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The Hoax Theory - Discussing Errors, Inconsistencies, Observations and Other Theories

Re: The hoax site...

Rockin. said:
There are shady ass comments from Kenny Ortega, Frank DiLeo, and LaToya - shes said things like 'Michael is watching you all, he really is, and he loves you all' and in her dedication '[...]I can't wait to see you perform again.[...] KEEP THE MAGIC GOING!!!!(in big letters with !!!)' Perhaps thats all innocent *(and she means he's watching from heaven etc.), after all she has also hinted that she thinks he was murdered.. La Toya just confuses me. Even some comments from TII dancers are strange.. not what they say themselves but things that MJ apparently said to them...aaand theres the '2010 aint going to know what hit em' comment.. but that of course could mean anything.
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What did the dancers say? And when or where or who said that "2010 comment?
 
Re: The hoax site...

All this is very, very confusing... And as the time goes by, it gets even stranger. I just don't know what to believe anymore. It feels like we're living in the middle of some scary movie and you don't know what to expect. :no:
 
Re: The hoax site...

oceanborn - I know what you mean..

I'm replying kinda blindly here because my internet is messed up, so I hope this comes out right..

mysterygirl7 said:
What did the dancers say?
Click to expand...

stuff like michael telling them - 'this is going to be a rollarcoaster of emotions' and 'im going to take you on an adventure'.

And when or where or who said that "2010 comment?
Click to expand...
 

one of the dancers - dres - on his facebook.

Now this is speculation, I know, so don't jump on me

- i saw this this from jodigomes (she is the executive producer and director of the jack5ons family dynasty) to genevieve (Michael's neice) -

''good for you. i heard one song, it was jammin! be sure u r filming your sessions too. u never know what u'll need it for ;-) about 13 hours ago from web in reply to genevievejaxn''

https://twitter.com/jodigomes

'film your sessions (recording sessions) u never know what you'll need it for *wink wink*' ..

Isn't that a bit strange to send to the neice of someone who just died but fortunately had filmed rehearsals for everyone to see. I wouldn't do that.. wouldn't it be a bit upsetting for genevieve?

Here are two tweets from Raffles (Jackson family friend) who was at the Golden Globes film and tv awards last night.

''On the Red Carpet of the Golden Globes, nasty weather. Thinking about Rihanna,(under my umbrella). Even Alberto Alvarez is here ;-)
about 15 hours ago from txt''

Alberto Alvarez was Michael's bodyguard and he is the one who made the 911 call.

''On the Red Carpet of the Golden Globes...[..]...Even Alberto Alvarez is here ;) *wink wink*''

One of those *winks* again.

''You are the first to hear it from ME first. Extra Extra read all about it.
about 15 hours ago from txt ''

http://twitter.com/rafflesvanexel


I don't know what he's trying to say about it.. I don't know what he means.
 
Re: The hoax site...

Rockin. said:
oceanborn - I know what you mean..

I'm replying kinda blindly here because my internet is messed up, so I hope this comes out right..



stuff like michael telling them - 'this is going to be a rollarcoaster of emotions' and 'im going to take you on an adventure'.


 

one of the dancers - dres - on his facebook.

Now this is speculation, I know, so don't jump on me

- i saw this this from jodigomes (she is the executive producer and director of the jack5ons family dynasty) to genevieve (Michael's neice) -

''good for you. i heard one song, it was jammin! be sure u r filming your sessions too. u never know what u'll need it for ;-) about 13 hours ago from web in reply to genevievejaxn''

https://twitter.com/jodigomes

'film your sessions (recording sessions) u never know what you'll need it for *wink wink*' ..

Isn't that a bit strange to send to the neice of someone who just died but fortunately had filmed rehearsals for everyone to see. I wouldn't do that.. wouldn't it be a bit upsetting for genevieve?

Here are two tweets from Raffles (Jackson family friend) who was at the Golden Globes film and tv awards last night.

''On the Red Carpet of the Golden Globes, nasty weather. Thinking about Rihanna,(under my umbrella). Even Alberto Alvarez is here ;-)
about 15 hours ago from txt''

Alberto Alvarez was Michael's bodyguard and he is the one who made the 911 call.

''On the Red Carpet of the Golden Globes...[..]...Even Alberto Alvarez is here ;) *wink wink*''

One of those *winks* again.

''You are the first to hear it from ME first. Extra Extra read all about it.
about 15 hours ago from txt ''

http://twitter.com/rafflesvanexel


I don't know what he's trying to say about it.. I don't know what he means.
Click to expand...

The winks are a problem for me. Too many!
;D:ph34r:

and what is Albert Alvarez doing there? Maybe he is providing security for a celeb there if he's a bodyguard? IDK.

Genvieve's tweets are in bad taste, I agree. A bit insensitive.

KANE- Those pics must have been photoshopped or edited...They don't make sense.
 
Re: The hoax site...

MJJ7777 said:
and what is Albert Alvarez doing there? Maybe he is providing security for a celeb there if he's a bodyguard? IDK.
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there's an update on Raffles's twitter

"Alberto was hired by the Globes as Security....You Rock Alberto....Thanks for everything..(looing forward to the interview) oops
about 3 hours ago from web"
http://twitter.com/rafflesvanexel
 
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Re: The hoax site...

MichaelMySoul said:
Let me refresh your memory...

http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/9128/mjbodybag.jpg
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oh, no strap here! in some shots, the body was clearly strapped when it was loaded onto to the helicopter, though, yes - strapless when it was unloaded to go into the coroner's van.

there truly are a lot of puzzling pieces to this mystery.

i'm not sure if this has been mentioned, but there are also these conflicting stories about where Janet was when she heard the news. in this article, it said she was filming, i believe in Atlanta, and her director even had his own story to tell.

Tyler Perry Speaks About Janet on Day MJ Died
http://www.etonline.com/news/2009/09/78454/

Madea is back for more in 'Tyler Perry's I Can Do Bad All By Myself,' in theaters Friday, and Tyler recalls the emotional moments working with Janet Jackson when she learned her brother had died.

"Janet and I are very close so I was very, very worried about her," Tyler tells our own Thea Andrews. "I wanted to make sure she was protected and comfortable."

Tyler was filming with Janet on the sequel 'Why Did I get Married Too,' coming out in April, when news broke that Michael Jackson had died.[/B][/B] In the middle of filming an airport scene with 500 extras, Tyler says, "I [felt] the energy drain out of the room."

Upon discovering what had happened, he spoke with Janet, who he says was "very strong; very quiet, very solid, like a mother. … Her strength was amazing."

After flying home to be with her family, Tyler says Janet came back to work every day.

- -

and here is Janet's interview with Robin where at around 5:20, she said she was at home in New York when she found out.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-iYNY8dK9I

i don't know, i just truly believe you don't forget such details. we, fans, know exactly where we were and what we were doing when we heard. and she's his sister.

and it's kind of far-fetched, i think, that she forgot. so why did she tell a different story?
 
Re: The hoax site...

mj_forever said:
i don't know, i just truly believe you don't forget such details. we, fans, know exactly where we were and what we were doing when we heard. and she's his sister.

and it's kind of far-fetched, i think, that she forgot. so why did she tell a different story?
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I'm wondering the same thing.
But aren't there others too who have been telling conflicting stories?
I recall someone telling 2 different stories about the way that person found out what was going on with Michael but I can't remember who and what...
 
Re: The hoax site...

And still this is what this is..

Rockin. said:
Loes54 said:
What do you think about this video?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WaDz6rk5E5c

The book is real, you can google it and find more information.

This sort of things make me still think he's probably alive and it's like he told us "A great adventure".

Also last week the Chigago Tribune did a poll on her website with the question: "Is Michael Jackson stll Alive?". Most people said yes! It's the first big newspaper I know off that's maybe questioning his "death".
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What the hell?? Is that video true? Erm.. that is very freaky if it is.
*The comic thing is enough, but Murray changing his name?? - Wha how can we validate that claim?

I saw an online article asking if Michael was going to turn up to his film premiere.. I don't know which site it was but I was like - why are you even entertaining this idea? - they even had comments from an American hoaxer Alan Abel - who has actually faked his own death in the past:

In 1979 Abel staged his own death from a heart attack near the Sundance Ski Lodge. A fake funeral director collected his belongings and a woman posing as his widow notified the New York Times. The Times published an obituary January 2, 1980[1] (a rare example of a premature obituary). On January 3, 1980, Abel held a news conference to announce that the "reports of my demise have been grossly exaggerated".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Abel

This is about Alan Abel -
'His audience and stage are provided by the world's too-easy-to-please news media. ''I admire good journalism, but I rely on human gullibility, and especially on journalists' willingness to overlook the facts to get a good story or a scoop. It upsets me that Walter Cronkite, the so-called father of American television news, has told people he will never forgive me for having duped him with the naked animals protest. My God, this is a man who's been lied to by some really evil people ... and he hates me!
"We're all gullible. We're overloaded with information, dominated by fibre optics. It's a weird time ... we're like sheep or robots, following the leader, doing what everyone else does. That makes my work easy."It was never my purpose to make money," Abel added. '
Click to expand...

Anyway.. OK, I said I had an open mind about all options - accidental death, murder, hoax.

I have accepted that Michael is gone whatever the reason, so the investigation of 'hoax' is not about denial.

I'm being openminded about the options because things just aren't making sense. I could write pages if I sat and got everything together, but this is what comes to mind right now...

25th June 2009
100 North Carolwood Drive


Murray's attorney stated that Murray entered the room in the afternoon and found Jackson in bed and not breathing. According to his attorney, Murray tried to revive Jackson for five to ten minutes, at which point he realized he needed to call for help. He was hindered because there was no landline in the house. weird, especially with the children there. He believed he could not use his cell phone to call 911 because he did not know the exact address. Oh really..how many times had he driven there? Besides, if he didn't know all he had to do was go tell someone else in the house STRAIGHT AWAY, problem solved. He phoned security but there was no answer. Finally Finally? After what? he ran downstairs, yelled for help, and told the chef who was in the kitchen to get security up to the room. By the time security called 911 about 30 minutes had passed. What was going on for 30 MINUTES? The New York Post said Jackson's 12-year-old son, Prince Michael Jackson, Jr., was present during the resuscitation attempts, and that the emergency services were contacted only after Jackson's father was told by a security guard that the singer was ill. ...?!

Murray said he was in contact with doctors at UCLA, who instructed the rescuers to inject epinephrine (adrenaline) directly into Jackson's heart. The autopsy said ephedrine?? Murray stated that Jackson continued to have a pulse when he was taken out of the house and put in the ambulance for the trip to the hospital. An LAFD official gave a different account. He said that paramedics found Jackson in "full cardiac arrest", and that they did not observe a change in Jackson's status en route to the hospital.

There QUITE a few different stories of this day, which I won't bother posting because we have all heard them.



Some things from the 911 call seemed strange, but they could have been honest mistakes I guess.

Extracts from 911 call -


Operator
Caller (Alberto Alvarez)

Ok. He's not conscious, he's not breathing?
Yes, he's not breathing sir
And he's not conscious either?
No, he's not conscious sir
(I'm no medical professional, but if a person is not breathing I don't think they'd be conscious)
Ok (pause). Alright, is he on the floor, where's he at right now?
He's on the bed sir, he's on the bed
( :O)
Ok, OK, we are on our way. We are less than a mile away and we will be there shortly.
Thank you sir, thank you
Ok sir. Call us back if you need any help. Thank you
(Call us back?! Since when do 911 hang up on you before the paramedics arrive?)


12:21pm paramedics are dispatched to Michael's home
12:26pm they arrive
Initial reports are that he had a 'faint pulse' on arrival (this story changed, paramedics later said he was dead already and there were signs of lividity - though the ambulance picture shows mj having cpr with an air pump - I thought CPR was not done on a DOA?)
Paramedics worked on him for 42mins before 'rushing' him to UCLA (why would they wait this long? Also, the video doesn't show much rushing with the ambulance where it is seen backing out very slowly, moving forward again, backing out slowly again)
1:14pm arrives at UCLA
2:26pm Michael is pronounced dead after being worked on for little over an hour.

(Remember Frank DiLeo said that when he arrived a nurse told him 'Michael was gone but they would continue working on him until his mother arrived.' [standard practice? I don't think so] )

Michael's chef Kai, on Larry King

''Larry - Did you see anyone remove the body (body? i thought he had a pulse, anyway..)

Kai - No. When the paramedics arrived, people, security were running around everywhere. The security asked us to leave the home at around 1:30pm so Michael could be taken to hospital.''
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According to official reports MJ should have been at UCLA being worked on already at this time.

Media reports paramedics didn't realise for nearly 10 minutes that the victim was MJ.. one said 'It just looked like a frail, old, sickly man'.
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Re: The hoax site...

Whether it be the hoax site or here in the IU thread, I suppose each with opposite objective, imo what I think it comes down to is people would like answers. I honestly don't know if we will get them, but I happened upon the mjhd site last week for the first time when I was looking for something else and although imo they speculate just as much as the IU does, I also noticed some people there have pointed out certain things that have been overlooked here in the IU. What it all means, who knows? We are all entitled to believe what we will, I kept an open mind, and it certainly was interesting.....although it changes nothing.....-_-
 
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Re: The hoax site...

Question:

On the Jacksons finale, they visit MJ's gravesite and the screenshot shows that they are headed to Forest Lawn Drive which is the address of the memorial park in Hollywood hills, near Walt Disney and NBC studios. (Research it yourself)...My question is why did they head there when MJ was supposed to have been buried at the Forest Lawn in Glendale, which is at a completely different location???

Here's the video that brought this inconsistency out. Very interesting. Also includes screenshot of address originally shown in the finale show.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E84C6LVPlcI

ForestLawnDr.jpg


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E84C6LVPlcI
 
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Re: The hoax site...

MJJ7777 said:
Question:

On the Jacksons finale, they visit MJ's gravesite and the screenshot shows that they are headed to Forest Lawn Drive which is the address of the memorial park in Hollywood hills, near Walt Disney and NBC studios. (Research it yourself)...My question is why did they head there when MJ was supposed to have been buried at the Forest Lawn in Glendale, which is at a completely different location???

Here's the video that brought this inconsistency out. Very interesting. Also includes screenshot of address originally shown in the finale show.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E84C6LVPlcI

ForestLawnDr.jpg


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E84C6LVPlcI
Click to expand...

Yes, they did indeed visit the wrong cemetary. This should have been highlighted on MJJC. I hope more people start opening their eyes. Dont be afraid or angry about a hoax-theory. I found it easier than sooner I ''accepted'' this theory. Michael never did this to hurt us and he never left his kids..... Try and be openminded guys. He is screwing with the media.
 
Re: The hoax site...

Oh....how I want this to be true ! He would have every right to do that...screw with the media. Great revenge.
 
Re: The hoax site...

Wow, that TMZ thing is pretty weird... They prided themselves in being the first to report the death and now he isn't on their RIP list?! Must have been a HUGE Typo lol
 
Re: The hoax site...

When the ambulance was leaving MJ's rented house (very slowly too with no sirens?!?) there was a pap from HollywoodTV who filmed the ambulance reverse and leave for UCLA. The HollywoodTV camera is filming one continuously filmed shot. The cameraman is @ the back left of the ambulance and the ambulance basically runs into him. The cameraman then runs to the right side of the ambulance and behind a guy in a red shirt and then the cameraman runs off.

The film is stopped and starts again next to a firetruck as the StarLine Bus Tour pulls up AFTER the ambulance has already left. The BACK of the StarLine bus is next to the FRONT of the firetruck. There is also a 2nd ambulance!!!
[youtube]QuXRaJFdmKU&feature=related[/youtube]

Someone on the StarLine bus also had a camera that was filming. So naturally you would think that both videos would have basically the same thing on them just from different positions. WRONG!

The StarLine bus arrives BEFORE the ambulance leaves (StarLine arrives after ambulance leaves in first video). Also the StarLine bus is right next to the firetruck (back of StarLine's bus end where firetruck starts). More importantly, when the ambulance is reversing in this video, you dont see the cameraman from HollywoodTV go around to the right of the ambulance and go behind the guy in the red shirt. The cameraman runs off straight away. The videos dont match at all.
[youtube]Z_VWCpIgrJI[/youtube]

Also the photographer Ben let this comment slip, "they were there that day and the other day..."
 
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Re: The hoax site...

^ I was looking at that earlier. It's not what it looks like. The 2nd video is bad quality so it's easy to get confused. At about 1:20 in the first video, look at the position he is in. At about 0:09 on the second video, that's about the same spot you can see a cameraman in. When he runs closer to the ambulance, there are 3 total people, hard to see, but they're there: the black man trying to guard the windows of the ambulance, and TWO cameramen. You can see the cameraman pull away from the ambulance on its right side and begin to run, filming the ambulance turning and leaving: this is the footage we see in the first video. Meanwhile, the other cameraman was the one that ran back towards the firetruck.

Everything matches up fine.
 
Re: The hoax site...

Just months ago I was calling the hoaxers crazy...lol, but now....now I just don't know.
There are just too many things that don't add up!

I also believe that IF Michael did indeed fake he death; he didn't do it for fun. He did it to save his life AND to send a message. We shall see.....
 
Re: The hoax site...

Naeniver said:
Everything matches up fine.
Click to expand...

Really? Well I found this youtube video of both videos sync'd up and they dont match. In the StarLine Tour video there are 2 black SUVs that leave with the ambulance but in the Hollywood video the 2 SUVs arent there!
[youtube]NVmCy68UWkI[/youtube]
 
Re: The hoax site...

I dont get any of it either and dont understand half of this. Im just pointing out the inconsistencies.
 
Re: The hoax site...

Dangerous Incorporated said:
Really? Well I found this youtube video of both videos sync'd up and they dont match. In the StarLine Tour video there are 2 black SUVs that leave with the ambulance but in the Hollywood video the 2 SUVs arent there!
[youtube]NVmCy68UWkI[/youtube]
Click to expand...

The SUV is there. The camera was being turned VERY quickly; go frame by frame. You need to continuously press Play and Stop to catch it. The SUV is at some point in 1:35. You will get a very quick glimpse; you will not see the second SUV, because by then, the cameraman had turned completely around.

[youtube]QuXRaJFdmKU&feature=related[/youtube]
 
Re: The hoax site...

Did Starline get there @ the same time as the ambulance? B/c the gates seem to close with the ambulance inside when starline arrives there on hollywood TV's shot. maybes thats why I'm seeing two ambulances?
 
Re: The hoax site...

Yes, from the videos we have, Starline arrived shortly after the ambulance. There is then a time gap, and the next videos we see are from after the gates reopened and the ambulance reemerged.
 
Re: The hoax site...

The Starline bus when stopped is almost parrallel in the Starline video and on the HollywoodTV video, the end of the bus lines up with the back of the firetruck. Theyre not the same. It doesnt matter from which camera angle you can see they dont match up.
 
Re: The hoax site...

Dangerous Incorporated said:
When the ambulance was leaving MJ's rented house (very slowly too with no sirens?!?) there was a pap from HollywoodTV who filmed the ambulance reverse and leave for UCLA. The HollywoodTV camera is filming one continuously filmed shot. The cameraman is @ the back left of the ambulance and the ambulance basically runs into him. The cameraman then runs to the right side of the ambulance and behind a guy in a red shirt and then the cameraman runs off.

The film is stopped and starts again next to a firetruck as the StarLine Bus Tour pulls up AFTER the ambulance has already left. The BACK of the StarLine bus is next to the FRONT of the firetruck. There is also a 2nd ambulance!!!
[youtube]QuXRaJFdmKU&feature=related[/youtube]

Someone on the StarLine bus also had a camera that was filming. So naturally you would think that both videos would have basically the same thing on them just from different positions. WRONG!

The StarLine bus arrives BEFORE the ambulance leaves (StarLine arrives after ambulance leaves in first video). Also the StarLine bus is right next to the firetruck (back of StarLine's bus end where firetruck starts). More importantly, when the ambulance is reversing in this video, you dont see the cameraman from HollywoodTV go around to the right of the ambulance and go behind the guy in the red shirt. The cameraman runs off straight away. The videos dont match at all.
[youtube]Z_VWCpIgrJI[/youtube]

Also the photographer Ben let this comment slip, "they were there that day and the other day..."
Click to expand...

Mmm, I dont know how to say it, but mm, fans were there and saw things with their own eyes. No inconsistencies here, sorry
 
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