away with it and keep doing it in the future (therefore constantly recording new stuff and having an unlimited amount of songs).

but John Branca himself said there are only enough songs for 2 albums. so if that was the goal they would have said they had hundreds of songs lying around. on the contrary people involved keeps saying there aren't that many songs and /or they aren't finished / usable.

 

[kreen]

Stop thinking. LISTEN.

Ok, let's think for a moment. Why did Teddy Riley lie about the vibrato being caused by Melodyne? Well, I THINK the question is pointless since you seem to have no idea about music production (overproduced, overprocessed, ...).

You think the singer in Fall in Love sounds overprocessed?
Did you actually get to listen to Fall in Love ?

I never got to listen to the untagged versions of those more recent leaks, but I have heard the tagged versions.

As for what Teddy Riley said : see, this is symptomatic of what the problem is with conspiracy theories. Instead of focusing on obvious, importants facts (like the absence of any legal proceedings against the Cascios, the mere unlikelihood of such a complicated scheme being pulled off and not revealed later on, the reuse of Monster on additional official products, etc.), people grab on to any insignificant detail, which, because they are not fully explained, are supposed to counter much more important facts.

Who knows what Teddy meant. Maybe he meant another software, but used the word "Melodyne" instead. Maybe he was confused as to which song was which. Maybe he did use Melodyne on another part, or in another way. Maybe, maybe, maybe. You're putting more faith into a short off-the-cuff tweet than in all of the other obvious reality.

And this goes for all of the rest, such as "Malachi's manager saying this on the Internet", or "Jackie Jackson saying that in a tweet". This is just noise, that may not be explained now, but could be if we got all of those people on the phone. Which is what the Estate CAN do and DID do. And they came away convinced they were not putting out fakes.

 

[Arklove]

^^ or, you know, MAYBE MAYBE MAYBE..it's just not Michael ...

 

[Calisto]

[...] the mere unlikelihood of such a complicated scheme being pulled off and not revealed later on [...]

Do you remember the Chandler family, and how they claimed Michael Jackson did something without evidence, and how they not only got away with it, but made millions?

Please, enough already with the tired, worn out excuses.

 

[Grent]

As for what Teddy Riley said : see, this is symptomatic of what the problem is with conspiracy theories. Instead of focusing on obvious, importants facts (like the absence of any legal proceedings against the Cascios, the mere unlikelihood of such a complicated scheme being pulled off and not revealed later on, the reuse of Monster on additional official products, etc.), people grab on to any insignificant detail, which, because they are not fully explained, are supposed to counter much more important facts.

Who knows what Teddy meant. Maybe he meant another software, but used the word "Melodyne" instead. Maybe he was confused as to which song was which. Maybe he did use Melodyne on another part, or in another way. Maybe, maybe, maybe. You're putting more faith into a short off-the-cuff tweet than in all of the other obvious reality.

You do notice the weird vibrato, right? Riley's explanation is Melodyne - or any other software, it's not the point - to pitch the voice up resulting in the weird vibrato.

Within that lie lies everything.

1) software is able to pitch up without messing up the vibrato to that degree
2) even IF it wasn't, for that effect, the voice must have been pitched up hell of a lot
3) why would they pitch up MJ in the first place? To fit the music? What music? To what music did MJ record to?


The vibrato is a dead giveaway. And not some insignificant point. It's about the VOICE. About nothing else.

 

[Korgnex]

Yep, out of context usage of quotes is often what keeps conspiracy theories as this one alive.
Also: No-one's asking for the motive that Tony Kurtis had for his ridiculous claim and even more ridiculous upload concerning "Breaking News". The files that he's uploaded were a good joke. Their video descriptions were the funniest of it all!

Or no-one's even trying to accept that John McClain as co-executor simply has the full legal power to veto the other co-executor, John Branca. But he allegedly tried everything to get certain songs removed. Hmmm, who spread this legal nonsense? Oh wait, a Jackson. LOL!
But it's still the golden gospel for Cascio doubters / haters. Guess why?

When there are explanations about how the US Copyright office registration works and how it's NOT possible to "swap" what has been registered on June 27th 2009, the idea of "the perfect crime" that we all know but cannot prove comes to the idea of many doubters.


Grent-style phrasing*:
Reading through all those postings from such self-proclaimed "Jason dude" experts makes you wonder, because their prejudice is at an unbelievable level. There's not any difference between extremists, conspiracy theorists and the doubters' leader figures - that all happen to have witnessed "the Jason dude" 's songs when Michael was still alive. Coincidence? Converting new doubters is their current mission to find peace for themselves. Because they cannot explain why nothing is happening and don't know how to contest the official word themselves.
They make you angry, because they try to tell everyone it must be the "Jason dude" because they are the definite voice experts and have only recently started to think of themselves as the "knowers".
They make you shake your head and ask, how they always think to have found "crucial evidence" and take things from their leader figures as the golden gospel. A flock of sheep following their shepherd.
They make you feel helpless, because actually doubters who solely focus on the "Jason dude" as an alleged impostor and who have provoced an ongoing obsession with him (and some even dare to deny it), have long forgotten the actual sound of "the Jason dude" 's voice. They cannot even realize it because they THINK they would hear him and are simply pissed off and full of hate. They back up their claims with "audio clips" that only show how different they perceive and process things.


SOME of you doubters have no respect for opposing views of other individuals. You're declaring yourself and other doubters to be the sole authority who knows everything about Michael Jackson and his friend Eddie Cascio and dictate for the rest of the fan community that you know everything about the songs and that there wouldn't be any chance that you're totally wrong due to a simple lack of knowledge. You know NOTHING about these tracks. You're listening to tracks and stolen files, you don't know anything about their origin. You don't know anything about Michael's private life and friends. Yet you THINK you'd know exactly how they have committed "the perfect crime" that on the one hand is soooo obvious that everyone of you doubters knows "the truth" yet on the other hand so perfectly done that NO-ONE is doing anything against it except for CHEAP TALK that only leads to fans ridiculing and attacking other fans as SOME of you love to do it - because if you can't hurt the ones you accuse of a fraud, you can hurt the feelings of those fans that are posting next to you.
This is called propaganda. Many fans (including me) do not support propaganda.

Who are you that you can call other fans 1) either liars, 2) misinformed persons or 3) fans with little knowledge about Michael Jackson's voice and songs?
This is exactly what SOME of you have just said and this is a clear INSULT to the intelligence of other individuals.

Do you see me ridiculing other fans, calling them liars/stupid or "unreal" fans with no idea how MJ's voice sounds like?
Yes, I used a "Grent-style" phrasing above. But that dude loves to ridicule me in all his postings and is lurking around at JacksonVillage.
He knows I'm fighting for justice as there's currently a criminal in Germany who's ripping off other fans, yet he thinks I'm stupid because I don't hear what his "well-trained" precious ears let him hear.


Also: which side is it that is often making up things for whatever reason, maybe to sound more like a "knower"?
A famous doubter claiming to have been graduated in law (when he always demonstrates to not understand basic legal aspects), another one having started to refer to himself as a musician at the age of 7 in order to claim to "have been an musician for over 20 years", calling himself to be "kind of an expert", yet saying he never claimed so.
Or the same one claiming his very own opinion "I personally think" to be the ultimate truth and thus believers to be "clueless" which means "idiots" in other words.

I personally think Porte's part in this whole thing is absolutely negligible. As is Melodyne. However believers just throw those terms in without a clue.

Yo, it's just the doubters who "have a clue". Lordliness at its best. Us other fans should be ashamed of ourselves. Oh Lord, have mercy.


Birchey - in order to not lose his face - is not letting you guys know what happened to him. If you knew it, you would lose all respect that you had for this man.
Or with Gary's words: It was his pure greed that has almost caused this forum to be shut down.


And FYI:
Birchey isn't the "hero" SOME doubters have hoped for ("Bring the truth, Birchey"). A lot of the information he gave has been MISINTERPRETED (intentionally?) and his PERSONAL OPINION has been taken as the "golden gospel" by SOME doubters. There are some fellow doubters who STILL have access to the SAME stuff he once HAD and who KNOW that this stuff does NOT provide a slightest sign of fraud.
The microphone stuff e.g. is NOT what you think it is because Birchey told you how he INTERPRETED it himself. And sorry to say this but what he said is NOT what's on the screens.

A lot of the information that Birchey gave was his personal opinion only how he imagined they would have faked the tracks as he thought these would be the original demos which is NOT the case! He might have finally realized it in the meantime!
Birchey got all worked up about it. At the same time he said (not just to me, ivy and others who spoke with him can confirm this) that there are vocals (he did NOT just mean copy-pasted ad-libs!, he was referring to whole sentences) that he believes to be authentic MJ vocals but which you guys claimed and still claim to be Jason doing his MJ-impersonation.

To sum it up: Birchey has NEVER had any real knowledge about these sessions (otherwise he would have never been so stupid to refer to the stolen files as "original demos").
The only thing Birchey could witness was the FABRICATION of the 12 Cascio recordings (which I will not go in details for obvious legal reasons). NOTHING ELSE. NO sign of any alleged impostor. NO "rough demos", just work-in-progress versions that went through the hands of various producers that were hired by Sony Music to make use of what they had acquired.

And funny how Birchey when compared to me is described as a "gentle person" that has always been "nice". Erm, yeah, why should he ever say sth that's not "nice" to you doubters? He's on your side. To believers he wasn't "nice", that's for sure but you just don't care about them.
And in the eyes of the doubters I can never be "nice" because I'm not cajoling the doubters and instead point out to their deep-routed prejudice because of their very personal feelings and how the songs' vocals lack so much of MJ's accustomed trademarks is considered an unrefutable proof which is not the case in reality, sth doubters don't wanna accept.


In case you haven't noticed it: Believers and neutral people are scared away from the ongoing debate about these tracks because the behaviour of SOME (NOT all! and NOT everyone posting in this thread) doubters has transformed them into EXTREMISTS who are upholding boundless HATE and profound SCORN for everyone that doesn't agree with them.

NOT a controversy.

It IS and will be until one side has been proven wrong. In the meantime some people should remember what RESPECT is...


Whatever doubters plan for the future, it will NOT bring any peace or "the truth", it will only expell more and more from the good old fans until what once has been called a "community" will have died out.



Sharp words but couldn't be any closer to reality. As time goes by, you'll remember these words.

 

[azsummergirl]

lol. u bet i'll remember my words. b/c i've been saying the same words from day one and it will never change. it's true now, it was true a year ago, it will be true 100 years from now. so i'll remember.

 

[StellaJackson]

Well here are the main questions surrounding the songs. This is focusing on the songs only, not any other outside stuff.

Let's assume Michael recorded the songs.

1) When recording multiple takes for 12 songs, it is inevitable, and this can be supported by previous MJ demos etc, that Michael would have been talking as he was working through the songs. All of this would have been recorded. These recordings are what you might call worktapes. Where are they? By releasing them, it would put the whole thing to rest, stop the damaging of Eddie Cascio's and James Porte's reputation and help to make the songs, and any potential future release of the remaining ones, a success. If I was Eddie, I would go out of my way to disprove this.

2) Same as above but with regards to written notes. Michael did not write these songs from scratch himself but he is credited as co- writer which means he must have contributed something. All those notes for other songs yet nothing for these?

3) Where did the idea come from that these songs were demos/guide vocals? It has never been stated by Eddie or the Estate or the record label.

4) If these songs were in such a state that they had to be processed to such a degree, then why do the newly recorded vocals for WBSS 2008, recorded in the same studio and in the same time period, sound fine?

5) Specifically what software was used that could create such a vibrato when applied to the vocals in order to "fix" them? Obviously the vibrato is not the natural vibrato of Michael Jackson and it wouldn't have been created deliberately. There is no vocal manipulation software or technique that would create such a vibrato as a by product. The most likely explanation is that it is what came out of the singers mouth. It is the same vibrato found in Jason Cupeta recordings. So if Jason isn't the vocalist, where did this vibrato come from?

6) Why did Teddy Riley feel the need to lie? He stated in a video interview (which can be found on youtube) that the vibrato was caused by his melodyning the vocals. He was very specific about it. He even apologisies for it in the interview. Thing is, we now know that the vibrato is not only on all 12 tracks, but is on earlier versions of 2 of the songs he worked on from before he received them. Sure, he could have been confusing melodyne with something else, but he clearly states that he caused it in the production phase. That is a lie.

7) Why did Michael Jackson change his pronounciation of certain words for these songs only? The pronounciation that he uses is the same pronounciation of certain words that Jason Cupeta uses. Again, no known software, or the side affect of said software's application, is known to cause this. So if it's not Jason, why did Michael decide to pronounce his words just like him?

8) One of the things that Jason does in his own songs is to make a "snort" sound when going quickly from one line to another. That's the best way I can describe it. These same snorts are present in the Cascio tracks, most notably in Breaking News. In fact, an identical snort to the one heard in Breaking News can be found in the song Critical by Jason Cupeta. How did this get there?

9) On demos that contain vocals by Michael Jackson, where he is not going full out, even mumbling lyrics or singing half heartedly, he still manages to sing in tune. A good example of this would be Fall Again. Why do several Cascio tracks contain out of tune vocals? Also, why does the vocalist have a different regional accent and younger sounding voice than Michael Jackson? Again, what software can cause this?

10) Why are things such as handclaps, footstamps, finger clicks and headphone bleeding absent from every song, despite being found on almost every Michael Jackson recording from the last 30 years?

11) Why is there no trace of the existence of these songs in the US Copyright Office, BMI or Library of Congress databases until almost a year after Michael's death? The "MJ Songbook 2009 #1" entry from June 27th 2009 does not mention specific titles. Eddie registered the songs (as per submission date) just two days after his friend died. Despite what has been said above, nothing was "swapped" at the US Copyright Office. The individual titles were later registered with BMI only. In fact, if we go by the correct assumption of the above poster that entries can't be swapped over, then it makes perfect sense that the contents of the 2009 registration are different to later registrations ie it is not what we hear in the songs now. Why did it take so long for the individual titles to materialise?

12) Jason Cupeta made a relatively successful career as a vocalist who can mimic the voice of Michael Jackson. He performed and released material under the pseudonym Jason Malachi. There are many instances of him using his similarity with Michael's voice to promote himself, both in interviews and on MJ fan forums. If he was not involved in these recordings, then why the drastic change in behaviour? Why does he choose to stay silent to this day, when it would be such an ideal promotional tool for him? Why, after almost ten months since a fan accessed his Facebook account and hotmail account, has he made no attempt to return to the public eye?

13) Why did neither Jason Cupeta or his manager Thadeus Nauden not make any denial following the outcry over Breaking News and the subsequent release of the album, until Nauden was placed in a position where he had to by TMZ? Why the silence, despite the accusations against him and potential free publicity that a rebuttal would get Jason?

14) Why have Sony music failed to provide any evidence of their alleged tests on the recordings?

15) Why did Eddie Cascio and James Porte refuse to be interviewed by Joe Vogel about the recording process behind these songs for his book "Man In The Music"?

 

[Grent]

An excuse for the snorts was "production artifact" ...
Although you have a perfectly fine "you keep on breaking the news" at the first time, you replace the 'keep' with a sample at the second and third occurence of the line ... yet you leave several snorts on the record? And what piece of equipment shall produce those snorts? I know what - the nose. I found it on my own recordings.

Absolutely ridiculous excuse.

 

[MusicMan26]

but John Branca himself said there are only enough songs for 2 albums. so if that was the goal they would have said they had hundreds of songs lying around. on the contrary people involved keeps saying there aren't that many songs and /or they aren't finished / usable.

Good point. Although if there truly are only enough songs for 2 albums (which I find hard to believe anyway), it would give them a reason to want to create more.

 

[Grent]

Let's take a look at Keep your head up and assume, Riley told the truth: pitching up the vocals to match the music (whatever that means) messed up the vibratos. So we can assume, he pitched up the vocals with no compensation of time to avoid vibratos getting faster.

Let's revert the effect. Let's pitch the vocals down with no compensation of time to dig out the normal vibrato.

http://soundcloud.com/mjlover01/normal-vibrato-no-way-falsetto

That's a very unusual low falsetto there, if you ask me.

 

[Jesta]

Let's take a look at Keep your head up and assume, Riley told the truth: pitching up the vocals to match the music (whatever that means) messed up the vibratos. So we can assume, he pitched up the vocals with no compensation of time to avoid vibratos getting faster.

Let's revert the effect. Let's pitch the vocals down with no compensation of time to dig out the normal vibrato.

http://soundcloud.com/mjlover01/normal-vibrato-no-way-falsetto

That's a very unusual low falsetto there, if you ask me.

Is it just me, or does it sound like he's speaking it rather than singing in falsetto?

 

[ADKIc3mAnX]

but John Branca himself said there are only enough songs for 2 albums. so if that was the goal they would have said they had hundreds of songs lying around. on the contrary people involved keeps saying there aren't that many songs and /or they aren't finished / usable.

I do not believe that at all Michael Jackson himself said he recorded 40+ songs for every album and he wanted to release 30 songs on the Bad album but he had to pick 10 out of 30.

There might be around 30 - 50 songs that MJ completed himself as in like it's ready to just be put out on a record and released.

Now take Best Of Joy for example it was vocally completed but the music was not and the producers had to work on that.

Update: I'm not saying I don't believe you I'm saying that I will never believe anyone who claims MJ had enough material for only 2 albums.

 

[Arklove]

I love it when Michael speaks...It sounds like he's singing; he's got such a 'musical' speaking voice :heart:

 

[Jesta]

How have my great believer-aimed questions been left unanswered?

 

[love is magical]

I love it when Michael speaks...It sounds like he's singing; he's got such a 'musical' speaking voice :heart:

I know. I can hear him reading the Yellow Page. :wub:

 

[ivy]

Good point. Although if there truly are only enough songs for 2 albums (which I find hard to believe anyway), it would give them a reason to want to create more.

if that's their reason and if they are faking the songs, they wouldn't go around saying "we don't have many songs" - that would be plain dumb.

I do not believe that at all Michael Jackson himself said he recorded 40+ songs for every album and he wanted to release 30 songs on the Bad album but he had to pick 10 out of 30.

There might be around 30 - 50 songs that MJ completed himself as in like it's ready to just be put out on a record and released.

Now take Best Of Joy for example it was vocally completed but the music was not and the producers had to work on that.

Update: I'm not saying I don't believe you I'm saying that I will never believe anyone who claims MJ had enough material for only 2 albums.

as I'm not the one that's saying it, I'm not taking it personal

Teddy on the radio show said that Michael generally only recorded one verse and didn't complete the songs. And we'll see if this is true as the time goes on. such as if any "legit" songs happen to have copy , pastes, added adlibs and/or songs released as duets , it will show us that they were worked on but not finished.

 

[ivy]

3) Where did the idea come from that these songs were demos/guide vocals? It has never been stated by Eddie or the Estate or the record label.

Roger Friedman, Joe Vogel and many people that wrote about these songs during the album release time called them as guide vocals. I believe Estate , Sony or Cascio to be the source.

Example : Vogel talking about breaking news

This was a guide demo, supplemented by the supporting vocals of James Porte (for which he is credited), and produced nearly four years later by Teddy Riley.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/joe-vogel/exclusive-the-inside-stor_b_781364.html

Friedman

Some of the confusion on the currently streaming “Breaking News” may exist because Michael provided “guide” vocals on the tracks. He didn’t record back up vocals or anything else that would embellish a regular recording.

http://www.showbiz411.com/2010/11/10/michael-jackson-there-is-concrete-proof-he-sang-the-new-songs

While these vocals may have been “guide vocals,” or in demo form, it does not detract in any way from their quality or their authenticity.

http://www.mjfanclub.net/home/index...hind-the-album&catid=85:latest-news&Itemid=82

4) If these songs were in such a state that they had to be processed to such a degree, then why do the newly recorded vocals for WBSS 2008, recorded in the same studio and in the same time period, sound fine?

difference between a guide vocal versus a finished job ?

There is no vocal manipulation software or technique that would create such a vibrato as a by product.

When lengthening/shortening notes with natural vibato, you must by default speed or slow down the vibrato by the very fact that you are changing the note duration. This is most apparent on longer notes and tail-offs. I have found that any more than 10-20% change really starts to sound like an unnatural change in vibrato frequency and I can't use it

6) Why did Teddy Riley feel the need to lie? He stated in a video interview (which can be found on youtube) that the vibrato was caused by his melodyning the vocals. He was very specific about it. He even apologisies for it in the interview. Thing is, we now know that the vibrato is not only on all 12 tracks, but is on earlier versions of 2 of the songs he worked on from before he received them. Sure, he could have been confusing melodyne with something else, but he clearly states that he caused it in the production phrase. That is a lie.

on his twitter he had said the songs had processing on them - and blamed Eddie for it.

11) Why is there no trace of the existence of these songs in the US Copyright Office, BMI or Library of Congress databases until almost a year after Michael's death. The "MJ Songbook 2009 #1" entry from June 27th 2009 does not mention specific titles. Eddie registered the songs (as per submission date) just two days after his friend died. Despite what has been said above, nothing was "swapped" at the US Copyright Office. The individual titles were later registered with BMI only. In fact, if we go by the correct assumption of the above poster that entries can't be swapped over, then it makes perfect sense that the contents of the 2009 registration are different to later registrations ie it is not what we hear in the songs now. Why did it take so long for the individual titles to materialise?

BMI and Copyright office are two different things. Copyright office is where you establish your ownership and protect yourself from your work being stolen and used without your permission. It allows the songs from the same authors to be registered as a collection. Registering songs one by one versus as a collection gives the same level of protection. but registering them one by one means you need to pay the fees 12 times. So unless the person is dumb there's no reason to do 12 applications, send 12 separate copies of the songs and pay the fees 12 times when you can do it with one application, one submission and one fee.

BMI is a music publishing that collects loyalty fees for their artists. Songs are added to their list for loyalty collection when they are released / about to be released / making the rounds and it's not possible to register them as a collection. so your question of "what made these songs materialize later" is actually the natural song release process.

You are totally lost in this topic and comparing apples to oranges and coming to bananas as conclusions.

12) Jason Cupeta made a relatively successful career as a vocalist who can mimic the voice of Michael Jackson.

ahahaha in what universe?

13)Why the silence, despite the accusations against him and potential free publicity that a rebuttal would get Jason?

a year later there are people who claim the songs to be 100% Malachi. He's getting the best free publicity ever on your backs and you are failing to see it.

 

[kreen]

1) When recording multiple takes for 12 songs, it is inevitable, and this can be supported by previous MJ demos etc, that Michael would have been talking as he was working through the songs. All of this would have been recorded. These recordings are what you might call worktapes.

**Friedman says those worktapes exist, so maybe we'll get to hear them someday. Maybe Cascio is keeping them for some future project. Maybe he wants money for them. Maybe he's so insulted strangers would call him a liar that he doesn't want to give them the satisfaction of having to prove he's not (kinda like what Obama did with his birth certificate for a while!). Besides, if he DID release work tapes, people would say those are fake too.

2) Same as above but with regards to written notes. Michael did not write these songs from scratch himself but he is credited as co- writer which means he must have contributed something. All those notes for other songs yet nothing for these?

**Friedman says those notes exist. If Cascio did release them, people would call them fake too.


5) There is no vocal manipulation software or technique that would create such a vibrato as a by product.

**Who else here never wants to hear the word "vibrato" again in their entire lives? FORGET about the vibrato. It's either a concidence, an artefact of some clumsy recording/singing/post-production, or just your mind playing tricks on you.

7) Why did Michael Jackson change his pronounciation of certain words for these songs only? The pronounciation that he uses is the same pronounciation of certain words that Jason Cupeta uses. Again, no known software, or the side affect of said software's application, is known to cause this. So if it's not Jason, why did Michael decided to pronounce his words just like him?

**Again, a coincidence, or your mind playing tricks on you. When we're told to look for something, we often see it, even when it's not there. It's the power of the imagination.

8) One of the things that Jason does in his own songs is to make a "snort" sound when going quickly from one line to another. That's the best way I can describe it. These same snorts are present in the Cascio tracks, most notably in Breaking News. In fact, an identical snort to the one heard in Breaking News can be found in the song Critical by Jason Cupeta. How did this get there?

**Yeah, there's no other possibility for that subtle sound being on that song than the hoax theory... It's just a snorting sound, we should get over it.

9) On demos that contain vocals by Michael Jackson, where he is not going full out, even mumbling lyrics or singing half heartedly, he still manages to sing in tune. A good example of this would be Fall Again. Why do several Cascio tracks contain out of tune vocals?

**Beause they were guide vocals, recorded by a MJ who was not in top form, by producers who didn't know what they were doing.

10) Why are things such as handclaps, footstamps, finger clicks and headphone bleeding absent from every song, despite being found on almost every Michael Jackson recording from the last 30 years?

**If they were there, people would take those elements as more fakery from the Cascios : "They thought they could fool us by adding trademark MJ sounds and tics. But we know better!". By that standard, Invincible is not a real MJ album, because he did away on that album with a ton of the tried-and-true MJ gimmicks (almost no hee-hees, very few aows, etc.)


12) Jason Cupeta made a relatively successful career as a vocalist who can mimic the voice of Michael Jackson. He performed and released material under the pseudonym Jason Malachi. There are many instances of him using his similarity with Michael's voice to promote himself, both in interviews and on MJ fan forums. If he was not involved in these recordings, then why the drastic change in behaviour? Why does he choose to stay silent to this day, when it would be such an ideal promotional tool for him? Why, after almost ten months since a fan accessed his Facebook account and hotmail account, has he made no attempt to return to the public eye?

**If he were to put his web site back on, he'd immediately get hundreds of threats/demands/accusations from half-crazed MJ fans who think he's the devil. He probably doesn't need the aggravation. As for him not capitalizing on this free publicity to kick-start his career, maybe he's decided, as indie musicians usually do at some point, that he won't make it after all. Maybe his wife finally said, enough with the singing, just stick to your day job.

13) Why did neither Jason Cupeta or his manager Thadeus Nauden not make any denial following the outcry over Breaking News and the subsequent release of the album, until Nauden was placed in a position where he had to by TMZ? Why the silence, despite the accusations against him and potential free publicity that a rebuttal would get Jason?

**His "manager" told the Estate right at the beginning that they had nothing to do with the songs, as confirmed by the letter from the Estate's lawyer. Anything else they say or don't say is just noise : when it counted, they denied having anything to do with those songs.

14) Why have Sony music failed to provide any evidence of their alleged tests on the recordings?

**Because they don't owe it to us, and because hard-core deniers would then just deny THAT evidence. You can't win with conspiracy theorists.

15) Why did Eddie Cascio and James Porte refuse to be interviewed by Joe Vogel about the recording process behind these songs for his book "Man In The Music"?


**Joe Vogel told me personally that the Estate tried to arrange an interview, but that they couldn't make it in time for the book.

See my individual answers within the quoted text, above.

 

[wolfrevenant]

But they can just drop all those songs to avoid the risk. It's not like they had to put out those 3 songs without choice unless all the MJ songs in the vault were gone and they don't have other material. Don't understand the logic why put three fake songs when you have other choices. I myself think they even better just drop those songs to avoid controversy from the beginning.

In my opinion, I think it's just a case of them not caring. They didn't care enough to authenticate the 3 songs, after all, the words of Michael's so-called surrogate family should be enough, right? Besides, from what I recall, the fans themselves were demanding for Cascio songs at the time, so they up-and-bought them because of the demand. Even when there was controversy, they still saw it as an opportunity to make a lot of money by marketing it as the last songs Michael recorded. They couldn't be bothered about the minority who were against it, because their real target was the general public who still thought Michael was "in-fashion" at the time.