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A theory: Michael himself bought in a vocal double on the Cascio songs.

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MattyJam

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Hear me out, because I think this is a plausable theory:

I believe MJ DID work on these songs with the Cascios but didn't feel ready to record a proper vocal performance, so he bought in a voice double to lay down the vocals with the intention of laying down his own vocals at a later stage. It wouldn't be unheard of.... R Kelly said when he wrote songs for Michael he would try and sing them as if he actually was Michael.

Many people who worked on TII said that MJ was "warming up" his voice again after many years of semi-retirement and not really using his voice properly. Don't forget MJ hadn't sung out properly in a long time so it's perfecty plausable that he would do this.

Michael died before he got a chance to resume work on these songs and the Cascios justified releasing them under the (misguided) logic that these ARE real MJ songs which he WAS working on, he just never got around to doing the vocals.

This is the only explanation I can think of as to why the vocals don't sound 100% legitimate. The Cascio's were close friends with Michael and I don't believe they would create completely fake songs which MJ hadn't at least contributed to.
 
Be prepared to get flamed for creating a new thread, especially on this issue.
 
Oh God. I just think he did record them but when Sony bought them, they were heavily edited or someone else's vocals were added. I choose to believe the Cascio's as in he recorded them himself in their studio.
 
Well come on, you have to think of every possible explanation. No harm in throwing out ideas, its hardly going to overflow the forum -_-

Oh no! An extra thread which we feel is pointless! Why did you post this!? The forum may very well explode!

At this point, no theory is wrong. I still think this could be possible.
 
Jason Malachi said in 2007 that he was working with Michael in the studio (which is the same year the Cascio songs were recorded).

At the time, I remember many fans saying "why would MJ work with an impersonator?" and this could be why.

The vocals were always the last thing MJ did when he was creating a song. He was working on these songs with the Cascios at a time when he hadn't really used his voice for years. He might of felt out of shape and wanted to use a vocal impersonator as a guide vocal. That happens a lot when artists are doing demos for other people. Prince used to record a guide vocal for Morris Day when he wrote songs for The Time.

The fact that Jason Malachi claimed to have worked with MJ in 2007 only adds more credibility to this theory.
 
MattyJam said:
Jason Malachi said in 2007 that he was working with Michael in the studio (which is the same year the Cascio songs were recorded).

At the time, I remember many fans saying "why would MJ work with an impersonator?" and this could be why.

The vocals were always the last thing MJ did when he was creating a song. He was working on these songs with the Cascios at a time when he hadn't really used his voice for years. He might of felt out of shape and wanted to use a vocal impersonator as a guide vocal. That happens a lot when artists are doing demos for other people. Prince used to record a guide vocal for Morris Day when he wrote songs for The Time.

The fact that Jason Malachi claimed to have worked with MJ in 2007 only adds more credibility to this theory.
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He claimed that? Never heard about this. Source?
 
L.T.D said:
Well come on, you have to think of every possible explanation. No harm in throwing out ideas, its hardly going to overflow the forum -_-

Oh no! An extra thread which we feel is pointless! Why did you post this!? The forum may very well explode!

At this point, no theory is wrong. I still think this could be possible.
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Only one theory can be right. I know which one is right but everyone has their own opinion. If they chooe to ruin the legacy of Michael Jackson, that's their choice and no one has the right to stop them.
 
I think that's not very reasonable theory but I think it's possible Michael just intentionally sung differently. He was able to change his voice if he wanted. And go really really low from his usual register. Don't you remember that phone call when he was pretending he is his own secretary.

I think if he changed his voice intentionally a bit, and the song would have leaked, people wouldn't have believed it's him but an impersonator. So who knows. But I think those tracks are Michael but the processing make them sound different. Somehow they don't sound "too different" now when your listening with the good stereo equipment. When I listen those songs I don't really think about the voice because it is very Michaelish..
 
KingMikeJ said:
Only one theory can be right. I know which one is right but everyone has their own opinion. If they chooe to ruin the legacy of Michael Jackson, that's their choice and no one has the right to stop them.
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Michael's legacy has been cemented already. If the trial didnt ruin his legacy, then saying vocals on certain songs are fake is hardly going to ruin it. QUITE over dramatic.

I have to question some peoples ego's when they automatically think there opinion is right. I mean, your just so openly arrogant...have you no shame?
 
L.T.D said:
Michael's legacy has been cemented already. If the trial didnt ruin his legacy, then saying vocals on certain songs are fake is hardly going to ruin it. QUITE over dramatic.

I have to question some peoples ego's when they automatically think there opinion is right. I mean, your just so openly arrogant...have you no shame?
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No I don't, I know I'm right, but I respect your opinion. And yes, if this album flops it will damage Michael's legacy. The media will write that he hasn't had "it" since Bad or Dangerous. Invincible is still called "dodgy", "dull", "awful", "boring" or something like that in the press. The media don't forget when a Michael Jackson album flops.
 
Michael was no stranger to using impersonators/body doubles.

In The Simpsons, he sat in the studio next to a sound alike and they recorded the song "Lisa It's Your Birthday" because his Sony contract wouldn't allow him to perform.

In the Superbowl, he used doubles to trick the audience, the Who Is It video used a look alike in parts and there are numerous occassions where he would disguise himself or use look alikes as decoys.

R Kelly spoke about singing like Michael for him to hear himself on the record.

For the Cascio song, the singer (if not Michael) tries to mimic him, perhaps to make the guide vocal for Michael to later add his voice to.

All I'm saying is that it's certainly a *possibility* that Michael knew all about this and taking that a stretch further, could possibly have known that Sony would have bought them... I dont believe that but it's a theory.

The truth WILL come out either way when the album hits the stores. This is Michael Jackson we're talking about.

I am in doubt about the vocals. I don't hear him (apart from the embellished bits) but agree that Sony/The Estate would be mad to do this. Their facts would have to be concrete. We haven't seen any proof yet though...

I found the Cascio family to be very sweet on the interview. I also agree with members who say that if 3T know the tracks are fake, then they should sue rather than Tweet.

Ultimately, this is all a mess and the tracks should not have been added.
 
L.T.D said:
Michael's legacy has been cemented already. If the trial didnt ruin his legacy, then saying vocals on certain songs are fake is hardly going to ruin it. QUITE over dramatic.
I have to question some peoples ego's when they automatically think there opinion is right. I mean, your just so openly arrogant...have you no shame?
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:agree::clapping:SERIOUSLY!

Originally Posted by MattyJam
Jason Malachi said in 2007 that he was working with Michael in the studio (which is the same year the Cascio songs were recorded).
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:bugeyed If that ends up being true!?:doh: YIKES! lol
 
KingMikeJ said:
No I don't, I know I'm right, but I respect your opinion. And yes, if this album flops it will damage Michael's legacy. The media will write that he hasn't had "it" since Bad or Dangerous. Invincible is still called "dodgy", "dull", "awful", "boring" or something like that in the press. The media don't forget when a Michael Jackson album flops.
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The album will dominate either way.....even a lot of people saying the vocals are fake are still buying the album. Such as myself.
 
KingMikeJ said:
No I don't, I know I'm right, but I respect your opinion. And yes, if this album flops it will damage Michael's legacy. The media will write that he hasn't had "it" since Bad or Dangerous. Invincible is still called "dodgy", "dull", "awful", "boring" or something like that in the press. The media don't forget when a Michael Jackson album flops.
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The media will always find a reason to hate on MJ...doesn't matter where he's positioned in the charts. Dangerous is often dismissed and some aren't even aware of its existence despite it being in the top 20 selling albums of all time.
 
Guide vocals demos - are one thing, indeed those are used by some producers writers in first stages of a song

Hiring because you are not able to sing? - that is not the truth with Mike, completely invented. Media people are coming here read that, in in week or so we will see it in the papers.

Fans should be more responsible. I mean all of us, those against the tracks, those pro tracks, does not matter - we should try to be more responsible and more diplomatic in what we write here.
 
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The media had it out for MJ a long time ago! So what's new? It was more worrying when some of them all of a sudden kissed his ass after June 25th! Now there was a shocker! lol
 
czechstar said:
Michael was no stranger to using impersonators/body doubles.

In The Simpsons, he sat in the studio next to a sound alike and they recorded the song "Lisa It's Your Birthday" because his Sony contract wouldn't allow him to perform.

In the Superbowl, he used doubles to trick the audience, the Who Is It video used a look alike in parts and there are numerous occassions where he would disguise himself or use look alikes as decoys.

R Kelly spoke about singing like Michael for him to hear himself on the record.

For the Cascio song, the singer (if not Michael) tries to mimic him, perhaps to make the guide vocal for Michael to later add his voice to.

All I'm saying is that it's certainly a *possibility* that Michael knew all about this and taking that a stretch further, could possibly have known that Sony would have bought them... I dont believe that but it's a theory.

The truth WILL come out either way when the album hits the stores. This is Michael Jackson we're talking about.

I am in doubt about the vocals. I don't hear him (apart from the embellished bits) but agree that Sony/The Estate would be mad to do this. Their facts would have to be concrete. We haven't seen any proof yet though...

I found the Cascio family to be very sweet on the interview. I also agree with members who say that if 3T know the tracks are fake, then they should sue rather than Tweet.

Ultimately, this is all a mess and the tracks should not have been added.
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Excellent post.

At the end of the day there are 3 options:

1. These songs are genuinely Michael Jackson's vocals.
2. The Cascio's created the songs and Michael had nothing to do with them, which would be a HUGE betrayal of someone who has been their friend for many, many years.
3. Michael worked on these songs but worked with a voice double.


I think number 3 is the most likely scenario.
 
MattyJam said:
The vocals were always the last thing MJ did when he was creating a song. He was working on these songs with the Cascios at a time when he hadn't really used his voice for years.
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Do you honestly think that Mike used to sing only for albums?? I mean he didn't sing all those years in the house, around the house, in the nature? Never?

Do you know what an artist is? How artistic process is working.... What an artist is doing in his home? His artistic pleasures are not directlly linked by finished projects, payed projects, and rewards.

I am sure Mike sung more around house than studio, all his life. Trust me, the percents would be 90-95% outside studio, and only 10-5% in studio!
What we see from an artist as finished work represent 5-10% at most, of the entire artistic vision, preoccupation and practice.
 
Tipareth said:
Guide vocals demos - are one thing, indeed those are used by some producers writers in first stages of a song

Hiring because you are not able to sing? - that is not the truth with Mike, completely invented. Media peopel are coming here read that, in in week or so we will see it in the papers.

Fans should be more responsible. I mean all of us, those against the tracks, those pro tracks, does not matter - we should try to be more responsible and more diplomatic in what we write here.
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I'm not saying Michael couldn't sing anymore. But if someone goes years without using their voice properly they can't just wake up one day and be on the top of their game.

Even the vocal coach from TII confirmed that MJ initially had some trouble nailing some of his vocals after not having performed in such a long time.
 
Tipareth said:
Do you honestly think that Mike used to sing only for albums?? I mean he didn't sing all those years in the house, around the house, in the nature? Never?

Do you know what an artist is? How artistic process is working.... What an artist is doing in his home? His artistic pleasures are not directlly linked by finished projects, payed projects, and rewards.

I am sure Mike sung more around house than studio, all his life. Trust me, the percents would be 90-95% outside studio, and only 10-5% in studio!
What we see from an artist as finished work represent 5-10% at most, of the entire artistic vision, preoccupation and practice.
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How do you know that? For all you know Michael may have gone years without singing properly.

When Axl Rose split up from the original lineup of Guns N Roses he went years and years without singing a word. When he eventually reformed the group with a new lineup it took him a number of years to get his voice back in proper shape again.
 
Well everybody can have some problems even after a week of stop.
That's why there's need of warming the voice.I do not think Mike didn't know how to sing 'properly' just because he used his singing in non studio environment. . .


And I am sure he sung all those years, that's artists do... they always doing their thing, never stoping only if you are with some handicap you stop. Meaning I will stop photographing if I am gonna get blind or my hands cannot hold the camera anymore. The photos that I publish and sell are tiny fragment of what I am producing, representing around 3% or less of what I am doing.

As for the vocal coach from TII, as other people surrounding Mike, I think he/she felt the need to hear himself/herself a bit more on tv/radio... therefor the rambling... :cheeky:
 
MattyJam said:
How do you know that? For all you know Michael may have gone years without singing properly.

When Axl Rose split up from the original lineup of Guns N Roses he went years and years without singing a word. When he eventually reformed the group with a new lineup it took him a number of years to get his voice back in proper shape again.
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The this artist was only 'artist', I mean not in true sense... his artistry was not that important...
 
Hahahaha. Oh my. This is just getting ridiculous now.
 
Nova said:
Hahahaha. Oh my. This is just getting ridiculous now.
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What's ridiculous is the estate approving songs with questionnable vocals for release on an official Michael Jackson album.
 
I've always said the it was Michael singing on these tracks, but I must admit this is the best theory there is in terms of explaining if there was any kind of doubt. If Michaels voice wasn't up to singing some vocals or had a sore throat, he may of asked someone to put in some vocals just to see how the song would sound etc (could of happened, stranger things have happened, no?).
 
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