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Michael - The Great Album Debate

qbee said:
Do we really need more casico releases to continue this debate about the 3 that were released.?
At least we know the estate admits a mistake in releasing them and promises fans they will not release any more. They have done much to try to make amends to the fans. We know Branca knows nows and realises how much these tracks upset and devided the fanbase. At least he is acknowledging that to the fans. (He didnt have to) He cant very well throw it all under the bus and destroy everything. But I think with his addmission more info will eventually come out from others. Branca broke the ice.
But I am elated the rest of Eddies crappy songs are flushed down the toilet by the Estate :)MJ deserved better
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So far Branca hasn't said anything. We only have a hearsay. The Estate needs to make a public statement and actually DO something about the future releases of the album "Michael" too.

Also, if true that Branca admitted they made a massive mistake, then their so called forensic proof is worthless and explains it why it's not been shown.
 
I agree Bumper In a perfect world - where everything would turn out happily ever after for Michael the Fans and the estate with that revelation - But but he cant do that in this world becuase that is not what will happen _ The end result would be disaterous. plus Branca never said the songs were not Michael just not up to standard thats all we will get. He said he listens to the fans and promised the rest would NEVER see the light of day. We can give him credit for that at least. The fans who met and spoke with Branca said he was a very nice guy and came across as very sincere when speaking with them. One (credible fan ) specifically asked him about the Casico tracks and John even apologised to them for their inclusing on the M Album. I know you want full disclosure and I dont blame you .. but I dont think that will happen any time soon ... Maybe down the line.
 
I think this is like a middle ground. Like Qbee my understanding is that their position and belief is that the songs are Michael but they realize the quality issues and how this debate affects the fans so for the future they would stay away from the songs as they want to make the fans happy. Also it's not hearsay as we have multiple people that has heard Branca say "no more Cascio songs will be released" . It's not hearsay when the people that actually heard it says it.

As their belief is still the songs are Michael , I would not expect any apologizes or reissues or statements or etc. They are just admitting to their mistake of not listening to the fans and they are making amends by listening to the fans in Bad25 release and making promises to listen to them in the future releases with no more Cascio songs.
 
The one thing this mess all hopefully finally proves to a lot of people is that Michael Jackson was the ultimate producer. Producer..meaning, the last person to give the OK to a song. The last person to say a song has the it factor. Not Quincy.(See Haiti 25) Not Riley. Not Darkchild. NOT CASCIO. And certainly not Sony. But Michael Jackson. Feeling this way, has kept me from getting ripped off. I find satisfaction in Michael's seven releases. I felt comfort when the Ultimate collection was released. Michael was here to oversee, before that got released. That's why that was good. Thriller 25. That was good. But now, he's not here to babysit the morons, anymore. I'll never feel comfortable getting other things. Not Bad 25. Not anything. I'll always only feel comfortable downloading the classics in single fashion. I would call that unfortunate for me, if MJ's music wasn't so special. IMO
 
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Again, people do not understand. THE ESTATE was responsible for the release of the Cascio tracks. Sony had no say in it; they just distributed the album.
 
it will always be difficult for me to believe in. It's like you're saying, Sony is the only multibillion dollar corporation in the world that will give somebody hundreds of millions of dollars, and then turn a blind eye to whatever happens next. Let me work for them, then.
 
I believe Sony does have a say in what they will release on their label. If they dont feel it will sell or is up to par they can reject a song or a project. They bought rights to publish the songs so they also have a say in what they publish. It's all negotiated between Estate and Sony what the end product will be.
 
Estate doesn’t say they will not release any more Cascio songs because they are fake.They just don’t want to see fanbase split up again.FACT (I know doubters here don’t like or agree with it,and you guys won’t admit it) is it’s Michael’s voice on Cascio songs.
Anyway,it’s good news for doubters,not bad news for believers.
 
AlwaysThere said:
Again, people do not understand. THE ESTATE was responsible for the release of the Cascio tracks. Sony had no say in it; they just distributed the album.
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This is not true as we don't know the specifics of the deal. Friedman had reported Sony wanted the songs and in the past Michael had issues with Sony with changing album songs, not doing certain single releases, pushing for other releases and such. In short we don't know for sure how much control they have. It's unrealistic to think that they would pay $250 million - $25 Million per project and have no say in it.
 
Paw;3701445 said:
Estate doesn’t say they will not release any more Cascio songs because they are fake.They just don’t want to see fanbase split up again.FACT (I know doubters here don’t like or agree with it,and you guys won’t admit it) is it’s Michael’s voice on Cascio songs.
Anyway,it’s good news for doubters,not bad news for believers.
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I know Michael's voice is featured in the Cascio songs. The question is how much? And, whether Michael's voice was recycled from previous recordings. To me, Eddie Cascio did Michael a disservice by calling the songs Michael worked hard for and would like to share with his fans.

I agree it's a GREAT news the remaining crappy Cascio songs never see the light of day. As for the believers, the remaining C tracks are leaked either in full or in part. if you really are so desperate for the tracks, just search them over the net.
 
ivy said:
From Jesta on twitter

Branca confirmed (several times) that the Cascio tracks will NOT be used in future products and that their inclusion was a massive mistake. I didn't hear the whole conversation, but it was roughly that "Michael" was far from his best;He personally contacted Malachi, who denied such things on account of his profession in the law, but promised to not include any more Cascio tracks on account of the pain it caused the fan-base.
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Good to know! Now we can leak all the cascio tracks... :D :D :D
 
qbee said:
I agree Bumper In a perfect world - where everything would turn out happily ever after for Michael the Fans and the estate with that revelation
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I see your point, but you see I wouln't call it a perfect world, but a normal world. Indeed when someone admits that a "massive mistake" has been done, you expect the mistake to be repaired in one way or another.

qbee said:
- But but he cant do that in this world becuase that is not what will happen _
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Yes, he can, because for the moment he (the Estate) is trying to sweep it under the rug, and that's not what I see as a normal or acceptable thing to do.

qbee said:
The end result would be disaterous.
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Well, to be honest, for the moment the desastrous result is being sold in the name of Michael Jackson - the Cascio songs.


qbee said:
plus Branca never said the songs were not Michael just not up to standard thats all we will get. He said he listens to the fans and promised the rest would NEVER see the light of day. We can give him credit for that at least.
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Personally, I am totally willing to give him credit, but not upon words, but actions. And when I am saying actions, I am not referring to any other action than repairing a mistake when this latter has been admitted. Not releasing the rest of the Cascio songs is only the consequence and a stept further, but what is he going to do about the "massive mistake" that has been made? It still reamins there as big stain in MJ's legacy.


qbee said:
The fans who met and spoke with Branca said he was a very nice guy and came across as very sincere when speaking with them.
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I don't think that anyone is after Branca personally. He probably is a nice guy. However, his personality shouldn't distract us from what has been done to MJ's legacy because of the Estate's poor decisions. Being nice doesn't give anyone the green card to escape from repairing a "massive mistake" that is actually repairable to a certain degree: removing the songs from "Michael" album in the future with a statement adressed to the fans and the public in general. And, by the way, we shouldn't forget that we're talking about Michael Jackson here, and that we are for Michael Jackson here, and not for Branca or anyonbe else who is taking care of MJ's releases.

qbee said:
One (credible fan ) specifically asked him about the Casico tracks and John even apologised to them for their inclusing on the M Album. I know you want full disclosure and I dont blame you .. but I dont think that will happen any time soon ... Maybe down the line.
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I am not doubting the credible fan's words, but I am talking about the principle here. This is not the way how a "massive mistake" is dealt with. Branca needs to take all the guts he has and come forward publicly. Also, when you say that Branca "even" apologized to some fans. Well, that is the least he can do. By the way, it is not only an insult to the fans, but also to MJ's legacy in general. So his apology will be accepted as sincere from the moment he repairs it by removing those tracks. Otherwise, admitting to committing a massive mistake and leaving that massive mistake on the album Michael does not change a thing to the current situation regzrding MJ's legacy.

Finally, let's not forget, we're Michael Jackson's fans. To many of us, although Michael had met Branca long time ago and although Branca was present in MJ's life, we had no clue who Branca was nor did we care really.

Now all of sudden, since MJ's death I have witnessed some MJ's fans defending and following Branca on Twitter and religiously defending his actions as wise business one's. The irony is that what he now admits as a massive mistake had been defended by some as wise business decisions. The question however remains, why didn't he listen to the fans before the release? The Estate was warned and they did nothing about it, and not coming forward publicly to repair that massive mistake is unacceptable.
 
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I know it's not MJ on the Cascio tracks...

But..

I still love and listen to Breaking News on a regular basis...

I even considered creating a video together for BN like I did for We've Had Enough, D.S, and The Way You Love Me (demo version)...
 
This wont end until what was done in the dark gets brought into the light. Until the full truth of these songs is exposed. Period. I pray it happens.
 
CrazyVegasMJ said:
I know it's not MJ on the Cascio tracks...

But..

I still love and listen to Breaking News on a regular basis...

I even considered creating a video together for BN like I did for We've Had Enough, D.S, and The Way You Love Me (demo version)...
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Even though you believe it's not MJ? That's so wrong.
 
elapentela said:
I don't think Eddie is hiding anything. My theory and hope is that he moved on with his life and just doesn't have the time to follow the controversy. I'm positive he will present the proofs when he will have the need for it. For example as a defendant in the court case if someone would charge him legally with the fraud.

I spoke with MJ about Eddie's future as a musician on 3 different occasions when I met him during my business trips in Ireland and US (LA and Las Vegas). Every time he sounded very enthusiastic and even proud when he talked about Eddie's progress in developing his producing skills.
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love is magical said:
Call me curious, when Michael told you about Eddie's progress as a musicain and producer, did he mention to you that he actually recorded 12 demos with Eddie? When you talked to Michael in Vegas, what year was that? Before 2007 or after 2007? This is the kind of information I want to know. We just knew so very little about these mysterious songs that seem to come from nowhere. Nobody knew they exist before Roger Friedman broke the story in 2010.

I wish Eddie can see providing information to fans as sharing stories about Michael's creative process instead of proving himself only when necessary. Oh well... he has rights to do whatever he wants.
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StellaJackson said:
I find this hard to believe. Why would Michael be talking to a fan about Eddie Cascio, a friendship which he actually kept very private? Could you state the exact place and date you spoke to Michael so it can be verified? If you met Michael in Ireland then it must have been at his house. Highly unlikely. Either way, it makes no difference whatsoever. Eddie has absolutely nothing except twelve tracks that were sold on a hard drive to Sony. No outtakes, notes, nothing to show that Michael went anywhere near these songs.
The very fact that these songs were sold for such ridiculous amounts of money instead of being passed on to Michael's children, shows just how much his "friendship" with Michael meant.
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elapentela said:
For the same reason you are in it again. To debate. Wondering how far it will go. Also it's a good fun too.
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hmm...elapentela, if you're here to debate, then care to elaborate on this information you dropped about 4 months ago?
 
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No more Cascio songs ever. They will never be released.

At least we know this now.

There's nothing left to do. I feel it's somewhat the closest we can get to a "victory".
 
Pentum said:
No more Cascio songs ever. They will never be released.

At least we know this now.

There's nothing left to do. I feel it's somewhat the closest we can get to a "victory".
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I like to think of this as a silent admission by the Estate. Face it, we won't ever get them saying that the songs are fake; the backlash would be disastrous to the point where nothing would ever be released again. Given the conservationist nature of the Estate when it comes to usable material, this is huge. We could go down the route that ends with Eddie getting his just desserts, but I think this is probably more painful for him: he won't get any more credits/royalties on any more albums and he won't get recognized as a big producer; only the guy who's songs were only good for one Estate project and had a giant uprising from the fans. This is realistically the ideal result, and I don't see "Michael" being displayed in store shelves anymore, nor is it really that well-known. I see the Estate sweeping this album under the rug and only making reference to 7 of its songs in the future.
 
Michael Jackson had already used an impersonator in "Lisa It's Your Birthday" (for different reasons of course). If the Estate had more imagination they could have used those Cascio songs in some cartoon or animated projects related to MJ, but without crediting MJ. But now that they included it in a studio album it's too late. They shouldn't have rushed to release them. Their apparent lack of imagination is apalling.
 
Jesta said:
I like to think of this as a silent admission by the Estate. Face it, we won't ever get them saying that the songs are fake; the backlash would be disastrous to the point where nothing would ever be released again. Given the conservationist nature of the Estate when it comes to usable material, this is huge. We could go down the route that ends with Eddie getting his just desserts, but I think this is probably more painful for him: he won't get any more credits/royalties on any more albums and he won't get recognized as a big producer; only the guy who's songs were only good for one Estate project and had a giant uprising from the fans. This is realistically the ideal result, and I don't see "Michael" being displayed in store shelves anymore, nor is it really that well-known. I see the Estate sweeping this album under the rug and only making reference to 7 of its songs in the future.
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Unfortunately, this 'album' is available on iTunes. That's the glory and agony of iTunes. Once it's in cyberspace, there's no getting rid of it.
 
i looked. they haven't removed them. and no...i have put stuff in cyberspace, hope it was removed, but found out that it was located by other people.
 
It doesn't matter what the estate is willing to admit or reveal. That doesn't mean a lot more can't be revealed somehow. I'm confident the truth will come out one day. I just wish that ALL the fans were united in finding the truth as it benefits all of us.
 
Well,I don’t think the fans who are interested in this topic really like to know the ins and outs of the matter and accept them from the bottom of their hearts like what they claimed before,as most debaters have already taken a firm stand.
Truth hurts,you won’t like it.This is the ideal result.
 
elapentela said:
I don't think Eddie is hiding anything. My theory and hope is that he moved on with his life and just doesn't have the time to follow the controversy. I'm positive he will present the proofs when he will have the need for it. For example as a defendant in the court case if someone would charge him legally with the fraud.

I spoke with MJ about Eddie's future as a musician on 3 different occasions when I met him during my business trips in Ireland and US (LA and Las Vegas). Every time he sounded very enthusiastic and even proud when he talked about Eddie's progress in developing his producing skills.
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Eddie has refused various interviews, given very little information about the recording/production of the tracks, has countlessly contradicted himself in the few interviews he DID make, denied release of the supposed "work tapes" that exist featuring Michael talking, and has seemingly disappeared from the public eye (as did Jason Malachi and Bobby Ewing/James Porte). The shame that he feels over the fact that he sold out one of his best friends finally caught up to him. And unless you forgot to note it, Michael never noted that he recorded anything with Eddie. I believe that he possibly heard a demo version of what would become the Cascio tracks, or maybe an entirely different song all together. But unless he HIMSELF stated, "Oh, I recorded a little bit with him," it is still in the air.
 
@WildStyle
Watch your tone,boy.You can have a wild style,but don't be rude to others.
You don't know what they know.
 
Paw said:
@WildStyle
Watch your tone,boy.You can have a wild style,but don't be rude to others.
You don't know what they know.
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Haha what the hell are you on about? You stated your opinion as fact, and I said rubbish and speak for yourself. Now you're offended. Oh well, not my problem. Grow a thicker skin maybe.
 
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