Latest on MJJC

Some info on the Chandlers

Literally nothing in my life would change if this happened, so I fail to see how wanting Jordan to come forward and say 'Michael didn't molest me' would be something I'd want for myself or for 'us'.. I can imagine it would mean a lot to Michael's children tho, which is one of the reasons I'd want Jordan to tell the truth.

But mostly it's about Michael's legacy and for the way he deserves to be remembered. I always think about how he said "I want to live forever" to Bashir, or how he loved that Michelangelo quote "I know the creator will go but his work survives, that is why to escape death, I attempt to bind my soul to my work". He clearly wanted his legacy to be strong and to 'live forever' through his work, and he gave his all for that.. So it just really pains me to know that these allegations are always going to be part of his life story, 10, 20, 50 years from now, even tho they're completely untrue.. It's so unfair :no:
I'm quite sure if Jordan's confession would be part of that story, it would make a big difference and hopefully it would make even those who aren't willing to do some real research see these allegations for what they are, perhaps making this stain on his legacy a little smaller.. also I just think he's an amoral a$$hole for not telling the truth - which is always the right thing to do. So yeah, I do hope he'll be honest one day!
 
^ For me it's about his legacy!! Though the allegations would never be wiped from his history it would re-write his story very differently.. I do care how the general public perceives him I probably should it shouldn't matter but it does to me.. Especially when everyone knows me as the MJ fan.. It does effect the way people perceive us... care or not, we are connected!
 
Michael's legacy, as the pictures from all over the world last week proved, is doing quite well. So much better than before June 2009. Undoubtedly, Jordan Chandler's confession about his participation in his father's awful scheme would go a long way to clear ideas for some people, but unfortunately there will always be those who will believe Michael was a pedophile. Thankfully, their numbers are shrinking ever smaller. How the media would cover such an event is even more interesting.

It is still amazing to me just how much of a non-story the latest waves of allegations have been as far as mainstream media is concerned. One cannot possibly take seriously a couple of tabloids with their 3 readers or some celebrity-obsessed website. I am talking about regular, credible media. As far as they are concerned and, by extrapolation, the general public which gets its news from them, the allegations during the last two years haven't even taken place. I'm no true example, considering just how little media info I take in these days, but if I wouldn't visit this forum/other MJ sites, I wouldn't even know about these things. I think the only other outlandish story about Michael out there that has gotten less exposure from the mainstream media has been the hoaxing of the death. Otherwise, just about any other thing has been studied, exposed and gossiped upon.

The naive creature in me likes to think that they purposefully ignored the latest allegations because they've realized just how ludicrous they are, perhaps to an even higher degree than previous ones so they don't want to be shamed yet again for covering that which could very well prove to be a complete work of fiction. There are those who say that the media would have yet another circus if Michael would be alive and his passing is the only reason for which they aren't covering this stuff. Still, the optimist me would believe otherwise.

Perhaps the media finally understood the grave injustice to which they subjected him from 1993-2009 and are less willing and ready to give credence to anyone spewing lies about Michael Jackson. It's a nice thought, right? And who knows, maybe one day, should Jordan Chandler decide to grow up and assume responsibility, the media may even be brave enough to admit its own huge, share of blame for perpetuating the most heinous of lies that have terrified and affected Michael's life for decades..........
 
Last edited:
Girl said:
Michael's legacy, as the pictures from all over the world last week proved, is doing quite well. So much better than before June 2009. Undoubtedly, Jordan Chandler's confession about his participation in his father's awful scheme would go a long way to clear ideas for some people, but unfortunately there will always be those who will believe Michael was a pedophile. Thankfully, their numbers are shrinking ever smaller. How the media would cover such an event is even more interesting.

It is still amazing to me just how much of a non-story the latest waves of allegations have been as far as mainstream media is concerned. One cannot possibly take seriously a couple of tabloids with their 3 readers or some celebrity-obsessed website. I am talking about regular, credible media. As far as they are concerned and, by extrapolation, the general public which gets its news from them, the allegations during the last two years haven't even taken place. I'm no true example, considering just how little media info I take in these days, but if I wouldn't visit this forum/other MJ sites, I wouldn't even know about these things. I think the only other outlandish story about Michael out there that has gotten less exposure from the mainstream media has been the hoaxing of the death. Otherwise, just about any other thing has been studied, exposed and gossiped upon.

The naive creature in me likes to think that they purposefully ignored the latest allegations because they've realized just how ludicrous they are, perhaps to an even higher degree than previous ones so they don't want to be shamed yet again for covering that which could very well prove to be a complete work of fiction. There are those who say that the media would have yet another circus if Michael would be alive and his passing is the only reason for which they aren't covering this stuff. Still, the optimist me would believe otherwise.

Perhaps the media finally understood the grave injustice to which they subjected him from 1993-2009 and are less willing and ready to give credence to anyone spewing lies about Michael Jackson. It's a nice thought, right? And who knows, maybe one day, should Jordan Chandler decide to grow up and assume responsibility, the media may even be brave enough to admit its own huge, share of blame for perpetuating the most heinous of lies that have terrified and affected Michael's life for decades..........
Click to expand...


Love your post and in the bold really say it all.
 
Hope it's okay to ask this here. What is the source of Dave Schwartz saying in Larry Feldman's office, to Evan, that the case was extortion? Or is it unsubstantiated?
 
Bad7;4126120 said:
Hope it's okay to ask this here. What is the source of Dave Schwartz saying in Larry Feldman's office, to Evan, that the case was extortion? Or is it unsubstantiated?
Click to expand...

Mary A. Fischer's article in the October 1994 issue of GQ magazine. The Chandlers in their book do not mention that he said it was an extortion but they admit to the whole fight scene.

September 8, 1993 – Evan Chandler, June Chandler, David Schwartz and their lawyers discuss the prospects of a “highly profitable settlement” in Larry Feldman’s office. Evan and David Schwartz have an argument about the settlement money that they have not even received yet. According to Ray Chandler’s book Schwartz demanded four million dollars while the Chandlers did not want him to be included in Jordan’s complaint. (Earlier Schwartz also asked Michael Jackson to give him a four million dollars loan, which the star refused.) During the argument Evan Chandler punched Schwartz. According to Mary A. Fischer’s article “Was Michael Jackson Framed?” (GQ, October 1994) during the argument Schwartz said “this was all about extortion, anyway, at which point Evan stood up, walked over and started hitting Dave”. Ray Chandler’s book admits that “in the heat of this verbal battle [Evan] sprang from his seat and slapped Dave in the face. Several of the lawyers stepped between the two men and separated them”.
Click to expand...


Fischer's article turned out to be pretty credible when it came to this kind of insider info. Remember she reported first that Evan hugged MJ upon meeting him during that August 4 meeting which then the Chandlers admitted in their own book.
 
respect77 said:
Mary A. Fischer's article in the October 1994 issue of GQ magazine. The Chandlers in their book do not mention that he said it was an extortion but they admit to the whole fight scene.




Fischer's article turned out to be pretty credible when it came to this kind of insider info. Remember she reported first that Evan hugged MJ upon meeting him during that August 4 meeting which then the Chandlers admitted in their own book.
Click to expand...

Thanks.
 
Lil said:
Literally nothing in my life would change if this happened, so I fail to see how wanting Jordan to come forward and say 'Michael didn't molest me' would be something I'd want for myself or for 'us'.. I can imagine it would mean a lot to Michael's children tho, which is one of the reasons I'd want Jordan to tell the truth.

But mostly it's about Michael's legacy and for the way he deserves to be remembered. I always think about how he said "I want to live forever" to Bashir, or how he loved that Michelangelo quote "I know the creator will go but his work survives, that is why to escape death, I attempt to bind my soul to my work". He clearly wanted his legacy to be strong and to 'live forever' through his work, and he gave his all for that.. So it just really pains me to know that these allegations are always going to be part of his life story, 10, 20, 50 years from now, even tho they're completely untrue.. It's so unfair :no:
I'm quite sure if Jordan's confession would be part of that story, it would make a big difference and hopefully it would make even those who aren't willing to do some real research see these allegations for what they are, perhaps making this stain on his legacy a little smaller.. also I just think he's an amoral a$$hole for not telling the truth - which is always the right thing to do. So yeah, I do hope he'll be honest one day!
Click to expand...
I could've sworn he had killed himself or 1of them did
 
Bad7 said:
Hope it's okay to ask this here. What is the source of Dave Schwartz saying in Larry Feldman's office, to Evan, that the case was extortion? Or is it unsubstantiated?
Click to expand...

The source of the first extortion claim was Geraldine Hughes, who was the legal secretary to Evan's lawyer. I believe she was interviewed by Mary Fischer, who used that information in her article. Hughes went on to write a book called Redemption: The Truth about the Michael Jackson Molestation Allegations, where she gave her account of what she overheard in the law-office. But then, she was disappointing when she went on tv for various interviews. Instead of TELLING what she'd heard, she peddled her book. She ducked questions and waved the book around and said, "Read my book!" She might have done Michael a lot of good if she'd just spoken up. That was my opinion at the time and it hasn't changed.

http://www.amazon.com/Redemption-Michael-Jackson-Molestation-Allegations/dp/1576880362
 
Autumn II said:
The source of the first extortion claim was Geraldine Hughes, who was the legal secretary to Evan's lawyer. I believe she was interviewed by Mary Fischer, who used that information in her article. Hughes went on to write a book called Redemption: The Truth about the Michael Jackson Molestation Allegations, where she gave her account of what she overheard in the law-office. But then, she was disappointing when she went on tv for various interviews. Instead of TELLING what she'd heard, she peddled her book. She ducked questions and waved the book around and said, "Read my book!" She might have done Michael a lot of good if she'd just spoken up. That was my opinion at the time and it hasn't changed.

http://www.amazon.com/Redemption-Michael-Jackson-Molestation-Allegations/dp/1576880362
Click to expand...

Interesting that she could be the source. Thank you.
 
I agree with you Autumn II she should have told what she heard. Telling the ppls to read the book led them to believe that you made it up and it is not true that why it would have been best that she tell what she heard like you mention it would have help Michael.
 
So I've finished Ray Chandler's book about 20 minutes ago... and what a bizarre book it is. Taken in isolation, at times he can be sort of convincing, so I could see how some could be convinced. However, it gave me further questions. I saw a hater recommend the book to someone with words to the effect of 'you'll be totally convinced'. Unsurprising for a hater, I guess.

First off, like I thought long before reading the book, why the heck are you even writing a book about your nephew's supposed sexual abuse?

Ray tries to come across as more intelligent than Jackson defenders when he 'rebuts' for example what the likes of Mary Fischer says. He laughably tries to get the reader to feel pity for the Chandlers and Jordy because Mary Fischer wrote an article about the situation several months after the settlement.

The GQ article opened wounds that had barely begun to heal. Jordie wanted nothing more than to shed his identity as 'the Jackson kid' and be a normal teenager. That was difficult enough to accomplish without the likes of Mary Fischer dredging the story back into the public eye, especially in such a negative manner.
Click to expand...

Yet, Ray sees no issue in him writing a book and 'dredging the story back into the public eye'. He even tried to get his book originally published DAYS after the settlement. Yet it's the terrible Mary Fischer opening wounds 'that had barely begun to heal'? Laughable!

Judith Regan on Ray trying to publish the book days after the settlement:


Then when Jordy is an adult, he finally publishes his book and in doing so is 'dredging the story back into the public eye'. Just wtf?

He also made public appearances in the 90s and around the time of the 2005 case. How the heck could this supposed victim ever 'heal' when his Uncle constantly kept bringing it up(?)

Ray said in an interview Jordy wouldn't testify as he was 'sick of it' and Ray blamed the media... yet Ray is sat being interviewed bringing yet more attention to him.

Ray defends Evan going for money immediately to protect Jordy from a a criminal trial. Yet, Evan was happy to put Jordy through a possible civil trial in which MJ's defence team could of ripped him to pieces.

Although Evan was certain Michael's actions toward Jordie were harmful, he still did not believe them to be intentional. As twisted as Michael was, Evan believed Michael genuinely cared about Jordie.
Click to expand...

Evan wanted to meet MJ without lawyers and felt 'I really thought we could work it out'.

Your son 'confessed' to being molested and you think you can work it out?! You don't believe MJ was intentionally harming your son? Just what the heck? The book, at times, is bizarre.

Like as has been said by people before, a simple 'yes' was enough for Evan when Jordy 'confessed'. Which is ridiculous.
Then meeting MJ he hugs him rather than knocking his brains.

Ray also claimed in the book that Evan offered MJ to take a lie detector test to which Pellicano refused and said he could help MJ beat the test easily. This supposed denying to take a lie detector test adds to the 'guilt'. However, this doesn't make sense.

Evan had fears what MJ was doing to Jordy, Jordy confesses, and with Jordy sat next to him Evan offers MJ to take a lie detector test in which, if MJ is telling the truth about his relationship with Jordy, that'd be the end of it?! It's another contradiction. His son has confessed so why would he ask MJ to take a lie detector test unless he doubted his own son?!

Yet another flaw to the story is that Evan's phone at his dental practice was being watched by police due to supposed death threats (death threats that bad Ray wants to sell a book and Evan make a music album, which Ray never mentions in the book) when a woman from Germany rings Evan. She says her son was molested by MJ and a therapist advised her to not do anything. Her and Evan chatted and Evan offered to pay for her flight over to the US and to go to the police with her. She turned down this offer. So what on earth did she even supposedly ring for?! Add to that, the police did nothing despite watching the phone?!

Ray also likes to cite how Jordy accurately described MJ's genitalia. Yet he says in the book there were numerous distinctive markings and discolourations. However, as we know, Sneddon says there was a marking 'in about the same relative location'.

There's many more contradictions, but this has been along enough post. The book is downright puzzling.
 
I actually rarely see haters mention it. They sooner will recommend something by Diane Dimond or Victor Gutierrez and I can see why. That book is a total embarrassment for the Chandler side IMO. Maybe simpletons can be fooled by it, but in a court it would be the Chandlers' downfall. I think even if you do not know anything else (things that straight up expose the many lies in the book) there are many red flags in it for anyone who is an independent thinker and can think critically. But then if you even have all the background info for the case it totally sinks the Chandler case and IMO Mez would have had a field day with that book in court if he could have put Ray Chandler on the stand. No wonder Ray was running scared from that opportunity.

Like you said it's ridiculous to claim the Chandlers were traumatized by the pulicity because of Mary Fischer's article when they themselves constantly seeked publicity - both before and after the Fischer article. Not only Judith Reagan claims that they were looking for a book deal after the settlement, but Ray Chandler himself admitted it in his motion in 2004. Also I am pretty sure they were in contact with the National Enquirer all through 1993 and 1994 because some of the stories in the NE from that time are the same as stories in Ray's book - down to the exact same use of expressions and words. For example, there is that story about MJ supposedly having another boy (Brett Barnes) on his lap in a car where Jordan and June were there as well and according to the book MJ gave him "soft and lingering kisses" . Now, acc. to the book this was witnessed by June. However June when asked about this trip in court in 2005 never mentions "soft and lingering kisses", nor that anything made her feel uncomfortable about that trip. Moreover she testified that Brett sat next to MJ not on his lap. So her version already contradicts Ray's in the book.

But the bottom line here is that interestingly enough the expression "soft and lingering kisses" is both in Ray's book in 2004 and in a NE article in 1993. The story could have only come from the Chandlers since June was the supposed witness of the supposed scene. Although in the NE article there is no mention of June being the witness, but there is in Ray's book. And this is not the only story that the Chandlers fed their fave tabloid the National Enquirer with. I think many of the NE articles at the time came from them.

No wonder that in 2004 Ray complimented the NE as a publication who gave a correct picture of the case in 1993/94. The National Enquirer! Can you imagine that? LOL. But of course they are praising them when they were their mouthpiece.

Then when Evan sued MJ again in 1996 they were again trying to stir as much publicity for the case as possible. I have a court document from that case. It was written by Lisa Marie Presley's lawyer because she too was deposed in that case. Her lawyer complains in it that Evan Chandler called the media on her when she went to court to give her deposition and how Evan Chandler is trying to publicize the case to the media and trying to create great publicity for it. Not to mention the fact that Ray was doing his media rounds at time too, as well as in 2003-2005. But they were traumatized by publicity, alright.

Yet another flaw to the story is that Evan's phone at his dental practice was being watched by police due to supposed death threats (death threats that bad Ray wants to sell a book and Evan make a music album, which Ray never mentions in the book) when a woman from Germany rings Evan. She says her son was molested by MJ and a therapist advised her to not do anything. Her and Evan chatted and Evan offered to pay for her flight over to the US and to go to the police with her. She turned down this offer. So what on earth did she even supposedly ring for?! Add to that, the police did nothing despite watching the phone?!
Click to expand...

1) Why would anyone call Evan with that information rather than the police?
2) And why wouldn't Evan tip off the police about this supposed call if it was true? They could have easily found the woman - as they were in desperate need of other "victims" and investigators roamed the world fishing for alleged victims globally.
3) What kind of therapist would it be that advises someone not to do anything when her son is molested? That's against the law because therapists are required to report it themselves if they suspect child abuse.

Yet another story from that book which is nonsense.
 
respect77 said:
I actually rarely see haters mention it. They sooner will recommend something by Diane Dimond or Victor Gutierrez and I can see why. That book is a total embarrassment for the Chandler side IMO. Maybe simpletons can be fooled by it, but in a court it would be the Chandlers' downfall. I think even if you do not know anything else (things that straight up expose the many lies in the book) there are many red flags in it for anyone who is an independent thinker and can think critically. But then if you even have all the background info for the case it totally sinks the Chandler case and IMO Mez would have had a field day with that book in court if he could have put Ray Chandler on the stand. No wonder Ray was running scared from that opportunity.

Like you said it's ridiculous to claim the Chandlers were traumatized by the pulicity because of Mary Fischer's article when they themselves constantly seeked publicity - both before and after the Fischer article. Not only Judith Reagan claims that they were looking for a book deal after the settlement, but Ray Chandler himself admitted it in his motion in 2004. Also I am pretty sure they were in contact with the National Enquirer all through 1993 and 1994 because some of the stories in the NE from that time are the same as stories in Ray's book - down to the exact same use of expressions and words. For example, there is that story about MJ supposedly having another boy (Brett Barnes) on his lap in a car where Jordan and June were there as well and according to the book MJ gave him "soft and lingering kisses" . Now, acc. to the book this was witnessed by June. However June when asked about this trip in court in 2005 never mentions "soft and lingering kisses", nor that anything made her feel uncomfortable about that trip. Moreover she testified that Brett sat next to MJ not on his lap. So her version already contradicts Ray's in the book.

But the bottom line here is that interestingly enough the expression "soft and lingering kisses" is both in Ray's book in 2004 and in a NE article in 1993. The story could have only come from the Chandlers since June was the supposed witness of the supposed scene. Although in the NE article there is no mention of June being the witness, but there is in Ray's book. And this is not the only story that the Chandlers fed their fave tabloid the National Enquirer with. I think many of the NE articles at the time came from them.

No wonder that in 2004 Ray complimented the NE as a publication who gave a correct picture of the case in 1993/94. The National Enquirer! Can you imagine that? LOL. But of course they are praising them when they were their mouthpiece.

Then when Evan sued MJ again in 1996 they were again trying to stir as much publicity for the case as possible. I have a court document from that case. It was written by Lisa Marie Presley's lawyer because she too was deposed in that case. Her lawyer complains in it that Evan Chandler called the media on her when she went to court to give her deposition and how Evan Chandler is trying to publicize the case to the media and trying to create great publicity for it. Not to mention the fact that Ray was doing his media rounds at time too, as well as in 2003-2005. But they were traumatized by publicity, alright.



1) Why would anyone call Evan with that information rather than the police?
2) And why wouldn't Evan tip off the police about this supposed call if it was true? They could have easily found the woman - as they were in desperate need of other "victims" and investigators roamed the world fishing for alleged victims globally.
3) What kind of therapist would it be that advises someone not to do anything when her son is molested? That's against the law because therapists are required to report it themselves if they suspect child abuse.

Yet another story from that book which is nonsense.
Click to expand...

It was the first time I had seen a hater recommend the book to anyone. I do wonder whether part of it is to do with the description Jordy gave. No hater, that I've seen, EVER cites what Ray says Jordy described. They constantly go with the Sneddon one which is flawed.

The book is bizarre especially about the Chandlers' and publicity. Ray tries to put across a case of, in a nutshell, 'we went for a settlement from the get go due to the harm a trial could cause Jordy'... but their actions don't show that.

Yeah, the German woman episode is weird. There are too many flaws to it.

Two other parts of the book, off the top of my head, stick out to me. One is June telling Ray her thoughts on MJ after she 'changed her mind about abuse'. When Ray asked her if MJ was nice to her, she responded with 'Unbelievably nice! The best guy. If he just didn't do that it would be perfect.' ... Is that really what you'd be saying about the man who molested your son? I mean, 'if he just didn't do that' feels like something you'd say about a minor issue not child abuse! Maybe I'm reading too much into it.

The other thing was Ray talking about the masturbation. Jordy told Dr. Gardner that everything else like kissing stopped once the masturbation started. Ray says

In other words, the kissing and hugging stopped once the masturbating started. No tenderness, no foreplay, just sex for sex sake. Manipulation for self-gratification.
Click to expand...

I was like, wtf? It comes across as if Ray is saying if supposed kissing had continued it wouldn't of been so bad.
 
Last edited:
I wanted to make this a separate post. Ray's wording at times left me thinking if this was all one big joke to him. Some of the things he said:

What I found weird was what Ray called the people involved. He gave the names of the people involved at the start of the book in a list. He didn't put 'Parties involved' or 'People involved'. Ray put 'cast of characters'. Is this one big fairy tale?

The eccentric yet benevolent zillionaire rescues the cherubic child and his adoring mother from the evil stepfather. A fairytale-come-true. Disneyesque.
Except for one small detail.
Click to expand...

He takes the piss throughout.

If the description matched the police photos it was one more giant straw on the camel's back that was Michael's defense. And the poor beast was already swayback.
Click to expand...

Another joke about a serious matter.

At the end of the climax to the case and a settlement being reached he says
'The scandal was now HIStory'.
Click to expand...

Just before that he says [/quote]'Bolstered by the anticipation of victory - more for the privacy it would bring than the money - the Chandlers began to relax.[/quote]

Victory? I'd hardly call it victory when my nephew has been supposedly molested, FFS.

Most alarming to me was the following in regards to trips to Disney Land. MJ would bring them publicity and in return they'd open up the park at night and provide accommodation. Ray says:

Disney, of course, returned the favour by providing luxurious accomodations for Michael and his entourage. Jordie was molested in the finest Mickey had to offer, from Florida to France. (Unbeknownst to Disney, of course).
Click to expand...

Seriously? 'molested in the finest Mickey had to offer'. There's too many times he doesn't take it seriously which rings alarm bells for me.

One from Evan as well:

Regarding meetings with a lawyer:

Evan believed that Jordie should attend as many discussions as possible. After all, it was his life they were talking about. 'I wanted him to see how the game is played and how each player operates, so he would never again be duped'
Click to expand...

Your son has been molested and you decide to bring him with you to discussions with a lawyer 'to see how the game is played' and 'so he would never again be duped'. As if blaming the kid for this supposed abuse.
 
The way Evan/Ray talks about Jordan is very creepy at times. Here is another that I felt was creepy:

“By mid-October the Chandler’s could be reasonably assured of walking out of their front door without having a camera staring them in the face. Which meant that Jordie was able to play in the front yard or across the street at a friend’s house. To look at him, he seemed without a care, running and laughing like any other kid. But to those who knew him well, there was much inner conflict.

In Jordie’s small circle of friends there were boys and girls, but as of yet, la difference seemed to be of no interest to him. Then one day his friend’s eleven-year-old cousin came to play — a dark, slim beauty with big brown eyes. Jordie was smitten. And apparently the feeling was mutual. She returned the next day, and then the next, and soon they were spending much of their days together.

“He would do stuff,” Evan explained. “Like throw a stick to show her how macho he was. And then she’d remark how far he’d thrown it and act impressed. Sometimes they’d go off on their own, just a few houses away, and sit on the lawn and talk. The other kids would giggle and make fun of them. What a relief!”

“What do you think of her?” Evan asked his son, after watching the relationship blossom for several weeks. “I want to kiss her,” Jordie replied. But we might get in trouble with her mother. She’s too young.” And he was right. Not too young to kiss, perhaps, but too young to establish a more intimate bond — which I’m sure is what he had in mind.

Being the gentleman that he is, Jordie controlled his desires and learned an important lesson, for his patience was soon rewarded. A day or so later a new, older girl appeared on the block. “Hey, Pops,” Jordie exclaimed, “look at her, she’s beautiful!” And that she was. A sweet kid, too. They “dated” for over a year.” [9; page 188-189]
Click to expand...

Why the hell does he discuss his son's love/sex life like that?

"Not too young to kiss, perhaps, but too young to establish a more intimate bond — which I’m sure is what he had in mind."

"Jordie controlled his desires"

WTF? To me it's just creepy. He is talking about a 13-year-old! Evan was such a creep.
 
respect77;4139266 said:
The way Evan/Ray talks about Jordan is very creepy at times. Here is another that I felt was creepy:



Why the hell does he discuss his son's love/sex life like that?

"Not too young to kiss, perhaps, but too young to establish a more intimate bond — which I’m sure is what he had in mind."

"Jordie controlled his desires"

WTF? To me it's just creepy. He is talking about a 13-year-old! Evan was such a creep.
Click to expand...

Yep. And that leads to another point. Jordy going to play a few houses away all of a sudden. At one stage Jordy and the family needed this all to end as the death threats were awful. How Jordy couldn't go out. Then in October Ray says Jordy was able to play on the front lawn and go out with friends. All of a sudden, out of no where, he's alright to be alone. Yet he says later these supposed death threats continued. Claiming dead animals left on the door step... yet Jordy is let out?!
 
It reminds me, them being creepy about Jordy, I can't remember her name now, but didn't an actress write in her book her being a dental patient of Evan? And she said Evan said, and I'm paraphrasing here, 'my son is a very good looking boy' and gave her a creepy smile.
 
Bad7 said:
I wanted to make this a separate post. Ray's wording at times left me thinking if this was all one big joke to him. Some of the things he said:

What I found weird was what Ray called the people involved. He gave the names of the people involved at the start of the book in a list. He didn't put 'Parties involved' or 'People involved'. Ray put 'cast of characters'. Is this one big fairy tale?



He takes the piss throughout.



Another joke about a serious matter.

At the end of the climax to the case and a settlement being reached he says

Just before that he says 'Bolstered by the anticipation of victory - more for the privacy it would bring than the money - the Chandlers began to relax.

Victory? I'd hardly call it victory when my nephew has been supposedly molested, FFS.

Most alarming to me was the following in regards to trips to Disney Land. MJ would bring them publicity and in return they'd open up the park at night and provide accommodation. Ray says:



Seriously? 'molested in the finest Mickey had to offer'. There's too many times he doesn't take it seriously which rings alarm bells for me.

One from Evan as well:

Regarding meetings with a lawyer:



Your son has been molested and you decide to bring him with you to discussions with a lawyer 'to see how the game is played' and 'so he would never again be duped'. As if blaming the kid for this supposed abuse.
Click to expand...


I am pretty sure Evan and Ray had fun with making up their tale. It certainly sounds like they think this is all fun. That type of thing with Mickey mouse and stuff is something that tabloids would write not the family member of a supposedly violated and deeply wounded child.

I think Evan considered this whole story the script of his lifetime. It certainly brought them more money than the ones he wrote for movies.
 
Bad7;4139267 said:
Yep. And that leads to another point. Jordy going to play a few houses away all of a sudden. At one stage Jordy and the family needed this all to end as the death threats were awful. How Jordy couldn't go out. Then in October Ray says Jordy was able to play on the front lawn and go out with friends. All of a sudden, out of no where, he's alright to be alone. Yet he says later these supposed death threats continued. Claiming dead animals left on the door step... yet Jordy is let out?!
Click to expand...

Yes, exactly. This is October 1993, so only two months after the allegations went public, in fact at the height of the whole frenzy and it turns out Jordan was perfectly able to move around the neighborhood normally, there was no one threatening his life or no danger why he could not move out of the house. Yet they are supposedly so threatened that they had to rather push for a settlement than going to trial. Alright.

Bad7;4139269 said:
It reminds me, them being creepy about Jordy, I can't remember her name now, but didn't an actress write in her book her being a dental patient of Evan? And she said Evan said, and I'm paraphrasing here, 'my son is a very good looking boy' and gave her a creepy smile.
Click to expand...

Yes, Carrie Fisher.

“But remember that dentist who sued Michael for molesting his kid?
Yes, that was my dentist. Evan Chandler, D.D.S. Dentist to the Stars. And this same Dr. Chandler — long before the lawsuit was brought (though not necessarily before it was contemplated) — needed someone to brag to about his son’s burgeoning friendship with Michael Jackson. (This was years before Michael had children of his own.) And so my “dentist” would go on and on about how much his son liked Michael Jackson and, more important, how much Michael Jackson liked his son. And the most disturbing thing I remember him saying was, “You know, my son is very good looking.”
Now I ask you—what father talks about his child that way? Well, maybe some do but (a) I don’t know them, and (b) they probably aren’t raising an eyebrow and looking suggestive when they say it. Over the years I’ve heard many proud fathers tell me, “My son is great,” or “My kid is adorable,” but this was the only time I’d ever heard this particular boast:
“My son [unlike most average male offspring] is VERY [unsettling smile, raised eyebrows, maybe even a lewd wink] good-looking [pause for you to reflect and/or puke].”
It was grotesque! This man was letting me know that he had this valuable thing that he assumed Michael Jackson wanted, and it happened to be his son. But it wasn’t who his son was, it was what he was: “good-looking.” [6]



​
A couple of months later, Fisher writes, Evan Chandler announced to her that he was going to sue Jackson for sleeping in the same bed as his son. Fisher shares some thoughts about his accusation:


“Now, I know for a fact that when this first started happening, the good doctor saw no problem with this odd bunking! Excuse me, he had been creepy enough to have allowed all this to happen, and now he’s suddenly shocked—shocked!—virtually consumed with moral indignation! “Can you believe it? I think Michael may have even put his hand on my child’s privates.” Well, what was this man thinking in the first place? Why did he encourage him to sleep in the same bed as Michael Jackson to begin with? He did it because he knew, somewhere, he would eventually be able to say, “Oh, my God! I suddenly realize that this thing between Michael and my son is weird. I’m horrified. My son may have been damaged! And the only thing that can repair this damage is many millions of dollars! Then he’ll be okay! And we’re not going to buy anything for ourselves with that money! It’s all going toward our son being okay!!!” This was around the time that I knew I had to find another dentist. No drug can hide the fact that one’s skin is crawling. The thing is, though, I never thought that Michael’s whole thing with kids was sexual. Never. Granted, it was miles from appropriate, but just because it wasn’t normal doesn’t mean that it had to be perverse. Those aren’t the only two choices for what can happen between an adult and an unrelated child spending time together. Even if that adult has had too much plastic surgery and what would appear to be tattooed makeup on his face. And yes, he had an amusement park, a zoo, a movie theater, popcorn, candy, and an elephant. But to draw a line under all that and add it up to the assumption that he fiendishly rubbed his hands together as he assembled this giant super spiderweb to lure and trap kids into it is just bad math.



[…]



But wait! Check this out! Let’s say your “really good-looking son” started hanging out with this odd-looking famous multi-multimillionaire that could maybe be persuaded to give you twenty-two million dollars if you threatened to tell everyone in the world that he touched your son’s underage, maybe-not- even-fully-grown-yet member. Well, I don’t know what you’d do? But when my dentist was presented with a choice between integrity and twenty-two million dollars, you’ll never guess what he did! That’s right—he went for the cash! But hey, he was only human-ish, right? But really, who could blame him? I mean, besides you and me and anyone else alive who cares about ruining their kid’s life, who else could blame Dr. Chandler for what he did? (I’ll wait while you think.)” [6]​
Click to expand...

BTW, this is another tidbit that proves the Chandler book is full of lies and exaggerations and half-truths. The Chandlers book mentions Fisher but the story there is totally different. It describes Evan as being worried about the relationship and sharing his worries with Fisher out of concern. However, Fisher had a totally different impression of Evan in her book.

BTW, Carrie Fisher also has something to say about Mark Torbiner (without naming him, but it's clearly him):

“But getting back to the special medical access I mentioned earlier, I had this dentist at the time, a Dr. Evan Chandler, who was a very strange character. He was what would be referred to as the Dentist to the Stars! And as one of the people who would have unnecessary dental work just for the morphine, this man was one of those people who could arrange such a welcome service. He referred his patients to a mobile anesthesiologist who would come into the office to put you out for the dental work. And as if that wasn’t glorious enough, this anesthesiologist could also be easily and financially persuaded to come to your house to administer the morphine for your subsequent luxury pain relief. And I would extend my arms, veins akimbo, and say to this man—“Send me away, but don’t send me all the way.” [6]
Click to expand...
 
respect77 said:
I am pretty sure Evan and Ray had fun with making up their tale. It certainly sounds like they think this is all fun. That type of thing with Mickey mouse and stuff is something that tabloids would write not the family member of a supposedly violated and deeply wounded child.

I think Evan considered this whole story the script of his lifetime. It certainly brought them more money than the ones he wrote for movies.
Click to expand...

You know, I had the same thinking was it one big script? Especially 'cast of characters' at the start of the book. That's really not the wording I would of used. There are far too many times in which things aren't taken seriously.

I especially also love how Ray paints the picture of Evan not wanting a dime of the money and it all being for Jordy, as if to paint the picture of taking money not being so bad... yet Evan got money in the settlement and constantly haggled Jordy for money after the settlement.
 
Bad7 said:
It reminds me, them being creepy about Jordy, I can't remember her name now, but didn't an actress write in her book her being a dental patient of Evan? And she said Evan said, and I'm paraphrasing here, 'my son is a very good looking boy' and gave her a creepy smile.
Click to expand...
Carrie Fisher, Debbie Reynolds' daughter AKA Princess Leia.
I haven't read the book and probably won't ever, but everytime I see an excerpt, it makes me laugh. Because it makes them such obvious con artists and extortionists.
Nobody in their right mind would act like this. Ever.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top