BAD25 - designated Discussion Thread

[mjleavemealone]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

I really can't wait til' all this bad era stuff is released, i check spike lee's twitter all the time for news. I will be so happy if the concert is good quality.

 

[Carmour260]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

Me too. I think it's fantastic Michael kept his performances, they are amazing things to watch and they prove he was out of this world when it came to performing.

That's very true. We're now two months away...I think by next month, we'll be getting a lot more information. I enjoyed that little treat with "Don't Be Messin' 'Round." That was brilliant to see how Michael works behind the scenes.

 

[MjsLovelyOne88]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

BTW just a sidenote, I'm not talking about amateur video. U know there are fans and non fans out there who has the pro tapes actually of such stuff we ain't seen in dreams. Several people in world have it but not Estate lol. I know this stuff, this is a fact.

Yeah, people who somehow get their hands on this whole unseen footage and whatnot, I know I know. Still, I'm not letting this ruin the excitement, And those screen caps you posted? I'm totally fine with the quality or "low quality" for some of you..lol.

 

[Moon__Walk]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

I think to suppress people's concerns, the Estate should release a video documenting the restoration process of the VHS. Interviews with the technical personnel that are restoring it, in which they can explain exactly what they're doing and how it improves the video quality. Then end with a snippet of the concert, before and after restoration side by side. Distribute it on Youtube and to fan clubs.

 

[Arklove]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

Seeing MJ, in his prime, in the best quality possible, for some of us, is absolute pure magic....We crave it....It`s almost a sickness....You can`t blame us, really....

I`ll be happy no matter what quality...But there`s always gonna be this...`what if`...type of feeling....It`s just the type of artist he was.....

 

[MjsLovelyOne88]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

Seeing MJ, in his prime, in the best quality possible, for some of us, is absolute pure magic....We crave it....It`s almost a sickness....You can`t blame us, really....

I`ll be happy no matter what quality...But there`s always gonna be this...`what if`...type of feeling....It`s just the type of artist he was.....

That's what I've been trying to express, I don't mind how I get to see MJ working his magic, I just want it. Period.

 

[Rudolf]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

Yeah, I'll be happy of course too, in any case. But yet quality is very important to me. VHS is fine for bootlegs.
I'm sure people will be blown away watching the Wembley DVD, BUT I'm sure you'd be 100X more blown away watching Wembley Blu-Ray. Higher quality = bigger impression. At least that's how it is with me in MJ case.
Also yeah, I completely agree with Moon__Walk about restoration documentary. That would be VERY interesting to watch for me

 

[bobmoo79]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

I agree with everything you say, but these people are magician's. I have no clue how good they'll do the job.

The snippet is very blurred and so has a lack of detail. The 'magicians' can do their best to cure any blotches or VHS 'wobble', adjust colour, brightness, contrast etc to a limited degree, maybe sharpen some edges here and there, but they can't add video detail where it doesn't exist. If you try to watch this on a large screen LCD/LED/Plasma TV it's just going to look awful. Reading through my posts again it seems like I'm on a real downer on this project. I'm not, I'm glad a BAD concert's being released and if this is the best they can do then so be it, I just don't want people here to have unrealistic expectations of what they're going to get and then start ranting at the Estate once it's released, causing more negative headlines just like with the posthumous album that won't be discussed here (begins with 'M').


P.S A restoration documentary is a brilliant idea, even if they only release a short video (maybe only 15 minutes or something). It shows a willingness to be transparent in what they're doing and what limitations they face. This could all be explained by the professionals.

The more I think about it the more I'm disappointed that we don't have something in great quality. For example there are Elvis performances in great quality - '68 special for example - yet MJ's greatest tour is being released in poor quality. Such a wasted opportunity.

 

[Dorian]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

I think to suppress people's concerns, the Estate should release a video documenting the restoration process of the VHS. Interviews with the technical personnel that are restoring it, in which they can explain exactly what they're doing and how it improves the video quality. Then end with a snippet of the concert, before and after restoration side by side. Distribute it on Youtube and to fan clubs.

They did this with Immortal Tour



Hope they will do it again!

 

[Galactus123]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

I hope nobody expects amazing quality. It is from old vhs tape that was never intended for official release. I wonder why Michael didn't want the original U-matic tape?

 

[Rudolf]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

I hope nobody expects amazing quality. It is from old vhs tape that was never intended for official release. I wonder why Michael didn't want the original U-matic tape?

Why would he need at home U-matic tape that I believe needs to have specific player to play it back? I believe he had enough with regular VHS at the time.

 

[Galactus123]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

Why would he need at home U-matic tape that I believe needs to have specific player to play it back? I believe he had enough with regular VHS at the time.

Your right. He wouldn't need U-matic player because I'm sure he didn't watch the concert many times if any. He just wanted to own it.

 

[lom kit]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

Yeah, people who somehow get their hands on this whole unseen footage and whatnot, I know I know. Still, I'm not letting this ruin the excitement, And those screen caps you posted? I'm totally fine with the quality or "low quality" for some of you..lol.

No wonder the estate manage to clear almost Michaels debt in just 3 years, when people are satisfied with so much less. they buy everything, no matter how low the quality is.

Bashing about the Vision dvds, but LOOOOLing about those who don't feel they have to be always positive with everything we get offered.

 

[Hunterr]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

wat?

The Visions dvd was a great idea, but there obviously was no quality control over it.
The HIStory and Dangerous videos dvd look perfect, whereas the Visions videos look like they were sourced from MJ's personal VHS collection

 

[XgenDaNcEs]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

Correct me if im wrong, but wasnt the HQ Lounis Production videos a VHS source? it had 24 years of degradation too, God knows how many times it was replayed, it wasnt even enhanced and it still looked great to me. Instead of pointing out out how much quality has been lost with the VHS source, lets point out how the professionals are gonna restore it. Everyone needs to know they are not using Sony Vegas or whatever, im sure they restored the footage using several state of the art programs, they are trained professionals and have been working on it for months. If we could enhance a video for Youtube in a day and still notice a good difference just imagine what they have achieved with it!

 

[Topcronos]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

Yes it's BELOW VHS standards. (thanks for the screen caps MJJLatvia)
The reason is simple. As soon as a VHS is made the magnetic tape starts to degrade. IF this VHS was created in the late 80s it's had over 20 years of degradation even if it was never played! If it was made in the late 90s which to me is definitely the last time anybody would ask for a VHS to be created since DVDs were widespread by then (we had our first DVD player in 1998/9), expecially for those who had money, then it's had maybe 15 years to degrade.
It's also true that every time a VHS is played it is slightly degraded through mechanical wear (i.e. the tape rubbing against the video and audio heads), and by stretching (this is made worse when fast forwarding/rewinding and especially if the owner likes to pause!). We don't know if this was a first generation VHS taken straight from source or if it was a duplicate VHS (my guess judging from the clip is that it's the latter)

Once VHS degradation has occured it's not possible to restore it to its previous state.

It doesn't matter who did the enhancements they wouldn't be able to enhance an old VHS back to original quality, so yes the DVD release will be below VHS standards.

Well, I am not sure we can be that certain.
It is a fact that magnetic tapes do degrade over time, but I would like to share my experience on this.
I personally own the Dinah Shore show with J5 performance. I do not recall how old it is but we can reasonably say its 20 years old.
Believe me, quality is JUST great. The tape I bought was in a mint state but surely deteriorated over time. Still it's very pleasant to watch. TinoMJ posted a rip of this tape in the 2000watts section.

Regarding the snippet posted by the estate, are we even sure it's a direct rip from the concert VHS ?
As far as I know the estate never confirmed nor infirmed it. Could be from any other source, even from another YT video should they be in a rush to build the trailer. This snippet of bad song from wembley can be found in many TV special, news report, fan videos etc...

And finally, I was watching PHM recently. You can see snippets from wembleys show. I recall a very short snippet where MJ is dressed with TWYMMF outfit, fainting to punch the camera. Surely from personal MJ video collection in VHS and quality is pretty I must observe.


Again, as many of us said, let's wait for the DVD to be released but I am confident we'll really be blown away !

 

[MJBT]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

I'm only going to be watching this DVD for months afterwards, CAN'T WAIT HURRY UP SEPTEMBER

 

[marebear]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

When Bad came out I was about 11 years old so my memories about it are not as strong. This just brings it back for me and just takes me back to my youth. It just doesn't bother me that the source is from VHS. I think it's special that it is from Michael's. It is something he wanted and kept all these years. Now we will get to see it.

 

[Ashtanga]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

 

[IMWhizzle]

Well, I am not sure we can be that certain.
It is a fact that magnetic tapes do degrade over time, but I would like to share my experience on this.
I personally own the Dinah Shore show with J5 performance. I do not recall how old it is but we can reasonably say its 20 years old.
Believe me, quality is JUST great. The tape I bought was in a mint state but surely deteriorated over time. Still it's very pleasant to watch. TinoMJ posted a rip of this tape in the 2000watts section.

Regarding the snippet posted by the estate, are we even sure it's a direct rip from the concert VHS ?
As far as I know the estate never confirmed nor infirmed it. Could be from any other source, even from another YT video should they be in a rush to build the trailer. This snippet of bad song from wembley can be found in many TV special, news report, fan videos etc...

And finally, I was watching PHM recently. You can see snippets from wembleys show. I recall a very short snippet where MJ is dressed with TWYMMF outfit, fainting to punch the camera. Surely from personal MJ video collection in VHS and quality is pretty I must observe.


Again, as many of us said, let's wait for the DVD to be released but I am confident we'll really be blown away !

Interesting thought! Let's hope so. Honestly, I don't think that the estate would allow a bad picture release. The Sony brand is a huge one within the music industry. I think that they are giving their all with BAD25. Must be.

Even if they can make the picture like Bucharest show it will be more pleasant to watch. That's if they are releasing a powerful surround soundtrack on the DVD, which will give the experience boost!

I just hope that it won't be a stereo soundtrack only. I mean come on, they have multitracks!!! Use that to its potential Sony, please!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[MjsLovelyOne88]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

No wonder the estate manage to clear almost Michaels debt in just 3 years, when people are satisfied with so much less. they buy everything, no matter how low the quality is.

Bashing about the Vision dvds, but LOOOOLing about those who don't feel they have to be always positive with everything we get offered.

No wonder? well, I can't be excited or be positive about MJ related stuff? instead I have to complain or bash something that hasn't even been released and that I haven't fully seen? I don't know how the final product will look neither do you and we won't until it's released. You can LOL all you want, but all I know is that I'm excited for the news and won't be pissed at the video's quality UNTIL I see it. Oh, and by the way I haven't bought much since MJ passed away. If you're suggesting I'm a nutcase who buys whatever the Estate puts out there, well no but I'm definitely excited over this, why is that so wrong? damn, sometimes I can't believe the things people say. I think those of you who don't like what you've seen so far should respect those of us who aren't making early assumptions or complaining about the quality of this, but are instead just happy we get something "new" from Michael. Sheesh.:sigh:

 

[bobmoo79]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

Well, I am not sure we can be that certain.
It is a fact that magnetic tapes do degrade over time, but I would like to share my experience on this.
I personally own the Dinah Shore show with J5 performance. I do not recall how old it is but we can reasonably say its 20 years old.
Believe me, quality is JUST great. The tape I bought was in a mint state but surely deteriorated over time. Still it's very pleasant to watch. TinoMJ posted a rip of this tape in the 2000watts section.

Regarding the snippet posted by the estate, are we even sure it's a direct rip from the concert VHS ?
As far as I know the estate never confirmed nor infirmed it. Could be from any other source, even from another YT video should they be in a rush to build the trailer. This snippet of bad song from wembley can be found in many TV special, news report, fan videos etc...

And finally, I was watching PHM recently. You can see snippets from wembleys show. I recall a very short snippet where MJ is dressed with TWYMMF outfit, fainting to punch the camera. Surely from personal MJ video collection in VHS and quality is pretty I must observe.


Again, as many of us said, let's wait for the DVD to be released but I am confident we'll really be blown away !

I'm glad your VHS is still in good condition (although undoubtedly worse than 20 years ago).

I assumed that the estate released a clip from MJ's personal VHS because I see no reason for them to release another video to the media instead. Why announce that they're releasing a concert from Michael Jackson's personal VHS and then release a clip from a different source (e.g. Youtube) to the media? It makes no sense to me, especially if the clip they released is lower quality then the VHS they're going to release.

Nobody was forcing them to make the announcement that day. When publicising the product I'm sure they wanted to send out the highest quality clip they had. That's why I personally feel that the clip they issued is likely to have already been enhanced in some way. Why release a clip before it has been enhanced? They had time on their side, so if they didn't have any enhanced footage on announcement day all they needed to do was wait until they could get 20 seconds of video enhanced and announce the concert at that time instead.

Anyway, if that it is true that the video clip they released is from MJ's VHS then the image quality will be low because nobody can make a vast improvement on it. Even if it wasn't already enhanced, there's not much they can do to improve it.

BUT I do accept that if your theory is correct and they released a clip that is lower quality than the VHS they have in their posession (it seems virtually unimaginable to me), then the picture quality can be much better because in that situation we don't yet know what the source quality is like.

 

[dam2040]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

My VHS from '88 to see the quality of a heavily played 24 year old tape.

 

[dam2040]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

My cousin was security for the show. (You can see him at 0:46 in the above video I posted )

 

[MjsLovelyOne88]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

My VHS from '88 to see the quality of a heavily played 24 year old tape.

You taped that? ahhh thanks for sharing. Of course it looks like a late 80's vhs would look but honestly it's still quite acceptable and even more if it's been heavily played.

 

[IMWhizzle]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

I don't think that this is an enjoying quality if the video will be like this.

But hey, at least we'll get a high quality audio experience.

 

[dam2040]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

I don't think that this is an enjoying quality if the video will be like this.

But hey, at least we'll get a high quality audio experience.

I agree, but atleast we're getting something from the 2nd leg of the Bad tour. It would be good to have better quality, but hey.

 

[Victor]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

Better than nothing
At least were getting a 2' leg Bad Tour concert released, for our viewing pleasure

 

[Rudolf]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

I Just hope it's decent looking and watchable. By that I mean no worse than Yokohama. If it's worse then h34r:

 

[WildStyle]

Re: BAD25 - The Announcement We Have All Been Waiting For [General Discussion]

The only thing unwatchable for me would be if it were like the bootleg of Victory Tour Dallas or something. Which it won't be.