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elusive moonwalker
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Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
Yes the footage of earth song and the way u .... From the film is in already.so we are back where we started before the defence started playing games.pros footage from 23 and 24 showing mj happy etc and no rebuttal footage from the defence as they wanted.so good news.
Yes the footage of earth song and the way u .... From the film is in already.so we are back where we started before the defence started playing games.pros footage from 23 and 24 showing mj happy etc and no rebuttal footage from the defence as they wanted.so good news.
Annita
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maral
Proud Member
Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
is it really a good news? i thought the prosecution had found more footage that showed he was healthy......
is it really a good news? i thought the prosecution had found more footage that showed he was healthy......
elusive moonwalker
Guests
Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
They are already showing the footage they originally wanted to show showing mj happy etc.the rest only came about cause of the defence wanting to show negative footage.the judge said there is no negative footage so the pros dont need to show anymore positive footage than they already are. The ruling stops another defence theory right in its tracks.if the judge had allowed the defence footage in it would have allowed the defence to push the mj was ill before theory now they cant.so yes its good news ad we have film footage showing mj happy and no rebutal from the defence
They are already showing the footage they originally wanted to show showing mj happy etc.the rest only came about cause of the defence wanting to show negative footage.the judge said there is no negative footage so the pros dont need to show anymore positive footage than they already are. The ruling stops another defence theory right in its tracks.if the judge had allowed the defence footage in it would have allowed the defence to push the mj was ill before theory now they cant.so yes its good news ad we have film footage showing mj happy and no rebutal from the defence
8701girl
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Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
I don't understand why they want to use hours and hours of footage to prove Michael's health. Anybody can see just by watching 2 minute clips that his health sure as hell was not poor. Any 50 year old man with such "poor health" like what's been described since his death could not get up on stage and perform the way he did! Michael was 50 years old, yes he probably had SOME health problems. Most 50 year olds do, whether it's severe or minor. But Michael Jackson's health condition could not have been that severe if he were still able to perform the way he did 25 years ago. I have family who are 50 or in their early 50's and they sure as hell can't do what Michael Jackson was doing at 50.
The judge said it was a "waste of his time" watching all of that footage and I have to agree. One only has to watch 2 minutes of footage to make a clear judgment. This hoopla over the footage is taking away the main focus of the trial and it may throw the jury off because the attorneys on both sides are so focused on hours of footage that isn't even necessary to be shown. It's not necessary to show 12 hours of footage of Michael performing to prove his good health. If this going to be the prosecutors' strongest piece of evidence then I'm going to be very concerned. Both sides should be working on bringing as many witnesses as they can who were around Michael in his final days.
I don't understand why they want to use hours and hours of footage to prove Michael's health. Anybody can see just by watching 2 minute clips that his health sure as hell was not poor. Any 50 year old man with such "poor health" like what's been described since his death could not get up on stage and perform the way he did! Michael was 50 years old, yes he probably had SOME health problems. Most 50 year olds do, whether it's severe or minor. But Michael Jackson's health condition could not have been that severe if he were still able to perform the way he did 25 years ago. I have family who are 50 or in their early 50's and they sure as hell can't do what Michael Jackson was doing at 50.
The judge said it was a "waste of his time" watching all of that footage and I have to agree. One only has to watch 2 minutes of footage to make a clear judgment. This hoopla over the footage is taking away the main focus of the trial and it may throw the jury off because the attorneys on both sides are so focused on hours of footage that isn't even necessary to be shown. It's not necessary to show 12 hours of footage of Michael performing to prove his good health. If this going to be the prosecutors' strongest piece of evidence then I'm going to be very concerned. Both sides should be working on bringing as many witnesses as they can who were around Michael in his final days.
elusive moonwalker
Guests
Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
The pros wrre only intrested in showing earth song and twymmf.it was the defence that caused the 16hr footage issue.the pros needed to beable to defend mj if the defence were given the go ahead to make claims about mj.luckily they werent
The pros wrre only intrested in showing earth song and twymmf.it was the defence that caused the 16hr footage issue.the pros needed to beable to defend mj if the defence were given the go ahead to make claims about mj.luckily they werent
elusive moonwalker
Guests
Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
http://teammichaeljackson.com/people-v-conrad-murray-7-25-11
transcipts of the hearing.appreciate if someone could summerize as im off to work
http://teammichaeljackson.com/people-v-conrad-murray-7-25-11
transcipts of the hearing.appreciate if someone could summerize as im off to work
elusive moonwalker
Guests
Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
Read the transcript.some intrestings things.one flannagan seems to have taken a leaf out of katherines aeg lawsuit saying the meeting around the 18 was were mj was threatened with the shows being pulled etc ie what katherine claims.while ortega claims it was he that was accused with murray saying mjs fine.wonder if flanagan has anyone to testify about that.thanks jacksons for that.
The defences problem re the days mj was absent and the judge saying u cant second guess why mj was not there and say thats not evidence of him being ill and footage of him being there and not performing isnt evidence of illness.and i like how the judge said what matters is the footage from the last two days and nothing else.as mj was in great form on the 24th and hrs later he was gone and footage before that is
irrelevent.the defences problem is that the last footage we have shows mj in great form.so if mj was ill cause of klien whatever it was left mjs system before the 23rd.the defence argument would only work if mj were ill in the last footage.also see how the defence twist the comment where walgren says they mention hes wrapoed in a blanket has the shakes.yet the footage the pros saw didnt show that.
My concern like what the pros kinda mentioned is this.are the defence going to be allowed to bring up the missed rehearsals and say he was like this when he was there.obviously the missed rehearsals can be rebutted by saying he wasnt needed that day etc but if the defence say he was basicalky wrapped up how can the pros rebuke that without showing footage
some of the judges comments make u think hes doing a good job like he says hes putting a stop to all the talk of mj health interms of the footage in the days and weeks before as its irrelevent and the case is about the last hrs and nothing more.yet in the other breath u get the impression hes gonna let the defence still go down that route with testimony about klien etc
and is the last bit about 4-6 weeks the timeframe for the entire trial or just the pros case.it kinda jumped to talking about the date for the next hearing which confused me abit
Read the transcript.some intrestings things.one flannagan seems to have taken a leaf out of katherines aeg lawsuit saying the meeting around the 18 was were mj was threatened with the shows being pulled etc ie what katherine claims.while ortega claims it was he that was accused with murray saying mjs fine.wonder if flanagan has anyone to testify about that.thanks jacksons for that.
The defences problem re the days mj was absent and the judge saying u cant second guess why mj was not there and say thats not evidence of him being ill and footage of him being there and not performing isnt evidence of illness.and i like how the judge said what matters is the footage from the last two days and nothing else.as mj was in great form on the 24th and hrs later he was gone and footage before that is
irrelevent.the defences problem is that the last footage we have shows mj in great form.so if mj was ill cause of klien whatever it was left mjs system before the 23rd.the defence argument would only work if mj were ill in the last footage.also see how the defence twist the comment where walgren says they mention hes wrapoed in a blanket has the shakes.yet the footage the pros saw didnt show that.
My concern like what the pros kinda mentioned is this.are the defence going to be allowed to bring up the missed rehearsals and say he was like this when he was there.obviously the missed rehearsals can be rebutted by saying he wasnt needed that day etc but if the defence say he was basicalky wrapped up how can the pros rebuke that without showing footage
some of the judges comments make u think hes doing a good job like he says hes putting a stop to all the talk of mj health interms of the footage in the days and weeks before as its irrelevent and the case is about the last hrs and nothing more.yet in the other breath u get the impression hes gonna let the defence still go down that route with testimony about klien etc
and is the last bit about 4-6 weeks the timeframe for the entire trial or just the pros case.it kinda jumped to talking about the date for the next hearing which confused me abit
elusive moonwalker
Guests
Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
Totally. Its all about mj.flanagans desperations shows through in the transcript and the judges frustration at his desperate attempts.although its no use if the judge lets him go there
Totally. Its all about mj.flanagans desperations shows through in the transcript and the judges frustration at his desperate attempts.although its no use if the judge lets him go there
elusive moonwalker
Guests
Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
I do wonder if the defence will file another motion to try and stop the 23/24th footage coming in.thats the impression they give
I do wonder if the defence will file another motion to try and stop the 23/24th footage coming in.thats the impression they give
JMie
Guests
Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
Elusive thanks for the summary. The defense is desperate to find smith but they are failing and it's a good thing
Elusive thanks for the summary. The defense is desperate to find smith but they are failing and it's a good thing
maral
Proud Member
Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
thank you for the explanation and the summery
thank you for the explanation and the summery
Justthefacts
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Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
The only person who could testify about that so called riot act is Conrad Murray. He Ortega, Phillips, Dileo and Michael were there. Now lets just say they try to call Karen Faye well that is hearsay. Why did he miss rehearsals again the only person who can answer that is Murray. But Faye on the stand show her face book writings and she will falter.
The only person who could testify about that so called riot act is Conrad Murray. He Ortega, Phillips, Dileo and Michael were there. Now lets just say they try to call Karen Faye well that is hearsay. Why did he miss rehearsals again the only person who can answer that is Murray. But Faye on the stand show her face book writings and she will falter.
elusive moonwalker
Guests
Yeah realistically u would need someone who was at that meeting.as it gets into hearsay.although im not sure if it would be if faye talks directly about what kenny told her and doest testify about what others said at the meeting.didnt faye say she wasnt asked to be a witness.or thats the last thing i read. Although the defence dont need a witnesd they can just question kenny about this and say isnt this what really happenend.because what kenny says about murray shouting at him saying mj is fine is very damaging so the defence need another reason as to why that meeting happened and thanks to the jacksons the defence have one
Vici
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Notes from a fan who was inside the courtroom.
"
Court hearing with Prosecution, Defense and SONY representatives. No Murray, no family.
The Judge began by saying he had been to SONY on the same day as the last court hearing, from approx. 1-6.30pm (Wednesday July 20th) and had reviewed 3 hours of material and that SONY filed a motion to quash the subpoena against them the next day.
The Judge added that he then went home (after reviewing the material, Wednesday July 20th) and looked online for any media report regarding that day’s court hearing. He found two interviews made by the Defense (Flanagan) and decided to put a stop to any more viewing of the material on his part. He therefore cancelled his next viewing days (July 23rd and 24th) and called all parties on the phone to inform them of his decision.
The Defense (Flanagan) argued that the interviews he gave only conveyed his opinion that “even on his bad days, he (Michael) was talented” and that over the 100+ hours of footage they reviewed, nothing looked “off”. (Let’s bear in mind that SONY had already chosen which footage they would allow both parties to review!)
Here is the defense breakdown of the footage that was selected from June 15th to June 24th:
June 15th: Michael was present but did not rehearse.
June 16th: Michael rehearsed.
June 17th: Michael rehearsed.
June 18th: Michael was present but did not rehearse.
June 19th: Michael was present but not rehearsing. Michael was wrapped up in blankets and then sent home.
June 20th: Randy Phillips, Kenny Ortega, Frank Dileo and Co. showed up at Carolwood threatening to “pull the plug because of his failure to co-operate”.
June 21st: Michael was absent from rehearsals.
June 22nd: Michael was absent from rehearsals.
June 23rd: Michael rehearsed.
June 24th: Michael rehearsed.
The Judge then asked the Defense if they were withdrawing the subpoena (subpoena to force SONY to release footage and use it in court). Defense said no but that allowing them to only view footage from June 15th- to June 25th when most of these day Michael is not rehearsing or present is unfair.
The Judge responded by arguing that only the 23rd and 24th of June should be the only relevant days, taking that Michael died a few hours later.
The judge then asked the Prosecution for their opinion. The prosecution answered that the footage from June 23rd to June 24th is indeed representative on Michael’s mental health, and so is the other footage they reviewed. They added that Michael was “engaged and involved” and “not curled up in blankets and “appeared healthy”. (?!?!?!?!).
The Judge continued by turning to SONY and asking them what THEIR opinion was on the matter.
SONY argued that showing ANY footage in court would be a problem and a risk because of potential future productions they may want to produce with the material and that this Michael Jackson footage is a commercial viability for them.
Prosecution then made a request of what footage dates they are requesting to use for court: 2 different tapes from June 16th, one from June 19th, one from June 23rd and one from June 24th.
Defense required June 18th, 19th and June 20th. Defense argues those dates are significant because of Michael’s either inability to perform (please check timeline further up).
The Defense made a point of adding hat if Michael was so healthy then why did he either not show up for rehearsals, be sent home or threatened to have the plugged pulled on the show. Flanagan added that the movie This Is It was a complete waste of time if it was to be shown in court because it was an “edited movie” and was not representative of the other days.
The Judge then made his decision after hearing all parties (Defense, Prosecution and SONY).
Motion to quash the subpoena granted in SONY’s favor! SONY representatives smiled and patted each other on the shoulders.
The Judge argued that the Defense’s motion to subpoena was a “fishing expedition” on their part and then commanded and praised SONY for their “willingness” to proceed the way they did and that they satisfied the interests of the Court and the People (?!). He then added that he had reviewed material that is very valuable to SONY and said “I’m not irresponsible in the interest of SONY”. (??!!!)
The Judge went on to say that despite the -350 million dollars Court deficit this year that SONY might still be entitled to a restitution for their efforts. (?!)
The Judge then told SONY representatives that they didn’t need to stay any longer in the court room, to which SONY replied: “We enjoy being here!” Laughter erupted in the court room. (???!!!!)
The Judge finished off by addressing the Defense, in particular Flanagan, regarding his interview on a top radio show where Flanagan made a comment about Michael’s “detractors” and exchanged some evidence. Flanagan argued that it was public record. The Judge said that his actions might be a violation and that he may issue a gag order and ended by saying “Be afraid”!
Samantha de Gosson
"
"
Court hearing with Prosecution, Defense and SONY representatives. No Murray, no family.
The Judge began by saying he had been to SONY on the same day as the last court hearing, from approx. 1-6.30pm (Wednesday July 20th) and had reviewed 3 hours of material and that SONY filed a motion to quash the subpoena against them the next day.
The Judge added that he then went home (after reviewing the material, Wednesday July 20th) and looked online for any media report regarding that day’s court hearing. He found two interviews made by the Defense (Flanagan) and decided to put a stop to any more viewing of the material on his part. He therefore cancelled his next viewing days (July 23rd and 24th) and called all parties on the phone to inform them of his decision.
The Defense (Flanagan) argued that the interviews he gave only conveyed his opinion that “even on his bad days, he (Michael) was talented” and that over the 100+ hours of footage they reviewed, nothing looked “off”. (Let’s bear in mind that SONY had already chosen which footage they would allow both parties to review!)
Here is the defense breakdown of the footage that was selected from June 15th to June 24th:
June 15th: Michael was present but did not rehearse.
June 16th: Michael rehearsed.
June 17th: Michael rehearsed.
June 18th: Michael was present but did not rehearse.
June 19th: Michael was present but not rehearsing. Michael was wrapped up in blankets and then sent home.
June 20th: Randy Phillips, Kenny Ortega, Frank Dileo and Co. showed up at Carolwood threatening to “pull the plug because of his failure to co-operate”.
June 21st: Michael was absent from rehearsals.
June 22nd: Michael was absent from rehearsals.
June 23rd: Michael rehearsed.
June 24th: Michael rehearsed.
The Judge then asked the Defense if they were withdrawing the subpoena (subpoena to force SONY to release footage and use it in court). Defense said no but that allowing them to only view footage from June 15th- to June 25th when most of these day Michael is not rehearsing or present is unfair.
The Judge responded by arguing that only the 23rd and 24th of June should be the only relevant days, taking that Michael died a few hours later.
The judge then asked the Prosecution for their opinion. The prosecution answered that the footage from June 23rd to June 24th is indeed representative on Michael’s mental health, and so is the other footage they reviewed. They added that Michael was “engaged and involved” and “not curled up in blankets and “appeared healthy”. (?!?!?!?!).
The Judge continued by turning to SONY and asking them what THEIR opinion was on the matter.
SONY argued that showing ANY footage in court would be a problem and a risk because of potential future productions they may want to produce with the material and that this Michael Jackson footage is a commercial viability for them.
Prosecution then made a request of what footage dates they are requesting to use for court: 2 different tapes from June 16th, one from June 19th, one from June 23rd and one from June 24th.
Defense required June 18th, 19th and June 20th. Defense argues those dates are significant because of Michael’s either inability to perform (please check timeline further up).
The Defense made a point of adding hat if Michael was so healthy then why did he either not show up for rehearsals, be sent home or threatened to have the plugged pulled on the show. Flanagan added that the movie This Is It was a complete waste of time if it was to be shown in court because it was an “edited movie” and was not representative of the other days.
The Judge then made his decision after hearing all parties (Defense, Prosecution and SONY).
Motion to quash the subpoena granted in SONY’s favor! SONY representatives smiled and patted each other on the shoulders.
The Judge argued that the Defense’s motion to subpoena was a “fishing expedition” on their part and then commanded and praised SONY for their “willingness” to proceed the way they did and that they satisfied the interests of the Court and the People (?!). He then added that he had reviewed material that is very valuable to SONY and said “I’m not irresponsible in the interest of SONY”. (??!!!)
The Judge went on to say that despite the -350 million dollars Court deficit this year that SONY might still be entitled to a restitution for their efforts. (?!)
The Judge then told SONY representatives that they didn’t need to stay any longer in the court room, to which SONY replied: “We enjoy being here!” Laughter erupted in the court room. (???!!!!)
The Judge finished off by addressing the Defense, in particular Flanagan, regarding his interview on a top radio show where Flanagan made a comment about Michael’s “detractors” and exchanged some evidence. Flanagan argued that it was public record. The Judge said that his actions might be a violation and that he may issue a gag order and ended by saying “Be afraid”!
Samantha de Gosson
"
elusive moonwalker
Guests
Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
If samanatha wants to report on the case for fans she needs to stick to the facts and not twist things cause she doesnt like sony.kinda pathetic that some would rather help murray cause they dont like sony etc.they need to get their priorites right
If samanatha wants to report on the case for fans she needs to stick to the facts and not twist things cause she doesnt like sony.kinda pathetic that some would rather help murray cause they dont like sony etc.they need to get their priorites right
Justthefacts
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Funny thing is that even after he was read this "riot" act he still miss two days of rehearsal. Fits better with Michael feeling off and taken off a few days
elusive moonwalker
Guests
Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
And keeps seeing klien.something doesnt fit
And keeps seeing klien.something doesnt fit
Ashtanga
Proud Member
Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
What will happen now? We will have more hearings?
What will happen now? We will have more hearings?
8701girl
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The Judge then told SONY representatives that they didn’t need to stay any longer in the court room, to which SONY replied: “We enjoy being here!” Laughter erupted in the court room. (???!!!!)
HUH? What the heck!!!???
is it just me or does it seem to like they making fun of mj !?
HUH? What the heck!!!???
is it just me or does it seem to like they making fun of mj !?
Justthefacts
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Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
It is you it is a joke because they didn't want to be there
It is you it is a joke because they didn't want to be there
elusive moonwalker
Guests
Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
Yeah it was a joke nothing more
Yeah it was a joke nothing more
Ashtanga
Proud Member
Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
Yes... But a court is no place to play and jokes. It is a serious place which deals with serious questions. Well, I envy these people because they can get some fun of this whole thing. Very sad and bizarre.
Yes... But a court is no place to play and jokes. It is a serious place which deals with serious questions. Well, I envy these people because they can get some fun of this whole thing. Very sad and bizarre.
elusive moonwalker
Guests
Re: july 25th hearing 0830pst
Well that the U.S system for you.the whole court system is seen as nothing but entertainment seeing as how its run
Well that the U.S system for you.the whole court system is seen as nothing but entertainment seeing as how its run