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Preliminary Hearing 11/1/11. Day Six. Discussion Thread

Vici said:
yeah, what hasnt so far? ;):p
i really wonder whats going through murrays mind at this moment..
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Judging by everything we know about him (doesn't know address, no watch, etc., etc., etc.) and the girlfriends he chooses (doesn't remember when she got pregnant, etc., etc., etc.) ... not much.
 
From Trials and Tribulations unedited draft update

Dr. Richard Ruffalo

- Ruffalo is an anesthesiologist and clinical pharmacologist. He went over everything about MJ's death and wrote a 47 page independent report.

- He says propofol levels in MJ at the time of his death would be even higher as the blood is drawn from him after he received a lot of IV fluids and propofol degrades over time.

- Dr, Ruffolo also thinks the numbers of the benzodiazapams from the heart blood, he thinks reflect an injection of a higher dose than what Dr. Murray states he gave.

- Dr. Ruffolo mentions monitoring requirements and the equipments and training needed for any emergency situation response.
 
Ingelief said:
question the prelim is to take two weeks? is that 10 workdays or 14?
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prob be done within the next couple of days or so as reported yesterday 24-30 witnesses we are at 22 now i believe. getting through 4 a day normally
 
ivy said:
- Dr, Ruffolo also thinks the numbers of the benzodiazapams from the heart blood, he thinks reflect an injection/ingestion of a HIGHER dose than what Dr. Murray states he gave.
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With the higher dose, he's referring to the benzos, I hope? Because it says "ingestion".
 
Dr, Ruffolo also thinks the numbers of the benzodiazapams from the heart blood, he thinks reflect an injection/ingestion of a HIGHER dose than what Dr. Murray states he gave.
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which has been said on here for along time.......
 
ivy said:
From Trials and Tribulations unedited draft update

Dr. Richard Ruffalo

- Ruffalo is an anesthesiologist and clinical pharmacologist. He went over everything about MJ's death and wrote a 47 page independent report.

- He says propofol levels in MJ at the time of his death would be even higher as the blood is drawn from him after he received a lot of IV fluids and propofol degrades over time.

- Dr, Ruffolo also thinks the numbers of the benzodiazapams from the heart blood, he thinks reflect an injection/ingestion of a HIGHER dose than what Dr. Murray states he gave.

- Dr. Ruffolo mentions monitoring requirements and the equipments and training needed for any emergency situation response.
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No matter what, Murray is not going to be able to get around the science of it all. I can't believe all of this. It really is worse than I thought.

I really will be shocked if the judge does not strip him of his medical license at the end of this. Isn't it right that he has the power to do so?
 
Milka said:
With the higher dose, he's referring to the benzos, I hope? Because it says "ingestion".
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My understanding is that both propofol and benzo levels should be higher at the time of MJ's death.

as blood samples are taken after he died and received IV fluids and propofol got degraded/broken down, they are showing 5-30% lower propofol and benzo amounts.
 
CNN In Session

The next witness is Dr. Richard Ruffalo. Ruffalo is an anesthesiologist and clinical pharmacologist.

In this case, he was asked to review a body of materials and offer his opinion about any possible deviation from the standard of care.

According to Dr. Ruffalo, if one is given propofol, monitoring techniques should be utilized.

But if one is mixing propofol with other medications, the risks of a bad reaction are increased.

Ruffalo: “You clearly need to pay even more attention...you’d need to be able to do resuscitative efforts."
 
ivy said:
My understanding is that both propofol and benzo levels should be higher at the time of MJ's death.

as blood samples are taken after he died and received IV fluids and propofol got degraded/broken down, they are showing 5-30% lower propofol and benzo amounts.
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Oh, ok, that makes sense. So the "ingestion" part is more of a general term in this context and probably about the benzos.
 
I really will be shocked if the judge does not strip him of his medical license at the end of this. Isn't it right that he has the power to do so?
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yes. the judge said at the beginging of the prelim he will look at the licence issue at the end of the prelim. it will give us an idea of what this judge is like and which way is going depending on what he does. and his wife is a dr if i remember right
 
omg omg murray is going to have a buddy in prison... i just hope its one hell of a big guy along with him being a big ass mj fan...
 
Sophielo said:
There is no way after all this he can keep his licence, its just impossible.
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Unfortunately, when it comes to something related to MJ, everything is possible :no:
But I want them so bad to prove me wrong!! Please!!!!! There is no single way this fellow can keep being a "doctor", for GOODNESS SAKE!!!!!
:tickingtimebomb
 
Milka said:
Oh, ok, that makes sense. So the "ingestion" part is more of a general term in this context and probably about the benzos.
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I think that's more like "regardless of how you think he received these medications" the actual amounts in his system when he died was higher.

Nothing more.
 
ivy said:
I think that's more like "regardless of how you think he received these medications" the actual amounts in his system when he died was higher.

Nothing more.
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Yeah, that's what I was trying to say, thanks for the translation. ;)
 
Still can't match the autopsy results, which are saying Michael was n good shape (today we've heard he was an "excellent" health) with those claiming he wasn't.

Random:
@ChuckyKlapow Michael's fans would like to speak to you here: http://www.ustream.tv/channel/conrad-murray-back-in-court

@PunkyzNena as soon as I'm on a computer I'll go to your link
1 minute ago via Twitter for BlackBerry®
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Erin on UStream said that Coroner said, if Murray had only given 25 mg Propofol and then went to bathroom, Michael would have been awake when he came back after 2 minutes. And that Michael couldn't have injected himself, he would have been to groggy from the Propofol and all the other meds he was given.

P. S. Could someone post the COD again, please? There's something in there about the benzos as well, right?
 
Milka said:
Erin on UStream said that Coroner said, if Murray had only given 25 mg Propofol and then went to bathroom, Michael would have been awake when he came back after 2 minutes. And that Michael couldn't have injected himself, he would have been to groggy from the Propofol and all the other meds he was given.

. . .
I think this is another thing that people had already been saying in terms of Michael being too groggy from the meds.
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Ingelief said:
but it started on a thuesday right? so monday would be ten? hope they finish this week
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in the beginning they said 7-8 days with 20-30 witnesses. We are on the 6th day with the 22nd witness. It will be over soon.
 
Still can't match the autopsy results, which are saying Michael was n good shape (today we've heard he was an "excellent" health) with those claiming he wasn't
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He was in excellent health sure , try a 4mg of lorazepam intravenously and everyone will say you look OUT OF IT .

My Mother has been ABUSING lorazepam for 30 years, and when she takes MORE , I know immediately.

Imagine someone who was not used to it, who was not abusing it. How much it was affecting his ability.

Ortega described MJ's state as SCARY on April 19Th, everyone began to have suspicious over what Murray was doing INCLUDING MICHAEL and that's why he called Lee on April 21st
 
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