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MJ Estate Statement Re: Justin Bieber Slave To The Rhythm Recording. [Merged]

rsggamer123 said:
The estate should simply release the solo version of this song on his birthday, make it the first single of the new album and release the album late November/early december
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would be better stated in the submission thread to the Estate - Please :)
 
My personal wish.. There should be 3 singles released before album release.. And considering award cut off times I'd say to not release the album til next year Q2..

I'd say single 1 in Oct.. Single 2 jan... Single 3 April... Release in may... And fourth single first week of June..

A lot of marketing should go into this..

But though I don't like being negative, I'm not sure that's what would happen
 
dam2040 said:
One quick question; what does JB/MJ comparison pics have to do with a duet? They were unnecessary and just used spitefully.
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I dislike Justin Bieber, thats my prerogative... and the pics were necessary IMO, because they reference that he is a MJ wanna be and constantly tries to copy him and steal his ideas. Mind you, He doesn't use MJ for inspiration to make his own, he just copies and mimics Michael even when he knows it aggravates MJ fans for him to do that. I don't find it cute or endearing at all. (Those are Michaels trademarks) It not just one thing either, if that was the case it wouldn't be an issue, but its everything. The masks, the tape on his fingers, MJ poses and costumes, MJ ideas in his concerts, the crotch grab, getting a Monkey, posing with a snake, using MJ quotes and phrases. Even mimicking personal pictures of MJ and MJ photo shoots shots. (that's plagiarism IMO)

I don't come against those who like him. but I have very valid reasons of my own not to and those reasons are
valid to me to keep him off of MJ songs. You certainly have a right to your own opinions.

ETA
Changed Spite to dislike .because I didn't know the defined meaning of spite.
My feeling are not that harsh. let's just say I dislike him and do not approve of his actions.
 
KOPV said:
Some people will deny this but if we never heard of sttr until now, we for the most part would love what we hear.. Like blue gangster when the mixed version came out/leaked prior to the authentic version..

We could hate the artist that is on the track, when we hear mj and its new to us we love it.. I don't think too many people would pick shaq on an mj track either.. But we listen and love 2bad!

I know there's a difference of mj choosing the artist and not.. But I think the whole fabric of this thread would be different if we heard these mj vocals for the first time the way we did here.
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There's a difference between a feature that was written by someone else to contribute to a Michael Jackson song and someone else removing a whole verse and chorus of the man himself in favor of laying down there own vocals in those parts, with the same exact lyrics.

Its not really comparable imo. Shaq isn't on 2Bad attempting to sing Michael's parts going "Too Bad Too Bad About It, Why Don't Cha Scream And Shout It" in that deep voice of his, he has his own section of the song, with his own 100% original contribution to the record. Same goes for Ice Cube in We Be Ballin' and the rappers on Blue Gangsta, they all had they're original pieces as far as lyrics go, as well as BIG on This Time Around. Its not like they were trying to overdub Michael word for word and take away his voice in favor of their own.
 
qbee said:
I do have spite for Justin Bieber, thats my prerogative... and the pics were necessary IMO, because they reference that he is a MJ wanna be and constantly tries to copy him and steal his ideas. Mind you, He doesn't use MJ for inspiration to make his own, he just copies and mimics Michael even when he knows it aggravates MJ fans for him to do that. I don't find it cute or endearing at all. (Those are Michaels trademarks) It not just one thing either, if that was the case it wouldn't be an issue, but its everything. The masks, the tape on his fingers, MJ poses and costumes, MJ ideas in his concerts, the crotch grab, getting a Monkey, posing with a snake, using MJ quotes and phrases. Even mimicking personal pictures of MJ and MJ photo shoots shots. (that's plagiarism IMO)

I don't come against those who like him. but I have very valid reasons of my own not to and those reasons are valid to me to keep him off of MJ songs. You certainly have a right to your own opinions.
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I agree with you. I've noticed all of that as well.
 
Who ever is behind all this i imagine that they look like this

herpderp.png
 
KOPV said:
My personal wish.. There should be 3 singles released before album release.. And considering award cut off times I'd say to not release the album til next year Q2..

I'd say single 1 in Oct.. Single 2 jan... Single 3 April... Release in may... And fourth single first week of June..

A lot of marketing should go into this..

But though I don't like being negative, I'm not sure that's what would happen
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I would like that, but KOPV, you're KILLING me with the May release date! :p I would say give us one strong chart topper in late September/early October, followed by the full album in November, and subsequent singles to follow. Hey, Black or White was only released weeks before Dangerous came out.

But on topic, I can't say I hate Justin Bieber. In truth, having cousins and friends of cousins who are addicted to Bieber's music, I've come across one or two songs that I actually enjoy (Fall, for those of you who haven't heard it, is probably his best). But as a person, he gets on my very last nerve. Justin Timberlake took the Michael Jackson trademarks, switched them around and made them his own over time. Bieber simply takes the trademarks and tries too hard. I don't find his adoration for Michael unacceptable -- I would say he's on the level of some of the people here on MJJC -- but as far as how he goes about paying "tribute" to him, that needs to stop. I won't even get into the behavioral problems he's been having as of late because that could fill several more paragraphs.

As a singer, Justin has potential. He doesn't have the strongest voice but when he tries he can put some soul into his work. But he thinks way too much of himself. I recall when his Believe Acoustic album came out a press release dubbed him as the Prince of Pop.

How about no?
 
What worries me about the estate's statement is that they say they are upset by the leak. They make no mention about being upset about the duet itself which what fans are angry about the most.
 
Still going through this thread, catching up on all of this...

All I can come up with at this point is: "Justin Bieber ft. Michael Jackson"....

On what effing planet am I right now?!? :bugeyed

:no:
 
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Another thing to consider is that while we're all against this there are plenty of people who will be happy to see MJ/JB duet released. Justin Bieber's fans will want this released and lets not forget the greedy fat cats in suits from the record companies. They'd want it released too because it will probably be a big hit and it will make them lots of money

Those people worry me
 
qbee said:
I do have spite for Justin Bieber, thats my prerogative... and the pics were necessary IMO, because they reference that he is a MJ wanna be and constantly tries to copy him and steal his ideas. Mind you, He doesn't use MJ for inspiration to make his own, he just copies and mimics Michael even when he knows it aggravates MJ fans for him to do that. I don't find it cute or endearing at all. (Those are Michaels trademarks) It not just one thing either, if that was the case it wouldn't be an issue, but its everything. The masks, the tape on his fingers, MJ poses and costumes, MJ ideas in his concerts, the crotch grab, getting a Monkey, posing with a snake, using MJ quotes and phrases. Even mimicking personal pictures of MJ and MJ photo shoots shots. (that's plagiarism IMO)

I don't come against those who like him. but I have very valid reasons of my own not to and those reasons are valid to me to keep him off of MJ songs. You certainly have a right to your own opinions.
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I agree with everything u said 100%

He is trying to be like some mini mj and it is tiring seeing him do that
 
Arklove said:
Still going through this thread, catching up on all of this...

All I can come up with at this point is: "Justin Bieber ft. Michael Jackson"....

On what effing planet am I right now?!? :bugeyed

:no:
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You seriously didnt hear bout this till now??
 
HIStoric said:
Well yes, in theory but in practise, it's unlikely that it will happen. Change the name of the video to something obscure "MJJBSTTR13" (or another code that makes less sense) and it'll be harder to find manually. Then fans can just fasten it up a bit, or adjust the pitch, adjust the audio in a number of different ways and the automatic takedown tool will not find it (or at least struggle to).
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Problem is the beiber fans love this and is trying to bring out so i doubt they will put a code on the vids .
 
8701girl said:
Problem is the beiber fans love this and is trying to bring out so i doubt they will put a code on the vids .
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That's a valid point, but they could still do that. Title of the video is irrelevant when you're sharing it via social media as all you need is a link. Thats why many people in the 2000 Watts forum take any words such as "michael jackson" out of the filename because then Mediafire or whatever will pick up its copyrighted work and remove it. Replace "2000 Watts" with a Justin Bieber forum/fan's twitter and "Michael Jackson" with "Justin Bieber" and it's the same situation.
 
qbee said:
I do have spite for Justin Bieber, thats my prerogative... and the pics were necessary IMO, because they reference that he is a MJ wanna be and constantly tries to copy him and steal his ideas. Mind you, He doesn't use MJ for inspiration to make his own, he just copies and mimics Michael even when he knows it aggravates MJ fans for him to do that. I don't find it cute or endearing at all. (Those are Michaels trademarks) It not just one thing either, if that was the case it wouldn't be an issue, but its everything. The masks, the tape on his fingers, MJ poses and costumes, MJ ideas in his concerts, the crotch grab, getting a Monkey, posing with a snake, using MJ quotes and phrases. Even mimicking personal pictures of MJ and MJ photo shoots shots. (that's plagiarism IMO)

I don't come against those who like him. but I have very valid reasons of my own not to and those reasons are valid to me to keep him off of MJ songs. You certainly have a right to your own opinions.
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Of course he copies MJ! Every single person in the industry does today, in some way or another. Beyonce, Lady Gaga, Bruno Mars, Justin Timberlake, Ne-Yo, Usher, literally every big name in the world right now. Not justifying it believe me, "Better to succeed at originality than to fail at imitation" or something similar. But I didn't see what that had to do with singing a song. I suppose it could've been used back when people knew hardly anything and threw blame at the Estate and Bieber. But some pictures were photo shopped, so it looked like you were trying to really prove a point about JB which isn't honestly, all that truthful anymore. He doesn't do the tape, wear the jackets etc. He said all the time his concert was taking inspiration from Michael and it has. The masks, well why wouldn't you want to wear one with the whole world flashing cameras at your face. Everyone has off days. He did it like twice anyways. Early JB was almost cringeworthy. It really was, but he's not as bad now. But just because Michael Jackson said something, Justin can't? Does that mean I can't? Everyone else can't? It's only Michael's to say? The crotch grab is one of the most popular moves today, everyone does it. Not only JB. Spite for a 19 year old? Ok..

Some of the photoshoot pics were a little embarrassing to look at, but they were again, early Justin. Not what he is, or does now. Not the guy that (unfortunately) sang on that record.

Not saying it is right. Just hating relentlessly on a 19 year old like he has no feelings, dreams for his career is a little odd. Especially when we get as we do when someone does it to Michael. Would Michael have worked with him? Who knows. If he worked with will.i.am, anythings a possibility. We'll never find out. To decide for Michael is wrong. It has nothing to do with Justin Bieber. To make such a huge artistic decision because someone thought it would sound nice or whatever for someone who took their work SO seriously, was wrong. It is massively, unbelievably, despicably wrong. if we really want someone to go after, look for those who's idea this was. A blatant disregard to Michael's ethics.
 
I liked "Michael" album and "Bad 25" realease:) I will never do the same mistake I did with "Invincible", I was so focus comparing the album with the old ones that I forgot how to be excited and dance and feel the music...I love that we, Michael's fans, are defending him all the time, we are really like an army, but we also need to learn to relax and enjoy new materials, nothing will be the way it was when he was alive but try just to have fun listening to Michael's beautiful voice!
 
dam2040 said:
Of course he copies MJ! Every single person in the industry does today, in some way or another. Beyonce, Lady Gaga, Bruno Mars, Justin Timberlake, Ne-Yo, Usher, literally every big name in the world right now. Not justifying it believe me, "Better to succeed at originality than to fail at imitation" or something similar. But I didn't see what that had to do with singing a song. I suppose it could've been used back when people knew hardly anything and threw blame at the Estate and Bieber. But some pictures were photo shopped, so it looked like you were trying to really prove a point about JB which isn't honestly, all that truthful anymore. He doesn't do the tape, wear the jackets etc. He said all the time his concert was taking inspiration from Michael and it has. The masks, well why wouldn't you want to wear one with the whole world flashing cameras at your face. Everyone has off days. He did it like twice anyways. Early JB was almost cringeworthy. It really was, but he's not as bad now. But just because Michael Jackson said something, Justin can't? Does that mean I can't? Everyone else can't? It's only Michael's to say? The crotch grab is one of the most popular moves today, everyone does it. Not only JB. Spite for a 19 year old? Ok..

Some of the photoshoot pics were a little embarrassing to look at, but they were again, early Justin. Not what he is, or does now. Not the guy that (unfortunately) sang on that record.

Not saying it is right. Just hating relentlessly on a 19 year old like he has no feelings, dreams for his career is a little odd. Especially when we get as we do when someone does it to Michael. Would Michael have worked with him? Who knows. If he worked with will.i.am, anythings a possibility. We'll never find out. To decide for Michael is wrong. It has nothing to do with Justin Bieber. To make such a huge artistic decision because someone thought it would sound nice or whatever for someone who took their work SO seriously, was wrong. It is massively, unbelievably, despicably wrong. if we really want someone to go after, look for those who's idea this was. A blatant disregard to Michael's ethics.
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I personally haven't seen any major imitation of Michael from any other artist than Justin in recent years. Every artist imitated him in some way during their early career but the best ones evolve. Beyonce, Usher, Justin Timberlake, Ne-Yo, many others have all done it. Yeah sure, you'll see a few inspired dance moves or maybe a song that sounds like something they'd put out, but for the most part they've created their own style.

Bieber, however, is trying way too hard. In my opinion, early Bieber was so much better. He released a few annoying songs but he kept his love for Michael to a minimum. Like it was said, in recent years Justin is doing everything he can to be Michael. There was one article in a magazine (I'll try to find it) that compared photos of the two, and it was incredibly similar. Yes, Justin wears the tape on his fingers; he wore a similar military jacket to Michael on several occasions; no other artist wears masks when out with the paparazzi, only Michael and now Justin; he does the crotch grab in concerts much more than any other artist; he began calling himself the Prince of Pop, a tactic Michael used in the early '90s; he actually had his musicians watch Michael Jackson concerts to know what to do. It's way more than simple adoration.

To his defense, my last point isn't all bad. But when you try to take yourself seriously and rather than step up and make your own style you rest on someone else's, that's when you fall off the map. That's why Michael was famous for decades; he took the formula from James Brown, Jackie Wilson and many others and switched it up.
 
dam2040 said:
Of course he copies MJ! Every single person in the industry does today, in some way or another. Beyonce, Lady Gaga, Bruno Mars, Justin Timberlake, Ne-Yo, Usher, literally every big name in the world right now. Not justifying it believe me, "Better to succeed at originality than to fail at imitation" or something similar. But I didn't see what that had to do with singing a song. I suppose it could've been used back when people knew hardly anything and threw blame at the Estate and Bieber. But some pictures were photo shopped, so it looked like you were trying to really prove a point about JB which isn't honestly, all that truthful anymore. He doesn't do the tape, wear the jackets etc. He said all the time his concert was taking inspiration from Michael and it has. The masks, well why wouldn't you want to wear one with the whole world flashing cameras at your face. Everyone has off days. He did it like twice anyways. Early JB was almost cringeworthy. It really was, but he's not as bad now. But just because Michael Jackson said something, Justin can't? Does that mean I can't? Everyone else can't? It's only Michael's to say? The crotch grab is one of the most popular moves today, everyone does it. Not only JB. Spite for a 19 year old? Ok..

Some of the photoshoot pics were a little embarrassing to look at, but they were again, early Justin. Not what he is, or does now. Not the guy that (unfortunately) sang on that record.

Not saying it is right. Just hating relentlessly on a 19 year old like he has no feelings, dreams for his career is a little odd. Especially when we get as we do when someone does it to Michael. Would Michael have worked with him? Who knows. If he worked with will.i.am, anythings a possibility. We'll never find out. To decide for Michael is wrong. It has nothing to do with Justin Bieber. To make such a huge artistic decision because someone thought it would sound nice or whatever for someone who took their work SO seriously, was wrong. It is massively, unbelievably, despicably wrong. if we really want someone to go after, look for those who's idea this was. A blatant disregard to Michael's ethics.
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OK I will concede on a few issues. I have no ambition to be right at any cost. I looked up the definition of spite so I change my post to read dislike instead. Spite is harsher than what I feel. I don't agree with the excuses you give for Justins actions. I Also removed the one photo that was photoshopped, because I'm not trying to bring false allegations or prove my views by using false info. I do understand your wanting to defend him and I find that endearing in you. but Like I said It is not just one thing he did or does that irks me, it's the of combination of ALl those things.

Taking each instance as you did would be acceptable excuses and I could easily agree with them, but when you put everything together its not the same as other artists do when they tribute or do some some MJ moves like Michael. They don't mimic MJ when they are not performing. Yes Justin did wear tape on his fingers. In fact he even wore the tape on the Ellen show and was asked why he was wearing it and he said "Because Michael did it." Then Ellen stated "well I think you should stop there" or something to that effect Even she found is odd. I don't think Justin wore the mask for the same reason MJ did or for his privacy. Its very obvious if you see the pics and footage. He doesn't wear masks for privacy. (you may think so and thats fine) Im not going to tell you how you must feel or what your opinion should be. I respect your opinion. Just don't agree with all of it.

Like I said It is not just one thing he did or does its the combination of all of them that irked and annoys me. If he stops, then I may change my opinion. But many of these things were in the last year. So I hope as he grows and matures he will stop trying to copy MJ and find his own. I'm not going to debate your views further as you have a right to believe as you want. Everyones opinion is valid as an "opinion"
 
Since we're on the topic of Bieber trying to be Michael, I recall reading an article from a few months ago (I think? maybe even last year) of him actually saying that he wants to be the "next" Michael Jackson/King of Pop. I can't remember exactly what he said or how he said it, but it was along those lines. That was enough for me....
 
There is no next Michael Jackson. He was a once-in-a-lifetime experience. But of course if I had to pick who was closest to him in separate categories:

Music/inventiveness: Justin Timberlake
Dancing: Chris Brown
Vocals: as of yet, no one has impressed me enough to land this spot
 
Michael revolutionized the industry, for those who don't think everryy artist copies or has strong influence from Michael does not understand the full scope how Michael evolved music and the industry the way it is.. From street dances that were not worldwide known, he brought it to the for front. To music videos, videos were nothing like they are before Michael.. He was the guy that brought choreography, story, and true film making to videos/short films. Its because of Michael how music boards are built, he wanted specific capabilities and they built it for him and now its the standard for all music/sound boards. He expanded multi track layers that every artist uses now.. I really could keep going on but many artists don't even know how they do what Michael did when he was the first..

Not to mention the obvious, any time you see usher airwalk across the stage thank Michael. Any time you see any artist use the toaster on stage, thank Michael. When you watch a video and a line of dancers are with the artist in a choegraphed dance, thank Michael..

Not to mention he was the first musician to have mega deals with Pepsi and other lined companies to the extent he did. Now everyone fallows that.. I'll stop preaching
 
AlwaysThere said:
There is no next Michael Jackson. He was a once-in-a-lifetime experience. But of course if I had to pick who was closest to him in separate categories:

Music/inventiveness: Justin Timberlake
Dancing: Chris Brown
Vocals: as of yet, no one has impressed me enough to land this spot
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I'd like to start a topic about this. People all too frequently limit Michael's influence to these throwaway popstars when in actual fact Michael's influence spreads far and wide across indie, country and electro genres (to name a few that have recently come to my attention) and from vocalists to real genuine musicians.
 
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