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quote saying new album sounds like off the wall for todays generation?

Invincible was a great album in many ways.. Not in EVERY way though..

If you comaire it to anything by any other album released in 2001.. Shoot, even ever since, it's the best piece of music.

Michael did allow others to control Invincible too much.. Michael wanted to do something cutting edge, experimenting with instraments that cannot be duplicated, ripped off. This turns to digital sounds when you tell someone like ROdney Jerkins this. Michael was very worried (he even said this) because of pirating was getting big in 2001, that he gets a sound that cannot be ripped easily.. The way things are leaked are not always how people think.. Technology has a lot to do with it..

Michael with this album is just writting a great album.. That's it.

In my opinion Michael is always ahead of his time in sounds/music. I think Invincible was a bit to ahead of its time for that generation.. If you listen to music coming out today.. (just starting to explode) it's taking those digital sounds. Britney Spears, Janet Jackson, etc.. The list is long.. Michael took the first dive into it and it was a bit early, people were not ready for it.. If Invincible were to be released today it would sell much more.. Even with the same crapy promotion.
 
like i said, this is turning into another Invincible bash fest and isnt really on topic anyways.
 
KOPV said:
If you comaire it to anything by any other album released in 2001.. Shoot, even ever since, it's the best piece of music.
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i have to strongly disagree with you there. during that period we had the mainstream boom of Neo-Soul, thanks largely to Lauryn Hill's masterpiece solo album in 1999 followed by numerous commercially-successful and Grammy-winning artists like D'Angelo, Erykah Badu, Alicia Keys, Angie Stone, Jill Scott, Musiq. not to mention related acts like Jamiroquai.

Mike worked this perfectly through Butterflies and even Break Of Dawn. he also tried to use UK Garage influence, which was a genius idea but failed to deliver when you get a 90's U.S. producer like Teddy to do it.

but he failed to capitalise on this need for soul by dealing largely with hit-and-run Rodney at his last moments of fame and nearly dated production/style/songwriting. if he used this wave of Neo-Soul like he did Rodney Jerkins, i'm 100% sure we would have had one of the top 3 best MJ albums.

In my opinion Michael is always ahead of his time in sounds/music. I think Invincible was a bit to ahead of its time for that generation.. If you listen to music coming out today.. (just starting to explode) it's taking those digital sounds.
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not at all, my friend. today's minimalistic, 80's synth-heavy pop music bears no resemblance to Invincible's heavy-layered electro-?, industrial sounds.
 
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jerkins is laym as hell. The dude is awful. Where is he now? OVER! He only did a couple of good songs with brandy. Ive never liked his stuff, when i heard mj was going to work with him, i knew it was going to be bad news. MJ shouldnt even work with these mainstream guys! These people are only good in the moment, no longevity! I cant understand why people would like a song like lost children, its so corny. Each to thier own hey!
 
damien shields said:
Exactly. He was relying on too many other people. Its like he didnt trust in himself. With all these cats he is hanging with at the moment eg. will.i.am and akon, blowing smoke up his ass about how f**king good he is, he is sure to gain some confidence in his own ability.

Mikes OWN music in enchanting. It drags you in. And on all levels Invincible is a perfect record. Perfect vocals, terrific music, lyrically incredible, alot of work went into it, but not alot of that work was headed by MICHAEL HIMSELF. So although "technically" the album is perfect, there is something missing. The thing that was missing was MJ's heart and sole and creativity, and that thing that takes over your body. Sure you can dance to the tunes on Invincible, but they dont FORCE you to dance. PTY, Billie Jean, TWYMMF, Black Or White, Blood on the Dance Floor... they take over your body. They have groove and funk and you cant help it. Unbreakable, sure, its dancable, but i could sit through it.

Then on the other end of the stick. Ballads. Slow tunes. Think back. If you shut your eyes and listen, the tracks on Invincible dont draw you into MJ's world. Listen deeply to Cry, Dont Walk Away, ect. There is the passion missing. But you can FEEL in tracks like Will You Be There and Stranger In Moscow. Its like your going to the place where MJ was at when your listening to them. You can picture his face, and hear the emotion in his voice. Not so much the Vince tracks (with the exception of Speachless and possibly one or two others)

I hope that MJ factor is back on the new stuff.
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You also forgot to add that in Vince, Mike did not have a theme to his CD. That cd was all over the place. I did not like Rodney's productions in that CD. I thought Philly producers Dre and Vidal did a great job with Butterflies. It wasmore of slow songs than anything else and I amnot really a fan of slow songs. I was really hoping that Vince would have more of a Dangerous vibe. I feel that Vince was the CD that was for a up and coming singer instead of a pop legend. Other than that, I agreed with everything you said. Vince is a good CD, Mike makes good cds, but it was his least creative, least promoted (not his fault) and least controlled out of all of Mike's music.

MJ working with Will, Ne-Yo, Kanye (rumored) - creative people, I think Mike is going to have a creative, feel good CD.

Where is he now? OVER!
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Not really. He produced "Feedback" for Janet. He is just not good for Mike.

like i said, this is turning into another Invincible bash fest and isnt really on topic anyways.
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It is not. J5, people do not like the CD like you. Let them express that. It does not make us (me included because I did not like the CD) any less of a fan. Some of us just did not like the cd.
 
It is not. J5, people do not like the CD like you. Let them express that. It does not make us (me included because I did not like the CD) any less of a fan. Some of us just did not like the cd.
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This doesn't happen for any of his other albums. When ever Invincible's name is mentioned, in ANY thread, people go on and on and on about it's faults. It can't even be MENTIONED without saying "man, that album sucked" LOL I mean look at this thread. This thread isn't even about invincible yet now everyone's going back and forth about what they feel is wrong with the album.

It's sooooooooooooooo annoying.

I'm not saying anyone's less of a fan, why are you putting words in my mouth???
 
J5master said:
This doesn't happen for any of his other albums. When ever Invincible's name is mentioned, in ANY thread, people go on and on and on about it's faults. It can't even be MENTIONED without saying "man, that album sucked" LOL I mean look at this thread. This thread isn't even about invincible yet now everyone's going back and forth about what they feel is wrong with the album.

It's sooooooooooooooo annoying.

I'm not saying anyone's less of a fan, why are you putting words in my mouth???
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thats true..maybe because its his last album maybe because its his worst...
 
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The album itself I am VERY HAPPY with it.. I LOVE INVINCIBLE.

It bothers me that michael was not able to go forth with his plans with the album. Some people don't relise how much it changes thoughts towards the music when you have something visual to connected to it.

Why do you think after the THRILLER video came out, much after the album did, (everyone heard the song by then) But the sales SKY ROCKETED again.. Because the visual contributes to the sound..

Michael first planned to release UNBREAKABLE as the first single with a 20 minute short film/movie but Sony refused to allow that because of production costs etc.. (This is just when things got started)

If Michaels vision for the album unfolded it would have been much bigger, much better.

Also keep in mind what was going on right around INVINCIBLE, not even a month after 9/11. It was the first time in modern day history that people focused on world issues OVER entertainment.

And also side note: It was the boom of pirating (2001).. ilegal downloads were at it's prime. beginning to become a household thing among everyone.. It is when the music industry was trying to figure out how will they control this problem.
 
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KOPV said:
Invincible was a great album in many ways.. Not in EVERY way though..

If you comaire it to anything by any other album released in 2001.. Shoot, even ever since, it's the best piece of music.

Michael did allow others to control Invincible too much.. Michael wanted to do something cutting edge, experimenting with instraments that cannot be duplicated, ripped off. This turns to digital sounds when you tell someone like ROdney Jerkins this. Michael was very worried (he even said this) because of pirating was getting big in 2001, that he gets a sound that cannot be ripped easily.. The way things are leaked are not always how people think.. Technology has a lot to do with it..

Michael with this album is just writting a great album.. That's it.

In my opinion Michael is always ahead of his time in sounds/music. I think Invincible was a bit to ahead of its time for that generation.. If you listen to music coming out today.. (just starting to explode) it's taking those digital sounds. Britney Spears, Janet Jackson, etc.. The list is long.. Michael took the first dive into it and it was a bit early, people were not ready for it.. If Invincible were to be released today it would sell much more.. Even with the same crapy promotion.
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no actually invinc. had nothing new at all and it wasnt a great album sorry!! its michaels worst album thats the truth.and it wasnt only sonys fault it was all this period which was bad for michael..nothing worked well in invincible era..even the video of the first single yrmw is michaels worst video ever....hopefully michael now is ok..he moved on in his life..he is not having the problems of the past..and he is really working hard on his next album..for first time after many years he looks so calm and cool as a person..
 
^ You cannot argue with opinions.. lol! I find it very funny how people like doing this..

If someone LOVES the album then it's a GREAT album to them.. lol!

Who is anyone to tell me what is good in my own mind?? ha ha!

What 'TRUTH' is behind on it being a 'Bad' album..? That is 100% opinion
 
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KOPV said:
^ You cannot argue with opinions.. lol! I find it very funny how people like doing this..

If someone LOVES the album then it's a GREAT album to them.. lol!

Who is anyone to tell me what is good in my own mind?? ha ha!

What 'TRUTH' is behind on it being a 'Bad' album..? That is 100% opinion
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at your opinion can you tell me which is michaels worst album?
 
PANOS THE GREEK said:
at your opinion can you tell me which is michaels worst album?
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If i told you that youd throw stones at me lol

Anyways MJ's worse is the industry's best. No matter what u think his worst is.

And critics are often wrong I can tell u that much.
 
the only true critic is your taste and personal opinion

judging on the popular success of an album is a bit more complicated, but i guess there's no real reason to care.

at the end of the day, it's only music made for you. discussion boards are here for us to discuss it, i don't understand the "anti-negativity" thing going on where some might enjoy it more than others.
 
Don't be surprised if you provoke a reaction by insulting great works by the greatest artist of all time! Most people come to these boards to find out what's going on in the world of Michael Jackson, communicate with other fans and celebrate four decades of musical genius. I'm sure there are plenty of music forums full of sheep bleating on about how Thriller and Off The Wall are the only good albums and how he's finished, it just seems a shame to have to read that kind of small minded rubbish here too.

However I do believe people can say what they like, as can I.;)
 
arXter said:
the only true critic is your taste and personal opinion

judging on the popular success of an album is a bit more complicated, but i guess there's no real reason to care.

at the end of the day, it's only music made for you. discussion boards are here for us to discuss it, i don't understand the "anti-negativity" thing going on where some might enjoy it more than others.
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i agree my friend...i love michael since i was six and i will love him always!!!! but as a fan i have a personal taste about things i like and things i dont like..when iam saying somethig negative this dont mean that everyone must agree with me or iam a bad guy and i want to huyt others feelings...
 
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gratian said:
Don't be surprised if you provoke a reaction by insulting great works by the greatest artist of all time! Most people come to these boards to find out what's going on in the world of Michael Jackson, communicate with other fans and celebrate four decades of musical genius. I'm sure there are plenty of music forums full of sheep bleating on about how Thriller and Off The Wall are the only good albums and how he's finished, it just seems a shame to have to read that kind of small minded rubbish here too.

However I do believe people can say what they like, as can I.;)
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...........:wub:
 
gratian said:
Don't be surprised if you provoke a reaction by insulting great works by the greatest artist of all time! Most people come to these boards to find out what's going on in the world of Michael Jackson, communicate with other fans and celebrate four decades of musical genius. I'm sure there are plenty of music forums full of sheep bleating on about how Thriller and Off The Wall are the only good albums and how he's finished, it just seems a shame to have to read that kind of small minded rubbish here too.
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no one should be surprised if one were to provoke a reaction by insulting anything. insulting or disrespecting a piece of work should not be tolerated in any forum - that includes work by other respectable artists, which unfortunately has been seen to occur many times on probably every fan forum.

but this is also a major music forum - certainly not everyone wants to talk about the personal tidbits and whatnot. many are here to discuss their love for the music and the dance. this will undoubtedly include a clash of tastes and opinions for many discussions to be of value.

if it's respectable and constructive, it shouldn't be seen as blasphemous just because you may like something that someone else doesn't, regardless of popular opinion or commercial success.
 
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arXter said:
no one should be surprised if one were to provoke a reaction by insulting anything. insulting or disrespecting a piece of work should not be tolerated in any forum - that includes work by other respectable artists, which unfortunately has been seen to occur many times on probably every fan forum.

but this is also a major music forum - certainly not everyone wants to talk about the personal tidbits and whatnot. many are here to discuss their love for the music and the dance. this will undoubtedly include clash of tastes and opinions for the discussion to be of value.

if it's respectable and constructive, it shouldn't be seen as blasphemous just because you may like something that someone else doesn't.
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There is a difference between showing preference to a type of music and constant putting down and ridiculing of another, People on this foruim do not like Invincible, that is understandable, but there are some that genuinely do. To make people feel silly because they do, by the constant bashing of the album is unfair. I tend not to join in these debates because they seem pointless. The people that like the album tend to keep quite, so as always we have the noise coming from the loud minority. Many people do not like History, but they do not put the album down constantly, but Invincible has become the victim of constant bashing.
It is as if people are trying to convince the rest of us that Invincible is bad. Well I say these people are very LIMITED in there taste of music and are going to be even more disappointed when the next album comes out cause it will be even more experimental. MJ has done everything there is in music. He can be free to experiment now. Since I love all types of music, I will be following where the sound leads.:D
 
i like invincible not all the songs are my favourite but one that does stand out is Speechless. :)
 
Datsymay said:
There is a difference between showing preference to a type of music and constant putting down and ridiculing of another, People on this foruim do not like Invincible, that is understandable, but there are some that genuinely do. To make people feel silly because they do, by the constant bashing of the album is unfair.
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I tend not to join in these debates because they seem pointless. The people that like the album tend to keep quite, so as always we have the noise coming from the loud minority. Many people do not like History, but they do not put the album down constantly, but Invincible has become the victim of constant bashing.
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as i said, if it's respectable and constructive there should be no reason not to criticise it.

and i've observed that many people like Invincible in the MJ community. i can't say i enjoy all or the majority of Invincible but i consider it to contain two of my top 10 songs of all time.

at the end of the day, it's all subjective talk and heavily influenced by an individual's tastes. no one should take it personally or get so personal and attacking/defensive over it from either extreme.
 
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I honestly cannot chose a worst album.. There are songs on every album that I LOVE very much, then one or two on some albums that are not AS great, but are still awsome.. I have never been good at chosing favorites with Michael stuff.

But 'good' and 'bad' is opinion. And in my opinion Invincible was the best album released after 2000. I just simply think Michaels music is untouchable, if I say I don't care for a sertain song very much. (MJ) to me it is still better than the 'hottest' song out.. Michaels understanding of song is untouchable. Yes ther are songs (VERY RARE) that I like better than some MJ songs, but in the large picture to me no artist can make a better album than Michael Jackson.. If he were to make an album of songs that did not make his other albums, it would still be better in my opinon than others music.. His voice, his styling, his touch on music is the IDEAL of what music should be to me..

(my opinion)
 
Jay-z says he off the wall too on his new album,and he says u other guys are nothing but titos
 
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