Atheist thread

Re: Athesit Thread version 2 (sorry K.O.S.:p).

I agree! I think we're all pretty level-headed people that can have a nice debate, without getting personal feelings involved. I'm all for it!
 
Re: Athesit Thread version 2 (sorry K.O.S.:p).

This thread should be more active, I'm aware most people in this forum are believers (all over the world in fact) and I wasn't happy many of my posts here were deleted.

I read few months ago God Is Not Great by Christopher Hitchens, as an atheist of course it was interested to read because he mentioned several examples how religions affect human kind an their intellect, behavior and not necessarily make all of them better persons.
 
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Re: Athesit Thread version 2 (sorry K.O.S.:p).

One non-believer here. I guess I'm atheist because I don't believe in God. I don't personally like to use the word atheist that much because it makes it sound like it is a religion.
 
Re: Athesit Thread version 2 (sorry K.O.S.:p).

Non-believer here
 
Re: Athesit Thread version 2 (sorry K.O.S.:p).

One non-believer here. I guess I'm atheist because I don't believe in God. I don't personally like to use the word atheist that much because it makes it sound like it is a religion.

I guess people can identify or label themselves as they please but atheism involves only the disbelief in the existence of gods. If people don't believe in all the supernatural phenomena related, different ideologies or philosophies involving different doctrines, even some scientific theories, then I guess some of us could be considered skeptics.

I accept some believers call me infidel, pagan (they're as pagan as me since many of the "christian" traditions come from many ancient Roman, Nordic, pagan festivities, oh the irony,) satanic, but what I don't accept is when some of them consider me a bad person. No one needs religions to be compassionate, to be caring, to be moral, to do the right thing without getting rewards. If people need it, they have a huge problem.
 
Re: Athesit Thread (For non-believers only)

At your request we have made this an Atheist only thread. Please read the rules and guidelines for posting .

You can discuss evolution, science, why you don't believe biblical theories, the bible, the Koran or other faith books etc. Profess reasons for your non belief in God. What you can not do in this thread is attack or ridicule the believer (many who are on this board ) We do not allow attacks on non-believer in the Christian thread so the same goes for this Atheist discussion. If you can not discuss your non - belief without doing that, please do not post in this thread. Don't make a
mockery of this thread

Admin Team MJJC

Thank you for your cooperation and as always if you have any questions or concerns PM Admin and do not derail the thread by replying or discussing moderation actions on your posts or moderation requests on the board.
 
Re: Athesit Thread (For non-believers only)

Did anyone have the chance to see 'The Unbelievers'? The trailer looks interesting, plus I love Richard Dawkins.

 
Re: Athesit Thread (For non-believers only)

Dawkins rocks, can't get enough of his stuff.

Indeed, his marvellous book, 'The God Delusion' was the reason I don't feel ashamed anymore to openly admit I don't believe in any god or goddess. I could spend hours watching his debates crushing believers with their arguments. And I love how Richard makes science and biology sound so beautiful and poetic at times.

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:thumbs_up:

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Re: Athesit Thread (For non-believers only)

Any of you guys been watching The Cosmos with Neil Degrasse Tyson?
Really cool. Should be required viewing in schools.
 
Re: Athesit Thread (For non-believers only)

Oh yeah, I'm loving it! It is informative, interesting and at least to me it makes me feel special. Also it made me think it's not a taboo, neither an embarrasment not lnowing all the answers. Professor Carl Sagan would be pleased his legacy lives on! :happy:

I hope religious butt-hurts don't get it cancelled.

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Re: Athesit Thread (For non-believers only)

Some great posts above.

Any fellow ex-Muslims on MJJC?
 
Re: Athesit Thread (For non-believers only)

Ex fundamentalist Christian, now atheist. I'm in Australia and it's not a huge deal here thankfully. Interestingly, in the process of researching the allegations against MJ I learned about logical fallacies and how to be really careful about what I accepted as being true and why. Since I needed good evidence to prove things before I believed them concerning MJ I applied that to my own belief system when I was still a Christian because it wouldn't have been consistent not too and it all fell apart because of the lack of evidence and reliance on logical fallacies. I'm quite thankful to be out of that system of fundamentalist thinking, my life has been much better ever since.
 
Re: Athesit Thread (For non-believers only)

I'm glad you chose logic and reason over a comforting fairy tale MJresercher.

Former Catholic here and I've been atheist/secular humanist for 11 years. Fortunately my parents aren't fanatical nor obssessed over religion, actually many Mexicans are casual believers because they do so when it's convenient to them; I've encounter discrimination for it nonetheless.

I don't have any problem with believers/religious people for the mere fact of their beliefs, anyone is free to believe in whatever or whoever they want but it really bothers me when many of them attribute EVERYTHING to their god/dess(es) like this recent, spectacular and beautiful lunar eclipse. Many delusionals were attributing it to Jesus and the apocalypse taking away credit to our universe and how it works in this case.

In my case, there's no way back, I'd have to completely lose my mind to be a believer again. I'm aware we're still a minority, even us MJ fans nonbelievers. It seems it's very common to be an MJ fan and believing in deities. Even if this thread is not very active, I'm glad I'm not alone.

It's a shame most women in Islam can't proudly say they're a former Muslims. I don't think all religious people are bad but in many cases, it takes religion to do evil. Islam frightens me to be honest knowing how Theo van Gogh was brutally murdered for telling the truth, thousands of little girls are forced to get marry with older men and they ended up being raped and tortured in many Islamic countries where pedophilia is legal.


 
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Re: Athesit Thread (For non-believers only)

I know your frustration, one thing that gets to me is when a person's life is saved by paramedics/surgeons etc and people thank their chosen god for it. It's even worse when they don't thank the people who actually did save their lives. I agree with you about not being able to go back and feel the same thing. When looking into my previous faith there where things I learned that can't be unlearned. After learning about logical fallacies and how to determine truth from fiction I definitely couldn't go back to the previous way of thinking. It must be difficult to live in a place where you're so outnumbered.

In Australia I think the majority of people believe that any religious person who thinks their god talks back to them is considered to be nuts and being an atheist isn't considered a big deal. I stopped attending church 2 years before my Mother and Brother did. He had the hardest time with it, he was a teenager and unbeknown to us he'd been praying and struggling to "choose" to be straight for 5 years. This of course didn't work and before he came out publicly he was suicidal. My Mother was working at a Christian radio station but despite that her and I accepted that he couldn't change who he is.

I saw my Brother go through hell thanks to people telling him he was "choosing" to be gay and that he was going to hell. His mentor at school even put him onto a guy who went around churches preaching about how he was "rescued" out of homosexuality. My Mother and I never believed this story but my Brother did for a short time. He was put in contact with this man who had married a woman, but it wasn't long before sexually explicit texts were being sent to my Brother (who was then 16) by this 28 year old man. So much for his claim that he wasn't gay anymore.

My Mother and I went to the Police about it but because he was 16 and had been consenting prior to the explicit messages there was nothing that could be done. Later that day I picked my Brother up off the floor from a fetal position, it was horrible. Some people in the church were more accepting of him than others, the new pastors had been good but he and my Mother didn't stay in church and just like me, once they left they didn't go back. These days things are much better and my Brother is happy with who he is and has new friends who don't try to turn him into something else.

After I left church it was another year before I was game enough to start researching the atheist perspective thanks to the fear of hell. That despicable teaching is probably the thing I hate the most about the doctrine. Because of that I'd spent my time as a Christian constantly repenting in my head all day everyday for "thought crimes". I was always in churches that preached a happy loving god and didn't mention eternal damnation much but it was still always there. When I finally allowed myself to study and think for myself instead of being told what I was and wasn't allowed to think I felt like I was free. From that moment on my mind wasn't like a busy bee hive anymore and I could think more clearly. Most importantly, I could think!

Oops, sorry about the long reply, sometimes I have a hard time keeping things short. It's nice to see that there are other MJ fans like yourself who I can relate to in this way. Thank you :)
 
Re: Athesit Thread (For non-believers only)

I'm glad you chose logic and reason over a comforting fairy tale MJresercher.

Former Catholic here and I've been atheist/secular humanist for 11 years. Fortunately my parents aren't fanatical nor obssessed over religion, actually many Mexicans are casual believers because they do so when it's convenient to them; I've encounter discrimination for it nonetheless.

I don't have any problem with believers/religious people for the mere fact of their beliefs, anyone is free to believe in whatever or whoever they want but it really bothers me when many of them attribute EVERYTHING to their god/dess(es) like this recent, spectacular and beautiful lunar eclipse. Many delusionals were attributing it to Jesus and the apocalypse taking away credit to our universe and how it works in this case.

In my case, there's no way back, I'd have to completely lose my mind to be a believer again. I'm aware we're still a minority, even us MJ fans nonbelievers. It seems it's very common to be an MJ fan and believing in deities. Even if this thread is not very active, I'm glad I'm not alone.

It's a shame most women in Islam can't proudly say they're a former Muslims. I don't think all religious people are bad but in many cases, it takes religion to do evil. Islam frightens me to be honest knowing how Theo van Gogh was brutally murdered for telling the truth, thousands of little girls are forced to get marry with older men and they ended up being raped and tortured in many Islamic countries where pedophilia is legal.




Don't believe everything the way the media portray things. Religions whas never been the source of conflmicts, but hungervfor power and money. Also, many atheistic countries such as North Korea, and in the recent past the Soviet Union, and all communist countries were portrayed as the evil ones. Since the communism collapsed all of sudden a new enemy in the media emerdged Islam.

Take a look at this article, which happens to be posted on an Islamic blog:

http://babelserail.over-blog.com/dynamic-conformity-our-brave-new-world
 
Re: Athesit Thread (For non-believers only)

To MJresearcher.

Yeah, it irks me when they do that. Doctors and nurses in general studying 8 years of medicine for such an usurper taking all the credit when they improved their health or saved their lives. Although, it puzzles me physicians being believers to be honest. It also irks me when people in general achieve something and they thank to their chosen deities.

I don't see it as a bad thing feeling prooud of oneself every time you achieve your goals and dreams. If people work their ass off to make it happen, why not. I LOVE Michael with all my "heart" (hypothalamus) and I truly respect him as a human being and artist; however I can't help disagreeing with his theist views. Every time I listened to him thanking his god for his enormous talent and multiple achievements, I wanted to tell him: "no Michael, you inherited your talent from your parents, you developed it, cultivated it through the years to be the best in what you do. As a result of your dedication and your hard work, you achieved all those accomplishments, it is because of you and all the people who have helped you, no one else."

I'm sorry to hear your brother has gone through all that hate and suffering just because a bunch of homophobic bigots think it's an abomination or something abnormal. Many species from the animal kingdom are have shown homosexual or bisexual behavior which is completely natural, so is for mammal humans. I wish he doesn't suffer anymore and finds happiness. In a way I can relate to him on discrimination, I didn't choose to born premature, to have physical limitations and using a walker. I just can tell I wish no one to go through it because it's idiotic and horrible.

To your brother, it may cheer him up.

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Now to BUMPER.

I admit we have bad representatives for atheism but you have to remember that not in all cases those dictators comitted atrocities and other crimes against humanity in the name of atheism but for their political views and totalitarian governments. Even though Josef Stalin, Mao Zedong and Kim Jong Ill didn't believe in any deity, they thought they were gods themselves. Nowadays Jong Ill's family forve North Koreans to venerate them as gods.

I never said in all Muslim countries child marriage is permitted. But North Africa, India (talking about Islamic nations) has the highest rate of child brides. Afganistan wants to low the legal age to get marry from 18 to 14 if I remember correctly.

In the meantime, the real reason for the season. Here it's still Friday.

Happy Ostara/Spring Equinox!

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Re: Athesit Thread (For non-believers only)

Now to BUMPER.

I admit we have bad representatives for atheism

To me there is only one "we" - humanity and as many atheists as individuals. So no one can claim to be representative of anyone. The same goes for religions. ;)

but you have to remember that not in all cases those dictators comitted atrocities and other crimes against humanity in the name of atheism but for their political views and totalitarian governments.

Which is exactly what is happening in all countries, regardless of their label "atheist" or "religious". There is no such thing as a religious or atheist country. Only people in their minds are what they are. The common point between many is unfortunately the fact that they have been brainwashed by the media and the educational programs approved (read imposed) by the elected (cough, cough) governments.


Even though Josef Stalin, Mao Zedong and Kim Jong Ill didn't believe in any deity, they thought they were gods themselves. Nowadays Jong Ill's family forve North Koreans to venerate them as gods.

Wrong. They did not think they were gods, they were fully aware that they were not gods. They were just under the influence of power and their positions they enjoyed. They however have/had acted as if they wer enever going to die (just like any adolescent feels the physical force will never leave him). And being venerated "as gods" is not the same as venerating gods.

In some ways, when I read some atheist posts, I actually don't see much difference between a brainwashed religious person and a convinced atheist of being right claiming that all others are wrong.

What happened to the individual questioning of meaning of life? I can understand why one excludes the dogmatic narrowminded relgious teachings, but I can't understand why shifting towards a dogmatic narrowminded atheist teaching? What happened to the personal quest and questioning of menaing of life and existence? Why necessarily excluding the possibility of existence of God? God does not equal religion, because as a matter fof act even atheism can be a religion if followed dogmatically.

I never said in all Muslim countries child marriage is permitted. But North Africa, India (talking about Islamic nations) has the highest rate of child brides. Afganistan wants to low the legal age to get marry from 18 to 14 if I remember correctly.

To me there is no such thing as a "Muslim" country. That's only a label on the same level as China, North Korea or Congo are "Democratic Republics".

Second, lowering the age of marriage is a societal problem and should be dealt accordingly. And I don't know you, but around me I don't know a single, nor have I ever met a single muslim family agreeing to get married at 14 or 15 or to agree to let their child get married at 14 or 15. I am not denying it doesn"t exist, but I am pretty sure that this phenomenon has nothing to do with the religion, but is more related to the remote villages situations regardless of religion.

By the way, in Belgium for example, the legal age to get married is 16. So frankly speaking between 14, 15 and 16, sometimes is hard to tell, as some adolescent look much younger at 16 and some much older at 14.

My point is, let's not get brainwashed by isolated cases and let's not disregard the bigger picture. ;)
 
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Snow White luvs Peter Pan;3986322 said:
To MJresearcher.

Yeah, it irks me when they do that. Doctors and nurses in general studying 8 years of medicine for such an usurper taking all the credit when they improved their health or saved their lives. Although, it puzzles me physicians being believers to be honest. It also irks me when people in general achieve something and they thank to their chosen deities.

I don't see it as a bad thing feeling prooud of oneself every time you achieve your goals and dreams. If people work their ass off to make it happen, why not. I LOVE Michael with all my "heart" (hypothalamus) and I truly respect him as a human being and artist; however I can't help disagreeing with his theist views. Every time I listened to him thanking his god for his enormous talent and multiple achievements, I wanted to tell him: "no Michael, you inherited your talent from your parents, you developed it, cultivated it through the years to be the best in what you do. As a result of your dedication and your hard work, you achieved all those accomplishments, it is because of you and all the people who have helped you, no one else."

I'm sorry to hear your brother has gone through all that hate and suffering just because a bunch of homophobic bigots think it's an abomination or something abnormal. Many species from the animal kingdom are have shown homosexual or bisexual behavior which is completely natural, so is for mammal humans. I wish he doesn't suffer anymore and finds happiness. In a way I can relate to him on discrimination, I didn't choose to born premature, to have physical limitations and using a walker. I just can tell I wish no one to go through it because it's idiotic and horrible.

Exactly! Surgeons can sometimes spend more than an entire day trying to repair a broken body and then the patient thanks Jesus. Argh! As far as believing medical staff go it could have something to do with people being able to compartmentalise things in their brains which can allow people to hold inconsistent beliefs. I’ve seen people who have good logic when it comes to other things but don’t apply the same logic to their theist beliefs. That was something I couldn’t do which was why I ended up an atheist.

MJ’s theist beliefs don’t surprise me given his upbringing, but I noticed there were times when he questioned things in it, I saw this in the lyrics of Jam and Earth Song. He definitely wasn’t a bigot either, he learned about other faiths with interest instead of refusing to have anything to do with them because they didn’t agree with what he was taught or believed. He seemed open to learn about anything. He worked very hard all his life and learned everything he could about music from other people in the business, he always had a talent for it and his nurturing of that was how he ended up being as good as he was.

Talent like that can be passed down from generations too, my father is a bass player. He left before I was born and I’ve only met him once that I can remember but I’m a bass player too. I started with guitar when I was 12 and a year later taught myself to play bass, I learn to play songs the same way my father did, by listening to them. There must be some difference in the brains of people with musical talent which allows this to happen. The brain is certainly an interesting thing, that’s for sure.

Thank you for your kind words regarding my brother, he’s recently found himself a partner who is helping him learn to drive and took him on his first flight the other day (this man works for an airline). He’s having a great time and rarely has people bothering him anymore, one of the up sides to living in a secular country. I’ll certainly pass this image along, he’ll love it.
 
Re: Athesit Thread (For non-believers only)

This is hilarious
 
Re: Athesit Thread (For non-believers only)

Lol, nice! I like this one, it shows how the logic of the whole "You send yourself to go to hell" crap.

 
Re: Athesit Thread (For non-believers only)

Atheism is a religion as bald is a hair color.

DarkMater videos are freaking awesome, my fave is the one what would happen if Adam and Eve obyed god. That Eddie Izzard video was funny :lol: but my fave atheist comedian is George Carlin. The religion is bullshit and the sketch where he destroys pro life nutjobs are epicly hysterical. :lmao:


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Re: Athesit Thread (For non-believers only)

Good video, love it! I can also hear the apologist excuses in my head. None of which are any good of course :)
 
Re: Athesit Thread (For non-believers only)

Here's the monologue about pro life, abortion and sanctity of life. Seriously, their excuses are a bunch of nonsense and bullshit.

 
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