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BAD25 | Charts & Sales History

What I can't understand is that Immortal had much less promotion than Bad 25 and yet sold more. How is that possible?
 
I just don't understand why the music shops won't stock Bad25????
 
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Memefan said:
This is the 4th album in 3 years.... excluding post June 25th sale. Michael fatigue....? Market saturation?

And we can't forget our beloved Jacksons, keeping their names in the news for all the wrong reasons. don't forget they captured worldwide news just 60 days ago for another debacle.

So it was the perfect storm for the greatest estate release since June 2009
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Sigh.

I can see fatigue being a reason...

I was expecting Mike's friends or fans to talk this product up more on twitter or wherever. But obviously not even his family will mention it...

Nathy MJ said:
What I can't understand is that Immortal had much less promotion than Bad 25 and yet sold more. How is that possible?
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People who attended Immortal buying it there?
 
well come October 'Immortal' will hit England so I am sure sales will jump there
 
Karthik said:
Pink Floyd's Greatest Hits album sold more than Invincible in its second week.
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So? Greatest Hits albums tend to sell well. Re-releases are not greatest hits albums.

So it looks like US sales are disappointing? Sad, because it's a great release. I really can't understand the reasons. Even if you count on "MJ fatigue" or the USA's general hostility to MJ in the last 20 years, but Immortal sold 40k+ in its first week. So why did Bad25 sell so much less with all the promotion and positive reviews?

I think it probably has several factors, not just one.

- MJ died only 3 years ago and since then we had the usual post-death surge, TII, "Michael", Cirque, Immortal. Maybe too much. Maybe the Estate will need to change their strategy and wait MUCH longer periods between releases.

- Let's face it the "Michael" album was a huge disappointment for many fans. Maybe that left a bad taste in many people's mouth and now casual fans are wary of buying any new release by the Estate.

- Maybe many are only buying the DVD which doesn't count in the album sales.

- There seem to be problems with distribution.

- High price. (Yes, one can buy the 2CD version for cheaper, but it's relatively uninteresting compared to the concert.)

It's disappointing especially because it will certainly affect future projects. I wish it would sell more, of course, but at the end of the day casual fans who don't buy this are missing out big time. The irony is that while the media will no doubt remind of how it just confirms once again the superiority of Thriller (ignoring the fact that they shaped that common opinion and THAT might actually affect people's attitude), but this is actually a LOT better release than Thriller 25 was.

Well, let's hope Spike's docu put things right in November.

No matter how many it sells it certainly won't affect my opinion of it, which is that it's the best MJ release since more than a decade.
 
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I think we all need to remember that it's not a new release. I mean, in France, the original album was available for 5 to 9 euros until a few months ago.
 
Memefan said:
This is the 4th album in 3 years.... excluding post June 25th sale. Michael fatigue....? Market saturation?

And we can't forget our beloved Jacksons, keeping their names in the news for all the wrong reasons. don't forget they captured worldwide news just 60 days ago for another debacle.

So it was the perfect storm for the greatest estate release since June 2009

And we have yet to get confirmation on whether or not Sony reported their sales.
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I also think they released too many things at the same time for Bad 25. I think if they released the std 2 cd edition first and then waited a while before releasing the dvd and an accompanying live cd, they could have milked the bad 25 campaign a lot longer and given each of the new items they released its own time to shine.
By releasing everything at once, they ended up competing with their own sales and messed up their charting potential.
 
I think the marketing also failed. They should've hyped up some of the demos, the concert, and perhaps released one of the demos (I'm So Blue/Al Capone) using newly found footage from that time period around it as a music video. (Just my own idea, I don't know if everyone else would be into that).
 
It's a re-release and the album has sold 45 million albums... what are ya'll mad about?
 
Memefan;3715443 said:
No mention of Bad 25 in the Top 10..just strange.

Michael Jackson's 1987 album Bad re-enters The Billboard 200 at #23, while a deluxe 25th anniversary edition debuts at #46. The two albums sold a combined total of 27K copies, about one-sixth of the number (166K) that a 25th anniversary release of Jackson's most famous album, Thriller, sold in its first week in February 2008. (That was 16 months before Jackson's untimely death, so sympathy wasn't a factor.) Thriller 25 would have ranked #2 for two weeks if catalog albums had been eligible to make The Billboard 200 (as they are now).

In a way, this week's so-so debut for Bad is fitting: In its time, Bad was seen by many as a somewhat disappointing follow-up to Thriller. Was that judgment fair or unfair? You decide.

Bad entered The Billboard 200 at #1 in September 1987 (when that was still a rare event. It was only the sixth album to achieve the feat.) It was the first album in chart history to spawn five #1 singles, a feat not duplicated until last year, when Katy Perry's Teenage Dream did it. For all its success, Bad didn't sell as well as Thriller or enjoy the near-universal acclaim that Thriller did. Where Thriller was #1 for 37 weeks, Bad was #1 for just six weeks. Where Jackson went home with a record-setting eight Grammys in February 1984, he went home empty-handed in February 1988. (U2's The Joshua Tree took Album of the Year.)

Deluxe reissues of a few other classic albums also got off to faster starts than Bad did this week. The Beatles' Abbey Road sold 89K copies in its first week in September 2009. The Rolling Stones' Exile On Main St. sold 76K copies in its first week in May 2010. Pearl Jam's Ten sold 60K in its first week in March 2009.

Bad re-enters Top Catalog Albums at #1. It's Jackson's fourth album to top this chart. Thriller logged 11 weeks at #1 in 2008. The Essential Michael Jackson spent one week at #1 in March 2009 (again, before Jackson's death). Number Ones logged 28 weeks at #1 in 2009 and 2010 (beginning the week after his death).

Michael Jackson Live At Wembley July 16, 1988 enters Top Music Videos at #1 this week, displacing One Direction's Up All Night—The Live Tour. Details below.
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Billboard don't seem to combine sales of BAD 25th & BAD.
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she DID NOT. and i will say this everytime i read this bullshit/fake/manipulation. <_<
 
respect77 said:
So? Greatest Hits albums tend to sell well. Re-releases are not greatest hits albums.

So it looks like US sales are disappointing? Sad, because it's a great release. I really can't understand the reasons. Even if you count on "MJ fatigue" or the USA's general hostility to MJ in the last 20 years, but Immortal sold 40k+ in its first week. So why did Bad25 sell so much less with all the promotion and positive reviews?

I think it probably has several factors, not just one.

- MJ died only 3 years ago and since then we had the usual post-death surge, TII, "Michael", Cirque, Immortal. Maybe too much. Maybe the Estate will need to change their strategy and wait MUCH longer periods between releases.

- Let's face it the "Michael" album was a huge disappointment for many fans. Maybe that left a bad taste in many people's mouth and now casual fans are wary of buying any new release by the Estate.

- Maybe many are only buying the DVD which doesn't count in the album sales.

- There seem to be problems with distribution.

- High price. (Yes, one can buy the 2CD version for cheaper, but it's relatively uninteresting compared to the concert.)

It's disappointing especially because it will certainly affect future projects. I wish it would sell more, of course, but at the end of the day casual fans who don't buy this are missing out big time. The irony is that while the media will no doubt remind of how it just confirms once again the superiority of Thriller (ignoring the fact that they shaped that common opinion and THAT might actually affect people's attitude), but this is actually a LOT better release than Thriller 25 was.

Well, let's hope Spike's docu put things right in November.

No matter how many it sells it certainly won't affect my opinion of it, which is that it's the best MJ release since more than a decade.
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GH always sell better, then regular albums. People tend to buy GH compilations of artist that they like , but not specific album. that way you cant go "wrong".

And sorry, I don't want to wait years, just because some are out of reality and want this releases to go no1 and sell millions. Did the SE releases bother you that much too, that they didn't went no1 and sell like hot cakes? this is not any different then the SE. Its for the fans and honoring the quarter century of age of the album.
It doesn't matter in its every year or every third. fans will buy it immediately . casual fans and regular music buyers will at some point.
'Michael' album has nothing to do with it. with the next posthumous album, people will be carefull before they buy it, yes.

Just enjoy the album and don't care about numbers that much.
 
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I think there's no need to look for a scapegoat here.

The promotion was fine : they got Spike Lee to make a feature-length, extra-positive documentary on the album, and played that documentary all over the world at some of the most prestigious film festivals. How many re-releases get that treatment? Even my local paper mentioned not once but twice the release of Bad 25 because of the film.

What happened is that the casual fan/general public didn't buy the album. When it comes to "Thriller", there's a nostalgia factor : people my age (thirties) want to own it because that's an era that have an ironic/non-ironic interest in. "Bad" just doesn't have that nostalgia factor going on for it. They tried to sell it on its artistic value, as a great album from a great genius, but most people just don't see MJ that way.

The 2-CD or 4-CD edition was also intimidating for those people; the way they see it, they only need the old CD from 2001, even if they do like Bad or that whole era. They don't care a bit about demos or anything like that.

But all of that was predictable. What DOES surprise me is that there are only 25 000 hardcore MJ fans left in the States. It's amazing to me when other old-timer artists like Paul McCartney always manage to sell 50 000 copies of everything they put out, even now, based on their hardcore fan base.

Expect many more MJ releases from now on to feature the words « Greatest" and "Hits" on them.
 
kreen;3715617 said:
I think there's no need to look for a scapegoat here.

The promotion was fine : they got Spike Lee to make a feature-length, extra-positive documentary on the album, and played that documentary all over the world at some of the most prestigious film festivals. How many re-releases get that treatment? Even my local paper mentioned not once but twice the release of Bad 25 because of the film.

What happened is that the casual fan/general public didn't buy the album. When it comes to "Thriller", there's a nostalgia factor : people my age (thirties) want to own it because that's an era that have an ironic/non-ironic interest in. "Bad" just doesn't have that nostalgia factor going on for it. They tried to sell it on its artistic value, as a great album from a great genius, but most people just don't see MJ that way.

The 2-CD or 4-CD edition was also intimidating for those people; the way they see it, they only need the old CD from 2001, even if they do like Bad or that whole era. They don't care a bit about demos or anything like that.

But all of that was predictable. What DOES surprise me is that there are only 25 000 hardcore MJ fans left in the States. It's amazing to me when other old-timer artists like Paul McCartney always manage to sell 50 000 copies of everything they put out, even now, based on their hardcore fan base.

Expect many more MJ releases from now on to feature the words « Greatest" and "Hits" on them.
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But Paul McCartney didn't die 3 years ago, sold 35M CDs and then 3 years later have a re-release.
 
kreen;3715617 said:
I think there's no need to look for a scapegoat here.

The promotion was fine : they got Spike Lee to make a feature-length, extra-positive documentary on the album, and played that documentary all over the world at some of the most prestigious film festivals. How many re-releases get that treatment? Even my local paper mentioned not once but twice the release of Bad 25 because of the film.

What happened is that the casual fan/general public didn't buy the album. When it comes to "Thriller", there's a nostalgia factor : people my age (thirties) want to own it because that's an era that have an ironic/non-ironic interest in. "Bad" just doesn't have that nostalgia factor going on for it. They tried to sell it on its artistic value, as a great album from a great genius, but most people just don't see MJ that way.

The 2-CD or 4-CD edition was also intimidating for those people; the way they see it, they only need the old CD from 2001, even if they do like Bad or that whole era. They don't care a bit about demos or anything like that.

But all of that was predictable. What DOES surprise me is that there are only 25 000 hardcore MJ fans left in the States. It's amazing to me when other old-timer artists like Paul McCartney always manage to sell 50 000 copies of everything they put out, even now, based on their hardcore fan base.

Expect many more MJ releases from now on to feature the words « Greatest" and "Hits" on them.
Click to expand...

Spike Lee documentary was a great idea, but it was executed very badly. The documentary should have been out (either in theatres or on major TV stations all around the world) few days before the release of the album. Or they could have included Spike's documentary in the boxset instead of Wembley concert. Many many many hardcore fans refused to buy it because the quality is below Michael Jackson standards. Why buy something like that if they can just download DVD via torrent in that exact same quality? (I bought DVD).

A review from a hardcore fan:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vRZuW01g4Q

Part at 9:00 is very true.
 
Nathy MJ said:
What I can't understand is that Immortal had much less promotion than Bad 25 and yet sold more. How is that possible?
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it's cheaper plus For bad25, sony released too many versions so it's hard to keep track or distribute them (some report that it's out or not available).

I think Sony focused on the hard-core fan this time, they maybe hope that the fan will buy different versions and they probably dont care about the chart as long as they can get more sales from different versions.
 
kreen;3715617 said:
I think there's no need to look for a scapegoat here.

The promotion was fine : they got Spike Lee to make a feature-length, extra-positive documentary on the album, and played that documentary all over the world at some of the most prestigious film festivals. How many re-releases get that treatment? Even my local paper mentioned not once but twice the release of Bad 25 because of the film.

What happened is that the casual fan/general public didn't buy the album. When it comes to "Thriller", there's a nostalgia factor : people my age (thirties) want to own it because that's an era that have an ironic/non-ironic interest in. "Bad" just doesn't have that nostalgia factor going on for it. They tried to sell it on its artistic value, as a great album from a great genius, but most people just don't see MJ that way.

The 2-CD or 4-CD edition was also intimidating for those people; the way they see it, they only need the old CD from 2001, even if they do like Bad or that whole era. They don't care a bit about demos or anything like that.

But all of that was predictable. What DOES surprise me is that there are only 25 000 hardcore MJ fans left in the States. It's amazing to me when other old-timer artists like Paul McCartney always manage to sell 50 000 copies of everything they put out, even now, based on their hardcore fan base.

Expect many more MJ releases from now on to feature the words « Greatest" and "Hits" on them.
Click to expand...

Ok, but does Paul McCartney sell this well all over the world?

Besides, the Docu was a great idea, but what good does it do if the public doesn't get to see it on time?


OnirMJ;3715635 said:
Spike Lee documentary was a great idea, but it was executed very badly. The documentary should have been out (either in theatres or on major TV stations all around the world) few days before the release of the album. Or they could have included Spike's documentary in the boxset instead of Wembley concert. Many many many hardcore fans refused to buy it because the quality is below Michael Jackson standards. Why buy something like that if they can just download DVD via torrent in that exact same quality? (I bought DVD).

A review from a hardcore fan:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vRZuW01g4Q

Part at 9:00 is very true.
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Exactly, the Docu was kind off a missed opportunity.
 
la_cienega said:
I think the marketing also failed. They should've hyped up some of the demos, the concert, and perhaps released one of the demos (I'm So Blue/Al Capone) using newly found footage from that time period around it as a music video. (Just my own idea, I don't know if everyone else would be into that).
Click to expand...

It should have had a single. All the other albums have a single and a video etc. This release only relies on the people knowing about the release to buy it.

OnirMJ said:
A review from a hardcore fan:
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who also happens to be an overly Anti- Estate fan.
 
I wonder and I really can't get it 'cause it sounds so obvious to me it would have changed the outcome drasticaly if the Estate had released the Docu the week before the release of the album, if in cinema maybe twoo weeks before the release of the album. Plus Price Of Fame would have done very well as a single.

Had this been done I think it would have been possible to get a Nr. 1 on BB. Call me naive, but I really believe it would have been possible.
 
Billie Jean 78 said:
I wonder and I really can't get it 'cause it sounds so obvious to me it would have changed the outcome drasticaly if the Estate had released the Docu the week before the release of the album, if in cinema maybe twoo weeks before the release of the album. Plus Price Of Fame would have done very well as a single.

Had this been done I think it would have been possible to get a Nr. 1 on BB. Call me naive, but I really believe it would have been possible.
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What was the Estate expectation? In my opinion, it's something that will sell over a long period, and the Christmas period will help.
 
here the chart positions for austria.

Bad 25: #10
Wembley DVD: #1 :jump:

if the price would not that high, it would do much better in austria.
 
Hess said:
BAD25 is nowhere to be found in Denmark - so naturally it hasn't charted!

I have not seen it in a single musicstore - same problem with the DVD - it's like it has not been released in Denmark. - Even the staff in the music stores do not know anything about BAD25 have been released!!!

It sucks!
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Really? I went to the music department in Stockholms biggest department store last week and asked for the CD and they told me they had 45 albums in stock! Ive seen the album on the shelves in different stores. However, they and other stores did not have the DVD so I had to order that one online.
 
Ok here is my final conclusion on this matter..

I honestly feel Sony didn't send out many "units" for sale. Period and point blank. I know here in Indiana it's virtually sold out just about everywhere so I think it's the Availability of Bad25 or Amazon,iTunes and MJ.com aren't kicking in for sales.
 
The CD Bad25 was last week at #14 in Sweden. The chart wont update till friday at 9am. The cd came out on september 19 in Sweden and in two days (chart update sept 21) it was at #14. Hopefully it have climbed the charts this week too, ill know on friday.
 
OnirMJ said:
Spike Lee documentary was a great idea, but it was executed very badly. The documentary should have been out (either in theatres or on major TV stations all around the world) few days before the release of the album. Or they could have included Spike's documentary in the boxset instead of Wembley concert. Many many many hardcore fans refused to buy it because the quality is below Michael Jackson standards. Why buy something like that if they can just download DVD via torrent in that exact same quality? (I bought DVD).

A review from a hardcore fan:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vRZuW01g4Q

Part at 9:00 is very true.
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That is far fetched and not many many many fans boycotted ....

This time, fans did rally to buy this ....It's the general public that has ignored the product.

That ..and Sony probably not turning in their sales.
 
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I don't know if I've seen too many classic albums re-issues with a single and a video. Thriller 25 had TGIM 2008, but that's thee only one I can think of. Just doesn't happen with these sort of albums. We can't expect sales like it's a brand new album.
 
kreen;3715617 said:
I think there's no need to look for a scapegoat here.

The promotion was fine : they got Spike Lee to make a feature-length, extra-positive documentary on the album, and played that documentary all over the world at some of the most prestigious film festivals. How many re-releases get that treatment? Even my local paper mentioned not once but twice the release of Bad 25 because of the film.

What happened is that the casual fan/general public didn't buy the album. When it comes to "Thriller", there's a nostalgia factor : people my age (thirties) want to own it because that's an era that have an ironic/non-ironic interest in. "Bad" just doesn't have that nostalgia factor going on for it. They tried to sell it on its artistic value, as a great album from a great genius, but most people just don't see MJ that way.

The 2-CD or 4-CD edition was also intimidating for those people; the way they see it, they only need the old CD from 2001, even if they do like Bad or that whole era. They don't care a bit about demos or anything like that.

But all of that was predictable. What DOES surprise me is that there are only 25 000 hardcore MJ fans left in the States. It's amazing to me when other old-timer artists like Paul McCartney always manage to sell 50 000 copies of everything they put out, even now, based on their hardcore fan base.

Expect many more MJ releases from now on to feature the words « Greatest" and "Hits" on them.
Click to expand...

Why the comparison with a living artist who puts out new albums? It's not like Paul McCartney sets the charts at fire, anyway (his album already dropped big time - and the fan reviews I saw were not that great anyway). Will any one the re-release Paul's solo albums sell like this years after he died? We will see, but that would be the fair comparison, not that you compare new albums by Paul to re-releases. Of course, you can bring up how well (usually) Beatles albums sell recently, but this Beatles renaissance also needed time to build. Back in the 80s there were times when a Greatest Hits compilation by the Beatles peaked at Nr 50 on the Billboard. There's a reason why Michael could buy their catalog for relatively cheap at the time.

Timing is very important. It seems like it's not time for Michael releases to be successful in the States. Michael's time will come again, IMO, but the US public may be a bit tired of him right now (when he died he was everywhere, people bought his albums - and it was only three years ago). You cannot expect a dead artist to have big releases every second year and sell well. IMO the Estate needs to take it a bit slower, Michael got over-exposed in the last three years. Obviously he's never over-exposed for us, fans, but the general public can get tired of hearing about him. That's another factor to consider when we compare this to Thriller 25.

Also, as others say, Spike's docu is great but it cannot have much impact on the sales until they don't show it on TV.

Yes, it's sad if only that many hard core fans are left in the US, but we knew already that Michael had it difficult in the US since 1993. The US abandoned him for a long time, compared to other markets. And those have reasons outside of music and art. Hopefully one day the US too will realize how unfairly they judged him.
 
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